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Need build advice for a new F@H box

W.Feather said:
@ this guy- GTFO off these forums with your core hack, its been discussed and is not supported here.
Click to expand...

No corehack, that is regular SMP in windows. :) With a corehack I'd be over 100k I'd think.

Nathan_P said:
must be those A4 wu that do ~30-50 secs a frame, Project 80xx i *think*

Which client/OS are you using to get those - i have run every combo of the v6 client/OS and never get any A4 WU? Maybe its a v7 only thing?
Click to expand...

I have switched back and forthe between v6 and v7, cant remember exactly which got those units though. 30-40 sec a frame does sound about right though, it was hauling through those WU's in 1.5-2hrs or so

This is with the 3930K system in my sig.
 
Now that HFM works with v7, i upgraded on my daily driver, got nothing but a4 units since, quickest I have posted is 44 sec tpf
 
Nathan_P said:
must be those A4 wu that do ~30-50 secs a frame, Project 80xx i *think*
Click to expand...

On the 8031, 8032, 8033, and 8034 WU, both my 460 GTX and 275 GTX are making about 55 and 57 TPF, making 9600 to 10600 PPD respectively. These cards use to make about 10K to 12K PPD before these WUs come along.
 
402blownstroker said:
On the 8031, 8032, 8033, and 8034 WU, both my 460 GTX and 275 GTX are making about 55 and 57 TPF, making 9600 to 10600 PPD respectively. These cards use to make about 10K to 12K PPD before these WUs come along.
Click to expand...

Yeah those WU suck too from what i have been reading, however we're on about the 801x core a4 SMP wu;)
 
You guys are talking gobbledegook to me... :p I can only use real-world anchors, like "you will get as much folding performance from an i5 2400 as you would a GTS 5600 ti" or something like that.


I've gotten the impression that the awesome new processors will do great folding work for less watts than a geforce card will, so I have some options open to me.

I like the idea of the 2120T *35W* processor just staying on 24/7 and folding, as opposed to an i5 or i7 being on only 8 hours overnight. UNLESS the performance difference between them is more than double, as I'm figuring.

If the i3 gets "1000 points" [number out of a hat] in an hour, an i5 gets 1500 in the same hour, and the i7 gets 1800 in an hour - it would be more beneficial for the i3 to run 24/7 than the i7 to run only 1/3 of the time.

Get my thinking? :)

I need YOU guys to tell me what kind of numbers certain hardware will put out, so I can build the appropriate system.

I want to dump this 140W AMD monster. :p
 
Sorry we did get a bit off topic there...

I've done some googling and have managed to find this thread over at overclockers.com discussing a very similar thing- i3 & i5 PPD

I don't know how much of a "power budget" you have in mind but personally i'd get a 2600k, load windows and v7 of the client and let it run. Power draw with a mild overclock, 1 hard disk and using the onchip gpu will be around ~200w from the wall
 
Good read... apparently the i7 can do something the i5 can't (more than just a hyperthreading thing...) so it gets a massive bonus.

That's a good reasoning to go the route of i7, even if the higher energy use means only running it overnight or when I'm playing with it. They used the number of 2.5x better than an i5.... that is a HUGE jump! You'd think with that big of a difference, you guys would be really pushing "i7 or bust!" :D
 
BlueMax said:
You guys are talking gobbledegook to me...
Click to expand...

Sorry. We are experts at gobbledegook. I predict you will be one day as well.

However, first things first.

Have you started folding? Have you turned in any work units on the current hardware that you own right now?

Make sure you enter your user name, passkey, and team number (33).

Instead of asking about a dedicated folding machine, I would ask about what kind of new computer you really need which you can also fold on. Do you want a new daily driver? Do you need a new gaming machine? Do you need an HTPC? Does your spouse or best friend need a computer? If so, work in that direction. Find a true need to fulfill before jumping into the folding game. After doing that for a time you will find that you have the answers you need.

Welcome to team 33, and welcome to our forums. Glad to have you here. Most all of us are pleasant and helpful. :)





 
I'll actually gear the new rig for folding FIRST, other needs second.

If the video card did more work than CPU, I'd budget more for a fancy video card (more than I need.)
If the CPU did more/better work than the video card, I'd budget more than I need for the CPU.


I have a 140W AMD 4-core w/ 550ti video card right now... I'll dump it all in favor of a far better box as a tribute to my dad who just died from cancer.
 
BlueMax, I have gone through the road you are going through rignt now little by little and now I have 7 box and 14 clients folding 24/7 after 10 years of folding. My power bill is over $200/month just for folding alone :D
Back to the topic ..
I suggest you put out a buget for power draw per month and cost of a system. Put both of those number here so everyone can help.
I list a few example I have for you to see:

3930k folding linux at 4.6ghz and it gives me 130k ppd drawing 400W
SR2 dual xenon folding linux at 4ghz gives me 230k ppd drawing 600W
4P AMD 6128 folding linux at 2.4ghz gives me 300k ppd drawing 600W

Hope that helps.
 
Exactly why I was hoping to see:

i7 2600k = xxxK ppd
i5 2500k = xxxK ppd
i3 2100 = xxxK ppd

Just an easy-to-understand idea of how much difference I can expect between them to guide me to making the most reasonable purchase.

If the i7 2600k only gave 20% more than the i5 2500k, I couldn't justify an extra $100.... but I sure could if the difference were big!
 
All those PPD numbers are based on folding 24/7. If you fold less than 24/7 your PPD numbers will be dramatically less because of how the QRB works.
 
ChelseaOilman said:
All those PPD numbers are based on folding 24/7. If you fold less than 24/7 your PPD numbers will be dramatically less because of how the QRB works.
Click to expand...

hmmm.... good to note.

That means I have the option of:
i3 2120T @ 35W
i5 2400s @ 65W
i5 2500k @ 95W
i7 2600s @ 65W
i7 2600k @ 95W

or stick with my current mobo (EDIT: sold the combo tonight.) :)

...I just want to get the most folding for my money and wattage.
 
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2600s is also a decent choice, similar to regular 2600 but only 65w. However a k series will allow overlooking, which can net quite a bit performance.

Going to an i3 would be a pretty big hit, as you go from 4 cores to 2.
 
Lucky I do have this

Intel(R) Core(TM) i3-2100 CPU @ 3.10GHz -> 7600 ppd runing linux OS

faster ram nets higher ppd. The above i3 uses cas 7 ddr3 1333

lower clock speed nets much lower ppd

keep in mind that a 2600k overclock draw about 200W at the wall.
 
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Actually v7 is the easiest to set up. But to answer your question my 2700K @ 4.8Ghz get's between 20,000 ppd and 26,000 PPD (Points Per Day) on the latest smp WU's and my GTX 580 @ 925Mhz gets between 16,000 PPD and 27,000 PPD on the latest GPU WU's. The 2700k uses far less power than the GTX 580. ;)

CPU / SMP

Project ID: 7903
Core: GRO-A4
Credit: 766
Frames: 100
Number of Frames Observed: 300

Min. Time / Frame : 00:04:12 - 20,284.9 PPD
Avg. Time / Frame : 00:04:16 - 19,811.3 PPD
Project ID: 8001
Core: GRO-A4
Credit: 88.59
Frames: 100
Number of Frames Observed: 300

Min. Time / Frame : 00:00:28 - 24,742.9 PPD
Avg. Time / Frame : 00:00:32 - 20,251.8 PPD
Project ID: 8012
Core: GRO-A4
Credit: 180.6
Frames: 100
Number of Frames Observed: 300

Min. Time / Frame : 00:00:52 - 28,423.7 PPD
Avg. Time / Frame : 00:00:55 - 26,130.1 PPD

Project ID: 8013
Core: GRO-A4
Credit: 180.6
Frames: 100
Number of Frames Observed: 300

Min. Time / Frame : 00:00:51 - 29,263.7 PPD
Avg. Time / Frame : 00:00:56 - 25,433.3 PPD

GPU

Project ID: 8023
Core: OPENMM_OPENCL
Credit: 1200
Frames: 100
Number of Frames Observed: 300

Min. Time / Frame : 00:01:01 - 16,996.7 PPD
Avg. Time / Frame : 00:01:02 - 16,722.6 PPD

Project ID: 8024
Core: GRO-A4
Credit: 185
Frames: 100
Number of Frames Observed: 300

Min. Time / Frame : 00:00:52 - 28,933.6 PPD
Avg. Time / Frame : 00:00:58 - 24,562.1 PPD

Project ID: 8033
Core: OPENMMGPU
Credit: 3843.4
Frames: 100
Number of Frames Observed: 300

Min. Time / Frame : 00:02:07 - 26,147.2 PPD
Avg. Time / Frame : 00:02:07 - 26,147.2 PPD

Project ID: 8034
Core: OPENMMGPU
Credit: 3843.4
Frames: 100
Number of Frames Observed: 300

Min. Time / Frame : 00:01:59 - 27,905.0 PPD
Avg. Time / Frame : 00:02:00 - 27,672.5 PPD
 
Grandpa_01 said:
Actually v7 is the easiest to set up. But to answer your question my 2700K @ 4.8Ghz get's between 20,000 ppd and 26,000 PPD (Points Per Day) on the latest smp WU's and my GTX 580 @ 925Mhz gets between 16,000 PPD and 27,000 PPD on the latest GPU WU's. The 2700k uses far less power than the GTX 580. ;)
Click to expand...

This.... this right here... Thank you! It's nice to have some reference numbers like this!
The i7 2600k will be 3-4x the performance of an i3 2100. That's worth the extra wattage! I'll also sell off this GTX550 ti and get myself a nice new AMD card which will be low power and 100% fanless. Silence is golden!

One tempting aspect of the 2120T is that at 35W you might even be able to run it fanless - just a big heatsink! Still - priorities...

Now I wonder how the 2500k stacks up! It's down to those two!
 
My estimate the i3 2120T will get max 5k ppd

I wouldn't get rid of that nice video card if I were you. If it is not folding it won't draw any power other than idle power. Not to mention you can play game from time to time and even use it to fold and get more points. AMD video card is really bad at folding and it use one full cpu core while folding.

Too much calculation might lead nowhere if you really want to fold.
 
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BlueMax said:
Now I wonder how the 2500k stacks up! It's down to those two!
Click to expand...

The 2500k does not have HT the 2600K does. The HT does make a noticeable difference in performance on folding applications. I can't give you exact numbers, but I know people tested the 2600k with HT off and on when it came out to see what produced better PPD and HT on was best.
 
GAH!! The buyer for my system pulled out on me...

Which do you think would give better numbers - an i5 2400s or an AMD 6-core 95W processor (I forget the model.)

I should just get the 6-core and use it until I can justify the cost of a new rig. As much as I want to dedicate a folding rig in his memory, I shouldn't eat Kroff Dinner every day to afford it. :)
 
That could be interesting. I got a 960t(4 core) with 6 unlocked and running at 3.8ghz. Getting 12-15k ppd on 5 cores under win2k8. Also runs as a file server and hyper-v host.
 
sc0tty8 said:
That could be interesting. I got a 960t(4 core) with 6 unlocked and running at 3.8ghz. Getting 12-15k ppd on 5 cores under win2k8. Also runs as a file server and hyper-v host.
Click to expand...

Heeeyyyyy.... nothing wrong with those numbers at all! I was expecting a lot worse.

That settles it. For the next 6mos or so, I'll move this unlocked 142W quad up to a real 6-core 95W unit. I can even keep using my huge, silent cooler. :)

Sure, the games would like an Intel processor more, but I should be doing more productive things anyway. ;)

Thank you!
 
sc0tty8 said:
That could be interesting. I got a 960t(4 core) with 6 unlocked and running at 3.8ghz. Getting 12-15k ppd on 5 cores under win2k8. Also runs as a file server and hyper-v host.
Click to expand...

Mine 960T bought at Microcenter for $99 + Asus MB $10 + tax = $115.
Unlocked to 6 cores running at 4.0GHz or a little less, pulling 250-270W and I got around 22Kppd under linuxfah.
 
OS depends on what else you use the machine for, IIRC you were thinking of making this a dedicated folder in which case the answer is easy - ubuntu, follow musky's guide and you'll be set up in no time.
 
Ideally, I'd like it to be my one-and-only. :p I can leave it on 24/7 but I'd also play a few games when I come home from a long day at work.

For that reason, Windows is much preferred... is the OS that big of a difference? Are we talking 10%? 50%? Double points?
 
Well on windows my x6 at 3.2ghz was making about 11k ppd if not using it, about 8-9k if i was (depending, some games would make it worse or you would have to shut down).
 
Nathan_P said:
Well on windows my x6 at 3.2ghz was making about 11k ppd if not using it, about 8-9k if i was (depending, some games would make it worse or you would have to shut down).
Click to expand...

X6 i7 (12 threads) or x6 AMD? How much would that 11k be under Ubuntu?
 
Hey.... revisiting the idea of the 2600S for the lower wattage...

...from what I've read, even a 2600k needs to be overclocked to a certain level in order to reach a critical speed point at which it's able to perform a specific job in time. Anyone familiar with this or would a slower-speed, not-overlocked i7 2600S (8 thread) perform extremely well?


Really, REALLY appreciate all the advice, folks. If I'm going to run this 24/7, I like the idea of the lower wattage and cooler running. OTOH, if it won't do the job fast enough to get the bonus points, why bother?


THANK YOU!! (Folding for team 33 now! Points rolling in!)
 
BlueMax said:
Hey.... revisiting the idea of the 2600S for the lower wattage...

...from what I've read, even a 2600k needs to be overclocked to a certain level in order to reach a critical speed point at which it's able to perform a specific job in time. Anyone familiar with this or would a slower-speed, not-overlocked i7 2600S (8 thread) perform extremely well?


Really, REALLY appreciate all the advice, folks. If I'm going to run this 24/7, I like the idea of the lower wattage and cooler running. OTOH, if it won't do the job fast enough to get the bonus points, why bother?


THANK YOU!! (Folding for team 33 now! Points rolling in!)
Click to expand...

You could get a 2600K and underclock/undervolt it. This would achieve the same goal, and also give you the option to overclock later if you want. If you are doing SMP, a 2600K even at low clocks would be more than enough to get bonus.
 
Just to revisit, I started using the CPU client instead of my 550ti... I'm getting about 6000-8000 ppd on my unlocked AMDx4 3.3GHz.

Missed out on a few good deals... oh well. :)
 
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Edited OP: It's buying time!! I'll likely grab 'em tonight!

LAST QUESTION! i5 2500k vs. i7 2700k..... will the HyperThreading really make much difference now that -bigadv is out of reach for both?

Is the difference noticable and worth the $100 difference?

THANK YOU!
 
for folding exclusively you will have ~50% + production @ same clock speed as the 2500k (if i you use the 2700k), IIRC the HT Threads dont have the same performance as the real cores, which is why it wont be double at the same clock speed
 
ya, its completly a personal preference, both will fold decently, one will just fold better than the other ;) if its worth the price premium thats your call, for a pure folding rig, i would save for something a bit more efficient, but if its got other purposes, as I said its whatever goes with your needs
 
I wish I could justify the extra $250+ for a dual LGA2011 board... then get one i7 quad and a second one later.

I still might... I can always sit on this cash until it gets bigger. ;) It might be worth it if -bigadv is important enough for research... I want to really help find a cure so I don't die like my father.
 
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