Trepidati0n
[H]F Junkie
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Paul is 100% correct. People are gonna pay....a nice 20 years of free money coming to them.
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Ultra Products Sues All Other PSU Makers
- Thread starter HardOCP News
- Start date
Paul is 100% correct. People are gonna pay....a nice 20 years of free money coming to them.
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I read the patent, it is clearly OBVIOUS under the art. Any engineer seeking to have flexible connections from a power supply would come to the same OBVIOUS conclusions about how to implement same with off the shelf components. The patent belongs in the trash, period.
Really? You read the entire patent, citations, supporting claims, references, foreign patents, and legal precedent in less than 30 minutes? Then why if it was so obvious was the mechanism not previously invented? What exact citation for precedent are you basing your legal opinion on?
Exactly which anti-trust statute have they violated?
I parted out some old IBM PS1 and PS2 systems a few years back. They were from late 80's, early 90's. They had modular power supplies from the factory.
I don't see how Ultra could get a patent on something that was already in production some 10-15 years before they applied for a patent.
I don't see how Ultra could get a patent on something that was already in production some 10-15 years before they applied for a patent.
DeftonesXP
Weaksauce
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At least no one patented the power strip / surge protector ... or did they ??
At least no one patented the power strip / surge protector ... or did they ??
Trust me, they are patented out the wazoo, and I bet more are pending
Aren't Ultra poor supplies synonymous with junk?
Nope. Thier 1600w psu is rated top of the breed. Won killer awards.
You are reading the posts of the few that they do release that are junk. But not all of them are.
I think so too. I remember thier X-Connect lineup and no one else could touch them at the time... everyone just bashed them with voltage drop and resistance arguments... now everyone is on the bandwagon. Revenge is a dish best served cold.
Agreed.
They have been waiting for the patent to clear. They didn't wait like other companies for years after the fact to claim their prize... they also sent numerous warnings to companies over the years their patents were pending.
At least no one patented the power strip / surge protector ... or did they ??
Yeah, the surge protector/power strip is patent to death. Take the nearest surge protector and look on the bottom... good chance you will see patent pending or a patent number on it.
Smoken Joe
Weaksauce
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I should have got a patent the internet when I read about it in class. I would be rich.
This was an old idea when they applied for the patent. Only a complete fool would have granted it.
This was an old idea when they applied for the patent. Only a complete fool would have granted it.
Well it was granted by a bureacrat in a government office.....so what's your point?
obviouslytom
Fully [H]
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My patent is currently pending on 1s and 0s. Once that goes through, I am suing everyone
Haha, basically. When other companies make better products off of "your" idea, all you need to do is sue them! That's what Ultra brings to the table as far as initiating innovation. I don't want Ultra to be granted the patent after all is said and done because they wouldn't use it effectively. Reminds me of the n00b fragging himself with the BFG that you were rocket jumping for 5 minutes to get to and thinking... what a waste.
Beat me to it...
I have to agree. I remember being very VERY tempted by those PSU's sitting in Fry's, specifically because of the modular cables. I didn't, because all the reviews said they were POS PSUs (which has changed to some degree), but I have to say it was a unique idea at the time.
With that said, I don't understand the law well enough to know if it's patentable. The idea of having a detachable power cable isn't a new one. I'd almost think that they could only patent the connector on the PSU side of the cable.
If applying an old idea to a new product is patentable, then I think the patent should hold.
My OCZ Modstream has UV Reactive cables and connectors.
Look at who is on the patent. Carl Fiorentino, President of Tigerdirect, the online store with terrible prices and awful service. Looks like a perfect example of greed to me. People are shopping at better online retailers, and buying better power supplies. What a mess our legal system is.
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They patented the modular interface and unit they developed not the concept.
Why have the people commenting on this not read the patent?
digitalfreak
Limp Gawd
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digitalfreak
Limp Gawd
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"If you can't innovate, litigate!"
supergrover
Limp Gawd
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Aside from brand loyalty fanboyism, this just sucks because the companies being sued will still make these modular PSUs since we want them, and the license fees for the 'Ultra Connect Cables' will be passed on to us when we buy the PSUs.
Of course they will. They'll make money by licensing the idea to all the other PSU manufacturers.
They're not stupid. They can make more money by getting a piece of virtually every PSU sold than they will by whatever they make on the PSUs they make.
It's Apple vs Microsoft....and we all know that MS makes less per/unit licensing, but more overall.
Face it....if someone could get a patent on the paper bag (and one was granted long ago), then this patent seems like it could stand up in court.
Either way, it won't affect us....all of our favorite PSU makers will still sell modular PSUs.
I read the patent, it is clearly OBVIOUS under the art. Any engineer seeking to have flexible connections from a power supply would come to the same OBVIOUS conclusions about how to implement same with off the shelf components. The patent belongs in the trash, period.
The other manufacturers are quite right to tell Ultra to go fuck themselves, see you in court, where we will get your patent withdrawn, and then sue you for anti-trust violations to get our legal expenses recompensed.
Uktra's lawyers are seriously mistaken if they think that peice of trash will hold up. Sorry but no.
Just because someone sends you a cease and desist letter, doesn't mean you comply. If the subject matter is 100% Pure BULLSHIT you treat it with the respect it is due.... none.
Totally with you on this one. Maybe b/c it's middle of the day on the CONUS and many of the over 30 set are not posting until close of business, but I for one remember many a mod shop offering custom sleeving and connector insertion as a service if you bought your name branded PSU through them waaaay before Ultra or anybody else commoditized the "modular psu" features we've come to know and love.
I'll have to run it by my buddy, a patent attorney, but it seems utterly without merit to me.
Paul, you know better than I, but isn't the interface on the Ultra unique? I don't own one, and haven't looked at one in a few years, but as I recall, the interface was different than what's on my OCZ (which uses the same old MOLEX on both ends of the cable. Corsair has a different connector than that, but is it the same as the Ultra?
If it's just the connector, how could they win against OCZ, for example?
It seems like the patent, at least to some extent, has to cover the concept to be successful against all of the PSU manufacturers.
Any patent lawyers out there care to chime in in plain English
ThaLoveDocta
Weaksauce
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pretty sure this won't fly...
It's about drawing reasonable conclusions... this wasn't revolutionary, it was the next logical step.
It's about drawing reasonable conclusions... this wasn't revolutionary, it was the next logical step.
I remember hearing about that japanese guy who did the calculations on the the best positioning of pepperoni slices on pizza for optimal coverage. He patented the idea many years ago, I'm sure hes just waiting to backsue all the pizza restaurants for stealing his idea. Better do it soon, before the US dollar collapses, lol.
There are actually patents in China for the production of soya sauce. Don't know if there are any for wine production, but I imagine there are. There is afterall a special way you must crush the grapes using your feet.
There are actually patents in China for the production of soya sauce. Don't know if there are any for wine production, but I imagine there are. There is afterall a special way you must crush the grapes using your feet.
Not to say. Ultra may want some technologies that these companies are keeping for themselves or they may want entrance in a specific exclusive market... this might be their ticket.
Next logical step? Man I want what you are smoking. This isn't something that revolutionized computers in the way that they behave, it doesn't do anything other than cleaning up the clutter in your case and looks cool.
When Ultra first released their XConnect, everyone was bashing them saying it's the dumbest move due to voltage drops and resistance... large companies tried to attack the whole concept of detachable cables. Now you are saying it's the next logical step?
The pizza guy probably won't cash in heavily because here in the US pizza places are all about making money, not really giving you the optimum pepperoni placement. Most places I see they just toss on the pepperoni as they please. However, if a place like dominoes followed his concept, he's in for a nice lump sum.
Yeah, Wine industry is pretty secretive and have many patents.
Master Blaster
[H]ard|Gawd
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All I can say is awesome. Thanks for the link...
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Paul, you know better than I, but isn't the interface on the Ultra unique? I don't own one, and haven't looked at one in a few years, but as I recall, the interface was different than what's on my OCZ (which uses the same old MOLEX on both ends of the cable. Corsair has a different connector than that, but is it the same as the Ultra?
If it's just the connector, how could they win against OCZ, for example?
It seems like the patent, at least to some extent, has to cover the concept to be successful against all of the PSU manufacturers.
Any patent lawyers out there care to chime in in plain English
All of the modular units I have seen use the same basic interface as what Ultra has a patent on. The only real different units are the ones Hank did with the shortened cables which is NOT part of the Ultra patent and really aren't modular in the same manner.
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Yeah, its all so screwy. Trademarks are just as bad as patents.
"Champagne" is actually a trademark, like "Pepsi" is. I remember hearing that an Ice cream maker got in trouble for tyring to sell "Champagne ice cream". They eventually just decided on "wine" because it was not trademarked.
Coke was threatening Nike over the word "It". Never materialized, but I can see more and more lawsuits about stuff like this in the future. Coke legally owns "Santa Claus" afterall.
"Champagne" is actually a trademark, like "Pepsi" is. I remember hearing that an Ice cream maker got in trouble for tyring to sell "Champagne ice cream". They eventually just decided on "wine" because it was not trademarked.
Coke was threatening Nike over the word "It". Never materialized, but I can see more and more lawsuits about stuff like this in the future. Coke legally owns "Santa Claus" afterall.
snaggletooth
Supreme [H]ardness
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i think they're well within their rights. ultra was first with modular supplies. i've got a greeny chrome one rated at 500W, it was first in a long line of modular supplies from ultra... and then everyone else jumped in on the 'modding is cool' idea; cause that's what it's all about. a clean case is a 'cool' case. see what i did there?
still powers my barton rig just fine as well.
still powers my barton rig just fine as well.
TheBluePill
2[H]4U
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+1, I agree.
Everyone wants a modular PSU, they make sense and look great. I cant recal anyone with a Modular PS before Ultra.
They built a better "mouse trap" and should reap the rewards of that if they invested in a patent, which isnt a cheap process either.
So they were granted a patent on detachable cables? WTF?! I can see patenting a connector plug type, but detachable cables in general? lmao! Then again, it would be nice to have interchangeable plugs. Can you imagine if we needed a different power connector for each brand of hard drive? ugh
The patent office is worthless and they seriously need to fire them all and reform.
I like my Corsair HX620, but I am just fine rolling the unnecessary cables above the power supply as I have for years. Ultra can hug my nuts.
The patent office is worthless and they seriously need to fire them all and reform.
I like my Corsair HX620, but I am just fine rolling the unnecessary cables above the power supply as I have for years. Ultra can hug my nuts.
snaggletooth
Supreme [H]ardness
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QFT, i can't believe some of these psu nubs hating on ultra for engineering a great leap forward in psu connectivity. ULTRA WAS FIRST, just because you can't remember doesn't make it any less true.
i remember forum conversations regarding the supposedly catastrophic voltage drops components would suffer from the added resistance in the x-connect cabling too.
i think the hate's on ultra in general just because people like to assume because a few of their models are junk, every psu they make must be.
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No, read the patent again.
Yes, and we all know how intelligent the folks at the US Patent office are...
I'm sure it's easy wading through a billion patents looking for duplicates.
Noted by thir absence (despite their earlier acquisition by OCZ) is PC Power and Cooling, Inc. (http://www.pcpower.com). Could the fact that PCP&C has *no* moduar PSUs in their product lines at all have something to do with it? (While parent OCZ does feature several modular PSUs in their separate PSU lines, PCP&C does not.)
So they were granted a patent on detachable cables? WTF?! I can see patenting a connector plug type, but detachable cables in general? lmao! Then again, it would be nice to have interchangeable plugs. Can you imagine if we needed a different power connector for each brand of hard drive? ugh
The patent office is worthless and they seriously need to fire them all and reform.
I like my Corsair HX620, but I am just fine rolling the unnecessary cables above the power supply as I have for years. Ultra can hug my nuts.
The patent office is worthless and they seriously need to fire them all and reform.
I like my Corsair HX620, but I am just fine rolling the unnecessary cables above the power supply as I have for years. Ultra can hug my nuts.
Considering the fact that it's now input into a computerized Database, yes, not too bad to search out.
Anyways, it was a sacastic reply, not a statement of fact.
One aspect that might impact the patent holding up in court:
The connectors themselves.
If Ultra had developed their own custom connector and made it in-house or had it made to their spec, I could see where the patent might hold water.
The fact that they are using standardized connectors already in use might enter into the picture.
Not to get to far down the geek train, but I wonder how Molex, Foxconn, AMP and others dealt with the design of the connectors themselves. I would assume there are various patents involved with the connector designs themselves.
I wonder if a patent that utilizes someone else's patented devices can be considered valid.
The connectors themselves.
If Ultra had developed their own custom connector and made it in-house or had it made to their spec, I could see where the patent might hold water.
The fact that they are using standardized connectors already in use might enter into the picture.
Not to get to far down the geek train, but I wonder how Molex, Foxconn, AMP and others dealt with the design of the connectors themselves. I would assume there are various patents involved with the connector designs themselves.
I wonder if a patent that utilizes someone else's patented devices can be considered valid.