ugh... noisy audio, do I need usb isolator or ac ground loop isolator or ???

A

atarione

2[H]4U
Joined
Mar 17, 2011
Messages
2,297
Well, for the first time ever I seem to have electrical noise issues in my pc audio set up.

and of course being the idiot I am I have too much stuff which has pro's and cons.

So there is a clicking sound coming thru headphones or speakers with several of my dacs and not the one. The sound changes with pc activity (mouse keyboard ..etc) but it will be present when not interactiving with the computer at all as well.

I have the following
  1. SMSL SU-1 which has the clicking in USB or optical when getting usb power from the computer, using either onboard USB ports or a powered hub. (no noise on optical when powering dac with a power bank)
  2. On board audio has the same noise on 3.5mm jack and on Optical using the SMSL SU-1 when device is powered by computer's usb.
  3. Steinberg UR22mkII doesn't have the clicking noise it is powered by external wall usb power. However oddly the Steinberg doesn't seem to get the clicking when switching over to PC power either?
So my question: Do I need a USB noise isolator or do I need ac noise / conditioning? or something else.

Items I've looked at so far
ELAC Protek 8
Topping HS02

I don't think a ground loop hum isolator will help because i think it is electrical noise not a 60hz hum ?

Somehow after all these years this is the 1st time I have actually had this problem so I welcome any guidance / advice.

Thank you.
 
As an Amazon Associate, HardForum may earn from qualifying purchases.
Sure sounds like it's coming from the system, anyway.

Does it still occur if all USB devices are disconnected?

If not, then does it happen no matter which USB port you use?

If it happens only with specific ports, check that they are properly grounded to the case. The rear IO ports should have a tab from the IO shield contacting the metal outside of the port. The front ports may have a wire soldered to the outside, if they aren't attached to a metal part of the case with screws.

If none of the above applies, then check the ground on the outlet, and ensure the PSU has a good connection/cable, and is secured with metal screws to the case.
 
Nobu said:
Sure sounds like it's coming from the system, anyway.

Does it still occur if all USB devices are disconnected?

If not, then does it happen no matter which USB port you use?

If it happens only with specific ports, check that they are properly grounded to the case. The rear IO ports should have a tab from the IO shield contacting the metal outside of the port. The front ports may have a wire soldered to the outside, if they aren't attached to a metal part of the case with screws.

If none of the above applies, then check the ground on the outlet, and ensure the PSU has a good connection/cable, and is secured with metal screws to the case.
Click to expand...
The outlet should be grounded fine, as my previous build (ryzen 5 3600 had no issue like this which the same case and powersupply). I have a bad hip so, if I am honestly I haven't dug into crawling under my desk to start disconnecting all the USB, yet.

I have tried a few different ports for the SMSL SU-1 and the issue persists as well as different ports for the FiiO dac...

Over the weekend I may get some help with getting under the desk to get to the pc itself and double check the screws for the power supply are properly secure still, haven't worked loose or whatever? and I have an outlet tester so I will give that a go as well.

The I/O shield is integrated w/ my motherboard (Z690 Aorus Elite AX )

unfortunately with the mobility issue / pain of my hip currently diving into troubleshooting this is a wee bit complicated atm.
 
atarione said:
unfortunately with the mobility issue / pain of my hip currently diving into troubleshooting this is a wee bit complicated atm.
Click to expand...

Put your pc on one of these and shove it back under your desk.

/s
 
As an Amazon Associate, HardForum may earn from qualifying purchases.
Well... checked a couple things, a couple of the screws holding the PSU had backed off a bit, but tightening them has done nothing to change the issue. I guess I need to pull this computer out from under the desk and sort of check if anything else has shifted / loosened, I was honestly a bit surprised by how much a couple of the screws holding the PSU in had backed out.

My trouble shooting was cut short by being to busy to deal with it and finding it too painful to mess about on with the pc at this point today.... over the weekend I may get some help to disconnect more stuff to try to see if I can isolate the issue at all? My power supply is probably 8~ish years old at this point, someone suggested that maybe it's aging is having some impact / causing this, I don't have a spare PSU to try swapping out (easily at least and my motivation to tear my wife's computer apart to "borrow" her psu is limited.. any thoughts on this the PSU is like I said 8~ish years old and is a Seasonic X750.

It is odd that my Steinberg UR22 is not having the issue while several other USB external dac's and onboard audio does...
 
It might have better filtering and ground isolation than the others?

Could be a driver conflict too, I guess -- does it stop if you uninstall the driver for the offending device?
 
are the pc and speakers on the same powerbar/ups or whatever? ive had issues like this with our school projector/speaker setups where the speaker is in the wall and the rest on the power bar, the speakers made awful noise until i moved them from the wall socket onto the power bar.
 
During bootup, when does the noise start? When the driver is loaded or is it always there?
 
This really feels like a power supply issue. As you said when you hooked your dac up to separate power than from the pc it was silent. So that leads me to think it isnt anything with your mains.

Also could be just not good enough ground connection inside somewhere
 
uOpt said:
During bootup, when does the noise start? When the driver is loaded or is it always there?
Click to expand...
Starts up as soon as the pc posts.. can hear electrical clicking noises before it gets to windows even loading at all (in bios also).
Darunion said:
This really feels like a power supply issue. As you said when you hooked your dac up to separate power than from the pc it was silent. So that leads me to think it isnt anything with your mains.

Also could be just not good enough ground connection inside somewhere
Click to expand...
Maybe didn't happen with previous build (ryzen 5 and B550 Aorus Elite) and my Steinberg UR22mkII doesn't have the clicking noise even when getting power from the PC itself. However onboard audio , a FSA Blackkey and SMSL SU-1 all basically have the same electrical clicking noise that changes with mouse movements..etc.
 
pendragon1 said:
are the pc and speakers on the same powerbar/ups or whatever? ive had issues like this with our school projector/speaker setups where the speaker is in the wall and the rest on the power bar, the speakers made awful noise until i moved them from the wall socket onto the power bar.
Click to expand...
hmm... actually my Amps are hooked up to a separate power-strip from the PC .. will try to mess around with this. Didn't have problems with this issue before w/ my old ryzen build and same power plugging arraignments however.
 
Bummer.. disconnected the other power strip so everything is on the APC now and the issue persists with my headphone amps...

Whatever the problem is it doesn't seem to be another usb device as I disconnected everything but The SMSL SU-1 and the electrical noise persists reguardless of USB port (including USB C / front panel)
 
atarione said:
Bummer.. disconnected the other power strip so everything is on the APC now and the issue persists with my headphone amps...

Whatever the problem is it doesn't seem to be another usb device as I disconnected everything but The SMSL SU-1 and the electrical noise persists reguardless of USB port (including USB C / front panel)
Click to expand...
well shit. got a powered usb hub?
 
pendragon1 said:
"USB noise isolator"
might need one then
Click to expand...
yes... or a better isolated dac?
uOpt said:
I had a similar issue just recently. The USB isolator changed nothing. But you can still try it and send it back to Amazon if it doesn't do it. I bought this one: https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B0849JGL93/ref=ppx_yo_dt_b_search_asin_title?ie=UTF8&th=1

I ended up getting an entire new USB sound block, which solved the problem with no other measures.
Click to expand...
ok, yeah I am going to get whatever I get on amazon so I can return it if it doesn't help. After looking around I feel like the Topping HS02 has the best odds ?? of helping in my case here?

Or I may cut my losses and look for a better dac? because annoyingly the stupid HS02 @ $90~ is more expensive than the SMSL SU-1..which kind of ticks me off honestly.

What DAC did you end up getting?
 
As an Amazon Associate, HardForum may earn from qualifying purchases.
atarione said:
(no noise on optical when powering dac with a power bank)
Click to expand...
You've pretty much solved the issue already, I think. Try optical again but power the DAC with a USB C power adapter instead, to be sure? Both ways of powering the DAC should break the ground loop through the computer's USB power. If this works it means the noise is injected onto the computer's USB ground, and the only way to solve it then is to break the ground loop between the computer's USB and "audio ground" (i.e. whatever is powering the rest of the components of your audio system) or to use balanced (i.e. not ground referenced) audio signals.

You can break the loop by using optical as above (and not hooking up USB to your audio devices at all) or by using a USB isolator. I'm using a Hifime High-Speed USB Isolator v2 for audio measurements. It seems to work fine and supports USB 3.1.
 
I don't think the OP has a ground loop leading to the noise.
 
at this point I don't think it is a ground loop either.. it seems more like a EMI/RF problem with something in the case.

I should really probably buy a more reasonably sized case, as the NZXT H630 is gigantic... and heavy. I won't have time likely until next weekend.. but I'm going to pull the case out and double check cables / screws.. etc and possibly swap powersupply with a Corsair 650W unit I have about here.. and see if that changes anything.

Given that my UR22mkII is ok at the moment the urgency isn't super high (and of course I can use optical on the SMSL SU-1 if I power it with something other than the PC, power bank..etc). I think if was going to spend the money on the HS02 $90~ I might as well just get a ATOM DAC 2 for $130~ instead as it seems to have better isolation and uses an external 15V powersupply, I hope that much like the steinberg getting external 5V power this would eliminate the noise from the pc's power as well? At that point I will move the SMSL to another pc i use occasionally, in the living room to get audio to my vintage Onkyo stack out there... which assuming it doesn't have the same noise issue would be nice, my little optical dac I was using for this actually died sometime ago.. so this good be a nice option out there.

1711208338437.jpeg
 
1. Any run of cable acts like an antenna, why pros use common noise reduction or XLR jacks. RCA plugs can be a noise machine especially with cheap cables.
2. You get what you pay for, my 200 USD Logitech PC 2.1 setup has a hum issue, my 1000 USD SVS sub does not.
3. Ground loops can be ugly to diagnose and fix.
4. Depends on internal circuitry too for example my SDR has a -120dB noise floor. See cheap USB cable used, no issues.
1711427407532.jpeg
 
So... I am please and also confused. I have solved the issue, today. But I already had eliminated this as a possibility last week..

TL : DC (is that a thing because it is now?) ... another device was getting usb power from my powered hub, it was apparently causing the noise... I swear I disconnected this before when trouble shooting but I guess ?? Anyway moved that device to a separate usb power source and now the PC audio seems fine..
 
atarione said:
So... I am please and also confused. I have solved the issue, today. But I already had eliminated this as a possibility last week..

TL : DC (is that a thing because it is now?) ... another device was getting usb power from my powered hub, it was apparently causing the noise... I swear I disconnected this before when trouble shooting but I guess ?? Anyway moved that device to a separate usb power source and now the PC audio seems fine..
Click to expand...

Bad hub?
 
uOpt said:
Bad hub?
Click to expand...

pendragon1 said:
more likely the cable for it due to the way usb works.
Click to expand...


The cable i think, as the hub is fine now with the one device disconnected from it and getting power from a seperate power source.. The cable actually looked a bit crap if I'm honest not sure where I even got it from? Oh well, I swear I tried unplugging that thing last week? but whatever.. audio is working correctly again which is most pleasing.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top