Windows 10 Warning: Anger At Microsoft Rises With Serious New Failure

Armenius said:
I guess using desktop shortcuts and taskbar pins is also old-fashioned now?
Click to expand...
I prefer to keep my desktop clean... same with my taskbar. I am not going to put shortcuts and links to the calculator on my desktop or pin it to my taskbar, same for notepad. If you prefer to have everything on your desktop good for you. It doesn't bother me how you want to use your computer, not sure why you're bothered with the way I use. I am not afraid to type a few keystrokes to find what I want. Heck most desktops are so cluttered that people have to type what they're looking for on their desktop, which makes even less sense :).
 
Ready4Dis said:
I prefer to keep my desktop clean... same with my taskbar. I am not going to put shortcuts and links to the calculator on my desktop or pin it to my taskbar, same for notepad. If you prefer to have everything on your desktop good for you. It doesn't bother me how you want to use your computer, not sure why you're bothered with the way I use. I am not afraid to type a few keystrokes to find what I want. Heck most desktops are so cluttered that people have to type what they're looking for on their desktop, which makes even less sense :).
Click to expand...
I pin to start menu. Windows key then click. For the stuff I use the most, no faster way for me. Better than typing search, and no clutter on the desktop. I personally feel the Win 10 start menu is the best since Win 3.1.
 
Best I can tell it only affected the "Type Here to Search" box on the start menu, have had 0 comments from anybody searching from file explorer, only from users who were using the start bar search. And that was only because that search box is internet enabled so it will search both local and internet sources and it seems they broke a connector while changing its layout which I might add is way nicer and lets you now differentiate between search types and now runs much faster with better results. Then again we are using Enterprise versions and I have not used any of this functionality on Home Edition so my views on it may be biased.
 
jardows said:
I pin to start menu. Windows key then click. For the stuff I use the most, no faster way for me. Better than typing search, and no clutter on the desktop. I personally feel the Win 10 start menu is the best since Win 3.1.
Click to expand...
I have my start menu fully collapsed (just the program list, nothing else, no pins or tiles). I like it to be minimal, just a preference. I use a lot of different programs (I do some gaming, some development, some 3d modelling, 3d printing, etc). I can easily just type 'visual' into my search and click on visual studio or visual studio code. No need to have links to both of them laying around (at least for me). I come from an older generation where typing what you wanted to do was a thing :). Guess old habits die hard.
 
Ready4Dis said:
I have my start menu fully collapsed (just the program list, nothing else, no pins or tiles). I like it to be minimal, just a preference. I use a lot of different programs (I do some gaming, some development, some 3d modelling, 3d printing, etc). I can easily just type 'visual' into my search and click on visual studio or visual studio code. No need to have links to both of them laying around (at least for me). I come from an older generation where typing what you wanted to do was a thing :). Guess old habits die hard.
Click to expand...
I enjoy how customizable Windows is. Not as customizable as some of the *nix based DE's, but there are several different workflow paths you can take depending on your preferences. With some 3rd party apps, you can really customize the GUI. Too bad that MS ties the local search to the "cloud" by default, but I can see why they would do that. With the push for a seamless experience across devices and syncing preferences and profiles across devices, without a local server to manage that, you would require the cloud-based approach.
 
naib said:
Sounds like you should use OSX
Click to expand...

Just like Android. Best way to implement Linux/Unix/BSD for everyone is to cover it up so nobody knows its even there.

Anyway, back to the topic. No surprises. Search and the Start Menu in Windows 10 have been breaking since launch. Rest of the OS has been quite stable though lol
 
pillagenburn said:
Serious question, but how do you know M$ isn't still logging everything you do?
Click to expand...
Doesn't matter. Any reduction to the spying is a win. Cutting off one of their major tentacles is a win. Less total traffic visible on Wireshark that is bound for Microsoft ip addresses is a win.
 
The article actually has the work around to turn off bing searching an MS store searching when you use the windows key to quick launch (and I do all the damn time.) So I'll be doing that when I'm at home.
 
odditory said:
Doesn't matter. Any reduction to the spying is a win. Cutting off one of their major tentacles is a win. Less total traffic visible on Wireshark that is bound for Microsoft ip addresses is a win.
Click to expand...

Want some fun. Get yourself tcpview and launch Skype. Do a call with a friend in the states. Watch how many connections Skype makes to overseas.
 
I have yet to see anyone that can backup why I can then do a local file search with the computer not being online.
 
M76 said:
I just realized something: Linux gamers are like vegans, they can't be happy until everyone else is converted.

As for search not working in windows, that's not news, that's the norm, I'm surprised when it actually works.
Click to expand...

Something tells me you've never met any vegans. Yes, you're projecting again.
 
Here's my problem with most of the replies in this thread. You're all ignoring the main issue of the fact that your local start menu search is connected to MS servers. That means it ISN'T LOCAL. You should be royally pissed off about that. Be vocal and not complacent like so many in this thread. We know it can work without the Internet so why does it even need to connect to MS? This has nothing to do with Linux vs Windows or carrying a cellphone but it absolutely does have something to do with your privacy. Stop giving it away every chance you get. That type of mentality is the exact reason why Windows 10 is spyware to begin with and why MS has apparently been secretly siphoning off all that start menu search data without telling you. They knew people would bend over without asking for a reach around and many in this thread have done just that.
 
dgz said:
Something tells me you've never met any vegans.
Click to expand...
What if I told you I never met any linux gamers either? OMG mind blown.
What does that have to do with the observation that they act the same way on the internet?
Yes, you're projecting again.
Click to expand...
If you have a personal beef with me just say that, because this is just embarrassing.
 
Vermillion said:
Here's my problem with most of the replies in this thread. You're all ignoring the main issue of the fact that your local start menu search is connected to MS servers. That means it ISN'T LOCAL. You should be royally pissed off about that. Be vocal and not complacent like so many in this thread. We know it can work without the Internet so why does it even need to connect to MS? This has nothing to do with Linux vs Windows or carrying a cellphone but it absolutely does have something to do with your privacy. Stop giving it away every chance you get. That type of mentality is the exact reason why Windows 10 is spyware to begin with and why MS has apparently been secretly siphoning off all that start menu search data without telling you. They knew people would bend over without asking for a reach around and many in this thread have done just that.
Click to expand...

Is it complacency or just an expectation of technology in a post Snowden world? Fighting it seems like an insurmountable task, because even after outrage against Facebook in the courts, things got worse. Not better. If Bezos can have his iPhone hacked, also Tor, Signal, Nord VPN what are we to do? Cloud has completely destroyed the concept of Personal Computing. Welcome to Public Computing.
 
VIC-20 said:
Is it complacency or just an expectation of technology in a post Snowden world? Fighting it seems like an insurmountable task, because even after outrage against Facebook in the courts, things got worse. Not better. If Bezos can have his iPhone hacked, also Tor, Signal, Nord VPN what are we to do? Cloud has completely destroyed the concept of Personal Computing. Welcome to Public Computing.
Click to expand...

Not use windows.
 
Vermillion said:
Here's my problem with most of the replies in this thread. You're all ignoring the main issue of the fact that your local start menu search is connected to MS servers. That means it ISN'T LOCAL. You should be royally pissed off about that. Be vocal and not complacent like so many in this thread. We know it can work without the Internet so why does it even need to connect to MS? This has nothing to do with Linux vs Windows or carrying a cellphone but it absolutely does have something to do with your privacy. Stop giving it away every chance you get. That type of mentality is the exact reason why Windows 10 is spyware to begin with and why MS has apparently been secretly siphoning off all that start menu search data without telling you. They knew people would bend over without asking for a reach around and many in this thread have done just that.
Click to expand...

Ok the windows key search isn't a drive search. Once you're in the explorer and do a search it doesn't search bing or the store, just your drive. Is it... dubious that they are doing it this way? Yes. Is it worth being called out on? Yes. Is it worth burning down the forest to save the seed... no. Moderation and consideration.

If you want to search your drive use the explorer or turn this off. I napped the steps to turn this off in regedit and will be disabling it today.

UPDATE: I recently rebuilt my system and when I went in to disable these registry keys they were already off. Meaning I was never impacted. I actually went through and customized my install during the install process (via the default prompts) and turned off all of that intelligent data sharing with MS. So when I was said and done my system was pretty well locked down from that sort of behavior.

Now if you're joe user... sure you probably just said meh defaults that's good right and moved on with your day.

Those saying in this thread to move to Linux or whatever alternative OS that is so much more secure are not talking to the people easily impacted by this issue.

PLUS if those enterprise installs were done correctly NONE of this would be an issue for those users either. The fact it is means whomever built your image was lazy and probably chose defaults.

Hell it's in these settings where you turn off sharing WIFI data with your 'friends' and letting your computer act as a distributor for MS patches! If your IT team is asleep at the wheel that is where the fault lies THIS time. If you are that IT team well you were caught with your pants down and whining about it here won't fix that. Just hope nobody else in your org figures out you pooched them.
 
Last edited:
techie81 said:
Not use windows.
Click to expand...

Here is a the world's most common drawing peripheral telling Google what you are doing in MacOS. I guarantee any OS will be vulnerable and punched full of holes the moment it is popular. Data is worth more than the oil industry now.

Developing AI bots that flood the internet with nonsense files, traffic, posts on fake social media profiles may be the only real defense going forward.

https://robertheaton.com/2020/02/05/wacom-drawing-tablets-track-name-of-every-application-you-open/
 
cjcox said:
"Can't believe this! No search. Broken. What?!"

I hear it's because of something down on the Internet.

"That's it! You mean, I can't search my LOCAL OS because of some mistake on the Internet?!!? I've had it with Microsoft!"

I've been running Linux as my desktop for 20+ years. It does the job.

"No way. I'm not leaving Windows."

Well, there ya go...
Click to expand...

Funny that, you can still ,manually search in Windows Explorer. No Internets Required :D

Just because they add new fancy features doesn't mean the old ones are gone. And that is why I'm not switching form MS: it still works.
 
M76 said:
What if I told you I never met any linux gamers either? OMG mind blown.
What does that have to do with the observation that they act the same way on the internet?

If you have a personal beef with me just say that, because this is just embarrassing.
Click to expand...

There's nothing to be embarrassed about. Maybe some day, when you meet such people in real life, and you'll realize you've been fed memes for years. Not changing your ways would be embarrassing.
 
Pyromaneyakk said:
Many professional software packages also won't run on anything other than Windows or Mac OS X, and there's no way I'm running the latter steaming pile. Adobe Creative Cloud, Visual Studio, and most Autodesk software are a few that come to mind.
Click to expand...

The entire VFX industry will tell you otherwise. From Servers and clusters to workstations, they all run primarily Linux.

VIC-20 said:
*nix as a viable option for everyone's desktop is an effin joke, because its users have no clue on how to support the clueless when things go wrong. I've been trying it since the 90s nothing has changed about its community.
Click to expand...

The community is actually quite good, r/linux_gaming is a fantastic resource. I don't encounter any issues assuming the title is silver or higher on ProtonDB, you avoid Manjaro and stick to Ubuntu based distros and read the comments re: Lutris runners before install. In fact I find games no harder to install and run under Linux and because I'm essentially running the title in a Windows API any issues experienced are shared with Windows users and quite often the same fixes work cross platform. It's not the 90s anymore.

What's more, DXVK/DX9VK is achieving pretty much a performance parity with native Windows these days and Vulkan based titles usually run faster under Linux.

Choice exists, unless you want to run every single bleeding edge so called AAA release available. Personally I'm not that sort of gamer, especially considering the cost of most of these titles outside the US.

As for the linked article, personally I don't search for files via the Windows 10 Start Menu so I really couldn't care less. At least there's no real nasty regressions like there quite often is.
 
VIC-20 said:
Is it complacency or just an expectation of technology in a post Snowden world? Fighting it seems like an insurmountable task, because even after outrage against Facebook in the courts, things got worse. Not better. If Bezos can have his iPhone hacked, also Tor, Signal, Nord VPN what are we to do? Cloud has completely destroyed the concept of Personal Computing. Welcome to Public Computing.
Click to expand...

You can take it back. I self-host as much as possible now because you don't need much horsepower for a lot of things. Sure I use a Pixel phone but I've separated Google from the more private parts of my life. I'm ok with the little bit Google does get because some of their services are unbeatable. Google Maps for example. OpenStreetMap and things are just garbage compared to Google Maps.

The key is a happy balance needs to be found.

Grimlaking said:
Ok the windows key search isn't a drive search. Once you're in the explorer and do a search it doesn't search bing or the store, just your drive. Is it... dubious that they are doing it this way? Yes. Is it worth being called out on? Yes. Is it worth burning down the forest to save the seed... no. Moderation and consideration.

If you want to search your drive use the explorer or turn this off. I napped the steps to turn this off in regedit and will be disabling it today.
Click to expand...

How do you know something isn't being sent back to MS though? That's the problem here. We don't know what they've been doing. My search on my work machine is completely borked right now. I can't even do local searches with the Windows key which breaks my entire workflow. That's not how that's supposed to work. Granted like you I'm doing the regedit and I'm writing a script to deploy to the other systems in the company as well. The key though is this is bullshit and I shouldn't have to even think about this.

VIC-20 said:
Here is a the world's most common drawing peripheral telling Google what you are doing in MacOS. I guarantee any OS will be vulnerable and punched full of holes the moment it is popular. Data is worth more than the oil industry now.

Developing AI bots that flood the internet with nonsense files, traffic, posts on fake social media profiles may be the only real defense going forward.

https://robertheaton.com/2020/02/05/wacom-drawing-tablets-track-name-of-every-application-you-open/
Click to expand...

Anybody that thinks Apple actually gives a shit about your privacy is a moron. They'll sell their users out the first chance they get so I'm not surprised that Wacom is doing that. Hell we know that for a fact now after it came out that they didn't roll out encrypted iCloud backups just to appease Uncle Sam.

However, the one thing you need to realize about the Linux community is how absolutely vicious they can and will be. Go look at the outrage at Canonical after the Amazon thing, the heat Canonical got for asking people to Opt into a tiny bit of hardware telemetry when you install Ubuntu (you could see all the data being sent back). Hell people were pissed that if you opted out Canonical got that as an answer. Yes, a few basement dwellers were scared of Canonical knowing that Ubuntu had been installed. The outrage at Manjaro for FreeOffice was so impressive it forced them to change directions. You throw an app in the community that siphons data like that Wacom app does and the outrage would be so outstanding that the app wouldn't be able to keep it going.
 
Mazzspeed said:
The entire VFX industry will tell you otherwise. From Servers and clusters to workstations, they all run primarily Linux.



The community is actually quite good, r/linux_gaming is a fantastic resource. I don't encounter any issues assuming the title is silver or higher on ProtonDB, you avoid Manjaro and stick to Ubuntu based distros and read the comments re: Lutris runners before install. In fact I find games no harder to install and run under Linux and because I'm essentially running the title in a Windows API any issues experienced are shared with Windows users and quite often the same fixes work cross platform. It's not the 90s anymore.

What's more, DXVK/DX9VK is achieving pretty much a performance parity with native Windows these days and Vulkan based titles usually run faster under Linux.

Choice exists, unless you want to run every single bleeding edge so called AAA release available. Personally I'm not that sort of gamer, especially considering the cost of most of these titles outside the US.

As for the linked article, personally I don't search for files via the Windows 10 Start Menu so I really couldn't care less. At least there's no real nasty regressions like there quite often is.
Click to expand...

There are a lot of industries other than the VFX industry. Many of them run Windows and Mac. This accounts for millions of users running billions of dollars in software, not exactly a niche market.
 
Pyromaneyakk said:
There are a lot of industries other than the VFX industry. Many of them run Windows and Mac. This accounts for millions of users running billions of dollars in software, not exactly a niche market.
Click to expand...

I never claimed otherwise. The interesting thing is, I have no doubt if the Adobe CC was released under Linux these industries would flock to Linux. Makes one wonder just who's stopping Adobe from doing so?
 
Vermillion said:
How do you know something isn't being sent back to MS though? That's the problem here. We don't know what they've been doing. My search on my work machine is completely borked right now. I can't even do local searches with the Windows key which breaks my entire workflow. That's not how that's supposed to work. Granted like you I'm doing the regedit and I'm writing a script to deploy to the other systems in the company as well. The key though is this is bullshit and I shouldn't have to even think about this.
Click to expand...

You know what, I don't. But I will take the steps to secure my system. The fact that this turns into metadata I'm sure they will justify with some... reason or another. Is this why they are working on a 3d accelerated command applet? Because everyone in it hits the window keys and types in cmd and enter a hundred times a day? Maybe? if they are using the data to give us better quality of life I'm ok with it. I just WISH they would be VERY CLEAR about where that is all tied in.
 
Mazzspeed said:
The entire VFX industry will tell you otherwise. From Servers and clusters to workstations, they all run primarily Linux.



The community is actually quite good, r/linux_gaming is a fantastic resource. I don't encounter any issues assuming the title is silver or higher on ProtonDB, you avoid Manjaro and stick to Ubuntu based distros and read the comments re: Lutris runners before install. In fact I find games no harder to install and run under Linux and because I'm essentially running the title in a Windows API any issues experienced are shared with Windows users and quite often the same fixes work cross platform.

What's more, DXVK/DX9VK is achieving pretty much a performance parity with native Windows these days and Vulkan based titles usually run faster under Linux.

Choice exists, unless you want to run every single bleeding edge so called AAA release available. Personally I'm not that sort of gamer, especially considering the cost of most of these titles outside the US.

As for the linked article, personally I don't search for files via the Windows 10 Start Menu so I really couldn't care less. At least there's no real nasty regressions like there quite often is.
Click to expand...

I imagine there are some scenarios where it all works out, especially professional organizations with in house Linux gurus and gaming which has had a problem solving community behind it since DOS.

But when it comes down to it, I have been able to fix literally any software problem of any kind on a Windows box without resorting to a reinstall since Windows XP. Why? Because someone found a solution and posted it. I can find endless forums where people are uploading logs and other random people on the internet are spending countless hours finding a personalized fix, then posting a solution. All for free.

No toxic elitist, figure it out on your own BS. Everyone jokes about users, but the Windows support community is simply unmatched for its willingness to assist.

I'm waiting for that day to happen for Linux. The Pi community has made huge strides towards this possibility, so maybe someday.
 
Mazzspeed said:
I never claimed otherwise. The interesting thing is, I have no doubt if the Adobe CC was released under Linux these industries would flock to Linux. Makes one wonder just who's stopping Adobe from doing so?
Click to expand...

That's a solid question. Maybe they make DX12 or 11 calls that arn't supported. Or perhaps they need to deploy to an OS that they know will have backward compatibility for x time.

Or maybe they get a check from MS to not port.
 
Grimlaking said:
That's a solid question. Maybe they make DX12 or 11 calls that arn't supported. Or perhaps they need to deploy to an OS that they know will have backward compatibility for x time.

Or maybe they get a check from MS to not port.
Click to expand...

The Adobe CC runs under Linux, Adobe themselves let a slide slip showing the CC running under Ubuntu a couple of years ago. They simply won't release it. The reason Linux is so popular in the huge VFX industry is because it's networked file system performance as well as NUMA support is better than both MacOS and Windows.
 
VIC-20 said:
I imagine there are some scenarios where it all works out, especially professional organizations with in house Linux gurus and gaming which has had a problem solving community behind it since DOS.

But when it comes down to it, I have been able to fix literally any software problem of any kind on a Windows box without resorting to a reinstall since Windows XP. Why? Because someone found a solution and posted it. I can find endless forums where people are uploading logs and other random people on the internet are spending countless hours finding a personalized fix, then posting a solution. All for free.

No toxic elitist, figure it out on your own BS. Everyone jokes about users, but the Windows support community is simply unmatched for its willingness to assist.

I'm waiting for that day to happen for Linux. The Pi community has made huge strides towards this possibility, so maybe someday.
Click to expand...

Linux is no different in this regard, how do you think anyone transitioning to Linux does so? Conflict arises when transitioning Windows users fly off the handle criticizing Linux because Linux is not a Windows clone and their learnt muscle memory doesn't apply, resulting in friction from the Linux community. MacOS isn't a Windows clone, yet everyone seems to be perfectly capable of accepting that fact. In fact MacOS is so similar to Linux it's uncanny.
 
Grimlaking said:
You know what, I don't. But I will take the steps to secure my system. The fact that this turns into metadata I'm sure they will justify with some... reason or another. Is this why they are working on a 3d accelerated command applet? Because everyone in it hits the window keys and types in cmd and enter a hundred times a day? Maybe? if they are using the data to give us better quality of life I'm ok with it. I just WISH they would be VERY CLEAR about where that is all tied in.
Click to expand...

Open Wireshark, it's all there. Windows 10 is constantly reporting back to the mothership using encrypted packets...
 
Lakados said:
maybe on Home Edition, Enterprise doesn't report much at all.
Click to expand...

It reports back a lot more than it should. GPO allows you to lock it down further but even then Win 10 ENT is still a Chatty Cathy. Only LTSC can be pretty much completely shut up.
 
Vermillion said:
It reports back a lot more than it should. GPO allows you to lock it down further but even then Win 10 ENT is still a Chatty Cathy. Only LTSC can be pretty much completely shut up.
Click to expand...

Furthermore, Enterprise LTSB isn't really ideal for home consumer usage - Especially if you're a gamer.
 
Vermillion said:
It reports back a lot more than it should. GPO allows you to lock it down further but even then Win 10 ENT is still a Chatty Cathy. Only LTSC can be pretty much completely shut up.
Click to expand...
PaloAlto has a block rule for the MS reports so what we don't have blocked via GPO it just drops on transit. I am starting to play with Intune which supposedly does a better job of allowing the reports to be turned off, in exchange of course they get a good snapshot of the hardware and its functions from there. But hey should let me do a better job of managing deployments and improve security overall so it is a trade we're willing to make.
 
I'd imagine with the amount of "serious" trouble people seem to have with Windows, half of the complainers must struggle to get dressed each day.
 
auntjemima

Is it a lonely friday night or do you have a dude coming over for board games?
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top