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Windows 10 No 'Loss Leader' for Microsoft
- Thread starter CommanderFrank
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heatlesssun
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Because turning off updates is like the one thing no one wants in beta software.
Unknown-One
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That's only because it's a technical preview, not something that will be in the final version...
They already deal with all of them.
hew hew hew
CreepyUncleGoogle
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No one wants? ktk clearly does which means someone does. Stop thinking in zero summing all the time and start thinking in division by zero to the negative eleventeenth power.
I wish folks would quit with the "well Apple can give OSX away for free!" crap.
Apple doesn't give OSX away for free. Its basically bundled in with $500 worth of laptop you just paid $1500 for. That covers you for a few upgrades till your Macbook gets thrown off the Apple upgrade island after 5 or so years.
When you buy a $1000 Windows laptop from HP, MS only gets a small cut of that for the OS.
If MS goes on with fast OS delivery then subscription could work pretty well for a lot of people. I usually stock up on pre release low cost versions to keep costs to the minimum.
Apple doesn't give OSX away for free. Its basically bundled in with $500 worth of laptop you just paid $1500 for. That covers you for a few upgrades till your Macbook gets thrown off the Apple upgrade island after 5 or so years.
When you buy a $1000 Windows laptop from HP, MS only gets a small cut of that for the OS.
If MS goes on with fast OS delivery then subscription could work pretty well for a lot of people. I usually stock up on pre release low cost versions to keep costs to the minimum.
Nope, not a good idea really. MS adding AV into 8 was a nice idea but it doesnt really help. By installing a feature on a machine as standard it becomes...the standard to beat as it will be on most machines.
Hence why MS has said that MSE is really only a baseline of protection as it's the one that is most common. If MS installed Malwarebytes or whatever as standard then within a few days it would get beaten down to 75% effective levels from 98%.
You have to mix it up on that front.
However MS should be switching on more of the security by default by now. Time to get rid of Admin accounts as standard.
End users shouldn't be buying OEM licensing. It is heavily discounted for a reason. OEM is for people like me to buy and have some overheard to resell the machine with a profit as "We" are the support for the PC/OS not MS. If you need support you buy retail, simple as that. Perhaps if people stopped for 5 minutes and tried to figure out the "why" they are saving money instead of just assuming that it was discounted for shits and giggles they might not be surprised when they learn there is less of something in the discounted version.
As I said, I don't have a problem paying for Windows. I have and will continue to buy the max version and the OEM version. Why? Because I don't need support from MS and I've never once had issue reinstalling it. But then I actually know what I'm doing.
Not quite. At least for Win 7 MS no longer sells retail.
coolpurplefan
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I actually bought a copy of Windows 7 because I don't want the (my own personal opinion) weird blocky (spelling?) tiles of Windows 8. It makes me cringe. I can spend 16 hours a day on a computer and I like a nice-looking desktop. I wish Microsoft would let you choose a different style layout just like they let you choose your screensaver.
I read Epic wants to make Unreal Tournament 2015 a pay-for-play model as well. I find that worrying. Windows is pretty much essential. And UT is one of my favorite games ever.
I'm playing the wait and see game with Win10. I'm not down for subscription services for an OS. Then again, almost everything I use runs on Linux. I believe Epic has always provided a Linux client as well (put me in the UT fan base).
In other words....I don't have much of a problem making my machine a straight up Linux box as opposed to the dual booter it currently is.
In other words....I don't have much of a problem making my machine a straight up Linux box as opposed to the dual booter it currently is.
Actually yea that is how it works. Win 7 isn't available oem because ms wants win 8 sold. Oem is always the first sku to be pulled. You clearly dont understand how licensing is supposed to work. Oem isn't and never was meant for end users to buy.
So go to Amazon or any other retailer, search for Microsoft Windows and tell us what comes up for sale. Claiming I don't understand OEM licensing is not an answer.
dandragonrage
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There are better reasons, such as complete lack of privacy. Technical preview is not an excuse to spy on me.
BladeVenom
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That's what I'm thinking.
How can they charge consumers $100 for an upgrade or OEM edition of Windows when you can buy a tablet with Windows for under $100, or a Windows laptops for under $200.
CreepyUncleGoogle
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I'm kinda with you on this one. I mean, it has nothing to do with the games and I'd like to see what the pricing model is gonna be like. We'll find out sometime next year though and if it stinks, whatever. I have a really old laptop on Vista that'll get Linux when Vista support ends in like 2017 if it still works and I'll use Windows 7 until its support ends or the computer it's on is like dead or something. Beyond that as long as there's a Linux distro around that isn't mandatory-cloud or creepy Google infested, then I really don't care what Microsoft does with their products.
Could be worse, could be the 10 consumers I had while helping out selling laptops last month asking that if there is no win 7 downgrade from win8.1 , they wont buy the laptop...
The win7 OEM keys are saving the laptop industry from a total clusterf*ck , amd yet you see m$ being a huge dick by pulling win7 retail off.
If win7 is still on retail, every laptop purchase would be made more profitable with a win7 retail pack but nooooooo....
I dont even want to go to the clusterfuck updates called " 2982791" (go google it yourself)
the fix? this :
Microsoft advised users to manually remove update 2982791 through a process of rebooting and deleting certain files.
nice move . And yet someone seems to not know why the f*ck forced updates are a bad idea.
While we're on the topic of what people clearly don't understand:
GFC-02733
- Windows 7 Home Premium 64Bit Service Pack 1Pack English DVD License Pack Brown Box
Local stock levels at one distributer, Toronto - 3232, Vancouver - 425, etc.
WN7-00615
- Windows 8.1 Edition 64Bit 1Pack English DVD Brown Box
Local stock levels at one distributer, Toronto -15, Vancouver - 3, etc.
uh huh, sure looks like the most popular OEM operating system isn't available.
Presumably US stock levels at just this one distributer is higher. Add that with even larger US distributers and you have huge levels of stock.
From what I am reading here and there.. I think I can see what MS is still trying to do: once again leverage the desktop market to tablets/phones.
I am not sure they will pull it off...
They view the market as a fragmented market and not separate markets: tables & phone vs desktops.
I believe they are wrong, I am starting to believe tables and phones while computing devices are nonetheless true separate markets at this moment: nearly always connected devices that need to be connected: tables and phones.. and the connected but not necessary expected/needed to be: desktops.
As Google and Apple moved computing (I used the latest Android, and I a sorry but WOW!, this is their Windows 7) to fully-connected monsters, MS fell behind and its still trying to make the desktop such a device too, so they can then leverage tablets and phones against it.
I am treating more and more my desktop as a separate, but needed computing device... there might be a time when I end up with a disconnected linux-based, nearly never-updated desktop.. to be used to burn CD of pictures, maybe type simple things and other MISC-but needed stuff.
I might invest in a full-feature tablet at some point, there is a newer Android phone in the household now.
I don't think they will pull it off: they will basically destroy the desktop as we know it (what we know, basically WinTel created), at which point, MS will be a newcomer in the GOOGLE/Apple arena.. with the desktop (now destroyed and made into a glorified tablet) actually up for grabs more and more by Google/Apple and the Arm architecture are a consequence.
I don't know that is my discombobulated opinion.
I am not sure they will pull it off...
They view the market as a fragmented market and not separate markets: tables & phone vs desktops.
I believe they are wrong, I am starting to believe tables and phones while computing devices are nonetheless true separate markets at this moment: nearly always connected devices that need to be connected: tables and phones.. and the connected but not necessary expected/needed to be: desktops.
As Google and Apple moved computing (I used the latest Android, and I a sorry but WOW!, this is their Windows 7) to fully-connected monsters, MS fell behind and its still trying to make the desktop such a device too, so they can then leverage tablets and phones against it.
I am treating more and more my desktop as a separate, but needed computing device... there might be a time when I end up with a disconnected linux-based, nearly never-updated desktop.. to be used to burn CD of pictures, maybe type simple things and other MISC-but needed stuff.
I might invest in a full-feature tablet at some point, there is a newer Android phone in the household now.
I don't think they will pull it off: they will basically destroy the desktop as we know it (what we know, basically WinTel created), at which point, MS will be a newcomer in the GOOGLE/Apple arena.. with the desktop (now destroyed and made into a glorified tablet) actually up for grabs more and more by Google/Apple and the Arm architecture are a consequence.
I don't know that is my discombobulated opinion.
Unknown-One
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Microsoft isn't being a dick, the end-of-life on Windows 7 was determined before the OS was even released.
QUOTE=ktk;1041278700]nice move . And yet someone seems to not know why the f*ck forced updates are a bad idea.[/QUOTE]
Updates are not forced-on on any of the operating systems effected by the update you're taking issue with.
Updates have never been forced-on except in pre-release versions. They cannot take away the ability of corporate IT to test updates before deployment. You have nothing to worry about on that front.
Unknown-One
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sanitarium16
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LOL a subscription for windows? Who's running Microsoft? Obama? WINDOWS 7 FOR LIFE
Unknown-One
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Again, I point to Office 365.
The existence of a subscription-based version of Office has not removed the option of buying Office at retail for a one-time fee that lets you use that specific version forever.
If Microsoft brings out Windows 365, much the same thing will happen. You'll be able to go subscription-based for a small monthly fee and get upgrades for the duration of your subscription OR pay one lump-sum and use the version you paid for forever.
They've been pushing very hard to change that and it's only a matter of time from what Microsoft employees and Microsoft authorized distributors have been saying. According to them, the retail skus were supposed to disappear in November.
However they're still available so who knows if Microsoft changed their mind or... we will see.
MS has just about sunk it's Office brand on desktops. Assuming they care about that market for it...
No one likes Office 2013. I sell the odd full license to those that must have it for business.
For home? I'm still installing customer's existing versions that they've been using for years, all the way back to Office XP. They could care less about any of the new menus, or the cloud storage.
Everyone else? Uses a free alternative like OpenOffice or LibreOffice.
I gave up and went to OpenOffice years ago. Havn't looked back. Hasn't hurt me or my business one bit.
When I need a compatible format to send information... I send a PDF. Every device on planet earth that matters can open a PDF.
No one likes Office 2013. I sell the odd full license to those that must have it for business.
For home? I'm still installing customer's existing versions that they've been using for years, all the way back to Office XP. They could care less about any of the new menus, or the cloud storage.
Everyone else? Uses a free alternative like OpenOffice or LibreOffice.
I gave up and went to OpenOffice years ago. Havn't looked back. Hasn't hurt me or my business one bit.
When I need a compatible format to send information... I send a PDF. Every device on planet earth that matters can open a PDF.
Unknown-One
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Not sure what you're talking about, Office is one of Microsofts most profitable divisions.
Offices buy up volume licenses like crazy, the mobile apps are free, and the web apps are free. There have never been fewer barriers between consumers and office products.
How, exactly, is the division "sunk" when all evidence is to the contrary?
They discontinued retail sales of Windows 7. Technically Office 2013 has never been on sale retail, just the license key you can use to activate a preinstall, or download when you get home.
And this is normal, just like how retail sales of Windows 8 will end November 2015. Both are still available from OEMs and will be as long as there's demand.
CreepyUncleGoogle
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The only problem with older versions of Office are the lack of security updates. It's probably not a big deal, but versions older than Office 2007 aren't gonna get any problems like that patched and that could cause problems. Then again, I use LibreOffice for the most part now, but I don't know much about their record for stuff like exploits.
Comixbooks
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Nutella is a dumb ass if this is the case Windows 10 will be as popular as Vista and Microsoft will go under. Sure charge a price for it but don't make it a sub lets say you own every piece of your PC except the OS that is just stupid.
ManofGod
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Please show me a legitimate source that says the OS is going subscription base? Otherwise, it is a BS rumors and nothing else.
ManofGod
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After what I just read there, I think I need to take and Advil.
Your opinion is just that, an opinion and can you please provide me actual proof that "no one" like Office 2013? Are you everyone?
ManofGod
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You might as well just say everyone because your source is just as solid of an excuse as that. There was never a time when the retail SKU's were going away. Oh well, keep shoveling it.
ManofGod
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Could be worse, could be the 10 consumers I had while helping out selling laptops last month asking that if there is no win 7 downgrade from win8.1 , they wont buy the laptop...
The win7 OEM keys are saving the laptop industry from a total clusterf*ck , amd yet you see m$ being a huge dick by pulling win7 retail off.
If win7 is still on retail, every laptop purchase would be made more profitable with a win7 retail pack but nooooooo....
I dont even want to go to the clusterfuck updates called " 2982791" (go google it yourself)
the fix? this :
Microsoft advised users to manually remove update 2982791 through a process of rebooting and deleting certain files.
nice move . And yet someone seems to not know why the f*ck forced updates are a bad idea.
So basically, you lost 10 sales, great job.
coolpurplefan
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So basically, you lost 10 sales, great job.
Does anyone here know what would happen if you used a Windows 7 disc to install it on a computer without a product key just to see if Microsoft will sell you a key? I know you get a message at one point to buy a copy of Windows. But I read Microsoft has stopped producing the keys for Windows 7.
I'm not sure why they'd want to eliminate it anyway. If they have updates for it until 2020, why not let consumers buy it until Windows 10 comes out? The one thing I find promising about Windows 10 is the ability to have multiple windows on the same screen arranged the way you want. That's one thing I'd really want.
ManofGod
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You can still order it from Newegg, Amazon or TigerDirect. Also, I just checked and you can order it from Best Buy as well. (Not in stock, it would have to be shipped.) Just checked using the Windows Anytime Upgrade and it would let me purchase the next one up.
Based on the Windows Anytime Upgrade, I would say you can still buy it without issue. Also, BuyCheapsoftware.com is also a good place to get it.
Ocean
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we should all just buy retail and every single time one of us runs into a bug, we go to microsoft directly for support.
microsoft never gets to hear from us power users about all the shit that is wrong from power users because we all buy oem.
microsoft never gets to hear from us power users about all the shit that is wrong from power users because we all buy oem.