Windows 11 available on October 5

I think the aesthetics of Win11 are an improvement. The center app bar is better for me (w/ poor peripheral vision). I'd like to think of it as more 10.5 than 11 though. Looking closely you can see they added new surface menus to various areas but to get stuff done, you find the old Windows menus popping back up from way back Win7.

So yeah not entirely new at all.

My biggest pet peeve so far though is relatively minor. When I click on the time in the task bar on the bottom right, I expect the time to pop up like it used to. Now it just pops up your notifications panel - which is something you can do by clicking on the far right button anyway.
 
jlbenedict said:
Isn't it rumored (or maybe it's true) if you do the tpm bypass trick, then you may not get updates.. .. what to believe anymore 😂
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Not a rumor.

waiver_windows_11-800x659.jpg


https://arstechnica.com/gadgets/202...arent-entitled-to-updates-on-unsupported-pcs/
https://www.theverge.com/2021/8/28/22646035/microsoft-windows-11-iso-workaround-no-update-guarantee

For that reason alone, I wouldn't risk installing it on unsupported hardware. Either upgrade your PC or run Win 10 until it dies.
 
jlbenedict said:
Isn't it rumored (or maybe it's true) if you do the tpm bypass trick, then you may not get updates.. .. what to believe anymore 😂
Click to expand...

That has not been the case on any of the dozen or so older PCs that I've installed Windows 11 so far, and 22000 is already the RTM build so there aren't going to be any significant changes at this point. All of the computers have received security updates normally. The chance that systems will be blocked from receiving security updates is basically zero. Everything about Windows 11, including the strict official requirements, are for security reasons. Creating a situation where you have a bunch of un-patched Windows 11 systems out there would directly go against that. The message you get during install, as shown above, is pretty typical as far as legal stuff goes. Saying that people aren't "entitled" to receive updates doesn't mean they won't actually receive updates.

The only thing that is really up in the air as far as updates go is eligibility for future feature updates. These are supposed to come out once per year. But even if you can't install a feature update through Windows Update, you can always download the new ISO and do an in-place upgrade, bypassing the requirements check the exact same way as when you installed Windows 11 in the first place. I've already done this upgrading unsupported Windows 11 systems from 22000 to the current Dev build (which is now a preview of the first feature update).
 
DPI said:
I'm still trying to find a single compelling feature that's worth downgrading from a heavily debloated 10 Pro.

Maybe once the first game with DirectStorage ships and the results are positive.
Click to expand...

There aren't (m)any. Auto-HDR is one thing that actually works pretty well right now. Android app support probably will pretty cool be once it actually arrives. Depending on how you feel about aesthetics, you might like the new menus, icons, and rounded corners.
That's basically it. It's 90% the same.
 
I'd also hoped for some performance improvements to WMR (VR) in 11, but reportedly no improvement or change.
 
I've got a Core i9-7940x in a Gigabyte x299 'board lacking the TPM module, so it's a no-go for me. But even outside of the TPM it looks like a middling beta and is rolling out a number of things I don't like. I'm not morally opposed to TPM but this seems like a questionably motivated power grab. And with worse performance to boot...
 
Halon said:
And with worse performance to boot...
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None of the systems I've put Windows 11 on, new or old, have shown any performance regressions. The older systems actually seemed to benefit more from Windows 11. The new scheduler does a better job prioritizing the active task or game, so your system doesn't feel as sluggish even when your CPU is pegged at 100%.
 
DPI said:
There's gotta be a sarcastic amount of additional telemetry data they're also capturing now in 11 that they'll continue pretending is no big deal.
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I still, haven't spotted any of this supposed telemetry data from 10 they are supposedly collecting, that wasn't present in any version going all the way back to XP with their crash reports, If they are doing it then it isn't from Business or Enterprise licenses and I haven't run a home version since 98 so I have no data there to collect.
 
Lakados said:
I still, haven't spotted any of this supposed telemetry data from 10 they are supposedly collecting, that wasn't present in any version going all the way back to XP with their crash reports, If they are doing it then it isn't from Business or Enterprise licenses and I haven't run a home version since 98 so I have no data there to collect.
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If you accept the default settings in Windows 10, it sends basically everything you do back to Microsoft, including everything you type into the computer. Free built-in key-logger courtesy of Microsoft.
https://www.privateinternetaccess.c...s-10-keylogger-enabled-default-heres-disable/
 
Lakados said:
I still, haven't spotted any of this supposed telemetry data from 10 they are supposedly collecting, that wasn't present in any version going all the way back to XP with their crash reports, If they are doing it then it isn't from Business or Enterprise licenses and I haven't run a home version since 98 so I have no data there to collect.
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Ah you're probably right, if you haven't personally "spotted" any telemetry, it must not exist, and Microsoft admitting they're collecting it must be a lie to make themselves look bad.

I'm kidding of course, but Microsoft themselves have published thousands of the datapoints they collect, with many more undisclosed they said couldn't reveal for "security reasons".
 
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Microsoft should not get a free-pass when it comes to telemetry but it's important to remember that they are a follower in this regard. Google, Facebook, etc have been collecting as much info as possible for over a decade with very little backlash from the government or users. In that context, it's difficult to blame Microsoft for jumping on the bandwagon. It's not going to stop until we get actual legislation that addresses this.
 
DPI said:
Ah you're probably right, if you haven't personally "spotted" any telemetry, it must not exist.

And to think all the thousands of telemetry datapoints Microsoft actually bothered to published at one point - with many more undisclosed ones they said couldn't be revealed for security reasons - were probably all just part of some big corporate mushroom hallucination too.
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We generate 60GB of networking telemetry per week, and it isn't there in any form beyond the now nonoptional crash reports, but it doesn't contain anything that wasn't there in said optional crash reports that have been there since XP.
 
DPI said:
I'm still trying to find a single compelling feature that's worth downgrading from a heavily debloated 10 Pro.

Maybe once the first game with DirectStorage ships and the results are positive.
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Windows 10 supports DirectStorage, so if a game using it requires Windows 11 then it is just bullshit. It is just supposedly slower than Windows 11.
 
Armenius said:
Windows 10 supports DirectStorage, so if a game using it requires Windows 11 then it is just bullshit. It is just supposedly slower than Windows 11.
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I have a trio of 2015 LTSB boxes that are due for replacement and I am wondering if Windows 11 will have an LTSB option available or if I am just moving over to LTSC 2019 instead. They are going in during the March break so it will be a fun time to check it out.
 
Lakados said:
The keylogger was in the Beta builds never made it to retail, but I can't follow that link because it hit like 5 AV notifications when it attempted to load.
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No, it's still in there. Microsoft collects what websites you visit, which apps you launch, as well as everything you type on the keyboard.

Look in the privacy settings under diagnostics. This was captured on my machine with latest updated Windows 10 as of today.

1633378500088.png


Most people probably don't realize what is happening, or don't believe it, and don't know how to switch it off. Those are the default settings above.
 
cybereality said:
No, it's still in there. Microsoft collects what websites you visit, which apps you launch, as well as everything you type on the keyboard.

Look in the privacy settings under diagnostics. This was captured on my machine with latest updated Windows 10 as of today.

View attachment 400162

Most people probably don't realize what is happening, or don't believe it, and don't know how to switch it off. Those are the default settings above.
Click to expand...

They made turning off sharing features in Windows 11 even more cumbersome than Windows 10...I mean wow
 
cybereality said:
No, it's still in there. Microsoft collects what websites you visit, which apps you launch, as well as everything you type on the keyboard.

Look in the privacy settings under diagnostics. This was captured on my machine with latest updated Windows 10 as of today.

View attachment 400162

Most people probably don't realize what is happening, or don't believe it, and don't know how to switch it off. Those are the default settings above.
Click to expand...
None of that is available it's all greyed out on this side with it all off. Not an option to enable any of it for us but I do have capture logs on all the telemetry data that Micrososft is collecting with that on.

But when I pull up the Palo Alto logs for events being sent to Microsoft I do find some encrypted packets to the Microsoft servers, running Decrypt on them now will post them momentarily.
{
"ver": "4.0",
"name": "TelClientSynthetic.HeartBeat_5",
"time": "2021-10-04T20:38:14.4412645Z",
"iKey": "o:0a89d516ae714e01ae89c96d185e9ae3",
"ext": {
"utc": {
"eventFlags": 258,
"pgName": "WIN",
"flags": 1979712121,
"epoch": "4606785",
"seq": 1215
},
"metadata": {
"privTags": 16779264,
"f": {
"PreviousHeartBeatTime": 9,
"ConsumerDroppedCount": 5,
"CompressedBytesUploaded": 5,
"TopUploaderErrors": {

},
"EventStoreResetSizeSum": 5
}
},
"os": {
"bootId": 48,
"name": "Windows",
"ver": "10.0.19043.1237.amd64fre.vb_release.191206-1406"
},
"app": {
"asId": 87
},
"device": {
"localId": "s:0FC7D89A-EAAC-4BB9-A250-116EF4AFE890",
"deviceClass": "Windows.Desktop"
},
"protocol": {
"devMake": "Dell Inc.",
"devModel": "G5 5590"
},
"loc": {
"tz": "-07:00"
}
},
"data": {
"PreviousHeartBeatTime": "2021-10-04T20:08:14.4144613Z",
"HeartBeatSequenceNumber": 2424,
"EtwDroppedCount": 0,
"EtwDroppedBufferCount": 0,
"ConsumerDroppedCount": 0,
"DecodingDroppedCount": 0,
"ThrottledDroppedCount": 0,
"FullTriggerBufferDroppedCount": 0,
"CriticalDataThrottleDroppedCount": 0,
"UploaderDroppedCount": 0,
"InvalidHttpCodeCount": 2,
"LastInvalidHttpCode": 2147954430,
"LastEventSizeOffender": "",
"SettingsHttpAttempts": 1,
"SettingsHttpFailures": 0,
"VortexHttpAttempts": 53,
"EventsUploaded": 204,
"VortexHttpFailures4xx": 0,
"VortexHttpFailures5xx": 0,
"VortexFailuresTimeout": 0,
"VortexHttpResponsesWithDroppedEvents": 0,
"VortexHttpResponseFailures": 0,
"CompressedBytesUploaded": 94489,
"RepeatedUploadFailureDropped": 0,
"UploaderErrorCount": 2,
"TopUploaderErrors": [
"WinHTTP\\v10.events.data.microsoft.com | NetworkError: -2147012866:2"
],
"MaxInUseScenarioCounter": 0,
"DbDroppedCount": 0,
"DbDroppedFullCount": 0,
"DbDroppedFailureCount": 0,
"EventStoreLifetimeResetCounter": 0,
"EventStoreResetCounter": 0,
"EventStoreResetSizeSum": 0,
"CriticalOverflowEntersCounter": 0,
"EnteringCriticalOverflowDroppedCounter": 0,
"DbCriticalDroppedCount": 0,
"CriticalDataDbDroppedCount": 0,
"EventsPersistedCount": 998,
"PrivacyBlockedCount": 0,
"MaxActiveAgentConnectionCount": 0,
"AgentConnectionErrorsCount": 0,
"LastAgentConnectionError": 0,
"Flags": 236,
"CensusTaskEnabled": 1,
"CensusExitCode": 0,
"CensusStartTime": "2021-10-04T11:32:43.377"
}
}
Click to expand...

But I do have one here that is actually concerning to me. It appears to be a crash event from an UltraViewer session, and UltraViewer is not an approved app for that device group so I am wondering why it is there to begin with and it will require follow-up.

I should point out that all of these were blocked and never delivered as they aren't on the outgoing access list. But there isn't a lot of personal data here, and what is is pretty well masked.
case in point the "user id"
{
"ver": "4.0",
"name": "Microsoft.Windows.Kernel.DeviceConfig.DeviceConfig",
"time": "2021-10-04T20:28:57.2663528Z",
"iKey": "o:0a89d516ae714e01ae89c96d185e9ae3",
"ext": {
"utc": {
"eventFlags": 258,
"pgName": "WINCORE",
"flags": 1979712121,
"epoch": "4606785",
"seq": 1047
},
"metadata": {
"f": {
"RebootRequiredReason": 5,
"InstallDate": 9
},
"privTags": 2048
},
"os": {
"bootId": 48,
"name": "Windows",
"ver": "10.0.19043.1237.amd64fre.vb_release.191206-1406"
},
"app": {
"id": "W:0000da39a3ee5e6b4b0d3255bfef95601890afd80709!00001100000000000000000000000000000000000000!",
"ver": "1970/01/01:00:00:00!0!",
"asId": 1
},
"device": {
"localId": "s:0FC7D89A-EAAC-4BB9-A250-116EF4AFE890",
"deviceClass": "Windows.Desktop"
},
"protocol": {
"devMake": "Dell Inc.",
"devModel": "Latitude 3500"
},
"user": {
"localId": "j:64FED759-E640-F8C1-D188-51DB60C38707"
},
"loc": {
"tz": "-07:00"
}
},
"data": {
"Legacy": false,
"DeviceInstanceId": "SWD\\PRINTENUM\\{A698C433-D33A-4A72-8822-053BD64C316F}",
"DriverFlightIds": "",
"FirstHardwareId": "PRINTENUM\\{133619e4-143b-463a-b809-b1f51d05f973}",
"LastCompatibleId": "SWD\\Generic",
"ClassGuid": "{1ed2bbf9-11f0-4084-b21f-ad83a8e6dcdc}",
"DriverInfName": "printqueue.inf",
"DriverProvider": "Microsoft",
"DriverDate": "06/21/2006",
"DriverVersion": "10.0.19041.1",
"DriverSubmissionId": "",
"ExtensionDrivers": "",
"InboxDriver": 1,
"SetupMode": 0,
"NeedReboot": 0,
"RebootRequiredReason": 0,
"StatusCode": 0,
"InstallDate": "2021-10-04T20:28:57.6254210Z"
}
}
Click to expand...
 
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cybereality this has actually been productive for me. In the logs here I am finding things that are trying to pass themselves off as Microsoft error reports but they are probably some sort of botNet, definitely contain private info but it’s all coming from the guest network in 2 of my buildings. So probably infected student laptops, so already kicked them off the network. Submitted the packets to Microsoft and PaloAlto for review and let their principals know to give them a heads up.

This filter is getting saved it’s gonna be part of my Monday health check now.
 
Armenius said:
Microsoft announced today that they will begin rolling out Windows 11 to users on October 5. If you are on Windows 10 currently you will be eligible to receive a free upgrade to Windows 11 should Microsoft's analytics determine your PC is special enough. They say that all eligible PCs should be able to upgrade by the middle of next year. PCs preloaded with the new version of the operating system will also be available for sale starting on October 5.

https://blogs.windows.com/windowsexperience/2021/08/31/windows-11-available-on-october-5/




Rolling out the free upgrade to Windows 11 in a phased and measured approach​

The free upgrade to Windows 11 starts on October 5 and will be phased and measured with a focus on quality. Following the tremendous learnings from Windows 10, we want to make sure we’re providing you with the best possible experience. That means new eligible devices will be offered the upgrade first. The upgrade will then roll out over time to in-market devices based on intelligence models that consider hardware eligibility, reliability metrics, age of device and other factors that impact the upgrade experience. We expect all eligible devices to be offered the free upgrade to Windows 11 by mid-2022. If you have a Windows 10 PC that’s eligible for the upgrade, Windows Update will let you know when it’s available. You can also check to see if Windows 11 is ready for your device by going to Settings > Windows Update and select Check for updates*.
Click to expand...

I'll wait. You Guinea pigs jump on it.
 
jeffreyp said:
I'll wait. You Guinea pigs jump on it.
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It's not available in VLSC yet wondering how that is going to work for me, it needs secure boot and all that jazz, but you don't get that when flashing a stick from an ISO. So I wonder if they are just going to release a tool like they did for the Win10 Media Creation only for Win 11 and have different versions available out the gate there.
 
Welp, it appears that at least on the same hardware that I have, Windows 11 is slower in gaming, somewhat, then my Ubuntu 20.04.3 installation. This is with VBS being disabled.
 
to the people that used the beta versions, is Windows 11 in good enough shape on Day 1 to use on my main gaming machine?...will OEM versions be available for purchase?
 
I thought I read somewhere that Alder Lake would need Win11 for the scheduler for performance cores vs efficient cores? Clearly that could be included in Win10, but I did not read that it would (or wouldn't).
 
Spent about 2 hours messing with Windows 11. Seems pretty good so far, no problems.

Gaming performance seems the same, maybe a little better, but definitely not worse.

The audio on Bluetooth seems better quality though. I tried the enhance audio and 3D sound, even though I have just a mono speaker, and it actually sounded pretty good.

I really like the new settings menu, and search seems to work better. Also some small things like the animation when maximizing a file explorer window seems better. On Win 10 it would sort of snap but on 11 there is a quick cross-fade/zoom.

The right click in file explorer is trimmed down, and copying and pasting is much easier. Overall it just looks a lot better.
 
I'm kinda tempted to try it on my laptop but given that it is new and has some teething issues I will probably wait until Dell clears it for this system. My desktop is going to have to wait until Steinberg gives it the go ahead for all the audio software. Normally I'd test it first at work but the guy administering our VLSC account has become pretty useless so getting new Windows versions takes much longer than it should.
 
Sorry, My Haswell HT CPU, 16gb ram, and GT1030 should run great on Win11, but I'm not compatible
 
It looks like the new windows will not get shoved down user's throats this time, but I am still going to be keeping an eagle-eye on my wife's notebook to make sure.
 
Will first run it stock, and will then see what can be debloated with MSMG Toolkit

https://msmgtoolkit.in/

Been using this utility since Windows 8 / 2013 and it works well.
 
Ok probably a stupid question but if I upgrade via the assistant will everything on my pc remain intact such as files and games?
 
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