Windows 11 Will Soon Block All Default Browser Workarounds

d3athf1sh

Gawd
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One of the many things that pushed me into the direction of OS X. Mac isn't perfect, but some of the shenanigans MS has been pulling have been too irritating.
says the apple guy.... :smh:

also: f*** windows 11... win10 was bad enough, plus they lied to us about it being the "last version of windows" to trick people into giving up on win7. and really only reason they are doing it is because they were bribed by intel to changing core functionality to favor THEIR architecture. and prob the NSA because too many people blocking telemetry on win10. nope. they can shove it.
 
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sed8em

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says the apple guy.... :smh:

also: f*** windows 11... win10 was bad enough, plus they lied to us about it being the "last version of windows" to trick people into giving up on win7. and really only reason they are doing it is because they were bribed by intel to changing core functionality to favor THEIR architecture. and prob the NSA because too many people blocking telemetry on win10. nope. they can shove it.
I'm not an Apple guy, to me a computer is a tool and I pick what fits my needs at the time. Currently thats Apple.

As your post states, Windows has been pushing a lot of shit that a lot of folks don't care for, loved it back in the Win7 days. Apple isn't perfect either, but for now the tool works for me.

Also learning Linux as Raspberry Pi boxes have been quite useful to me lately in my hobbies. Just a tool in the toolbox.
 

DukenukemX

Supreme [H]ardness
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What free and open capitalism? What we have is more like corporatism.
Free and open capitalism creates corporatism. They're both the same. The problem we have is that companies shouldn't be allowed to get as big as they're getting. Microsoft was a software computer company that has now branched off into many different markets. Like why Google is now Alphabet and Facebook is now Metaverse. There's too much synergy is terms of what different parts of these companies can do. Microsoft using Windows to push Edge to push a financing service goes to show you how much these companies are allowed to push for this type of synergy. They're free to do as they please because years ago we failed to break up Microsoft.
 

Red Falcon

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Free and open capitalism creates corporatism. They're both the same. The problem we have is that companies shouldn't be allowed to get as big as they're getting. Microsoft was a software computer company that has now branched off into many different markets. Like why Google is now Alphabet and Facebook is now Metaverse. There's too much synergy is terms of what different parts of these companies can do. Microsoft using Windows to push Edge to push a financing service goes to show you how much these companies are allowed to push for this type of synergy. They're free to do as they please because years ago we failed to break up Microsoft.
No, Socialism creates Corporatism, and destroys and makes true Capitalism impossible.
Companies are allowed to become Corporatist megacorps by Socialist governments that enable them to do so, which is exactly what we are seeing here with 2020s Microsoft.

Also, Microsoft was broken up by the USA in the 1990s, before it was a Socialist nation like it clearly is now.
Seriously, the bashing of Capitalism is getting old when it appears that Socialists don't understand that when they elect Socialist governments to power, they are thus destroying Capitalism and are fully enabling Corporatism, and that is by design; two sides of the same coin, if you will.

F1ZCI6WyJ1cm46c2VydmljZTppbWFnZS5vcGVyYXRpb25zIl19.jpg


It is extremely ironic that those who do not understand how businesses operate, or how basic economics work, elect Socialist governments which in turn creates the Corporatism that enables these very systems to fail.
I mean, look at what this dark cyberpunk future has done to Bikini Bottom...

Without any competition from the Chum Bucket, the Krusty Krab retained a full monopoly over the citizens of Bikini Bottom, thus revealing that the once loyal customers themselves were in fact the secret ingredient to the Krabby Patty - hook, line, and sinker! 🎣

SwiYXVkIjpbInVybjpzZXJ2aWNlOmZpbGUuZG93bmxvYWQiXX0.jpg
SwiYXVkIjpbInVybjpzZXJ2aWNlOmZpbGUuZG93bmxvYWQiXX0.jpg


The silver lining to all of this is that the cyberpunk future we all dreamed of years ago, with callous megacorps and corrupt governments, has finally come true - get to work cyberpunks, there's much to be done. :borg:
Just remember, when a product is free, you are the product.
 
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cybereality

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Yeah, I thought I loved cyberpunk fiction. But now that it's real, it's not as glamorous as it seemed in the books.

Also, I am not against capitalism. I think it's the best system we have. Anyone can make it big. This motivates people, and also allows the poor to (potentially) become rich. You can't have that with socialism.

The issue is, that you can't leave a system unchecked. Nothing can be 100% unrestrained. If a company gains too much power, the people (or rather the government as an extension of the collective populous) should be able to step in.

Especially when companies like Microsoft are abusing their position in anti-competitive ways in what is essentially a monopoly. I don't have a problem with companies making money, but there needs to be balance.

For example, the government can fund (with our money) open source development of software like LibreOffice. They could mandate that public schools and government facilities use open source software. This would not be hard and not that controversial.

They can make rules, like they did in the 90's, that certain software not be pre-installed, or that alternatives must also be installed or easy to select. This is also not difficult.

For example, instead of pre-installing a web browser, maybe have a generic link to "Web" and when you click it the first time, it gives you a randomized list of the 10 most popular browsers, which you can choose to download (with Edge not allowed to be given special preference).

Same with Office. A generic link for a "Word Processor" which then allows you to download LibreOffice or whatever you want. I bet if people knew there was something almost as good as Word for free they would try it. But give people the choice.
 

ManofGod

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Yeah, I thought I loved cyberpunk fiction. But now that it's real, it's not as glamorous as it seemed in the books.

Also, I am not against capitalism. I think it's the best system we have. Anyone can make it big. This motivates people, and also allows the poor to (potentially) become rich. You can't have that with socialism.

The issue is, that you can't leave a system unchecked. Nothing can be 100% unrestrained. If a company gains too much power, the people (or rather the government as an extension of the collective populous) should be able to step in.

Especially when companies like Microsoft are abusing their position in anti-competitive ways in what is essentially a monopoly. I don't have a problem with companies making money, but there needs to be balance.

For example, the government can fund (with our money) open source development of software like LibreOffice. They could mandate that public schools and government facilities use open source software. This would not be hard and not that controversial.

They can make rules, like they did in the 90's, that certain software not be pre-installed, or that alternatives must also be installed or easy to select. This is also not difficult.

For example, instead of pre-installing a web browser, maybe have a generic link to "Web" and when you click it the first time, it gives you a randomized list of the 10 most popular browsers, which you can choose to download (with Edge not allowed to be given special preference).

Same with Office. A generic link for a "Word Processor" which then allows you to download LibreOffice or whatever you want. I bet if people knew there was something almost as good as Word for free they would try it. But give people the choice.

We speak of Microsoft and yet, it is Google who is the biggest threat in the monopoly space.
 

cybereality

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We speak of Microsoft and yet, it is Google who is the biggest threat in the monopoly space.
Yeah, well this is (or was supposed to be) a Microsoft thread. But Google is definitely up there as well. However, they don't employ the kind of illegal tactics that Microsoft does.

For example. I use Android. Though Chrome comes installed on a new phone, I can easily download Firefox (without annoying popups) and switch the default browser with one button. And everything in the OS respects that choice.
 

Red Falcon

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I'm not sure what is more disturbing: that our harbinger of doom is wearing a New Text Document on his hat, or that his system is configured to hide file extensions. 📄

🖱️New Text Document.exe 😱
LOL
I know, right, I can't remember where I found this meme at, but I probably should shop it some day to remove that - it just adds to the lore. 😆
 

DukenukemX

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No, Socialism creates Corporatism, and destroys and makes true Capitalism impossible.
Companies are allowed to become Corporatist megacorps by Socialist governments that enable them to do so, which is exactly what we are seeing here with 2020s Microsoft.
That's not how socialism works. Socialism means the community have a say in how a business is run, usually employees, while capitalism gives companies like Microsoft freedom to do what they want, usually within reason. That unchecked freedom is why Microsoft can force you to use their web browser on their operating system which has 90% of the market share in desktop computers. The reason Microsoft isn't allowed to force you to use their web browser was an act from the Europeans. The social collective that forced a company to change it's ways is socialist like.

Seriously, the bashing of Capitalism is getting old when it appears that Socialists don't understand that when they elect Socialist governments to power, they are thus destroying Capitalism and are fully enabling Corporatism, and that is by design; two sides of the same coin, if you will.
We're not corporatists but capitalists. You'll know we're in corporatism when you, Elon Musk, and Jeff Bezos don't own anything. Considering that you do actually own land, businesses, and slave labor then yes we're capitalists.

Also, I am not against capitalism. I think it's the best system we have. Anyone can make it big. This motivates people, and also allows the poor to (potentially) become rich. You can't have that with socialism.
Going from poor to rich is a pipe dream most Americans can't ever possible expect to achieve.
The issue is, that you can't leave a system unchecked. Nothing can be 100% unrestrained. If a company gains too much power, the people (or rather the government as an extension of the collective populous) should be able to step in.
Exactly, you can let businesses and certain individuals do as they please unchecked. Control must always be maintained, cause if society doesn't then the wealthy few will.
For example, instead of pre-installing a web browser, maybe have a generic link to "Web" and when you click it the first time, it gives you a randomized list of the 10 most popular browsers, which you can choose to download (with Edge not allowed to be given special preference).
I'm fine with Microsoft just allowing the installation of alternative browsers. The problem is how many browsers try to become the default browser. Even on Linux you have browsers that constantly ask to be the default. On Linux Mint they default to Yahoo search on FireFox and make it a bit difficult to get Google to be the default because Google ain't paying them money. All these defaults are the problem because they know 99% of people won't try to switch them. Also they make it difficult in how to change the defaults as a deterrent.
Same with Office. A generic link for a "Word Processor" which then allows you to download LibreOffice or whatever you want. I bet if people knew there was something almost as good as Word for free they would try it. But give people the choice.
Again it's the issue of knowledge and accessibility. It's not like Windows offers you to switch browser defaults or applications defaults. It will tell you to switch to the superior Edge browser when it has the chance. I doubt you'll see LibreOffice or FireFox as a popular choice on Microsoft's app store. Computers today are less about technology and more about social engineering.
 

cybereality

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I totally agree. What I'm saying is that the government needs to step in. It shouldn't be just Microsoft, I'm saying this includes pre-installed apps and options on all operating systems.

Imagine if you could buy an Android phone without a single installed app? A completely fresh blank slate. You choose which app store to install, what browser to install, etc.

Maybe the carriers like Verizon or Sprint could chose to sell pre-configured phones (because most people would want that), but the law would mandate that blank unlocked phones always be available at no additional cost.

And even if you bought the pre-configured phone, there should be one button in the advanced settings to "blank phone" which is an empty OS, no apps. And even without that, you could always easily switch to a new browser or app store with 1 button click.

This is what I am saying. And if the government doesn't have the balls to do this, then we as users need to switch to Linux (or other open systems) and boycott these abusive companies and their illegal social manipulation.
 

DukenukemX

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I totally agree. What I'm saying is that the government needs to step in. It shouldn't be just Microsoft, I'm saying this includes pre-installed apps and options on all operating systems.
This is why I said the government should have broken up Microsoft into pieces. Not just Microsoft but all these companies that are giving themselves new names because they go beyond what was their original business model. Apple for example makes it tempting to stay within their ecosystem, like their computers, their phones, their routers even, because it all just works together very nicely. With other products it's not always the case. Microsoft has always been doing this, with less success than Apple. Apple's iOS has been forcing users to use Safari and nothing has been done about it. I think it was a number of years ago when Apple allowed browsers to use their own backend rather than Safari with a different skin.
Imagine if you could buy an Android phone without a single installed app? A completely fresh blank slate. You choose which app store to install, what browser to install, etc.

Maybe the carriers like Verizon or Sprint could chose to sell pre-configured phones (because most people would want that), but the law would mandate that blank unlocked phones always be available at no additional cost.

And even if you bought the pre-configured phone, there should be one button in the advanced settings to "blank phone" which is an empty OS, no apps. And even without that, you could always easily switch to a new browser or app store with 1 button click.
I always buy a phone that allows me to install a custom rom, usually LineageOS. Though it shouldn't be expected that everything should know how to use ADB and FASTBOOT in order to get this functionality. We seem to be socially engineered to believe that phones are not computers and therefore give you less control over what you can do with them, including adding and remove applications. They don't get updates like computers do, they don't allow you to install other OS's like computers do. I can't even remove the bloat that comes with phones unless I root the device.

Why does this happen? The phone manufacturer has a deal with the carrier in how the device is configured and what software it comes with it. The phone manufacturer is trying to create synergy in places where it can't do it alone. The phone doesn't receive updates by design because that's a reason for you to upgrade. The phone has apps that can't be removed by design. The OS on the phone can't be replaced by design. We can't allow companies to create too much synergy that makes it hard for users to want to fight this. Most Apple users will tell you they love this aspect of Apple, that they how so much internal synergy. Sure they don't use industry standard charging ports like USB C that has been around since 2014, but the Lightening port works just fine, so long as all you other devices that are also Apple devices. Or how iTunes is needed to do certain things with your iOS but not a problem on Mac OSX since iTunes is included. This level of synergy is wanted even though outside of Apple these devices sometimes can't even send a text message to a Android phone. You either stay within the ecosystem and enjoy the synergy or step outside and watch as everything falls apart, again by design.
This is what I am saying. And if the government doesn't have the balls to do this, then we as users need to switch to Linux (or other open systems) and boycott these abusive companies and their illegal social manipulation.
I'm already using Linux Mint, but boycotting these companies is hard. Try not using Google for a month and you'll come back crawling. As a Linux user I have to use Windows, if not directly on a PC then through a VM. I seriously doubt that Microsoft is going to get more browser market share by doing what they're doing, other than confusing people why a link opened up Edge instead of Chrome or FireFox. I personally cannot be tricked into using another web browser without immediately realizing it. It has my bookmarks, it has my tabs which is in the hundreds btw. Yea I'm lazy. It has my addons like adblock and Zoom Page WE. Most other people will notice as well. Some will not care and continue to use the Edge because they ain't got no time for dat.

The government is to heavily corrupted to ever care enough to step in. Microsoft is pretty good at ruining a good thing they have going on. If it wasn't for Microsoft's legacy products like Office and Windows then they wouldn't have a leg to stand on. There aren't many situations where Microsoft succeeds in alternating the market share in their favor. Windows 11 requires TPM2 and Secure Boot turned on to install it. Most people will continue to use Windows 10 because traditionally most users hate upgrading Windows. They won't even upgrade for free, as Microsoft had to force a number of users to upgrade. Microsoft fucking up doesn't make it Ok in what they're doing. Absolutely the government should step in and tell them no, but that means the government will enact the will of the people. They're more likely to enact the will of the wealthy.
 

dandirk

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No, Socialism creates Corporatism, and destroys and makes true Capitalism impossible.
Companies are allowed to become Corporatist megacorps by Socialist governments that enable them to do so, which is exactly what we are seeing here with 2020s Microsoft.

Also, Microsoft was broken up by the USA in the 1990s, before it was a Socialist nation like it clearly is now.
Seriously, the bashing of Capitalism is getting old when it appears that Socialists don't understand that when they elect Socialist governments to power, they are thus destroying Capitalism and are fully enabling Corporatism, and that is by design; two sides of the same coin, if you will.


It is extremely ironic that those who do not understand how businesses operate, or how basic economics work, elect Socialist governments which in turn creates the Corporatism that enables these very systems to fail.
I mean, look at what this dark cyberpunk future has done to Bikini Bottom...

Without any competition from the Chum Bucket, the Krusty Krab retained a full monopoly over the citizens of Bikini Bottom, thus revealing that the once loyal customers themselves were in fact the secret ingredient to the Krabby Patty - hook, line, and sinker! 🎣



The silver lining to all of this is that the cyberpunk future we all dreamed of years ago, with callous megacorps and corrupt governments, has finally come true - get to work cyberpunks, there's much to be done. :borg:
Just remember, when a product is free, you are the product.

So is this a definition or wording thing? Admit not fully knowledgeable on the definitions...

Seems like in the context of this discussion, corporatism is where companies control the state. (oxford def could be used both ways actually).

Seems like unchecked capitalism is what causes Corporatist megacorps (in context of this discussion)... Socialism seems like it would be the opposite, where the government has more control over the businesses then the business has over government.

In the US, sure you can make an argument about over-bearing regulation amounts to socialism, but (imo) that would be a tough sell. There is certainly room for opinion here, but socialism? don't think we are there yet.

Really trying to understand how Socialist governments create Corporatism?

What we are seeing in the US is basically the opposite, capitalism by its nature gives advantages to the leader in a market. Those companies are leveraging that to expand markets, which suppresses competition.

Just because something "can" happen doesn't mean it happens often enough to even be a factor.
 

cybereality

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DukenukemX Apple in particular is setting a bad precedent. Everyone always says: "well they made the phone and the OS, they can do whatever they want." Well, no.

Let's say I buy a car from Honda. I should (and right now, can) drive anywhere I want. Not that Honda has some deal with McDonald's, and they physically disable the car if I try to drive into a Wendy's parking lot. That would clearly be illegal, but it's the exact same thing with iOS.

Apple still blocks other browsers on iOS. Basically the whole time (even today) you cannot use any other browser. Yes, they have Firefox on the AppStore, but it is just a Mozilla skin for Safari. This again is complete BS.

Pre-installed apps? BS. Even if we accept that apps can be pre-installed via some deals, users should still be able to uninstall at their will. Even doing a factory reset does not remove Candy Crush or whatever garbage is taking up space on the memory I paid for.

Yes, you can always install custom ROMs (provided you buy the right phone) but this also is not the best solution. You may lose features that are important to you, and most people don't have the skill or knowledge to do that.

USB-C works fine. Not sure about the technical aspects of Lightning, but I don't think Apple is doing anything so advanced that USB-C wouldn't work. But I think they make more money selling cables and chargers than the computers themselves, so there is that.

I see what you're saying with the boycotting aspect. I do believe that, but we're not there yet. I did try DuckDuckGo for about a month... and it sucked. The search results were horrible, I couldn't get my work done. So I had to switch back to Google. I understand.

Yes, the government is not for the people (at least in the US). There are honest politicians, sure, but the crooked ones far outnumber them. And the big companies pay them all off, we have almost no chance of making any change going this route.

The only thing I see working is getting open systems functional to the point where average people could switch. I love Linux, but I will admit you have to be a little more knowledgeable with computers to be comfortable with it. Especially the command line.

And the Linux / open source phones are so bad right now. The hardware is like 5 or 10 years old and the software is not ready to compete with iOS or Android. It's sad, but it's true. And I don't know how to solve this, but our window of opportunity is shrinking.
 

DukenukemX

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Let's say I buy a car from Honda. I should (and right now, can) drive anywhere I want. Not that Honda has some deal with McDonald's, and they physically disable the car if I try to drive into a Wendy's parking lot. That would clearly be illegal, but it's the exact same thing with iOS.
The worst thing is that Toyota is already blocking people from using features that exist in their cars. BMW has been doing this for a while but you know it's bad when Toyota does it.
Apple still blocks other browsers on iOS. Basically the whole time (even today) you cannot use any other browser. Yes, they have Firefox on the AppStore, but it is just a Mozilla skin for Safari. This again is complete BS.
I didn't know they still did this. Yet we're upset when Microsoft forces their web browser to be used in some situations and Apple makes what Microsoft does seem like nothing.
The only thing I see working is getting open systems functional to the point where average people could switch. I love Linux, but I will admit you have to be a little more knowledgeable with computers to be comfortable with it. Especially the command line.
Linux's problem is still no different from 5 years ago. Linus Tech Tips did videos where for a month they used Linux to see how their daily life would be effected by it. There's a reason why I use Linux Mint, as Luke seems to be having an easier time compared to Linus. The problem with operating systems nowadays is that they all have ulterior motives. Nobody makes an OS to be a good OS but to trap you into a ecosystem. If Microsoft was trying to be a good desktop OS, they wouldn't push Windows 8 and Windows 11 to be something meant for tablets. Apple wouldn't make Mac OSX with limited OpenGL support and Metal API instead of Vulkan if the OS was good. Apple is trying to lock developers into writing code that isn't compatible with any other OS and thus forcing developers to code for Apple and only Apple, to feed their App Store. Google didn't make ChromeOS to be convenient but to force everything through a web browser. Their web browser specifically which can't be good for overhead in applications since nothing can run outside of the Chrome Browser.

Linux distros are the only OS's you can find that aren't trying to collect data, force you into a ecosystem, or pushing you to use a certain style of a UI so that it can be used in the tablet and smart phone market. Linux's problem is a chicken or egg situation in that what came first the application or the user? Hence why sometimes running Windows in a VM is important since I can't always depend on Wine or open source alternatives to applications like Photoshop.

And the Linux / open source phones are so bad right now. The hardware is like 5 or 10 years old and the software is not ready to compete with iOS or Android. It's sad, but it's true. And I don't know how to solve this, but our window of opportunity is shrinking.
Android is open source and does somewhat use a Linux kernel. Android is far from perfect since it's a OS that's never meant to be regularly updated. LineageOS does a pretty good job updating phones they do support, like my Moto X4, but updates are like upgrading from Windows 10 to Windows 11 and not a simple process of running an update program and waiting to just quickly reboot and be done.

On the other hand Linux is far from perfect to be running on a phone. It can be done but a lot of work is needed to have simple phone features working, and working responsively. So we either take Android and make it more like a desktop OS with more desktop OS features, or we take a Linux desktop distro and try to make it more phone OS like. It's a huge undertaking either way but it can be done. Polish is key as Android and iOS have a ton of it. They're made to be snappy and quick while Linux is meant to manage a lot of hardware and be open and yet secure. iOS doesn't worry about security because it treats its users as a hostile entity while Android just doesn't give a shit if you install apps from a APK and screw up your device. Both iOS and Android have horrible tools to repair any software problem on your device and the usual solution is to wipe the device and reset it to factory.

At this point I hope someone starts a project where Android merges with Linux desktop features and creates a whole new operating system. One where you get the speed and responsiveness of an Android phone while also being open and secure with regular updates like you get with a desktop Linux distro.
 

cybereality

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Right. As much as Google is a huge company, Android and ChromeOS *are* Linux and they're the only ones that figured it out. It's easy to use, even easier than Windows.

And Android is switching to mainline Linux, they are trying to get away from all the proprietary forks, though this will take years to complete.

I have a few Chromebooks, the Lenovo Duet is my favorite, and it works great. Yeah, you can't really play games or use Photoshop, but for general computing (browsing, video watching, etc.) it's perfect.

For anyone that is not a serious gamer or content creator, I would say ChromeOS is what they should be using. It is more secure, much easier to use, and basic enough that you don't have to have a Computer Science degree to use it.

And the Linux support on ChromeOS is getting better. Most command-line apps work fine, and GUI support (even with GPU acceleration) is in beta, it works okay. You can even run GIMP and some other apps, but performance is not stellar.

I kind of like this. Make something dead simple, then still have the command line for advanced users who wish to enable it. Still would prefer it was a community project, but I understand we don't have the money or resources as Google does (and never will).
 

swetmore

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Sooner or later, MS will require you to scan / synch your Vax Passport (aka unique digital id) just to be able to login...

Ya know.. just for this initiative fully originated / funded by Senior Gates: https://id2020.org/

You will have 0 privacy and like it. Surf "alternative news sources" using Brave? Social Credit score decremented. Social Credit Score too low? Login Denied.

But remember kids, Windows 10 and 11 are "free"

Maybe we are already halfway there?


act.gif
 
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ManofGod

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Right. As much as Google is a huge company, Android and ChromeOS *are* Linux and they're the only ones that figured it out. It's easy to use, even easier than Windows.

And Android is switching to mainline Linux, they are trying to get away from all the proprietary forks, though this will take years to complete.

I have a few Chromebooks, the Lenovo Duet is my favorite, and it works great. Yeah, you can't really play games or use Photoshop, but for general computing (browsing, video watching, etc.) it's perfect.

For anyone that is not a serious gamer or content creator, I would say ChromeOS is what they should be using. It is more secure, much easier to use, and basic enough that you don't have to have a Computer Science degree to use it.

And the Linux support on ChromeOS is getting better. Most command-line apps work fine, and GUI support (even with GPU acceleration) is in beta, it works okay. You can even run GIMP and some other apps, but performance is not stellar.

I kind of like this. Make something dead simple, then still have the command line for advanced users who wish to enable it. Still would prefer it was a community project, but I understand we don't have the money or resources as Google does (and never will).

Simple and Google owned, what could possibly go wrong?
 

ManofGod

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Yeah, well this is (or was supposed to be) a Microsoft thread. But Google is definitely up there as well. However, they don't employ the kind of illegal tactics that Microsoft does.

For example. I use Android. Though Chrome comes installed on a new phone, I can easily download Firefox (without annoying popups) and switch the default browser with one button. And everything in the OS respects that choice.

And then remove Google Chrome and all Google stuff easily, right? Right?
 

cybereality

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And then remove Google Chrome and all Google stuff easily, right? Right?
Well, I'm trying to be realistic here. I don't exactly expect Google to allow me to uninstall Chrome. But if they let me use Firefox without some rigmarole, then I can accept that.
 

ElementDave

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I did try DuckDuckGo for about a month... and it sucked. The search results were horrible, I couldn't get my work done. So I had to switch back to Google. I understand.
I've tried to use DDG on numerous occasions in recent years, and the results have been objectively awful without fail. I couldn't even tell whether my search terms influenced the results. They must borrow their search algorithm from Amazon. It's impressive you lasted a month. I too had to return to Google's spamdex.

Simple and Google owned, what could possibly go wrong?
What could go wrong? That's a good question. Someone should google it! ;)

Google has an effective monopoly in the search space and an audience of billions of undiscriminating and suggestible individuals. A single entity with that level of control over the flow of information could be perceived as dangerous, but who would notice? People are too busy debugging their smart appliances and fidgeting with their phones.

Nope, no reason for concern.
 

cybereality

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The thing is, Google is not a forced monopoly. They are popular because they legitimately make the best products.

Google search is unrivaled. Nothing even comes close. Pixel phones, if not the best, are definitely in the top 3 and competitive with Apple and Samsung.

ChromeOS is the best version of Linux that average people can use. It just works. Android is great.

All of Google's services work. The Docs, the Photos, Cloud, etc. They are leaders because they make the best stuff, not because of some technological lock-in.
 

AceGoober

Live! Laug[H]! Overclock!
Joined
Jun 25, 2003
Messages
24,119
I've tried to use DDG on numerous occasions in recent years, and the results have been objectively awful without fail. I couldn't even tell whether my search terms influenced the results. They must borrow their search algorithm from Amazon. It's impressive you lasted a month. I too had to return to Google's spamdex.


What could go wrong? That's a good question. Someone should google it! ;)

Google has an effective monopoly in the search space and an audience of billions of undiscriminating and suggestible individuals. A single entity with that level of control over the flow of information could be perceived as dangerous, but who would notice? People are too busy debugging their smart appliances and fidgeting with their phones.

Nope, no reason for concern.

Interesting. I've been using DDG for everything from simple recipes to engineering drawings for over a year and have had results on par with Google. Maybe it's the way the search terms are typed?
 

1_rick

2[H]4U
Joined
Feb 7, 2017
Messages
2,681
Interesting. I've been using DDG for everything from simple recipes to engineering drawings for over a year and have had results on par with Google. Maybe it's the way the search terms are typed?
I've been using it for somewhat under a year. They admit they sometimes use Google search themselves. I find it's not always as good as Google, but usually it's pretty close, and it doesn't seem to have some of the thumb-on-scale that Google uses.
 
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