Trying Linux again

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carlmart

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Apparently my laptop has limitations on the graphic card to be able to view some video files I have.

And the advice was to try Linux, using just a CD or DVD to boot the system.

So the first question is what version you recommend for me to use.

My second question is this. After that I will use Linux to view the files, to move the files from the SD cards to HDD and then to format the SD cards again. Will I be able to do that?

Format for the SD card would be exFAT and 128Kb.
 
I'm not aware of any magic tricks that linux could do for you to view any video files lol. Most likely you need some codec that's missing from your computer.

If your laptop lacks power to run hd video on windows it will be even more lacking using linux.

But go ahead and try linux as it costs nothing but time for you. Probably the best beginner linux would be linux Mint. Be aware though that once you boot from a live CD you may need to install extra software to be able to run different video formats. There are also some things that need a reboot, those you obviously can't do using a live cd or usb unless you choose Puppy linux.

Puppy is not so beginner friendly but it's super fast and runs many things out of the box. That would be my second recommendation.
 
Well, the person who advised me to try this way is quite knowledgeable on professional video.

There's no missing codec on my system, but the graphics card memory is just 128Mb, which seems the bottle-neck to play this mov files. In any case it deserves a try and I have no other options.

Something I could boot from an USB might allow me installing and updating, which a CD does not. My last experience with Linux was from CD, and I had to update things continuously after every boot.

There's very little information to argue on what might be better, but Googling a bit seemed to recommend Mint, which I already downloaded. But I'm open to what should I use and what else to download for extra software. Do shoot what you think I could try.
 
carlmart said:
Well, the person who advised me to try this way is quite knowledgeable on professional video.

There's no missing codec on my system, but the graphics card memory is just 128Mb, which seems the bottle-neck to play this mov files. In any case it deserves a try and I have no other options.

Something I could boot from an USB might allow me installing and updating, which a CD does not. My last experience with Linux was from CD, and I had to update things continuously after every boot.

There's very little information to argue on what might be better, but Googling a bit seemed to recommend Mint, which I already downloaded. But I'm open to what should I use and what else to download for extra software. Do shoot what you think I could try.
Click to expand...

Puppy linux is perfect for you then. First of all it runs 100% in ram so its very fast. Second each time you shut it down it saves your session to the USB drive so you can restore your settings etc. back on your next boot.

Try Simplicity linux: http://simplicitylinux.org/ (Simplicity is a version of Puppy)

But still, linux won't make your graphics memory limitation go away. Only a hardware upgrade can do that. Puppy linux also supports exfat format since Precise Puppy using GParted: http://distro.ibiblio.org/quirky/pet_packages-precise/gparted-0.16.1-i486-gtkmm_static-precise.pet
 
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Unfortunately I will not be able to boot from usb using this laptop I'm using now. It doesn't allow booting from external units, memory sticks or even an HDD.

So I will have to try it with a CD. What Linux is the most recommended then?

Is there a way I complement that with info to be taken from my internal HDD?
 
carlmart said:
Unfortunately I will not be able to boot from usb using this laptop I'm using now. It doesn't allow booting from external units, memory sticks or even an HDD.

So I will have to try it with a CD. What Linux is the most recommended then?

Is there a way I complement that with info to be taken from my internal HDD?
Click to expand...

Hi, carlmart,

Puppy Linux runs on CD and/or DVD and other media and is not limited to USB.

Hope this helps.
 
What I wonder is, now that I won't be running from a memory stick, only from CD, if another Linux version might be better or convenient. Particularly with demanding graphics.

Also if there's a way to use some part of the HD to store information of the setups I will be using.

I can't remember the Linux version I used in the past, and I'm not at home to check on that. But I had to fill in several things every time I loaded the program, which I'm not used to in Windows anymore.

Perhaps I'm dreaming with the better of both worlds (Windows and Linux) which is unattainable.
 
the amount of video ram is determined by the BIOS if allowed to change it, nothing to do with OS, and a video file does not use 128MB of GPU memory, at all, sorry but your pro friend seems a little..clueless when it comes to hardware and limitations and playing media.

I play 50G BR rips on Intel i3 with integrated video with little GPU usage.
 
MrGuvernment said:
the amount of video ram is determined by the BIOS if allowed to change it, nothing to do with OS, and a video file does not use 128MB of GPU memory, at all, sorry but your pro friend seems a little..clueless when it comes to hardware and limitations and playing media.

I play 50G BR rips on Intel i3 with integrated video with little GPU usage.
Click to expand...

My thoughts exactly. 128Mb of video ram should be perfectly enough unless he runs a dual 4k screen or something.
 
Remember I started by saying that I can't play my files as it is on this laptop, either on XP or Win 7.

If you tell me your laptop runs on an i3, it's quite likely the graphic card ha better capabilities than mine.
 
You're "trying Linux" to view video files? Doesn't make any sense, and you're going about this the wrong way. Video files are simple. You got your container file (.avi, .mov, .mp4, etc) and inside those you have a video stream and an audio stream. The video stream is compressed (these days usually h.264), and the audio stream is compressed (these days usually aac). What the streams are compressed with is what people need to concern themselves with, because if your computer doesn't recognize the compression, then it won't be able to play the video.

Now the video files you're trying to view might be compressed with something else, which is why you can't view them. So what you need to do is find out what they are compressed with and then get the proper codec to decode them. Many video players like VLC and MPC-HC come with a ton of codecs themselves and can view almost any video.
 
Well, these files are mov, and were recorded as ProRes on an exFAT formatted card.

This what MediaInfo says of them:

General
Complete name : F:\Blackmagic Pocket Cinema Camera_1_2014-04-17_0359_C0000.mov
Format : QuickTime
Format/Info : Original Apple specifications
File size : 22.8 GiB
Duration : 17mn 32s
Overall bit rate : 186 Mbps
Encoded date : UTC 2014-04-17 05:59:32
Tagged date : UTC 2014-04-17 05:59:32
Writing library : Apple QuickTime
com.apple.proapps.manufacturer : Blackmagic Design
com.apple.proapps.cameraName : Blackmagic Pocket Cinema Camera
com.apple.proapps.clipID : Birds of the Wetlands
com.apple.proapps.logNote : This take has examples of grebes, pelicans, cormorants, long-legged wading birds and waterfowl.
com.blackmagic-design.cinemacame : Wetlands, Grassy, Birds, Low Light, Sunset, Close Up, Flight
com.apple.proapps.reel : 1
com.apple.proapps.scene : 1
com.blackmagic-design.cinemacame : 1
com.apple.proapps.shot : 1
com.apple.proapps.angle : CU

Video
ID : 1
Format : ProRes
Format profile : High
Codec ID : apch
Duration : 17mn 32s
Bit rate mode : Constant
Bit rate : 183 Mbps
Width : 1 888 pixels
Original width : 1 920 pixels
Height : 1 062 pixels
Original height : 1 080 pixels
Display aspect ratio : 16:9
Frame rate mode : Constant
Frame rate : 25.000 fps
Color space : YUV
Chroma subsampling : 4:2:2
Scan type : Progressive
Bits/(Pixel*Frame) : 3.660
Stream size : 22.5 GiB (99%)
Language : English
Encoded date : UTC 2014-04-17 05:59:32
Tagged date : UTC 2014-04-17 05:59:32

Audio
ID : 2
Format : PCM
Format settings, Endianness : Little
Format settings, Sign : Unsigned
Codec ID : in24
Duration : 17mn 32s
Bit rate mode : Constant
Bit rate : 2 304 Kbps
Channel(s) : 2 channels
Sampling rate : 48.0 KHz
Bit depth : 24 bits
Stream size : 289 MiB (1%)
Language : English
Encoded date : UTC 2014-04-17 05:59:32
Tagged date : UTC 2014-04-17 05:59:32

Menu
ID : 3
Duration : 17mn 32s
Language : English
Encoded date : UTC 2014-04-17 05:59:32
Tagged date : UTC 2014-04-17 05:59:32

For the time being, I came back to my XP HDD, where I had upgraded it to play exFAT/ProRes files. But it only does so in QT, not in VLC or any other.
 
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Well ProRes is Apple's own proprietary codec, mostly to be used with video editing in Final Cut Pro (Apple), and 17minutes at 22.8GB shows that, you're supposed to edit it and then re-encode it. It kinda makes sense that you can't read it unless you're using QuickTime, which is an Apple product. This is proprietary "Apple World" stuff you're dealing with. There has to be something out there though. Try installing ffmpeg and see if it can give you a codec to decode it properly.

What errors are you getting anyways with VLC?
 
Well now it makes sense. It's entirely possible that linux has reverse coded driver support for proprietary Apple formats and this is why you should try it. It has nothing to do with your display ram.

If you're just trying to view the files, have you tried installing quicktime to your windows? https://www.apple.com/quicktime/download/
 
First of all, I did play these files with VLC in two desktops with "proper" graphic cards. Excellent image quality and all. So it seems there is something related to this laptop, hardware or software, that is preventing it from normal play video.

In Win 7 I couldn't make it play smoothly with no programs,including QT, VLC, etc. In XP I could play it fine with QT after I installed exFAT and ProRes upgrades. That didn't work in Win 7.

I haven't yet tried Linux, so I can't say anything about it. I will have to install the Linux on a CD.
 
carlmart said:
First of all, I did play these files with VLC in two desktops with "proper" graphic cards. Excellent image quality and all. So it seems there is something related to this laptop, hardware or software, that is preventing it from normal play video.

In Win 7 I couldn't make it play smoothly with no programs,including QT, VLC, etc. In XP I could play it fine with QT after I installed exFAT and ProRes upgrades. That didn't work in Win 7.

I haven't yet tried Linux, so I can't say anything about it. I will have to install the Linux on a CD.
Click to expand...

If it worked on XP but not on Win7 it seems there is some driver problem. Does your laptop have Win7 support? Chances are your computer is simply too slow and old if it ever came with XP in the first place.

Linux may or may not help you - as I said it costs you nothing but time to try it out. Linux Mint or Ubuntu are the most user friendly probably.
 
Originally this laptop came with Vista installed, which I replaced with XP. Never regretted on that.

But I looked for Win 7 drivers package for the new install. I wonder which driver I should try with W7 to make it work. I would instantly.

I also think this computer is slow for what I want it to do, which is weird because one reason I bought it was because it had a 1394 input, which was rare in laptops back then. It probably is yet, mostly because 1394 almost vanished.

Perhaps I should have looked at the graphic card specs too, which I didn't.
 
carlmart said:
Originally this laptop came with Vista installed, which I replaced with XP. Never regretted on that.

But I looked for Win 7 drivers package for the new install. I wonder which driver I should try with W7 to make it work. I would instantly.

I also think this computer is slow for what I want it to do, which is weird because one reason I bought it was because it had a 1394 input, which was rare in laptops back then. It probably is yet, mostly because 1394 almost vanished.

Perhaps I should have looked at the graphic card specs too, which I didn't.
Click to expand...

Laptops suck dude. You'll either pay 2 grand for a laptop or get a workstation for cheaper to do the job. You can try to install the Vista driver to the Win7 if no win7 version is available. Sometimes they work.
 
Of course you're right.

But modern video cameras, that work with CF cards, expect you to download the cards onto HDDs on location, and also have to be able to check the video files you recorded. With good quality.

They also expect you will be able to reformat the cards. Just not did I realize XP does not allow you to format the card in exFAT with 128 kilobytes, as the camera manufacturer specifies. Only Win 7 and up does.

So I had to go back to my Win 7 SSD.

If Linux does not have a way out over this, and apparently it doesn't, I won't be able to check on the files with this laptop.
 
Did you try linux already or why do you say it doesn't have a way? If your machine could handle the video using XP but not Win7 you have a good enough hardware, just your Win7 drivers and/or codecs are lacking. The problem with older laptops is that you can't install generic drivers on them and the OEM just doesn't care if you get stuck with an ancient OS it was shipped with. They rarely if ever update their drivers.

That's why I use a macbook pro as my laptop - it gets frequent upgrades and works like a charm. But of course the 3000 dollar cost may be prohibitive for some.
 
3000 u$s is a problem for most, not many.

Unfortunately the country I live in is a PC country, and Macs are even more expensive than the US. Think double that money you mention. Also there's little or no support. Mac is only viable in the US and Europe.

But PCs got much better recently, and later portable types are more reliable and fast. I will be upgrading my laptop when I get back home.

I only tried Linux from a memory stick, and you can't boot from it on this laptop. So I will make a CD with it and try that, then report back here.

About XP handling the files, only with QT, not with VLC or WMP, which are the players I regularly use and prefer. I'm not sure which other driver/codec to add with Win 7. But they do run in Win 7 on two desktops I tried, with the same drivers and codecs I'm using on this laptop, so I pretty much guess it's a hardware issue, not software.
 
carlmart said:
3000 u$s is a problem for most, not many.

Unfortunately the country I live in is a PC country, and Macs are even more expensive than the US. Think double that money you mention. Also there's little or no support. Mac is only viable in the US and Europe.

But PCs got much better recently, and later portable types are more reliable and fast. I will be upgrading my laptop when I get back home.

I only tried Linux from a memory stick, and you can't boot from it on this laptop. So I will make a CD with it and try that, then report back here.

About XP handling the files, only with QT, not with VLC or WMP, which are the players I regularly use and prefer. I'm not sure which other driver/codec to add with Win 7. But they do run in Win 7 on two desktops I tried, with the same drivers and codecs I'm using on this laptop, so I pretty much guess it's a hardware issue, not software.
Click to expand...

The drivers can't be same on a laptop and desktop. Laptops usually require OEM specific drivers. If you want to be adventurous you can try omega drivers which are hacked to enable installation on laptops which would normally refuse a generic driver installation.

My suspicion is that your laptop lacks video hardware acceleration at the moment and this is the main culprit. Which GPU does your laptop have and which driver version is in use?
 
My GPU is ATI Radeon X1200, with 128Mb memory.

Whatever Omega driver around I would try it.

I already have the CDs to install Linux on them. Any other programs to install or put on same CD that work with Linux?
 
Once you install linux you can download everything from the internet (by using repositories and a tool like apt-get or yum). Large part even using the integrated software manager.
 
OK, I did my first try at Puppy Linux and files do play, but in slow motion.

At least is better than on Win 7, where playing is choppy, but I'm not sure if there's a way to improve on that. Is there?

No audio either.
 
carlmart said:
OK, I did my first try at Puppy Linux and files do play, but in slow motion.

At least is better than on Win 7, where playing is choppy, but I'm not sure if there's a way to improve on that. Is there?

No audio either.
Click to expand...

So you were able to play the files on Win7 but too choppy. You should mention stuff like this when you ask for help - your original text gave the impression the video didn't run at all.

Did you install the Radeon proprietary driver to your puppy? Without it it will definitely be too slow. The driver installer is found in the puppy tools on your desktop most likely.
 
What is xvinfo?

Sorry about not being clear enough on how the video was playing in Win 7. Choppy for me is like not playing at all.

I didn't know about the Radeon driver on Puppy. I will install it and try.
 
carlmart said:
Sorry about not being clear enough on how the video was playing in Win 7. Choppy for me is like not playing at all.
Click to expand...

So this whole time it wasn't even a codec issue, as you were able to play it. You just said they didn't play because they were "choppy" ? Jesus. :rolleyes:
 
I wasn't able to play it if the movement was not as it should be. A stop and go play is not play, it's photo maybe, but not video. I'm not sure what do you consider correctly played video then.

From the beginning I said it might be a hardware issue, not software related, and I was told (wrongly or not) that Linux might be a way to do it.

In any case it didn't work out, or at least not what I tried.
 
carlmart said:
I wasn't able to play it if the movement was not as it should be. A stop and go play is not play, it's photo maybe, but not video. I'm not sure what do you consider correctly played video then.

From the beginning I said it might be a hardware issue, not software related, and I was told (wrongly or not) that Linux might be a way to do it.

In any case it didn't work out, or at least not what I tried.
Click to expand...
The problem is we can't see what you are looking at so unless you are specific about the problem it's difficult to properly diagnose.

A video not opening at all is going to have a different set of solutions than the video playback isn't smooth.

When you say the video is not working at all it implies that you can't open it or that the screen is blank, not that you are able to open the file but the performance isn't satisfactory.
 
Sorry about not explaining things properly, particularly on the degrees of what was happening. I thought I was doing so.

For me it was obvious that what I was looking for was the videos to play smoothly. I thought I did tell so, but evidently I did not, and for that I apologize.

As I was used to these ProRes files playing smoothly on my desktop and in Win 7, trying to see the files on the laptop and not being able to was extremely frustrating. I didn't see it coming, or I might have made tests and all, which I did not.

So let me tell exactly what was happening in Windows 7: playing was choppy, and jumped I don't know how many frames forward every time. In Linux the files play, but in slow motion, with no audio. In XP files play fine with QT player, as long as you update to exFAT with MS and to ProRes with QT. But they do not play smoothly in any program with Win 7.
 
I'm a big fan of fedora. Exfat can be added with
'yum install exfat' or 'yum install exfat-fuse', I forget which, but 'yum search exfat' should return the correct package.
 
carl, try another distro if Puppy didn't work out of the box for you. Fedora is nice, it's especially easy to base configure by using fedy which allows one click installation of basic things like microsoft fonts, flash etc.
 
I'm leaving this place and shooting tomorrow.

So I will try Fedora on my desktop first to see how it behaves. Then try it on the laptop.

In any case it's quite likely I will get a new laptop, more powerful, anyway.
 
carlmart said:
I'm leaving this place and shooting tomorrow.

So I will try Fedora on my desktop first to see how it behaves. Then try it on the laptop.

In any case it's quite likely I will get a new laptop, more powerful, anyway.
Click to expand...

If you do, this time pay attention to the graphics card type. If you want to play with linux get a laptop with an Nvidia based graphics card. 760M or higher for example.
 
Yes, indeed. I will try to get a model with Intel CPU and Nvidia card, not sure if as good as that you mention, or things might get pretty expensive.

But I will take the HD with the ProRes files I'm working with now, and try to pick one that does play them.

The idea is to install Avid Media Composer on it, not to edit with it, but to be able to play external HDDs with edited files, conformed to them. Then I can play them on my plasma TV or projector when I have one or whatever situation I may face.

That is something I hadn't really considered before, and I see now that might be necessary.
 
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