Is UPS really necessary?

D

daweinah

Weaksauce
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Jan 16, 2006
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Reading about UPS, they seem to serve two main functions 1) regulate power if you have surges or brown outs 2) give you time to save and shut down if you lose all power.

For people who live in areas with frequent power fluctuations (what kind of areas do people live in?? I dont understand) I guess this would be nice. I'm curious how much one would help me though, I just spent ~$1300 on a badass new comp (if I may say so myself) and I definitely want to protect it, but I also can't throw too much money around.

With my old computer, I used an even older (at least 6 years) surge protector that plugged into the wall and gave me 5 outlets to plug my PSU, Monitor, printer, and speakers into (one was empty) and I never had any trouble with it. I used it as an extension cord basically, I never used the power buttons on the surge protector, they all stayed on all the time. I controlled the power of computer by shutting it down and turning the monitor off manually. The speakers were always on. I guess I live in one of those areas with constant power or something, because I've never noticed any power issues with the computer, except, of course, in thunderstorms when the whole house/neighboorhood loses power.

Would a UPS be a good investment for me, or could I sneak away with one of those long, rectangle, cheap 6-outlet extension thingers?
 
Well it may not be the answer you're looking for, but I read a post somewhere saying that using a UPS ith a non PFC (power factor correction) switching mode power supply (SMPS) is probematic. It has something to do with spikes in the electrical draw of the power supply, the upshot being that if your p.s. is not a PFC type, a 1kva is the minimum you want for a 300 to 400 watt p.s.

Perhaps some electronics peeps could elaborate?

p.s. APC is generally considered to be the brand of choice for the avg. user.

http://www.apc.com/products/category.cfm?id=13
 
My power in this house drops down to a little as 90 volts for extended durations. This doesn't affect much; if you're watching them, the light bulbs dim, but it also drops down from 115 slowly enough that sometimes you can't even tell. This does, however, fuck with my computer. My PSU will struggle and sometimes my PC will restart when the voltage drops too low. In addition to just buying a better PSU, (which needs to wait for Tax Day) I have a UPS-in-a-powerstrip-style UPS, and the line conditioning makes a big difference in stability.

So you might have low voltage yourself and not know it, and for $40 you can get something that might help when you don't expect any problems at all. (And they power down your PC for you if you've bought a decent one, when the battery life is at it's end.)
 
A good UPS isn't that expensive, and can be picked up at placed like BestBuy and CompUSA. I have one in place on my mother's computer because she runs a home based business and a power spike or sudden loss could cause a great deal of damage.

I myself don't currently do any critical work on my desktops, only on my laptop. So I personally just use a high quality power strip. If I had some extra cash I would pick one up.
The only trick, is to buy one that actually meets the power requirements of the components connected to it, and if possible buy one that you can link to your PC to get log reports etc..

Oh and you need to remember that surges are not what generally damage the electronics in your home; power spikes do. A surge will trip fuses, protecting components connected to it, whereas a spike may act too quickly (at least this is what I was told by one of my Bosses).
 
daweinah said:
For people who live in areas with frequent power fluctuations (what kind of areas do people live in?? I dont understand)
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I need one in my dorm. Last year, I went through 3 cheap PSU's... all died after power fluctuations/outages. In the room last year, if the neighbors turned off their microwaves, the breaker would go... very aggravating.

The problem with dorms, is a lot of them are old. Mine is 60 years old. There are 4 electrical outlets... all of them waist high. They were designed to run curling irons and such. Now, each outlet has a 7 plug surge protector on them, all full. Fridge, microwave, xbox, tv, 2 computers, you name it. Dorm wiring was simply not designed for that way back in the day... I'll be getting a UPS soon. I wouldn't get one unless you had shitty power.
 
this is like asking do i need car insurance, or life insureance. You dont need it until you need it you know.
You just spent 1300 bucks on a system i dont think a few more is going to hurt that much.
I personally dont own one. But plan on getting 2 or 3 in about 2 months. But we have like 6 here at work and they have saved me many problems. COnstant power surges and dropouts.
Plus, if something goes out on your comp. i think the UPS company will cover it.
I reccommned them for anyone that has a computer.
Cuz i work on them all day long and get to see the ass end of everyones problems.
 
daweinah said:
Would a UPS be a good investment for me, or could I sneak away with one of those long, rectangle, cheap 6-outlet extension thingers?
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Look at it this way, you can get by with only Liability insurance (surge protector) on your car, until you get into an accident or somebody breaks into your car, and then you realize Liability doesn't do shit for you, just the other guy. Sometimes it's nice to have Full Coverage. (UPS)

Buying an UPS is like buying peace of mind. You have reserve power in case of power outages, especially the 1/2 second kind that cause your computer to reboot and can cause some damage if they happen 2 or 3 or 4 in a row, especially since they usually come with a surge or browns out before or after. You have clean power if your UPS provides voltage regulation, so brown outs don't strain your equipment and cause instability. You have insurance, if you buy an UPS from a decent company, to where if a power problem does fry your equipment you can get reimbursed by the UPS company.

So, if any of that's valuable to you, by all means buy an UPS. I did.
 
Where i live now, I get short (a couple of seconds usually) blackouts once or twice a week. I was well aware of that because I've had to reset clocks enough times so when I built my current rig I got an APC RS1500. I was really interested in what Ren H said though because I've actually blown up 2 of them now (unrecoverable overloads on pc start-up), and I'm on my third, although in my case it seems to have been related to which outlet I plug the ups into for some reason. And APC have happily shipped out replacements so no worries on that front.
Anyway I''ve often left the pc on overnight and got up to find that the ups has had to intervene, so I wouldn't want to be without one now.
 
Line conditioning.

Everything connected to the same circuit will feel the effects of all things connected to that circuit. When you turn something on that is on the same circuit, there will be a minor fluctuation momentarily. While this will not cause immediate damage to your electrical equipment, computers and other electronics are very sensitive, and they will experience greater wear over time due to this. Therefore, purchasing a UPS can extend the life of the equipment connected through it.

However, high pull equipment, like laser printers for example, should not be connected to a UPS.
 
You spend $1300 on a computer, you can get a decent APC ups for less than $100 dollars. The batteries in everyone I've owned have lasted anywhere from 3-5 years. In that time you'll probably up grade your system, a few times. Most people do. So right now you're comparing $1300 (still expensive to replace that much) to an extra $100. In the long run it could be more towards $3000 put into the system, after upgrades, compared to the $100. It doesn't make sense to buy some nice hardware and not protect it from a very common occurance. Hell if a random traffic accident hits a pole outside your house, or lightning hits, you could lose everything, at least with the UPS on there you stand a better chance of your hardware surviving. People don't buy them because of stuff that happens. They buy them because of stuff that might happen.
 
According to the APC configurator this one should get the job done for me.

I wish it wasn't $60, but in the 2 car accidents I've been in, its been a huge PITA to have only Liability coverage. :)
 
I have 3, one is running my main desktop, the other is running my server, and one more is running my cable modem. I didn't think they were necessary until I started hearing how often they go into line conditioning. If I run the vacume, or turn on the large halogen light in the room they will begin line conditioning.
 
i just ran that little configure thing and im looking at over a hundred bucks per pc.
and i got 4
dang....
i didnt know you not supposed to put a printer on it,
learned something else new today
good luck on getting one
 
I've got 3 UPS's right now, 3800 VA worth of APC Smart-UPS units, they're not cheap but ever since I've been using them, my machines have been much more stable, I've never lost work due to a sudden sag/surge/blackout, and I haven't had any hardware failures anymore. You may think that your power is clean and stable enough, until you hook one up that has voltage regulation and actually watch how often it's clamping or boosting power, or switches to battery since it can't even correct the power coming in anymore.
 
After watching my friend's LCD go because of a power spike, I decided that I wasn't gonna take the risk and bought a UPS. I've never had the need for one, but you just never know. The $50,000 equipment protection is also a bonus if something really happens.
 
i didnt know you not supposed to put a printer on it,
learned something else new today
good luck on getting one
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The thing about laser printers is that they require sudden large power surges (melting tuner onto paper). Other appliances do this as well, although not so many in the computing realm. The UPS is not designed to handle power surges from the protected side, only from the source side. Power surges from the supply side can cause the UPS to overload, and the worst case scenario would actually cause damage to the UPS.

If you have other computer related devices you think may cause sudden power surge requirements, you would be best advised to power them separately. Some UPS's provide connect-through plugs like the ordinary 'surge-protector' type that do not interfere with the battery backup system. These separate plugs on the UPS would be okay to use for a laser printer if your UPS has them, and you also use your UPS for its multi-outlet capabilities.

From APC's site:

Printers draw a very large amount of power and it is not advised that they be provided with UPS backup power because it is not economical. Many UPS for desktop use have additional surge protected outlets that do not provide backup power. This is where laser printers should be plugged in. Since laser printers are plugged into outlets that do not use the UPS battery, the presence of the laser printer does not affect UPS wattage or run time. If you do plug the Ink Jet Printer into the outlets with battery backup power, the UPS backup time during an outage will be reduced.
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mdameron said:
I need one in my dorm. Last year, I went through 3 cheap PSU's... all died after power fluctuations/outages. In the room last year, if the neighbors turned off their microwaves, the breaker would go... very aggravating.
Click to expand...

Welcome to my situation. Our breaker goes out at least once per day due to microwaves, water heaters, etc. After about three weeks at school I knew my hardware wasn't liking the power it was getting and then my Windows registry got shot by it. Then I bought a 350 something unit from APC for about $70 and my problems have gone away :)
 
Skim skim skim skim.... Ok. I think I've got it.

Decent UPS's have AVR. I can't think of any one of those "six outlet block thingies" with AVR. Not APC, Cyber, etc.

AVR is going to be what's going to help you. Not so much the fact that it's a battery back up.

In fact, I bet all you really need is an AVR unit:

http://www.powercom-usa.com/product_sub.asp?CategoryID=06

I have the 2000W Tap-Change unit: http://www.powercom-usa.com/ProductDetail.asp?ID=146

My heavy loads were causing poor AC and I was killing UPS's with prolonged 1000W loads. This solved all of those problems.
 
Well, the calculator recommended this one:

And it said I'd only be using 50 something % of the power. Can speakers die from power surges and stuff? My 5300's have an integrated amp, so I fear it could die easy. But at the same time, I think it'd drain the battery backup too fast... whatcha think? I'm glad it has a 6ft cord... I need at least 4 feet of cord for surge protectors to actually be able to sit on the ground.
 
i got one off ebay last summer (a Liebert one, 700VA or so) and am very happy with it. After my win2k3 server went down during a power outage in the early summer, which took my install down the tubes as well, I am happy that further outages do not affect it anymore.

I live in Pittsburgh and I am not sure about the 'quality' of our power, but we do get an outage about every 3-4 months. I do not notice them anymore, but from having to reset the VCR's clock ;)
 
I'll make the obligatory if you're really worried about power quality, get an "online" UPS that always has its rectifier and inverter running. I snagged two of Powerware Prestige 3kva units off of EBay about 2 years ago and couldn't be happier. I just had one of the APC AVR boxes before and my systems are much more stable with the UPS. Plus my TV, stereo, and computers will run for an hour or so if I loose power.

 
On-line UPS's are typically so expensive. All most people need are Line-Interactive UPS's.

Just stay away from Off-Line (aka Stand-by) UPS's.

But again... make sure it has AVR.
 
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