Fileserver storage replacement, the 2TB and/or green dilemma.

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Akirasoft

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So, I've been around here for a LITTLE while, don't post much here as I spend most of my time elsewhere but I do lurk...

That out of the way, I've got a fileserver setup with a 2ghz pentium-D on a supermicro PDSLA mobo and a highpoint 2320 8 port raid card....

I put this system together back in january of 2007 with 6 500gb seagate 7200.10 drives configured in a 5 drive raid5 array with a hotspare. Performance has been stellar but the just under 2TB of usable space is now full.

I'm looking to replace the drives with upgraded models. Now I've heard alot about the sata unrecoverable read error issue with 2tb drives in raid5. Raid 6 would also encounter the problem but with a slightly lower chance but is not an option on this card.

So, I'm looking to bulk things up with 8 2tb drives in a raid 10 array. That being said, I haven't done the math to determine the chances of hitting the URE issue with 1.5tb drives in raid5. 1tb drives would only postpone another upgrade for 1 year giving my current rate of data accumulation.

Then onto the green front, given the speed multiplying factor of properly configured raid arrays and the limitations to throughput presented by gig-E, I don't necessarily see a problem running one of the new low power drives with the caveat regarding their low power states when idle. I run a green as a storage device in my desktop to store files that dont need to go on the velociraptor. the first access after a period of idle time can take a while. I hear that same functionality wreaks HAVOC with raid arrays, even ones that see periods of idle time.

Is it possible to disable the low power functionality of these drives in order to reap the low cost benefits? Additionally, i hear significant bad (reliability) things about the current crop of low cost "eco friendly" drives...

Any folks care to comment?
 
I should add that going with non 2tb options are interesting as I have two goals here:

#1, control costs in drive selection. 3 years ago I paid approx 129-139 per drive, I'd like to pay the same now.

#2. I need at least 8TB of usable space so that I won't need to upgrade my storage for about 2-3 years. I'm currently accumulating about 250GB/mo, give or take.
 
I paid $140 (iirc) for my third/latest WD20EADS. Great drives.

I killed my RAID5 to go with the greens. Backups, duplication of important stuff, and high speed connections kill the need for redundancy for me. Not using RAID also lets you add drives as needed, saving you money (you can buy cheaper 2TB drives or bigger than 2TB drives in the future). Beyond that the choices are yours.
 
yeah raid is really a necessity for me. Mind you, different data on the drive has different levels of importance and much of it is replicated in its original storage medium but there is a lot of time invested in transferring the data to disk.... (the argument of spending time transferring it to disk so that you don't have to get up to replace a dvd in the paper being a topic for another time...)
 
Not possible to disable the low power function to reap the low costs benefits. As for your goals, outside of an awesome sale, the only drives in that $130 to $140 are just consumer 1.5TB drives or enterprise/RAID class 1TB drives.

Basically in a RAID environment, the WD Green drives are not a good choice, especially considering that WD has now stopped allowing people to change the TLER. Which means that for a RAID 5 array, WD's consumer drives will not work well unless the RAID controller specifically supports that drive or even drive series. As far as 2TB drives in a RAID array, might want to check out this thread:
http://www.hardforum.com/showthread.php?t=1475838
 
the RE3 GP drives are good, not sure if there are 2tb drive out ATM,

my WD RE2 GP 1TB drives work great in my RAID5 array
 
I really dislike the fact that manufacturers are now making folks ante up for enterprise class drives even with a SOHO raid array. crap like this wouldn't even be necessary if error rates haven't gotten out of control over the past 3-4 years.

Now I am severely unamused.
 
Woah woah woah... I haven't used RAID since I last striped a pair of 74gb Raptors 5 years ago. You're telling me only certain hard drives now are made for RAID. What about JBOD?
 
cnick79 said:
Woah woah woah... I haven't used RAID since I last striped a pair of 74gb Raptors 5 years ago. You're telling me only certain hard drives now are made for RAID. What about JBOD?
Click to expand...

AFAIK, for RAID 0, RAID 1, and JBOD (assuming using software), consumer drives will be fine. For other forms of RAID like RAID 5, you'll more than likely need server grade drives.
 
@OP: Here's your answer. HItachi 2Tb drives for striped RAID arrays. End of story. I've tried everything else (WD20EADS, Seagate 2Tb, the newest Samsung F1's). Now running 20 x Hitachi 2Tb's in RAID6 on Areca 1680ix-24 and been beating it up for a week creating/deleting/recreating arrays - no errors, dropouts or problems.

Problem is the trend with "desktop class" drives - everyone (exception Hitachi) is employing power saving features meant for single-drive desktop use that can't be tweaked or undone for striped array use. Examples: varying and inconsistent true spin rates set at factory on 5x00RPM drives, drive going to sleep on too short a timeout, etc. Those power saving econo features conflict with RAID operation obviously. On top of it WD has closed the door on TLER since drives manufactured in early October forward. The Hitachi's are 7200RPM and they're also one of the only drives that support APM (power management - i.e. the array controller can set them to spin slower on a timer). They're a bit brute force but in my mind is the only sub-$140 option for striped RAID arrays right now in the 2Tb factor. They were on sale at Fry's last week for $129. Just watch out for those sales.
 
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You mean the Deskstar 7K2000 model? Or the Ultrastar A7K2000 enterprise model?
LE: read thoroughly odditory's post second time and its the Deskstar 7K200 model.
Volkum runs Seagate 2TB LP drives with an Adaptec 5805. Maybe your Areca is a little picky in terms of desktop drives.
 
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MustRotate said:
You mean the Deskstar 7K2000 model? Or the Ultrastar A7K2000 enterprise model?
LE: read thoroughly odditory's post second time and its the Deskstar 7K200 model.
Volkum runs Seagate 2TB LP drives with an Adaptec 5805. Maybe your Areca is a little picky in terms of desktop drives.
Click to expand...

I mean Deskstar- I wouldn't recommend people go out and buy enterprise drives just for archiving DVD's and BluRay's.

I didn't say other drives don't work, I meant there are issues. The fact that a Seagate works on a low port count IOP348 controller isn't news to me -- the old buggy Seagate 1.5TB's worked on that card too, but try attaching say 12 drives to a 12/16/24-port card based on the same IOP348 and watch what happens- not good. It's been speculated the issues on > 8 port IOP348 cards is due to addition of onboard SAS expander chip. I had 8 x WD20EADS with TLER enabled on my 1680ix-24, and once the first drive dropped out I said "okay I'm done". Some drives may work but longterm the array may be a ticking time bomb with the various "behaviors" of GP drives that raid cards don't like. YMMV. You could also get WD20EADS (even ones that can't TLER enable) and get an LSI card and set the timeout to 120s on the card as a workaround, but it's still not ideal and makes babies cry.

I'm not a WD hater by any means- I've had 8 x WD10EADS w/ TLER in a Raid5 for like a year and its been rock solid. However WD decided they didn't want our money anymore when they made the decision to cripple TLER on > October 2009 manufactured drives..
 
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I think the issue is specific to a hardware issue with the onboard expander used by adaptec/areca and anyone else on this generation of SAS cards, where external expanders on the 5805 will work with drives that won't work on the cards with internal expanders. At least that is my interpretation from compatibility issues with 2tb drives working with the adaptec cards as long as they weren't connected directly to a 12+ port card.
 
agreed, novadude. that's the only explanation that would make sense, especially since its exactly the same IOP348 chip on an Adaptec 5805 as it is on an Adaptec 52445.

hopefully Marvell gets it right in the upcoming SAS2 chip.
 
Danny Bui said:
AFAIK, for RAID 0, RAID 1, and JBOD (assuming using software), consumer drives will be fine. For other forms of RAID like RAID 5, you'll more than likely need server grade drives.
Click to expand...


What about 2tb green drives in a RAID 1+0 config?
 
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