Microsoft Has No Plans To Tell Us What's In Windows Patches

Jim Kim said:
It's only a "big deal"
After your in a reboot loop or After a forced driver install has broken your widget.
No Big Deal, exactly, right?

Call me boring but I read software patch notes and changelogs.
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Fine, but reading up on a given patch will not tell you anything about whether installing it will cause your system to crash or otherwise foul up, will it?

Nope, you have to install it first. Then, and only then, if it doesn't happen to work for you (when there's a problem patch it never affects everyone universally), you can uninstall it. This is the procedure whether you read about the patch in advance or you don't.

I used to read up on them, too--as I had Windows set to "Notify & let me install" for years. But on reflection, I don't blame Microsoft here...too many people simply turned off updates and let the system languish until they picked up something nasty--which would have been their fault, exclusively, but people don't see things that clearly, most of the time. They'd blame Microsoft because they chose not to patch, etc. People act as if security patches grow on trees for free somewhere--they don't--it costs Microsoft a pretty penny to keep on churning them out year after year, for free. As is the rule, rather than be appreciative, people bitch about it. They don't stop to think that Microsoft could be like Apple if it chose and declare that its OS was "safe enough" and let it go at that--except that Apple security-patches regularly but hides the information from its customers--like everything else Apple hides from them...;)

Really, it's not that bad at all when you think about it, imo.
 
As a network engineer/admin I hope nobody is OK with this shit. If you're not then your opinion doesn't mean jack shit anyway as you don't have a clue. Hope I made that clear enough.
 
As a software engineer, i can only say that MS seriously needs to implement some sort of visibility toggle that either hides or shows the actual patch change log. At times, when i need to track down potential causes of instability after windows updates, i look at the change logs.

Simply "nothing there" is unacceptable.
 
Bowman15 said:
As a network engineer/admin I hope nobody is OK with this shit. If you're not then your opinion doesn't mean jack shit anyway as you don't have a clue. Hope I made that clear enough.
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Yeah, that's really mature. "I'm qualified with x job title and if you disagree with my opinion then here's some totally unintelligible profanity-laced bitterness that proves nothing, but I'm right and you're dumb." That's a very adult way of expressing your feelings. I'm glad you shared. *head-pats* :D
 
CreepyUncleGoogle said:
Yeah, that's really mature. "I'm qualified with x job title and if you disagree with my opinion then here's some totally unintelligible profanity-laced bitterness that proves nothing, but I'm right and you're dumb." That's a very adult way of expressing your feelings. I'm glad you shared. *head-pats* :D
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Truth hurts...sorry if you're not qualified. ;-)
 
Heatlesssun has a history of trying to deflect what is said to change the topic when something is said against MS or Windows.
 
Again, only offering an opinion like everyone else around here. You have a history of turning into more than that.
 
The personal attacks are funny as shit. However, there is only one correct position to take on this subject. Microsoft should post change logs when it comes to patches. If your not intelligent enough to understand why, or you don't want to read them, or you plain don't care or your just trolling. It does not matter. These are the facts, get over it. slams mike :p
 
Mr Milquetoast said:
Meanwhile in Linux Mint you can read a description and change log for updates before installing them:

[/iMG]http://fs2.directupload.net/images/150822/a8dg3pgh.png[/IMG]

I still use Windows for things like games, but every aspect of it is getting worse. The interface gets worse with each version, Microsoft's policies get worse with each version, the range of customisation options gets less with each version.

I'm just amazed how willing people are to bend over and take whatever Microsoft gives them, with no knowledge what it is and no choice on the matter. With Linux constantly improving and Windows getting rapidly worse I honestly don't know why more people aren't switching to Linux.

I'll continue to use Windows for games, but I'll definitely stick with Windows 7. Windows 10 is a new low for Microsoft.
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Linux will never become mainstream until you can click an installer instead of compiling the installer by typing a bunch of stuff into the command prompt. People want to be able to download a file, click on it and it just installs.
 
Jim Kim said:
The personal attacks are funny as shit. However, there is only one correct position to take on this subject. Microsoft should post change logs when it comes to patches. If your not intelligent enough to understand why, or you don't want to read them, or you plain don't care or your just trolling. It does not matter. These are the facts, get over it. slams mike :p
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It genuinely doesn't matter at this point what position you take. Microsoft's people, who are a part of a corporation that's super-profitable and have products in pretty much every end user who can't figure out Linux's computers decided not to share changes. No matter what you think of as fact, the reality is different. If you don't like it, use a different OS on computers you control and get over it on the computers you use that aren't your property.
 
Jarod888 said:
Linux will never become mainstream until you can click an installer instead of compiling the installer by typing a bunch of stuff into the command prompt. People want to be able to download a file, click on it and it just installs.
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^--Has not used a Linux distro in the last 10+ years. :p
 
CreepyUncleGoogle said:
^--Has not used a Linux distro in the last 10+ years. :p
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Perhaps not. But is the state of desktop Linux radically much better now than ten years ago? I've not used desktop Linux natively much recently though I usually have the latest version of Ubuntu installed in a Hyper-V VM. Used to run Red Hat a lot in the 90's and honestly it wasn't that big of deal to setup and install software. The problem was then as is now the latest and great software and hardware support. In that regard Linux has changed anywhere where it would need to be to be mainstream.
 
CreepyUncleGoogle said:
It genuinely doesn't matter at this point what position you take. Microsoft's people, who are a part of a corporation that's super-profitable and have products in pretty much every end user who can't figure out Linux's computers decided not to share changes. No matter what you think of as fact, the reality is different. If you don't like it, use a different OS on computers you control and get over it on the computers you use that aren't your property.
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I understand your a one trick pony from your previous posts in this thread. Thankfully not everyone agrees with your "roll over and take it", "get over it", "because no one cares" childish attitude.

And yes, Linux is easy to install. I put it on my folks computer and have not had to remove "Adobe Flash Player PRO" or "Mega Registry Cleaner And Computer Fasterizer" since doing so. :)
 
heatlesssun said:
Perhaps not. But is the state of desktop Linux radically much better now than ten years ago? I've not used desktop Linux natively much recently though I usually have the latest version of Ubuntu installed in a Hyper-V VM. Used to run Red Hat a lot in the 90's and honestly it wasn't that big of deal to setup and install software. The problem was then as is now the latest and great software and hardware support. In that regard Linux has changed anywhere where it would need to be to be mainstream.
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I don't know much about Linux prior to like 5 years ago aside from knowing several distros (Lindows, Ubuntu) and whatnot had an app store experience in 2005. I'd agree though that not much has changed in the last 10 years beyond making a large number of successive incremental improvements.

Then again, those incremental improvements have, at least as far as my usage of it, really made a big difference. I haven't had any issues with hardware or software support. Even my weird Brother printer was very easy to configure. Plus, Microsoft has gone through radical changes and we saw how well that worked out for them with Windows 8. Linux is sorta like a shark, it doesn't evolve quickly because it doesn't really have a need to do so...and really, neither did Windows but because profits looked like they might have suffered because of iPads, unnecessary changes that a lot of people rejected were forced upon a world that collectively went, "Meh, no thanks."
 
heatlesssun said:
Perhaps not. But is the state of desktop Linux radically much better now than ten years ago? I've not used desktop Linux natively much recently though I usually have the latest version of Ubuntu installed in a Hyper-V VM. Used to run Red Hat a lot in the 90's and honestly it wasn't that big of deal to setup and install software. The problem was then as is now the latest and great software and hardware support. In that regard Linux has changed anywhere where it would need to be to be mainstream.
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If you game, you have no choice but to use Windows. Thankfully you don't have to use Windows 10. It will be a while before Direct X 12 benefits the games that I play.
 
Jim Kim said:
I understand your a one trick pony from your previous posts in this thread. Thankfully not everyone agrees with your "roll over and take it", "get over it", "because no one cares" childish attitude.

And yes, Linux is easy to install. I put it on my folks computer and have not had to remove "Adobe Flash Player PRO" or "Mega Registry Cleaner And Computer Fasterizer" since doing so. :)
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Actually that was two tricks. :D The first one was saying that it didn't matter to most people and the second one was pointing out that the Lord High Keeper of Operating Systems has decided no change logs are how business will be done which makes arguing with me (who's obviously right) is sorta silly. Besides that, both of these clever tricks of mine are just statements about the reality of the situation and all I did was add my totally awesome professional internet troll opinion to ride atop them like they were a giant wave and my opinion was an amazing surf-tastic surf-y board.
 
Jim Kim said:
If you game, you have no choice but to use Windows. Thankfully you don't have to use Windows 10. It will be a while before Direct X 12 benefits the games that I play.
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Even this reason is starting to weaken. Obligatory "Look at the linux games on Steam!" That list is exponentially larger than it was 5 years ago, and there's plenty to be entertained by. It's not just TuxRacer anymore. OS X has had the same or even better story of no games to games.

Sure, Windows is still the platform for AAA titles, but to say you have >no choice< for PC video game entertainment is not true. You just may have to sacrifice a few titles for ideology. Interestingly enough, those titles are probably by companies that people have reasons to not support anyway. (EA)
 
Bowman15 said:
As a network engineer/admin I hope nobody is OK with this shit. If you're not then your opinion doesn't mean jack shit anyway as you don't have a clue. Hope I made that clear enough.
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Not really, I don't understand, what are you trying to say? :p
 
One would almost have to be nuts to not use an open-source OS and browser these days for your ordinary day-to-day activities.

Windows is probably rifling through all your files, looking for credit card numbers to send to Russian hackers and Indian tech scam artists.

Sleep well.
 
jwcalla said:
One would almost have to be nuts to not use an open-source OS and browser these days for your ordinary day-to-day activities.

Windows is probably rifling through all your files, looking for credit card numbers to send to Russian hackers and Indian tech scam artists.

Sleep well.
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Doesn't that tin foil hate get uncomfortable when you are trying to sleep? :D I am still toying around with building a cheap box to put Ubuntu on but no where near as a replacement for Windows. (I just like to use everything and Ubuntu works the best and stuff is easy to find.)
 
Frobozz said:
Even this reason is starting to weaken. Obligatory "Look at the linux games on Steam!" That list is exponentially larger than it was 5 years ago, and there's plenty to be entertained by. It's not just TuxRacer anymore. OS X has had the same or even better story of no games to games.

Sure, Windows is still the platform for AAA titles, but to say you have >no choice< for PC video game entertainment is not true. You just may have to sacrifice a few titles for ideology. Interestingly enough, those titles are probably by companies that people have reasons to not support anyway. (EA)
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A "few titles" huh? Steam has about 3700 games on it, and about 1200 are confirmed to work on Linux. So that means picking randomly, about 2/3 of games won't run on Linux. Don't get me wrong, Linux has made a lot of progress and I'd love to see Windows dethroned as the gaming OS, but hyperbole like this doesn't help anything.
 
tetris42 said:
A "few titles" huh? Steam has about 3700 games on it, and about 1200 are confirmed to work on Linux. So that means picking randomly, about 2/3 of games won't run on Linux. Don't get me wrong, Linux has made a lot of progress and I'd love to see Windows dethroned as the gaming OS, but hyperbole like this doesn't help anything.
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Ok. you can hang me on the use of "a few titles". However, the sentiment is that the landscape of gaming on Linux and OSX has changed dramatically over the past 5 years. Personally, I'm impressed with the numbers you've posted. It'd be informative to see numbers on how many games released this year are cross platform vs 5 vs 10 years ago.

With 1200 titles, there's surely something you'd (the general you) want to play. The point is that it's at the level where you can make a choice not to go Windows and still have PC gaming entertainment that's more than Zork. You could compare it to going vegetarian. You're forgoing meat and don't get bacon, but you are still satisfied by your food, get to support your ideology and sleep better at night. One of those "is it worth it to you?" situations now because, there are viable alternatives.
 
Frobozz said:
Ok. you can hang me on the use of "a few titles". However, the sentiment is that the landscape of gaming on Linux and OSX has changed dramatically over the past 5 years. Personally, I'm impressed with the numbers you've posted. It'd be informative to see numbers on how many games released this year are cross platform vs 5 vs 10 years ago.

With 1200 titles, there's surely something you'd (the general you) want to play. The point is that it's at the level where you can make a choice not to go Windows and still have PC gaming entertainment that's more than Zork. You could compare it to going vegetarian. You're forgoing meat and don't get bacon, but you are still satisfied by your food, get to support your ideology and sleep better at night. One of those "is it worth it to you?" situations now because, there are viable alternatives.
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I love Linux, use it on my laptop full time and desktop part time. I run a pair of esxi servers at home, all but one VM is linux.... But its not really viable for gaming on the PC. Being a fanboy is never good. The only rational way to assess an OS is per task (or group of tasks weighted on priority on a multiuse device), and in the gaming category nothing comes close to windows. If I can't play the game I want to play, then the PC system has diminished value. My time in many cases is limited, if I have 2 hours a week for gaming, it damn sure better be exactly what I want to play, not a 3rd backup choice.
 
SonicTron said:
Hmmm I wonder when I should update from Windows 7
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'Should update', eh? Windows 7 is still supported for another five years, so by 2020 one could take a gander at the Windows versions or alternatives out there by that time :)

That's my plan at least...
 
SonicTron said:
Hmmm I wonder when I should update from Windows 7
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When there's a feature that you decide "I want that!". Unfortunately, there isn't really anything must-have in Win10 until DX12 games start hitting in a year.
 
DPI said:
When there's a feature that you decide "I want that!". Unfortunately, there isn't really anything must-have in Win10 until DX12 games start hitting in a year.
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That's definately a personal thing. An API that's mostly focused on providing a framework for games is like an absolute non-reason to buy into a new operating system. I know and don't fault other people for feeling otherwise (well, actually I do, but I know better than to like try the whole using reason thing on them) but there are consoles, tablets, and phones for games.
 
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