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If they put grass in between the solar panels it might not actually be that bad.
There are more trees in this country now then when we first settled here. I'm sure it's not that big of an issue.
Oh and just to give an idea of how completely insignificant solar output is for its cost and land use
Not shaped like a giant apple...FAIL.
How so? Coal is the most abundant domestically readily available power source, it is currently the most cost effective means of producing power, the emissions with the exception of very high CO2 output are absolutely excellent since the advent of "clean coal" plants with essentially no pollution of nearby water sources or chemicals released into the atmosphere (particulates and sulfur and the like are all captured thanks to syngas and other processes... you don't actually burn coal anymore), and with new carbon-sequestration designs that are already implemented in three large plants here in Texas even the CO2 output is a non-issue.
And the output of a coal plant (many are well over 3000 megawatts) is actually significant to meeting the power needs of the nation, unlike that giant solar array that couldn't even power a small town.
Not really; Germany is the world leader when it comes to solar energy output and their climate is as cloudy as England.Must suck on a cloudy week.
errmm not to play the devil's advocate or anything, but the best efficiency panels are ~25% on a good day and it takes more energy to produce them (counting mineral extraction, tranporation, assembly, etc) than they will ever produce in a reasonable lifetime. Ironically it would have been "greener" if they just stuck to nuclear power
During the summer months, my AC runs at night. Oh, and btw, you are welcome. Glad my tax dollars were able to help you with your project.I have 12 panels on my roof that basically makes my electrical usage zero during the summer months... yeah completely insignificant considering the land it's using *sarcasm**rolly eyes**pooping*
Clean coal is a somewhat recent development, and carbon sequestration is absolutely new and basically in alpha testing (out of hundreds of plants I only know of three).someone smart enough to type up something so coherent should also be smart enough to figure out that if it were that good and easy we wouldn't need other sources of power.
Hey Ducman69, I have a couple questions for you about "clean coal"
1) Where do the byproducts go? you did know there are still some very nasty byproducts that need to be disposed of right?
2) How many clean coal plants are there? How many regular coal plants are there? hint: not very many, and many.
If its a really old plant and for some reason the state hasn't updated it and installed scrubbers and the like, OK, the tall stack actually is spitting out bad stuff... and that's why its tall, it gets dispersed high into the atmosphere thanks to stronger air currents that pick it up.
But the new clean-coal plants that use gasification, its nonsensical to worry about the stacks since its mostly just steam from the steam turbine.
Same thing with nuclear plants, people see the big steam stacks and think its outputting tons of pollution when its just a cooling tower and carries no radiation or anything... water vapor, relax!
And yes, you are the reason for the solar farm.I think the point is that it's green. We need to stop thinking about only money. We need to start thinking more about the environment. Coal is so 1800's, it's time to completely stop throwing mercury, sulphur and other hazardous pollution into our air.
Coal, gas, nuclear, and hydro power are not subsidized, and solar power is HIGHLY subsidized. Despite this, it accounts for less than 1% of the total power output on our grid. Yes, less than 1% despite all your tax dollars behind it trying to prop it up and make it a viable technology.
That demonstrates ignorance of the limitations of the technology versus alternatives if that is your reasoning.I absolutely plan on installing solar panels on my first home to be as independent from the grid as possible. Natural disasters still happen, and if a plant, lines, transformers, etc... go down, I want to still have power.
That demonstrates ignorance of the limitations of the technology versus alternatives if that is your reasoning.
In the case of a natural disaster or other power interruption, you need reliable power. You can't get that from solar, as you won't get output at night, you won't get peak output for most of the day, and you probably don't want to invest in a huge battery grid (especially if you are pretending its to help the environment), even if for some reason you didn't mind flushing benjamins down the toilet.
It'd be like relying on wind power for power backup, its output will vary and at times be zero, and it can in fact be near zero for very extended periods of time (if its unusually still). Reminds me of a Simpson's episode...
If you are smart, you'll do what I did, buy yourself a reliable gasoline generator. Mine is from Yamaha (Honda also makes great ones), and it runs on autogas. Stock up during hurricane season on gas, and pour what you don't need into your cars after (and visa versa you can siphon you car's gas). An electrician can install an appropriate plug for you so it'll hook right into your home's electrical system cheaply (cost me $150).
You can also go with a natural gas generator, although these are a bit more expensive. In the event of an earthquake where both the electrical power and your gas line may be interrupted, some can be run off of propane tanks as backups.
That demonstrates ignorance of the limitations of the technology versus alternatives if that is your reasoning.
In the case of a natural disaster or other power interruption, you need reliable power. You can't get that from solar, as you won't get output at night, you won't get peak output for most of the day, and you probably don't want to invest in a huge battery grid (especially if you are pretending its to help the environment), even if for some reason you didn't mind flushing benjamins down the toilet.
It'd be like relying on wind power for power backup, its output will vary and at times be zero, and it can in fact be near zero for very extended periods of time (if its unusually still). Reminds me of a Simpson's episode...
If you are smart, you'll do what I did, buy yourself a reliable gasoline generator. Mine is from Yamaha (Honda also makes great ones), and it runs on autogas. Stock up during hurricane season on gas, and pour what you don't need into your cars after (and visa versa you can siphon you car's gas). An electrician can install an appropriate plug for you so it'll hook right into your home's electrical system cheaply (cost me $150).
You can also go with a natural gas generator, although these are a bit more expensive. In the event of an earthquake where both the electrical power and your gas line may be interrupted, some can be run off of propane tanks as backups.
I'd rather have one of those surrounded by lush forests, than have 2000 acres plowed flat into a wasteland to equal the same power ouput.
I'd rather have one of those surrounded by lush forests, than have 2000 acres plowed flat into a wasteland to equal the same power ouput.
And yes, you are the reason for the solar farm.
Its a "feel good" marketing gimmick to make Apple look green, and appeal to people like yourself that look at solar and think its "teh futurez", and everyone else is so 1800s.
If they really wanted to help the environment, they would follow Dell's example and change their packaging (the smaller bamboo packaging is smart and effective), and concentrate on recycling programs for their equipment and reduce the use of mercury, sulphur, and other hazardous pollution into the ground water of third world dumping grounds were old Macbooks, iPhones, and iPads go when they die.
That demonstrates ignorance of the limitations of the technology versus alternatives if that is your reasoning.
In the case of a natural disaster or other power interruption, you need reliable power. You can't get that from solar, as you won't get output at night, you won't get peak output for most of the day, and you probably don't want to invest in a huge battery grid (especially if you are pretending its to help the environment), even if for some reason you didn't mind flushing benjamins down the toilet.
It'd be like relying on wind power for power backup, its output will vary and at times be zero, and it can in fact be near zero for very extended periods of time (if its unusually still). Reminds me of a Simpson's episode...
It is amazing how much people know about me from my anonymous online alias... but sadly this time you're wrong.You've obviously never lived near a coal plant before, therefore your opinion is about as useless as Helen Keller.
But its a good idea, considering that solar power is currently the most cost effective, practical, space efficient, and reliable means of adding power to the grid.
It is amazing how much people know about me from my anonymous online alias... but sadly this time you're wrong.
Please, take two seconds of your time and actually read more than one post from me in this thread, then do a google search about what the byproducts of clean-coal plants are. Its chemically impossible to get soot as you describe from the exhaust stack for example, as the pulverized coal is gasified and the syngas goes through various scrubbers.
Yes, a lot of CO2 is produced, but as was said that too can be captured and compressed and either just pumped underground under layers of clay, into saltwater aquifers, or even used by the oil industry so that it cannot enter the atmosphere, whatever happens to work for the conditions in the area. Now if its a forty year old plant, modernizing with scrubbers and what not has probably already been done by now, but they may not be able to do anything with the carbon dioxide... but that's hardly something that is going to make you choke, and maybe, just maybe, it will help prevent the encroaching ice age.
...and maybe, just maybe, it will help prevent the encroaching ice age.
Wait so they cut down all the tree's to put in that??? Not sure thats helping.
Sure beats a coal powered plant any day of the week.