Xbox Always Online Controversy Gets Weirder

ballistic90

2[H]4U
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Nov 17, 2010
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Not sure how did you read as this, but this guy clearly is talking about constantly connected to the internet.

You're combining two different things. First, nothing he ever says, EVER, says that the Xbox has an online requirement. Nothing.

Second, he clearly states that the console will be "Always On". Not "Always Online", not requires online. Just that if an online connection is available, it will be using it.

What is so difficult to understand?
 

Dekoth-E-

Supreme [H]ardness
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Mar 23, 2010
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You pretty much sum up the issue here. Always online is not a defense against piracy, while yes it does prevent it that's not the intention. You can pull all the piracy numbers out of your butt as far as lost sales, etc... but the reality is there's no way to accurate track how much money you ACTUALLY are losing do to piracy.

Money lost to a secondary market of games however, is something you absolutely can track and calculate. Every copy of StarCraft 2 that gets resold (assuming it could) is $60 Blizzard doesn't get (or whatever their cut of that is). For something like an Xbox, every used game that's sold, is a licensing fee that they don't get, which is precisely how they make their money since every game pays that whether or not MS has a hand in it or not, they lose even more if its a game they get revenue from. And this is a value they absolutely can track, and something that can show on a graph and say "If we do this, this loss goes away"

Sorry but that is completely untrue as well. There are Many many games I have bought used because it was cheap and I never would of paid retail for it.
 

CappyCobra

Weaksauce
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Nov 2, 2004
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Then you will either no longer play video games,

or you will come to the PC where this has been going on for quite a long time, and everything is just fine.

Honestly, I can't see THAT many people not buying the new consoles because they won't be able to sell their games after they are done. You buy the game to enjoy playing it - not to just resell it later (tho that is a nice perk).

Naa I'll just work through my backlog while these clowns get their heads out of their asses and realized they effed up. ;)

At least with PC you have several choices (greenman, GOG, Amazon, Steam, Origin, Uplay, hell even GameStop) which tends to keep some competition in check. I dont have time ATM to find it but I do believe there is some legislation int he works to allow selling second hand of digital goods.

Almost forgot, doesnt gamefly let you 'rent' PC games? I'll just run that route if I ever (if ever) run out of backlog.
 

azuza001

Gawd
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Apr 4, 2012
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Maybe Microsoft just wants to lose this next Console war? Is it even a war anymore? Seems more like the Cold War, where the big 2 just doing the same thing and the 3rd choice kinda being there.
 

Jagger100

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If it was always on eating enegy, isn't that contrary to green-mindedness you'd expect from a Seattle based company.

anyway, this whole thing was probably a 'trial balloon'. Meaning this guy's statements can be denied but carry enough credibity initially people take the comment seriously and give insight into the size of the backlash.
 

klljm

Weaksauce
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Sep 30, 2004
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Green Mindedness! Haha. This city is full of pussies that turn on the heater when its only 60 outside.
 

cthulhuiscool

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I've never wanted to dunk a guys head in a toilet more than I do with that "Orthy" guy right now. "Why would I want to live there" what a self absorbed, close minded twatface.
 

turbogeek

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Nov 13, 2008
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Well, before this little incident it was nothing but an unsubstantiated rumor that keeps getting repeated over and over without a shred of credible evidence.

Sony did the same thing, let the rumors fester (over its patent) for months until it announced the PS4 and finally laid the rumors to rest.

Microsoft's hand might be forced now to make a statement but I suspect the original "end of April" console reveal will be when the rumors are squashed. E3 will be where Sony and Microsoft really pull the covers off their next-gen stuff.

good work
 
Joined
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This "Orthy" guy sounds like an ignorant asshole. Anyway, I don't expect anything spectacular from Microsoft anymore, these days their product quality has gone to shit and it seems like they don't even listen to their customers anymore, if they ever did in the first place.
 

Void

[H]ard to Tame
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This "Orthy" guy sounds like an ignorant asshole. Anyway, I don't expect anything spectacular from Microsoft anymore, these days their product quality has gone to shit and it seems like they don't even listen to their customers anymore, if they ever did in the first place.
They never did. They just gave the illusion that they did but just like most other companies they do what they want and how they want it. But I, just like ever consumer should be, also have the right to tell said companies to fuck off by voting with my wallet.
 

odditory

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Well, before this little incident it was nothing but an unsubstantiated rumor that keeps getting repeated over and over without a shred of credible evidence.

Well.. I'd consider this a shred... today Paul Thurott admitted he was told by an insider in January that always-online would be a requirement. His tips from MS insiders are usually on the money since he's been running a pro-Microsoft, pro-Windows blog for years.

4) Microsoft is only upset about the way this feature was communicated, because it likes to present this kind of thing as a positive, not a negative.

Folks, the next Xbox is going to require an always-on Internet connection. I don’t know the specifics of what that means .... this piece of information had been communicated to me, along with some other relevant tidbits, in January. It’s true.

Will Microsoft change this requirement in the wake of early outrage? Frankly I think we’re too far along in the development process of the next Xbox, codenamed Durango, to make such a change. More to the point, I think that an always-on Xbox is directly in keeping with Microsoft’s strategy for all next-generation platforms, including Windows Phone (all versions) and Windows 8/RT, which are designed to work as if you are simply connected all the time. Yes, they do work offline, of course. But the apps platform on these systems—which will be replicated on the Windows 8-based next Xbox—assumes a connection. Microsoft’s new platforms are integrated conduits for online services.

http://winsupersite.com/xbox/xbox-vnext-and-always-online
 

Jagger100

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Is it too early to call the PS4 the winner this generation?
The marketing winner by default.

The only reason to let the rumors fester is if these leaks are trial balloons and they are not sure if they want to go forward or not.
 

Absentee

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Please read all of his posts. Notice that he says "Always On", not "Always On Requirement" or "No offline play". I sincerely think that someone noticed "Always On" and confused it with the Simcity fiasco for "Always On DRM" and created this stupid shitstorm.

Exactly. They want "always on" as in what something like the iPod does, always sleeping until you press a button. While suspending apps or games using minimal power, allowing you to instantly start using it instead of waiting.
 

Absentee

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Exactly. They want "always on" as in what something like the iPod* does, always sleeping until you press a button. While suspending apps or games using minimal power, allowing you to instantly start using it instead of waiting.

*I meant iPad, but same difference
 

Thuleman

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"For those six hours, I wouldn’t have been able to access anything that was always-on."

And the world, as we know it, would come to an end, chaos and wide-spread looting would break out, civil order would break down, people would grab their guns and their bibles and head for the mountains.
 

Thermite Paste

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The EASIEST EASIEST way to both combat piracy and used game sales is for each game to come with a serial number. You then put the blu-ray in your system, install the game to the harddrive, and put in the serial number, at which point that serial number will be forever connected to your xbox/psn account.

Done. If you go offline, you can play the game installed in the HD once the key is verified. Simple.
This is also the easiest way to strip consumers of their rights to purchased content. Valve/EA get away with this now because it's a relatively new thing in regards to the law, but if MS/Sony start doing it things will change. EULA's are the only thing that allow companies to get away with this currently, and the EU has already ruled that they're unenforceable on software.

The Copyright act of 1976 protects against non-resale license agreements in the US, but it needs to be brought to current times as it was not written to deal with digital content.
 

Jagger100

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This is also the easiest way to strip consumers of their rights to purchased content. Valve/EA get away with this now because it's a relatively new thing in regards to the law, but if MS/Sony start doing it things will change. EULA's are the only thing that allow companies to get away with this currently, and the EU has already ruled that they're unenforceable on software.

The Copyright act of 1976 protects against non-resale license agreements in the US, but it needs to be brought to current times as it was not written to deal with digital content.

Publishers would solve the problem by no longer using Steam.

Physical media sharing has practical limits. Things get lost, broken and many people just don't like 'used' stuff. A digital copy doesn't have those problems. Publishers would stop using digital distribution if unlimited transfering was allowed.

Do you seriously think in most cases, publishers would still make the same games for free or at best a tiny fraction of the revenue.
 

chockomonkey

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And the world, as we know it, would come to an end, chaos and wide-spread looting would break out, civil order would break down, people would grab their guns and their bibles and head for the mountains.

No, but i'll bet he would be disappointed in his gaming device that he can't use.

He may even feel regret for buying it, because he probably remembers consoles that didn't break when the internets went down.
 

Thermite Paste

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Publishers would solve the problem by no longer using Steam.

Physical media sharing has practical limits. Things get lost, broken and many people just don't like 'used' stuff. A digital copy doesn't have those problems. Publishers would stop using digital distribution if unlimited transfering was allowed.

Do you seriously think in most cases, publishers would still make the same games for free or at best a tiny fraction of the revenue.
Who said they'd be making games for free? There are still plenty of games that have no binding license agreement that circulate in the used market and the publishers haven't gone out of business :rolleyes:

While you can't copy current generation console games directly, they are still digital media. Even if the disc gets scratched it can be resurfaced, and if proper care is taken they can last for a very long time. And you have every legal right to sell or transfer that video game under the law. The underlying problem with digital content is that by nature it is "copied" rather than "transferred" when not sold on a physical medium, and the law hasn't caught up to this notion yet. You can't trade digital music because it would be technically "copying", yet you can sell a CD without issues. I guarantee you the law will catch up and content providers will have to adapt.

If that means publishers moving away from steam and digital distribution, then what's the problem? Steam is a convenience I can live without if it means actually owning my games.
 
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