Hyperloop Co-Founder 'Very Serious' About California Secession

Secession isn't the way to go. But coming from a populous state, it is pretty disheartening that your votes matter so much less due to arbitrary lines on a map.

Our 2 Senate votes represent the say of ~37M people. That same population of people inhabit the bottom 22 states. So ~37M people spread through 22 states get 44 votes in the Senate, meaning their votes are 22x as meaningful as a Californian's in the Senate.

The House is slightly better, but when something has to pass both chambers...it's pretty ridiculous. This is a Texas problem as well, any large state really. But being the largest state by ~33% (37M vs 25M in TX), it's the most massive inequity.
 
Stiletto said:
This is why Trump won. You people never fucking learn. Insulting people is not how you win elections. After Brexit and Trump, how are you still not getting this?
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Fat women, Mexicans, Muslims, journalists aren't people, amirite?
 
DocSavage said:
Sorry, but some personal firearms aint doing shit to a battalion of tanks and air.
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Yeah, tell that to ISIS. Tell that to the IRA, who had the British Army running scared for years. Anyone who thinks that any government is going to crush their citizenry with heavy weapons has been watching too much Hunger Games. Their reputation worldwide would be mud overnight if they quashed people that way. That's why even Turkey has to be careful right now with their cleansing of Kurds.
 
DocSavage said:
Sorry, but some personal firearms aint doing shit to a battalion of tanks and air.
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Sorry, but your ignorance shows. Did you not pay attention in history class in school? People said the same thing back in the 1770's. Farmers with guns can't take on the might of a planet spanning Empire. For modern examples you need not look any further than Vietnam war, Afghanistan and the Taliban, ISIS, or even Syria. I guess you've never heard of asymmetric warfare?
All it takes is a few intrepid individuals to start the movement, and all they might have are personal firearms and homebuilt weapons. Their National Guard could defect or they could get outside help. Sometimes all it takes is one man and one bullet.

That being said, I still don't believe Californians have the spine to pull it off. It's just not their culture to be rebellious. Texans on the other hand...
 
TwistedAegis said:
Fat women, Mexicans, Muslims, journalists aren't people, amirite?
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I didn't support nor vote for Trump. That said, he didn't call half of his opponent's supporters "deplorables". That cost Hillary the election, and that attitude will keep costing you elections until you learn to stop treating people who disagree with you as if they're monsters. If the only people you care about are certain identity groups, then you have bigotry issues of your own to sort out before slinging that label around.
 
No, he just called 10% of the population rapists and murderers.

And bigotry? Not really. Calling someone deplorable because they support deplorable ideas like banning 1/6 of the population of the Earth from coming into your country isn't bigotry. I understand that it doesn't feel good. But it's an interesting psychology of upsetting the people so upset by the supposed over PC-ness of communication.

There is disagreement, which is healthy, then there is someone running on an authoritarian platform who has threatened retribution to those who disagree with him.
 
TwistedAegis said:
And bigotry? Not really. Calling someone deplorable because they support deplorable ideas like banning 1/6 of the population of the Earth from coming into your country isn't bigotry.
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big·ot·ry
ˈbiɡətrē/
noun
noun: bigotry; plural noun: bigotries
intolerance toward those who hold different opinions from oneself.
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You are not even nearly as intelligent as you think you are.
 
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BlueFireIce said:
As already stated, they have to much debt and borrow WAY to much from the fed, which just goes to show how out of touch these people are. They do not have an economy to support it self, hell, they can't even do it as a state.
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Couldn't the same be said for the country as a whole? "too much debt and borrow WAY too much from China"
 
nutzo said:
If it wasn't for the bay area and LA, this would likely be a battle ground state.


If it looked like they where going to some how pull this off, I would leave.
Between the Democrats, the government worker unions, and all the money in silicon valley, the rest of us don't stand a chance.
They say they care for the poor, yet the wage gap in California is one of the largest of any state.
The high cost of living and the over bearing nanny state is just getting to be much.
Just hope I can manage for another 10 years or so, then I can sell my over priced home and have a comfortable retirement somewhere cheaper.
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Why has this never been an option for Texas then? Why do they get to secede and Texas couldn't? Just curious all I have ever heard is that it's not possible. I would love for CA to move on and be Mexico again because that is what it is now. The poor bastards that want nothing to do with it will be welcome anywhere in this great nation with open arms. Let the hate run through them!
 
JNavy89GT said:
now if Cali decides to do this, and it goes to a civil war. Will Cali ground forces be limited to 10 round mags and need background checks when the troops need more ammo?
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Hahahhahahaah my hero right here. SO true. Let's bring no gun zone signs to that war. We win!
 
https://www.texastribune.org/2016/06/24/can-texas-legally-secede-united-states/

Simply put, the answer is no. Historical and legal precedents make it clear that Texas could not pull off a Texit — at least not legally.

“The legality of seceding is problematic,” said Eric McDaniel, associate professor of government at the University of Texas at Austin. “The Civil War played a very big role in establishing the power of the federal government and cementing that the federal government has the final say in these issues.”
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Yet even before Texas formally rejoined the nation, the U.S. Supreme Court declared that secession was not legal, and thus, even during the rebellion, Texas continued to be a state. In the 1869 case Texas v. White, the Court held that individual states could not unilaterally secede from the Union and that the acts of the insurgent Texas Legislature — even if ratified by a majority of Texans — were "absolutely null."
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“If there was any constitutional issue resolved by the Civil War, it is that there is no right to secede.”— Antonin Scalia, late Supreme Court Justice
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TL;DR - if you want to secede as a state from the United States, you're gonna have to take it from the United States. By force.
 
gulguran said:
Why has this never been an option for Texas then? Why do they get to secede and Texas couldn't? Just curious all I have ever heard is that it's not possible. I would love for CA to move on and be Mexico again because that is what it is now. The poor bastards that want nothing to do with it will be welcome anywhere in this great nation with open arms. Let the hate run through them!
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I've never seen anyone say one state "get to secede" while another can not, but certainly whenever this kind of discussion takes place the most relevant factors would generally be size and scope of economy, scale of the state, and how much it does or doesn't depend on the federal government for its day to day operations.

By those metrics, California is in much better position than Texas to "go it alone."
Admittedly, some people might argue there are other relevant factors I just haven't heard/seen them listed out except to touch on the two states' economies and argue that even though Texas' economy is only about 2/3 the size of California's that it's growing fast and could conceivably catch up. That tends to ignore how much federal dollars are actually flowing through Texas. It'd be similar to Los Angeles vs. San Diego arguing over leaving the union whereby SD would be hit seriously hard if the Navy and Marines up and pulled out.
 
staknhalo said:
https://www.texastribune.org/2016/06/24/can-texas-legally-secede-united-states/


TL;DR - if you want to secede as a state from the United States, you're gonna have to take it from the United States. By force.
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Oh, well in that case nothing to worry about. CA has zero possibility of people with any real gumption. Bunch of sniveling crybabies that can break a defenseless glass window but I guarantee when the real feeling of wondering whether you will get your head shot off as a result of your beliefs it will all fall apart. My old man was in Vietnam and my friends were in Desert storm and Iraq. I find it incredibly offensive when sniveling little cherubs cry things like "There will be casualties".
 
travbrad said:
Couldn't the same be said for the country as a whole? "too much debt and borrow WAY too much from China"
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Yes, however the country as a whole has been lucky that it has been able to print money to hide these issues, cali and every other state does not have this luxury. The country can not keep doing what it has forever either, it will either have to stop, or it will come to a very bad end.
 
gulguran said:
Oh, well in that case nothing to worry about. CA has zero possibility of people with any real gumption. Bunch of sniveling crybabies that can break a defenseless glass window but I guarantee when the real feeling of wondering whether you will get your head shot off as a result of your beliefs it will all fall apart. My old man was in Vietnam and my friends were in Desert storm and Iraq. I find it incredibly offensive when sniveling little cherubs cry things like "There will be casualties".
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Yes, like I said earlier - this entire issue/subject/article/individual boils down to:

staknhalo said:
TL;DR - I lost and I'm butthurt.

gg ez
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getting tired of seeing all this anti-California shitposting going on

pull your head out of your ass and crack a history book--it's like you don't know how much military we have stationed here in California or how many conservatives we've given the nation

Where the fuck do you think Reagan came from?
 
mope54 said:
-it's like you don't know how much military we have stationed here in California
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LOL

Who's military do you have? Oh, right, the very military you'd have to fight against to secede. They aren't yours - they're the military of the United States - that's who you'd have to fight. Just shows how blind those on your side of the argument are to the very facts and realities before you.
 
TwistedAegis said:
No, he just called 10% of the population rapists and murderers.

And bigotry? Not really. Calling someone deplorable because they support deplorable ideas like banning 1/6 of the population of the Earth from coming into your country isn't bigotry. I understand that it doesn't feel good. But it's an interesting psychology of upsetting the people so upset by the supposed over PC-ness of communication.

There is disagreement, which is healthy, then there is someone running on an authoritarian platform who has threatened retribution to those who disagree with him.
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No such thing as the perfect candidate, otherwise he/she would have a landslide victory.

Restricting immigration from hotspots in the world is reasonable IMO. I wouldn't even want a 1 in 1000 chance a rapist/terrorist/murderer/drug dealer makes it into my home (yes, I consider America my home). Just look at the troubles in Europe. Home grown terrorism is bad enough, we don't need to be letting in external threats as well.

Term limits for congressmen and limits on lobbying are other things Trump has said that I wholly support. I don't completely support his environmental views or the wall at Mexico. However, I believe fixing our political system and terrorism threat to be of greater importance than our environment.
 
staknhalo said:
Just shows how blind those on your side of the argument are to the very facts and realities before you.
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oh yeah, well since you're so keen to talk out your asshole, what's my side of the argument?
 
mope54 said:
getting tired of seeing all this anti-California shitposting going on

pull your head out of your ass and crack a history book--it's like you don't know how much military we have stationed here in California or how many conservatives we've given the nation

Where the fuck do you think Reagan came from?
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Those conservatives aren't the people wanting to exit the nation.
mope54 said:
getting tired of seeing all this anti-California shitposting going on

pull your head out of your ass and crack a history book--it's like you don't know how much military we have stationed here in California or how many conservatives we've given the nation

Where the fuck do you think Reagan came from?
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If that is truly the case, all this nonsense about California exiting the union won't even make it out of California. That military? Think they are going to fight the country they swore to defend for a bunch of crybabies because they didn't win an election? The reality is outside of the larger cities you are right, so I guess we have even less to worry about. I lived in the bay area for 20+ years and I never really had interactions with people that behaved the way these people are so I have to believe it's just a very vocal minority. I mean it doesn't get anymore democratic than San Jose and Santa Clara. I just have a hard time believing that a majority of those same people are now insane.
 
mope54 said:
oh yeah, well since you're so keen to talk out your asshole, what's my side of the argument?
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That people are just butthurt they lost the election, they're shocked that not everyone in the country falls in line with 100% of their views 100%, and they're throwing a fucking tantrum; like children - screaming out ridiculous, asinine things in a fit of rage - like that they even have the possibility of pulling off, or even the right, to secede from the union.
 
I vote to send in the bad ass hardcore battle harden US MARINES along with their apaches, tanks, rifles, f-18, drones, artillery, multiple rocket launchers, tomahawk cruise missiles, us navy battle carrier group to block the seas....


Sit here and watch liberals be crunched!

What a great movie squeal coming!:joyful:
 
Stiletto said:
You are not even nearly as intelligent as you think you are.
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Got it. So it's bigotry to oppose anything by your definition; if someone says all Mexicans are rapists, and a judge shouldn't preside over a case because his parents immigrated from Mexico, and I call them out on it, I'm the bigot - and unintelligent for not getting it to boot!

That's some pretty awesome newspeak right there.
 
Nobified[H] said:
I vote to send in the bad ass hardcore battle harden US MARINES along with their apaches, tanks, rifles, f-18, drones, artillery, multiple rocket launchers, tomahawk cruise missiles, us navy battle carrier group to block the seas....


Sit here and watch liberals be crunched!

What a great movie squeal coming!:joyful:
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Why don't you go look up where most of the marine presence is located and get back to this thread calling all Californians a bunch of sniveling pussies.
 
It's also an interesting mental gymnastic to chant support our troops, blue lives matter - I'm also stockpiling guns and ammo to kill the same troops and police if it comes to it.
 
mope54 said:
Why don't you go look up where most of the marine presence is located and get back to this thread calling all Californians a bunch of sniveling pussies.
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Haha...those navy and marines will out the Californians themselves!
 
damn, I see the kiddies are out of school and posting on the internets while their parents aren't home so I'm going to have to exit this stupid "discussion"
 
TwistedAegis said:
It's also an interesting mental gymnastic to chant support our troops, blue lives matter - I'm also stockpiling guns and ammo to kill the same troops and police if it comes to it.
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Come on man....what other place can we talk shit and have fun at the same time? We live in an awesome country! Don't forget that!!
 
DeathFromBelow said:
Boo hoo I didn't get what I want, burn it all down!

I don't like Trump, but I dislike traitors even more.
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I feel that these same people are the ones that called Obama a monkey and the N-word every chance they got. So basically the one percent of nastiness on the other side. There were people that no matter what were going to just bash the guy and make sure that they wouldn't ever accept anything he could or would do. As a republican I found those people and the politicians that would not even try terrible. Now though we have them on the left showing up too. Same degenerates, different party. Hating some candidate to the p
Stiletto said:
Yeah, tell that to ISIS. Tell that to the IRA, who had the British Army running scared for years. Anyone who thinks that any government is going to crush their citizenry with heavy weapons has been watching too much Hunger Games. Their reputation worldwide would be mud overnight if they quashed people that way. That's why even Turkey has to be careful right now with their cleansing of Kurds.
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Unlike ISIS human governments try not to obliterate the populace. It would take .25 seconds to win if we didn't mind that.
 
TwistedAegis said:
Secession isn't the way to go. But coming from a populous state, it is pretty disheartening that your votes matter so much less due to arbitrary lines on a map.

Our 2 Senate votes represent the say of ~37M people. That same population of people inhabit the bottom 22 states. So ~37M people spread through 22 states get 44 votes in the Senate, meaning their votes are 22x as meaningful as a Californian's in the Senate.

The House is slightly better, but when something has to pass both chambers...it's pretty ridiculous. This is a Texas problem as well, any large state really. But being the largest state by ~33% (37M vs 25M in TX), it's the most massive inequity.
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55 electoral votes is hardly "doesn't matter" it's just a bummer I am sure to always know for a fact what your state is going to do though. It's basically a lay up, no more, no less.
 
TwistedAegis said:
Secession isn't the way to go. But coming from a populous state, it is pretty disheartening that your votes matter so much less due to arbitrary lines on a map.

Our 2 Senate votes represent the say of ~37M people. That same population of people inhabit the bottom 22 states. So ~37M people spread through 22 states get 44 votes in the Senate, meaning their votes are 22x as meaningful as a Californian's in the Senate.

The House is slightly better, but when something has to pass both chambers...it's pretty ridiculous. This is a Texas problem as well, any large state really. But being the largest state by ~33% (37M vs 25M in TX), it's the most massive inequity.
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This was kind of a big argument when the federal government was put together. Small states were worried that they would be bullied by the larger ones.

Having to pass legislation through two chambers of Congress helps to balance the power. It intends to guarantee that the legislation being passed is beneficial to the entire nation.

Of course the original idea was to keep federal power limited to a handful of necessary obligations, leaving the states free to regulate themselves as their citizens saw fit. This principle is now seen as a heresy to your typical modern American, who now seems to think the point of the federal government is to get into everybody's business.
 
Everyone needs to calm the fuck down. No-one is seceding from anyone & it isn't the end of the world. Yes, I think Trump is an arsehole (and it will be a long four years) but I still think half the shit he has said was just to get himself into the oval office - he is a flip flop and many presidents have back-tracked.

To be honest, I think he is shitting himself now as the reality of being the President has hit him.....I'm sure the daily security briefings etc has added to it. I just hope he isn't Putin's little lap dog bitch as he seems to brown-nose him every time Russia is mentioned.
 
Nobified[H] said:
Haha...those navy and marines will out the Californians themselves!
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Show me a single Marine, one that is talking about seceding. Show me one that is rioting and breaking windows and burning the flag. The people that are doing this are sniveling pussies.
mope54 said:
Why don't you go look up where most of the marine presence is located and get back to this thread calling all Californians a bunch of sniveling pussies.
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It's Veterans day, let's not equate people that give a shit about this country by serving with the people looting and acting like idiots. Show me a single Marine, one that is talking about seceding. Show me one that is rioting and breaking windows and burning the flag. The people that are doing this are sniveling pussies. Even comparing the two in the same post is absolutely disingenuous.
jwcalla said:
This was kind of a big argument when the federal government was put together. Small states were worried that they would be bullied by the larger ones.

Having to pass legislation through two chambers of Congress helps to balance the power. It intends to guarantee that the legislation being passed is beneficial to the entire nation.

Of course the original idea was to keep federal power limited to a handful of necessary obligations, leaving the states free to regulate themselves as their citizens saw fit. This principle is now seen as a heresy to your typical modern American, who now seems to think the point of the federal government is to get into everybody's business.
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Agree, if you look at the map, if it wasn't for the electoral system this would be the united states of florida and california!
 
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Whach said:
I just hope he isn't Putin's little lap dog bitch as he seems to brown-nose him every time Russia is mentioned.
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Sorry, but most of us want to have friendly relations with the Russian people and are sick of these stupid Soros wars.

Frankly, I think we're fed up with these "brother wars". We're done falling for the "Let's you and him fight" narrative of TPTB.
 
gulguran said:
Show me a single Marine, one that is talking about seceding. Show me one that is rioting and breaking windows and burning the flag. The people that are doing this are sniveling pussies.


It's Veterans day, let's not equate people that give a shit about this country by serving with the people looting and acting like idiots. Show me a single Marine, one that is talking about seceding. Show me one that is rioting and breaking windows and burning the flag. The people that are doing this are sniveling pussies. Even comparing the two in the same post is absolutely disingenuous.


Agree, if you look at the map, if it wasn't for the electoral system this would be the united states of florida and california!
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No you misunderstood me. I was referring the navy and marines on the side of the constitution...not the cry babies.
 
jwcalla said:
Sorry, but most of us want to have friendly relations with the Russian people and are sick of these stupid Soros wars.

Frankly, I think we're fed up with these "brother wars". We're done falling for the "Let's you and him fight" narrative of TPTB.
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Exactly - the American people don't have a problem with the Russian people. The Russian people don't have a problem with American people.

The American elites have a problem with the Russian elites, and the Russian elites with the American elites. They fuel a propaganda war against each other to try and brainwash their 'subjects'.
 
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