Cheap but decent 120mm fans for upside down mounting?

Nazo

Nazo

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So I need to replace some old fans that are beginning to wear out, one of which has reached the point of grinding even. But it has to be pretty low budget at this point and the system doesn't get terribly hot anyway, so I don't need high static pressure Noctuas or anything like that. I'm more interested in getting something that will hopefully last a good while (within reason.) And I don't need LEDs, but if a good option in my budget has them that's fine because I can always just clip them anyway (they always run on a separate circuit.) Well, I realize that quality and cheapness don't generally go hand-in-hand and some compromise is necessary, but many of the best fans cost almost $30 and that's just not going to work for me. To some extent I'll have to compromise and maybe get something that wouldn't last as long as would be ideal, but at least I want to find something not so poor it won't even last more than a year or so.

I tried to do some searching first of course. It's a bit difficult to specifically search for things that handle upside down mounting well though. As a point of clarity (since in my searches I found a lot of people not knowing the difference,) when it's upside down it pulls the components more and can stress the components more making them not last as long -- especially if you add some heat to the mix. Many fans are known not to last as well upside down versus any other mounting position and it's especially a problem in cheaper power supplies. Unfortunately, it's kind of hard to search this specific thing short of actually going through a bunch of manufacturer websites and digging through whitesheets, but I'm pretty sure there are reviewers out there that I've read having discussed this in the past (mostly in regards to PSUs) so someone out there likely has looked at least somewhat at which case fans hold up (if nothing else as a potential replacement option.)
 
ive honestly never put that much thought into case fans. You are looking for long life and cheap, those go opposite directions so you need to pick which is important and suffer on the other. Ive been running Corsair Air Series fans in my case at the top, dunno how they are mounted, air is exhausting upwards, been running for 7 years now, computer never shuts off.

3 packs on amazon for $36 usd

https://www.amazon.com/CORSAIR-AF120-Noise-Cooling-Triple/dp/B07KGYG8N7/
 
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Nazo said:
So I need to replace some old fans that are beginning to wear out, one of which has reached the point of grinding even. But it has to be pretty low budget at this point and the system doesn't get terribly hot anyway, so I don't need high static pressure Noctuas or anything like that. I'm more interested in getting something that will hopefully last a good while (within reason.) And I don't need LEDs, but if a good option in my budget has them that's fine because I can always just clip them anyway (they always run on a separate circuit.) Well, I realize that quality and cheapness don't generally go hand-in-hand and some compromise is necessary, but many of the best fans cost almost $30 and that's just not going to work for me. To some extent I'll have to compromise and maybe get something that wouldn't last as long as would be ideal, but at least I want to find something not so poor it won't even last more than a year or so.

I tried to do some searching first of course. It's a bit difficult to specifically search for things that handle upside down mounting well though. As a point of clarity (since in my searches I found a lot of people not knowing the difference,) when it's upside down it pulls the components more and can stress the components more making them not last as long -- especially if you add some heat to the mix. Many fans are known not to last as well upside down versus any other mounting position and it's especially a problem in cheaper power supplies. Unfortunately, it's kind of hard to search this specific thing short of actually going through a bunch of manufacturer websites and digging through whitesheets, but I'm pretty sure there are reviewers out there that I've read having discussed this in the past (mostly in regards to PSUs) so someone out there likely has looked at least somewhat at which case fans hold up (if nothing else as a potential replacement option.)
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Arctic P12 are the lowest cost, legit well performing fan.
 
Darunion said:
ive honestly never put that much thought into case fans.
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You have to use them for years and it can be a pain when one decides to die at a bad time. Maybe you should pay attention more.
Darunion said:
You are looking for long life and cheap, those go opposite directions so you need to pick which is important and suffer on the other.
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No. I get tired of that general sort of attitude. Real life is much more complicated than things are all black or all white. Shades of gray exist. There are expensive products with shiny, expensive looking exteriors that are crap inside or otherwise offer less actual functionality and features compared to cheaper competitors. Sony makes a lot of products that are terrible inside for example. There are some cheap things that are surprisingly good. I can think of a lot of examples there, but since we're in a computing forum a good one would be this little company called AMD that Intel tried to shake off after their earlier dealings were over who kept making cheap processors that performed surprisingly well. (Ok, they aren't so cheap anymore, but point is they were.) There are cheap things that are utter crap and expensive things that are great too of course, but the point here is that you MUST NOT look at price tag alone as an indicator of anything useful beyond how much it will hurt your wallet. And thus... that's why I ask a thing like this on a place like this where people might actually know.

And 3 for $30 of a fan that seems to be $20 in a one pack is a good deal if I need three, but I need two for $20. I can't spend more for the better shoe in this scenario.
chameleoneel said:
Arctic P12 are the lowest cost, legit well performing fan.
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Ok, looking at them on Amazon. It seems they use ball bearings. Which made me realize I was searching the wrong thing. It seems the chief culprit in lower quality fans dying faster when mounted upside down is largely because of sleeve bearings. In fact, it seems sleeve bearing fans aren't so great in any horizontal mounting position. Interesting. Would explain a lot of grinding noise over my many years of computing. Ball bearings like these use seem to be the middle ground of not being as expensive as liquid bearings, though it seems like it's going to vary a bit regardless.

I am seeing one interesting review for that particular model complaining that quality control is lacking though. Well, most likely they got a bad batch since they ordered a bunch at once and real life selection has much better results than that. I'll add them to the list to consider anyway.
 
Nazo said:
Ok, looking at them on Amazon. It seems they use ball bearings. Which made me realize I was searching the wrong thing. It seems the chief culprit in lower quality fans dying faster when mounted upside down is largely because of sleeve bearings. In fact, it seems sleeve bearing fans aren't so great in any horizontal mounting position. Interesting. Would explain a lot of grinding noise over my many years of computing. Ball bearings like these use seem to be the middle ground of not being as expensive as liquid bearings, though it seems like it's going to vary a bit regardless.

I am seeing one interesting review for that particular model complaining that quality control is lacking though. Well, most likely they got a bad batch since they ordered a bunch at once and real life selection has much better results than that. I'll add them to the list to consider anyway.
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They are low cost. So, certainly some compromises on materials and consistency.

If you want better consistency, Be Quiet's Pure Wings 3 are the best balance of cost to quality/consistency (and I'm a big fan of Be Quiet's fans, in general):

https://www.amazon.com/quiet-Top-en...refix=be+queit+120mm+fan,aps,139&sr=8-10&th=1
 
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arctic P12 PST. just set them so the ramp up past ~1100 quickly, as they make some odd noises in that range....
 
Hmm. Getting a specific exact RPM is... tricky. At least without a dedicated fan controller or running extra software to handle it. Well, my BIOS has pretty surprisingly good controls, just it's in percentage, not RPM, so it will make tuning them a bit painful. Not impossible though.

EDIT: Was looking at the "Max" version, but some people say that the sound it can create is a bit higher pitched. That would definitely bother me. The PST may indeed be the better choice. It seems to be a fluid dynamic bearing, which supposedly is the best of the classic three.

chameleoneel said:
If you want better consistency, Be Quiet's Pure Wings 3 are the best balance of cost to quality/consistency (and I'm a big fan of Be Quiet's fans, in general):
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I was actually looking at that specific model earlier, but wasn't sure. However, looking it up now that I better know what to search, it sounds like the rifle bearings it boasts are basically just slightly better sleeve bearings, so basically probably not going to last all that great when mounted horizontally instead of vertically.
 
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Nazo said:
Hmm. Getting a specific exact RPM is... tricky. At least without a dedicated fan controller or running extra software to handle it. Well, my BIOS has pretty surprisingly good controls, just it's in percentage, not RPM, so it will make tuning them a bit painful. Not impossible though.

EDIT: Was looking at the "Max" version, but some people say that the sound it can create is a bit higher pitched. That would definitely bother me. The PST may indeed be the better choice. It seems to be a fluid dynamic bearing, which supposedly is the best of the classic three.


I was actually looking at that specific model earlier, but wasn't sure. However, looking it up now that I better know what to search, it sounds like the rifle bearings it boasts are basically just slightly better sleeve bearings, so basically probably not going to last all that great when mounted horizontally instead of vertically.
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Most fans do not use actual ball bearings. And AIO's are often top mounted, with the fans "upside down", pushing air through the radiator. And many cases otherwise have top mounted exhaust fans. I wouldn't worry about it.
 
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chameleoneel said:
Most fans do not use actual ball bearings. And AIO's are often top mounted, with the fans "upside down", pushing air through the radiator. And many cases otherwise have top mounted exhaust fans. I wouldn't worry about it.
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You... you do realize that AIOs literally are designed not to last more than two years at the most, right? True, usually it's the pump that dies, but the point is that as far as a vote of confidence of durability goes, being part of an AIO design is basically a huge negative, not a plus. Actually, I still don't understand why people are ok with that with AIOs. I don't accept two years expected maximum lifetime as being remotely acceptable for any component or device.

Like I said though, the P12 PST uses a type of bearing that usually is supposed to hold up pretty well (and the P12 Max I also looked at does as well,) so I think it probably would last pretty well -- despite being used in an AIO design, lol.
 
Nazo said:
You... you do realize that AIOs literally are designed not to last more than two years at the most, right? True, usually it's the pump that dies, but the point is that as far as a vote of confidence of durability goes, being part of an AIO design is basically a huge negative, not a plus. Actually, I still don't understand why people are ok with that with AIOs. I don't accept two years expected maximum lifetime as being remotely acceptable for any component or device.
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I bought my Corsair H100i in September 2014. It has seen daily, all-day use for well over 9 years, and it is still running just fine. The warranty was for 5 years, and it easily lasted almost twice that long.
 
How long you are you expecting these fans to last? All the ones mentioned here are solid fans. sleeve bearing or ball bearing they will likely last at least 5 years. Not really that much of a pain in the ass to change out a fan if it dies. Get the pack of 5 Artic P12 for $35 and be done with it. You will have 3 for back up.
 
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I'm in a bit of a financial situation. To you it's no biggie tossing out $35 every few years, but to me it has been problematic for quite some time. So yes, I need fans to last and, as I already said, I needed to aim for something more akin to $20 total.

The BeQuiet fans are almost guaranteed to be among those that start grinding after a couple of years or so. The Arctic P12 probably will last far longer. It's that simple. The Arctic ones are on my wishlist. There's no point in repeating this over and over. I get that they're probably good. They're in my wishlist. Unless there are other brands or specific models I should look at, they are the better choice among all the fans I've looked at so far. So they're in my wishlist. By the way they're in my wishlist.

pendragon1 said:
thats a lie.
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Rofl, ok.
DrezKill said:
I bought my Corsair H100i in September 2014. It has seen daily, all-day use for well over 9 years, and it is still running just fine. The warranty was for 5 years, and it easily lasted almost twice that long.
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I didn't say no AIO ever lasts more than two years. I'm saying they're, as a whole, designed to last two years. Some will last longer. Some will even last for a shorter period before they break. Most will probably go longer since they probably don't get pushed to the max in most scenarios. And yes, not all are created equal. I don't think your Corsair H100i is on the same level as an Arctic P12 fan price/quality-wise.


Again, not saying all AIOs are bad, just that a fan being in one does not inherently mean that fan must be great.
 
pendragon1 said:
lol riiiight.... lets design a product to only last 2 years and then slap a 5 year warranty on it....
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Nazo said:
I didn't say no AIO ever lasts more than two years.
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Nazo said:
Again, not saying all AIOs are bad, just that a fan being in one does not inherently mean that fan must be great.
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That line of conversation is completed. The loop is closed. Let's return to the original track. Further off-topic discussion is not needed.
 
Nazo said:
That line of conversation is completed. The loop is closed. Let's return to the original track. Further off-topic discussion is not needed.
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move those goal posts...

pick up some PSTs and call it a day.
 
The point was to see if there were any other brands and models I should be looking at. How is any of this discussion of whether some AIOs are better quality than others and whether or not AIOs existing proves that a specific fan is somehow better in some way on topic?

So far people have suggested a grand total of, let's count them: two fans. One of which I have added to a wishlist to take into consideration.

It will probably be the Arctic P12 PST. Probably. But other options must exist and maybe among them is something that lasts longer, or has more static pressure for the same duration and noise level. Or maybe not. I don't know because right now what we're talking about whether one or two specific AIOs might be better made than many others.

How is that constructive? Can we please get back to the topic?
 
pendragon1 said:
suggesting you grab a particular model was getting back on topic.
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The topic is "what are my options?" Your response was effectively you ordering me to go buy one specific model immediately without any consideration of other options. That isn't on topic. I've already added it to a wishlist to consider. At this point you're just trolling. I'll save you the trouble. You're now in my ignore list.
 
Nazo said:
Hmm. Getting a specific exact RPM is... tricky. At least without a dedicated fan controller or running extra software to handle it. Well, my BIOS has pretty surprisingly good controls, just it's in percentage, not RPM, so it will make tuning them a bit painful. Not impossible though.

EDIT: Was looking at the "Max" version, but some people say that the sound it can create is a bit higher pitched. That would definitely bother me. The PST may indeed be the better choice. It seems to be a fluid dynamic bearing, which supposedly is the best of the classic three.


I was actually looking at that specific model earlier, but wasn't sure. However, looking it up now that I better know what to search, it sounds like the rifle bearings it boasts are basically just slightly better sleeve bearings, so basically probably not going to last all that great when mounted horizontally instead of vertically.
Click to expand...

I recently purchased the MAX version and have no regrets. The Arctic P12's to me had a weird whine noise. In addition to the weird noise at lower RPM they felt very cheaply made to me. The MAX versions seem to be of better quality, and push allot of air. They are loud at max speed.. but not much louder than what I've used in the past.
 
Nazo seems like you are hesitant to try the P12, which is understandable.

Unfortunately, the updated "MAX" model, had a lot of user reported problems, after release. I dunno if that has been resolved or not. But, IMO, if the low cost P12's aren't agreeable for you, I would try the more expensive, but still affordable Pure Wings 3, from Be Quiet!. IME, Be Quiet!'s quality/consistency, is about as good as it gets. And the Pure Wings 3 should otherwise be a pretty nice fan.
 
That Gentle Typhoon looks really good -- possibly among the better fans even -- but it's about double the pricerange. Not really cheap anymore when you hit the $20 for one range. I know it doesn't sound like a huge distinction, but I have about $20 total to work with for now, so that would mean one fan would have to be as good as two and really I need one in and one out, so that's... not going to work.
Odigo said:
I recently purchased the MAX version and have no regrets. The Arctic P12's to me had a weird whine noise. In addition to the weird noise at lower RPM they felt very cheaply made to me. The MAX versions seem to be of better quality, and push allot of air. They are loud at max speed.. but not much louder than what I've used in the past.
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Well, I'm not sure, but I see they're easily twice the noise level of the PST. I'm wondering if mostly it just needs to be kept from running at that one RPM mentioned before. I would generally prefer something quieter -- at least within reason -- since this system is mostly running fairly cool as long as I'm not running Prime95 or something. In fact, Prime95 is the only thing that can push my CPU all the way to the max I guess. Even ffmpeg with AVX2 seems to not push as hard. The 65W TDP claim is a straight up lie, but the aftermarket cooler I have on it and undervolting has it pretty under control now. Curiously enough the videocard I have now uses more power than my old one, but runs cooler and quieter anyway. (Just all around better design I guess.) So I think maybe I don't need heavy airflow and can strike a bit of a balance of noise levels. If it's mostly just a matter of avoiding that one specific RPM I think I'll be ok. Simply put, other than the occasional noise from the fan I most need to replace (some kind of very light grinding that comes and goes) my system seems to be safely able to run very quietly outside of Prime95.
chameleoneel said:
Nazo seems like you are hesitant to try the P12, which is understandable.
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Nah, just shopping around instead of grabbing the first thing that came along. Right now the P12 PST is on the top of my wishlist as my most likely choice.

I'm really disinclined to go with sleeve bearing fans at least for the top of the case though and the BeQuiet is effectively a sleeve bearing fan.
 
aliexpress 120mm fan

$3 for a fan shipped. There are a few vendors there with the same deal (sadly 1 per customer). You could get 6 fans if you play it right and then just have spares to replace as needed. Just presenting probably the bottom of your options.
 
Nazo said:
The BeQuiet fans are almost guaranteed to be among those that start grinding after a couple of years or so.
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I would avoid the people and/or places that are giving you that information. It's abjectly false.

I've been using bequiet! fans of all styles and sizes for at least the last 8-10 years (easily 50-60 units by now). Mostly in client builds but also in my own rigs. They've been mounted in every orientation possible, including top mounted...and I have yet to have any fail or make any grinding noises. In fact I primarily use their cheapest fans on the regular. 120/140mm pure wings 2 and 3, in virtually every build for that very reason. Reliability.

Another cheap but solid option is Thermalrights fans. I have no personal experience with the majority of them but my limited use of the two models I have has been positive.

Then of course there's Yate Loon. They can usually be had for around $5 a fan. They come in low, medium and high speed variants. As well as blue green and red LED options. They are literally bulletproof. I have several that are 20+ years old and still going strong in my retro rigs. They don't offer pwm unfortunately.

Goodluck in your quest. Finding cheap solid fans in this day and age? Not an easy ask.
 
hititnquitit said:
I would avoid the people and/or places that are giving you that information. It's abjectly false.
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I'm one of those people. I'm tired of fans grinding. It's an awful noise. I've had quite a number of them do it over the decades I've been using computers including one now that I have to bump around a few times to make it stop (this is the one that is going to go ASAP.) I'm not really going to avoid myself here, so I'm just going to go with the actually fairly reasonable information that sleeves aren't really the best form anyway, much less when hung in a different orientation than is ideal for fans (other than PSUs, mounting fans horizontally is actually a relatively new thing. Computer cases only just very recently started doing fans at the top -- relatively speaking.)

Not really going to fight about this anymore. Agree or disagree, I'm going with other bearing types. Most other types have better MTBF as a whole anyway.
 
Nazo said:
That Gentle Typhoon looks really good -- possibly among the better fans even -- but it's about double the pricerange. Not really cheap anymore when you hit the $20 for one range. I know it doesn't sound like a huge distinction, but I have about $20 total to work with for now, so that would mean one fan would have to be as good as two and really I need one in and one out, so that's... not going to work.
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Buy once, cry once. I have done builds with these fans for decades now, and just none better IMO. I have six in my current system in a push/pull config, and I think I built this loop in 2015/16/17? Still work and sound like new, and I never turn this system off.
 
Nazo said:
I'm one of those people. I'm tired of fans grinding. It's an awful noise. I've had quite a number of them do it over the decades I've been using computers including one now that I have to bump around a few times to make it stop (this is the one that is going to go ASAP.) I'm not really going to avoid myself here, so I'm just going to go with the actually fairly reasonable information that sleeves aren't really the best form anyway, much less when hung in a different orientation than is ideal for fans (other than PSUs, mounting fans horizontally is actually a relatively new thing. Computer cases only just very recently started doing fans at the top -- relatively speaking.)

Not really going to fight about this anymore. Agree or disagree, I'm going with other bearing types. Most other types have better MTBF as a whole anyway.
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Sorry to hear you're bequiet! fan is dying. That's a real drag. Which version are you running Nazo? Being that your cash strapped, it may be worth reoiling if possible. You may get a few more months/years out of it. Giving you time to save up for a pair of those GTs or Noctua a12x25s, phanteks t-30s etc...

May have been wise to add that bit about your bequiet! being the fan that was dying in the OP btw. Could have saved some unnecessary suggestions.

Horizontal mounting? Nah, It's nothing new. Case manufacturers have been doing it consistently since 2010, 2012? DIYers have been doing it for as long as hole saws and Dremels have been around. Wcing gurus looking to maximize case space by top mounting their rads in particular have been doing it since the heatercore days.

Anyhow, that's neither here nor there. You seem to have a very narrow outlook as to what you can and can't accept regarding advice/suggestions for some reason. Folks are going to stop trying to help you because of that. With that in mind, I will withhold any further suggestions.

I may tend to have a blunt way in giving suggestions sometimes. It doesn't mean I'm trying to fight with you ;) just making a point.
 
These are a cheap ball-bearing fan too, not used them except for testing though: https://www.amazon.com/dp/B09CH1PPY4/

Keep in mind that ball bearing fans have their own sound which is why most pc fans are "fluid dynamic".
 
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D-EJ915 said:
These are a cheap ball-bearing fan too, not used them except for testing though: https://www.amazon.com/dp/B09CH1PPY4/

Keep in mind that ball bearing fans have their own sound which is why most pc fans are "fluid dynamic".
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yup they have their place and not everyone is as picky about noise.

look at this though, never noticed it before and i think its coming from edge browser...
1706806590175.png
 
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