President Proposes Study On Media Violence

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I got something the government can study and it won't cost them $10 million to do it either. :rolleyes:

A memorandum ordering the CDC research is just one of 23 executive actions that the president can take without help from the legislative branch. It is not directed at video games explicitly, but rather a general research on the causes of gun violence. He requested that Congress put $10 million into research on the possible connections between media and real-life violence.
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Well, he's doing something, I guess.

Hasn't this been studied already?

Give me 1/10th of that budget, get a bunch of [H] people together. We'll see how violent media (movies, games, music) and beer affects us all.

I think that I may have watched Highlander and whacked my sister too hard with a plastic sword as we were sword fighting once. But, I don't think it was that movie, because we had those swords before it came out.
 
Because more knee jerk money wastes are just what we need. Especially when the research has already been done proving no link. You are never going to convince people to stop trying to blame something else, personal responsibility doesn't exist in most Americans vocabulary.
 
Ur_Mom said:
Well, he's doing something, I guess.

Hasn't this been studied already?

Give me 1/10th of that budget, get a bunch of [H] people together. We'll see how violent media (movies, games, music) and beer affects us all.

I think that I may have watched Highlander and whacked my sister too hard with a plastic sword as we were sword fighting once. But, I don't think it was that movie, because we had those swords before it came out.
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FBI does it every year.
 
"possible connection"?!?

I, and LOTS of other kids I grew up with played violent video games, watched horror movies non-stop, and now I wouldn't harm anyone. Didn't back then either.

The reason we have violence is because someone or something pushes someone's buttons too much, and that person breaks. Simple as that.
 
IMO, who cares if there is a connection. Parents need to monitor their kids and raise them.

I really love all these NRA and those trying to protect the 2nd amendment are trying to throw the 1st amendment under the bus to do so.
 
Do we really have that many instances of putting birds in rubber bands and shooting buildings with them?
 
travanx said:
Do we really have that many instances of putting birds in rubber bands and shooting buildings with them?
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well shooting birds into buildings to cause them to tumble... oh snap, didn't realize Rovio were complete rip off artists.
 
I think they would be better served trying to figure out how to identify crazy people ... if normal people could be inspired to commit acts of violence by violent media we would have thousands of shootings a week ... why don't we ... BECAUSE MOST PEOPLE AREN'T CRAZY ;)

Bottom line ... crazy people do crazy stuff and they can be manipulated by lots of different triggers ... figure out who has their wires crossed and you MIGHT and that is a BIG MIGHT be able to prevent some violence ... but normal people will continue to be normal people (so please government, leave us alone) :cool:
 
It's a fair concern that deserves attention. It's probably hard to tell by what you hear by casual discussion or media reports, but research on this issue has been very mixed. There's a lot of dispute regarding both the quality of the research and whether certain trends demonstrate alone a casual effect.

To me it doesn't seem like a little Ozzy, a Tarantino movie & a little Killzone 3 is that big a deal, so I wouldn't be surprised if later on they come to more of a consensus agreeing with me, But that's just anecdotal and not a substitute for research. Besides that, they might stumble on some other causative factor in the course of their research that correlates to violent behavior. You never know what you're going to find accidentally until someone's pouring over data and notices something that's slipped by before.

Anybody remember the thing where they spent $700,000 studied cow emissions? It seems funny to say it and was almost universally lambasted and held up for ridicule, but I don't think anyone can question the overall product of agricultural research in the last 60 years. What a lot of armchair critics didn't realize was that UNH has a very old an establish dairy research specialty and this was one of many studied, and this particular one also focused on other dairy farm emissions and toxins and how they can best be dealt with, and more specifically, building software to achieve that. But the American public at large--who, let's face it, isn't exactly world powerhouse in science--doesn't hear anything but "$700k on cow farts."

I think if you made a list raking the worst ways government can waste money, commissioning research projects in general are going to be pretty low. As it applies here, this particular administration is pretty friendly toward the entertainment industries, so I don't see it as a witchhunt to blame video games and movies either. The behavioral sciences field isn't one of the best funded in general either.
 
Is the study going to conclude anything about handguns, which constitute the bulk of gun violence? Or is it just going to blame semi-automatic rifles, that were responsible for less then 5% of gun murders in the US last year?
 
I'm sure a completely unrelated to money from entertainment industries, and under the table corruption won't swing this one way or the other.

Although everyone that has gone on a shooting spree, or beaten to death another person were driven to it, or had a mental history that should have set off alarms, but slipped through the net and continued towards their ultimate, and in most cases final goal.

I'm sure Hitler blamed vegetables and his artistic streak for the mass genocide of WWII, you know since video games didn't exist. And Frans Ferdinand wasn't the reason for WWI kicking off, no it was a cheese sandwich that had gone bad....Nope nothing to with people doing evil s#!t because they want to or they are insane.
 
Research like this isn't produced in a week. First you have to get your proposals drawn up, submitted, reviewed, and then if approved the funding needs to be allocated. Research teams get assembled and so on. Then the actual work researching and collecting your data begins, then process review, then evaluation of your results, then publication, then you've got the whole peer review bit, then further analysis as needed. Something like this might well last beyond the current presidency and certainly wouldn't be timely enough to affect things like the gun control debate, at least in the immediate future.

Again I personally don't think there's that much correlation if any between violent media and violent behavior, in fact it might be something of a stress release for some folks. That said, that's only my anecdotal opinion and not my field. I'd much rather trust explanations from the scientific community rather than my best guess, or leave it to industry claims, or politicians, or activist groups, or the Editorial page, or public opinion.
 
I agree with you 100%. Personally I don't think there is much of a link, but to be honest I think that a lot of the research that has been done on the subject in the past has been done at the behest of a party (on one side or the other) with something to gain. An unbiased look at it certainly wouldn't hurt and might end some of the rampant finger pointing by people (including the NRA) everytime something bad happens.
 
Hopefully they mean media as in over sensualization by news reporters causing violent crimes to rise. The world is a lot more fucked up when you start giving troubled people on the edge ideas like shooting up a school.
 
kbrickley said:
I think they would be better served trying to figure out how to identify crazy people ... if normal people could be inspired to commit acts of violence by violent media we would have thousands of shootings a week ... why don't we ... BECAUSE MOST PEOPLE AREN'T CRAZY ;)

Bottom line ... crazy people do crazy stuff and they can be manipulated by lots of different triggers ... figure out who has their wires crossed and you MIGHT and that is a BIG MIGHT be able to prevent some violence ... but normal people will continue to be normal people (so please government, leave us alone) :cool:
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Still "innocent until proven guilty". We can't limit peoples rights simply because there is a possibly they are at a greater risk of commiting a certain act. Not unless we change some basic principles of this country.

The easy method is to take away the guns.

The hard method is to develop a culture that doesn't think about using them.

One method allows the government to have more control and over sight. The other allows us to be more self reliant.
 
I'm also not sure why the NRA is demonized. They are trying to uphold a law. That is their only goal.

Why are we upset about a group that is trying so hard to make the federal government uphold a law which the federal government created? Do we dislike the NRA or what they stand for?
 
The NRA pressured Congress members in 1996 to block the study of gun violence (by defunding programs), for gun control or not, by the CDC.

Ars believes that video games won't be the focus since it's pretty well established, even mentioned in a SCOTUS decision (video games sale law case), that there are links between video games and violence. But this story makes a good distraction. ;)

The NRA will go back to 1996 mode to prevent any studying of gun violence by the CDC. Because they care so much.
 
el gonso said:
It's a fair concern that deserves attention. [...]

I think if you made a list raking the worst ways government can waste money, commissioning research projects in general are going to be pretty low. As it applies here, this particular administration is pretty friendly toward the entertainment industries, so I don't see it as a witchhunt to blame video games and movies either. The behavioral sciences field isn't one of the best funded in general either.
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Thank you for writing such a succinct and well-written post, this is exactly how I feel about this.

Of course the armchair politicians on the internet lambast it, they always do. But what would they actually do and accomplish? So if a kneejerk ban on something goes out, that's bad. When nothing is done, that's bad. When appropriate studies are done by an agency that knows how to do them, so that future action may be undertaken with science to back it up.. that's bad too? :rolleyes:
 
Also, just so there's no ambiguity about where the political forces are lining up in this debate as it relates to gun control, the NRA's made their position very clear. There are real press conference quotes from NRA Executive VP Wayne LaPierre, from just last month:

"There exists in this country, sadly, a callous, corrupt, and corrupting shadow industry that sells and stows violence against its own people. Through vicious, violent video games, with names like Bulletstorm, Grand Theft Auto, Mortal Kombat, and Splatterhouse. And here's one [with extra outraged and dramatic pause -EG]: Kindergarten Killers... it's been online for ten years."

“I mean, we have blood-soaked films out there. American Psycho, Natural Born Killers, that are aired like propaganda loops on splatterdays , and every single day.”

“A thousand music videos—and you all know this—portray life as a joke. And they play murder, portray murder, as a way of life. And then they all have the nerve to call it entertainment.”

These are direct, unedited quotes from a prepared speech, read live. I’ll stop there, but there’s plenty more, including claims of research the NRA people have done and the old pornography comparison. If you doubt my transcription or think I’m cherry picking quotes out-of-context, here's a video of the entire thing: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Lgu9f-qd_Uo

So this is the sort of thing being put out there by a major political lobby with a large membership, and should help people who don’t really follow this see the context, namely why a sitting democrat POTUS would be motivated to commission a study like this. Specifically now, and with a focus on how media relates or doesn’t relate to gun violence. From some of the general comments I’ve read attached to various articles (not so much here thankfully), it seems a lot of people are misinformed and reading this backwards, as if this is some kind of attack by Obama on video games.

But this is what we have researchers for, so we don’t have to depend on special interests groups and half-ass web articles. Unfortunately, Congress effectively imposed a funding freeze in 1996 (supported by the NRA) effectively killing research into the causes of gun violence by the CDC and other government organizations, now that looks to be lifted soon. But wherever a person might line up on the matter politically, we all benefit from being more informed. Some people might change their mind about their position as we learn more. There’s still a lot to learn about this stuff and stifling research shouldn’t be acceptable to anyone.
 
lollerwaffle said:
Thank you for writing such a succinct and well-written post, this is exactly how I feel about this.

Of course the armchair politicians on the internet lambast it, they always do. But what would they actually do and accomplish? So if a kneejerk ban on something goes out, that's bad. When nothing is done, that's bad. When appropriate studies are done by an agency that knows how to do them, so that future action may be undertaken with science to back it up.. that's bad too? :rolleyes:
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But has this same lame ass study been done to death? It's pretty much the same every time. It's like spending money to verify a circle is round with no new evidence to the contrrary.
 
Not to mention that there various other reasons for people to just go do stupid things, like being pushed to their wits ends with taxes or oppression by government/corporations or even dumbass lawsuits.
 
It's studies like this that give people the urge to kill.

There really should be a limit on this sort of thing.
 
pothb said:
But has this same lame ass study been done to death? It's pretty much the same every time. It's like spending money to verify a circle is round with no new evidence to the contrrary.
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But that's just it, NRA and other conservative groups aren't satisfied with the results, and are blaming video games and media. They aren't happy with the results other then their own in-house studies. So now, Obama is offering to play ball and test their theories using government-funded research.

The trick is, that's going to require lifting the ban on gun violence research to get the full picture, which the NRA doesn't want to happen. So they shot themselves in the foot a bit (so to speak) with this line they're taking. They're the ones making the dispute and helping to open the door to gov't-funded gun violence research.

Now nobody really knows what the CDC or other gov't organizations might conclude one way or the other, but that's why you do research. What is clear is that the NRA doesn't really doesn't want it done, which is an odd position to take if they actually feel that their numbers will hold up. If they believe what they say, or even half of it, they should be demanding gun research instead of trying to suppress it.
 
News flash for the government, the overwhelming majority of gun violence in this country and in many third world countries is born of the government's own policy of prohibition. The black market economy which it gives birth to does not rely on contracts and lawyers to settle disputes, or secure turf. They cannot call the police to solve disputes. Their tool of choice is the firearm.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DE5i7RVHEPU

Crimes of passion committed with firearms, and mass killings committed by psychopaths, are a statistical minority.
 
Well, maybe if someone does a good and proper study with the imprint of the government, the people claiming a link exists can finally shut the f-ck up.
 
Why does it cost $10 million to fabricate some info? Is the price tag on the project suppose to legitimize the crap they are going to come up with?
 
Stiletto said:
Is the study going to conclude anything about handguns, which constitute the bulk of gun violence? Or is it just going to blame semi-automatic rifles, that were responsible for less then 5% of gun murders in the US last year?
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Last time I checked, the murderers were 100% responsible for these murders. Now, if you want to talk about the percentages that certain weapons were used in such crimes, we can do that. ;)
 
blackscreen said:
Last time I checked, the murderers were 100% responsible for these murders. Now, if you want to talk about the percentages that certain weapons were used in such crimes, we can do that. ;)
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I fully agree, but my goal is to point out the hypocrisy of those who claim that the other side "doesn't care about gun violence/victims/Sandy Hook parents/etc". If the gun grabbers really cared about gun violence, they wouldn't be trying to prevent 5% of gun murders through bans...they'd be trying to prevent 75% of gun murders through bans.

Unfortunately, they tried that in Chicago and DC, and they became hellholes. They know it won't work(well, apparently Andrew Cuomo and the NY Senate are unaware).
 
westrock2000 said:
I'm also not sure why the NRA is demonized. They are trying to uphold a law. That is their only goal.

Why are we upset about a group that is trying so hard to make the federal government uphold a law which the federal government created? Do we dislike the NRA or what they stand for?
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Ask CBS anchor Bob Schieffer, who just did a broadcast where he compared the fight against the KKK and the Nazis to the fight against the NRA. Yes...some people downright despise what the NRA stands for, and they frankly hate that they have to keep saying "I believe in the Second Amendment"...because they really don't, and they're too chickenshit to say it. Wonder why that is?
 
I think everyone on this forum is aware of the many studies that's been done in the past but we're all watching and reading tech news all the time. Your average Jane and Joe don't. We probably know what the results of the president's tests will be, but he has to at least put on the show that he's covering all bases - the known and unknown. After these studies are done, even more people will then realize that video games and media sources does not inspire violence amongst the populace.

Yes he's going to do a few things some of you disagree with - assault weapons ban and maximum bullet requirement and so on, but I think we can rest assured that video game and media violence are here to stay.
 
kbrickley said:
I think they would be better served trying to figure out how to identify crazy people ... if normal people could be inspired to commit acts of violence by violent media we would have thousands of shootings a week ... why don't we ... BECAUSE MOST PEOPLE AREN'T CRAZY ;)

Bottom line ... crazy people do crazy stuff and they can be manipulated by lots of different triggers ... figure out who has their wires crossed and you MIGHT and that is a BIG MIGHT be able to prevent some violence ... but normal people will continue to be normal people (so please government, leave us alone) :cool:
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That's debatable. Last election I thought about 40% of the population was crazy ;)
 
Azhar said:
Yes he's going to do a few things some of you disagree with - assault weapons ban and maximum bullet requirement and so on, but I think we can rest assured that video game and media violence are here to stay.
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Oh good. He's limiting our rights to real firearms, not video game firearms. Thank Christ the important shit is safe! :rolleyes:
 
Fictional violence isn't the problem. It's the news who makes mass murderers famous, creating more mass murderers.
 
My favorite part of the President's speech was when he said..."if we can save just one life, it will be worth it." So, in keeping with the spirit of the message and his executive orders:

Outlaw all video games because any video game could cause a seizure, which could be deadly. While we're at it, let's also outlaw all video broadcasts, because there might be one person out there that might die from a seizure induced by flashing images on a screen. Next, let's outlaw all vehicles, because they are involved in significantly more deaths annually than guns...Small candies must be made illegal because someone could choke to death. Electricity is dangerous and could kill someone, let's get rid of that too. What about trees? One of them could fall over on someone...Where does the list end?

Enough with the sarcastic rant. On a more serious note, we narrowly averted the fiscal cliff by staving off any really tough decisions until later, so let's distract everyone by taking away their guns. And another thing, if saving one life is justification to enact these various mandates, why is it not a sufficient argument that we could save at least one life by defending ourselves against a home invasion, or providing food for our family, or instilling our children with a sense of responsibility and a quality of character so that they do not go out and shoot people in the first place?
 
Azhar said:
That's debatable. Last election I thought about 40% of the population was crazy ;)
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Actually it was closer to 98%. Anybody who voted for either of those dimwits help sustain this fucked-up government.
 
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