Windows 10 Home Edition May Force Updates On You

Dead Parrot said:
I wonder how many of the folks making these decisions play any type of ping sensitive games? Nothing like several hundred megs of updates to roach up a gaming session.
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That's exactly why I don't do any kind of automated anything. Windows updates, graphics drivers... you name it. I update manually. It also gives me a chance to back up my machine so that if an update fux0rs I can fix it in a few minutes instead of a few hours. At least Steam is polite enough to stop updating while you're in a game, but Windows? Yeah, nothing's worse than getting a lag spike and packet loss right before you're about to get the game-winning flag capture, and you get fragged and watch the lucky-assed newbie return their flag and run off with yours instead because Windows decides "Oh, screw you, user! I belong to Micro$haft, and so do you! Your frags mean nothing to me!".

It's also why I don't touch anything with the words "home edition" on it. It takes enough time to de-noobiefy every new version of Windows so that it's not eye-bleeding and nausia-inducing to look at without getting hamstrung by all the limitations they put on the "Ur 2 dum 2 uz comp00tur" versions. :rolleyes:
 
Steve said:
Something doesn't sound right about this. Why would Microsoft remove the ability to defer updates from just one version of Windows 10?
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People who buy Home typically don't have the knowledge to decide. Pro licenses imply a more knowledgeable user (in theory) but more than that, those are used by businesses. Yes, some use Enterprise licenses, but at my jobs, we used Pro.

Then again, I don't recall ever having IT preventing me from installing patches, which I tried to do within a day or 2 of release. They did sometimes install them for you if you hadn't already installed them.
 
For those of you late to the thread, see WaltC's post above. The page in question has been corrected.

Now, on to the next rumor, in which a poorly worded Microsoft webpage is interpreted to mean that Windows 10 will check your underwear for ringworm on a daily basis and post positive results to the Internet for all to see.
 
For the low, low price of $429.99 you can upgrade to Windows 10 Pro.

Once that's done, you can choose whether you update or not.

Rather not pay? That's just fine as well, but we're gonna fuck your shit up.
 
evilsofa said:
For those of you late to the thread, see WaltC's post above. The page in question has been corrected.

Now, on to the next rumor, in which a poorly worded Microsoft webpage is interpreted to mean that Windows 10 will check your underwear for ringworm on a daily basis and post positive results to the Internet for all to see.
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A daily ringworm check would be a pubic service! :cool:
 
Unknown-One said:
This is a non-issue. Windows already has the option to delay windows updates while on metered connections. This isn't being removed in Windows 10.
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Sorry. It's a MAJOR issue. And Microsoft simply does not get it. A metered, restricted connection is anathema to pushed out updates. That's why I hate Apple. They (or their software vendors) do it every day.
 
Unknown-One said:
This is a non-issue. Windows already has the option to delay windows updates while on metered connections. This isn't being removed in Windows 10.
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That's not the point. The point is that the updates are being pushed out. Let the user control updates until they are off a metered connection.
 
TwistedAegis said:
So you would never update? Sounds like that is as bad as the overage charges.
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I didn't say or suggest that. I want full control of updates, not have them pushed at me when I'm on a metered connection.
 
DKS said:
That's not the point. The point is that the updates are being pushed out. Let the user control updates until they are off a metered connection.
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They are looking at the bigger picture not the minority. Un-updated vulnerable systems are a bigger threat than the few people that have metered connections and also have to have the newest OS. I am so tired of fixing problems on pc's that all was needed was windows update and when I run it it takes hours.

It should be enabled by default to push updates but at least bury an option somewhere to disable it, because those that would need to hopefully are smart enough to google how to disable it.
 
Makes sense considering botnets consist mostly of home user machines that lack the management and protection of a dedicated IT team.
 
DKS said:
I didn't say or suggest that. I want full control of updates, not have them pushed at me when I'm on a metered connection.
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That's not how it works at all. When you are on a metered connection, updates will not download automatically, just like in Win8.
 
Shmee said:
It kind of makes sense. You would be surprised how many people never install updates. I mean never, and they are proud of it. Then on the other hand enterprise users would probably be using WSUS or something, so they would have a Sys Admin forcing their updates.
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Exactly.

Plus, since Microsoft is moving to a "Windows as a service" model, it's important that the OS stay up to date. An IT Professional that runs Pro or Enterprise edition is going to know what to do to get Windows updated much better than a home user.
 
Yeah, that will be swell especially for Friday night gaming, nothing beats trying to grind through a background update while gaming. Haha
 
ghostyclaw said:
Yeah, that will be swell especially for Friday night gaming, nothing beats trying to grind through a background update while gaming. Haha
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Patch Tuesday, not Patch Friday. :rolleyes:


Most people gaming are on 40mbit or higher connections. Do you honestly think Microsoft updates are going to leech all of your bandwidth?


Sheep will be sheep, I guess. :rolleyes:
 
DKS said:
This is absolutely asinine. For anyone with a data-capped internet connection, using up valuable download capacity is simply not acceptable. I have a cottage where there is no DSL or cable available. The only internet access is through cell phone hotspot. I have 6 Gb/month of data. Any kind of large patch ( and I have seen several from MS) will use up valuable data. Overage charges are usurious. This is simply dumb on MS's part.
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Not just that, but I prefer to install updates when I have time to fix any potential problems. Nothings worse than trying to do a quick restart of your computer, and having to wait for 20 minutes while windows updates run.

If Windows 10 home won't let me set update to just notify me (instead of automatically install the updates) Then I'll likely be on Windows 7 for a very long time.
 
Currently we already have auto update option. Let users have the choice, it's as simple as that.
 
DKS said:
This is absolutely asinine. For anyone with a data-capped internet connection, using up valuable download capacity is simply not acceptable. I have a cottage where there is no DSL or cable available. The only internet access is through cell phone hotspot. I have 6 Gb/month of data. Any kind of large patch ( and I have seen several from MS) will use up valuable data. Overage charges are usurious. This is simply dumb on MS's part.
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When I hear that I can't help but think to myself, sucks for you. My father in law has a similar situation but got a good deal on satellite ISP which is capped as well but not very badly. Thank god I stuck with my data plan from 2009. I have used 12gb this last month and haven't ever been throttled. I live in an area where t-mobile is actually very very fast and dependable, even new contracts will let you download as much as you please. They may slow down after 2gb though. Sounds like what you have available to you just blows. Sorry man.
 
I mentioned this weeks ago on many forums, in the win10 preview, the auto update stuff is ghosted out, when I mentioned this people told me I am worrying about nothing, but seems I was right.

Win10 pro should allow skipping updates tho as it has windows update for business included.

As far as I know all win7/8.1 pro licenses convert to win10 pro, also win7 ultimate converts to win10 pro.
 
Also to add (sorry cant edit my above post)

They have 2 clear reasons to do this.

Dev's always want their users on the latest version of their software, supposedbly as it means its easier to support, plus forces new features out faster.

#2 By making the old behaviour a premium feature they can get more revenue which is increasingly harder to get from operating systems.
 
chrcoluk said:
I mentioned this weeks ago on many forums, in the win10 preview, the auto update stuff is ghosted out, when I mentioned this people told me I am worrying about nothing, but seems I was right.
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You're still wrong.
 
Modred189 said:
DPI said:
And you would be surprised how many things windows update fucks up. Like my friend's AMD driver and CCC settings that windows update kept wiping out with an older driver in an endless loop. If there's no way to at least defer driver updates this could be very bad.

....
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I'm not sure what your friend is doing, but I don't get Nvidia driver updates from Windows Update. I get them from the nvidia control center software (whatever it's called, "Experience"?)
The last time I had a windows update actually mess anything up was back in Windows ME, and hell, that was SOP back then. But these days, it's essentially flawless.
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Yeah, I have an AMD card, and I've never had Windows Update get my driver updates. CCC handles that, not Windows. Honestly, I'd love it if I could get video driver updates through Win Updates.

Are there some bad updates that get pushed through Win Updates? Yes. Do they affect large groups of people? No, typically well under 1% of people are affected by these issues, and the update gets pulled/corrected immediately.

Even if you have auto updates turned on, like I do, the updates only get installed on reboot on Windows 7. (I haven't read anywhere about that changing in Win 10.) By the time I do my weekly reboot, any bad updates have already been redacted.
 
chrcoluk said:
I mentioned this weeks ago on many forums, in the win10 preview, the auto update stuff is ghosted out, when I mentioned this people told me I am worrying about nothing, but seems I was right.

Win10 pro should allow skipping updates tho as it has windows update for business included.

As far as I know all win7/8.1 pro licenses convert to win10 pro, also win7 ultimate converts to win10 pro.
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You're assuming that the behavior in a Technical Preview is going to be extended to a retail product. Part of the Microsoft Insider agreement when you download and install the W10 Technical Preview is that it must always be kept up to date. It still amazes me that every time a new Windows is being previewed that people think it's okay to use as their primary OS and expect it to behave like a retail product.

This reply was readily glossed over because apparently it's too cool to hate on the big, bad corporation of Microsoft.
WaltC said:
The article is wrong--the Microsoft link where this information was supposed to be has been taken down, so it's just one more thing about Windows 10 that has been misinterpreted/misunderstood by Internet writers trying to drum up page hits. First came the nonsense about Microsoft charging a fee for Win10 after the first year; now this garbage about forcing updates. People really are stupid, aren't they?

Update: the page is now back and corrected:

"These are for a pre-released version of Windows 10 and are subject to change."

It's sad that Microsoft has to keep repeating itself in a variety of ways because people's brain-cages are shrinking...;)
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As long as they have a way to install updates offline, this shouldn't be a big deal. Some industries like the one I'm in use isolated, closed off systems, miles offshore that will never, ever be connected to the internet while out there.
 
ccmfreak2 said:
Yeah, I have an AMD card, and I've never had Windows Update get my driver updates. CCC handles that, not Windows. Honestly, I'd love it if I could get video driver updates through Win Updates.

Are there some bad updates that get pushed through Win Updates? Yes. Do they affect large groups of people? No, typically well under 1% of people are affected by these issues, and the update gets pulled/corrected immediately.

Even if you have auto updates turned on, like I do, the updates only get installed on reboot on Windows 7. (I haven't read anywhere about that changing in Win 10.) By the time I do my weekly reboot, any bad updates have already been redacted.
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Windows 10 will retrieve and install driver updates including for your video cards. Both NVIDIA and AMD currently have their latest drivers on windows update. You can turn off the feature if you want to use beta drivers or what have you, but at least by default it's on for all the people who can't be assed.
 
UrielDagda said:
Great, so look forward to winding up with a bricked system when they push a bad update.
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A big reason why they've had so many issues with that as of late is because of how many versions of windows they have to account for. Think about it. With Windows 7 alone you have SP1 with IE8, 9, 10, 11, x64, x86, Thin PC, Embedded, starter, home basic, home premium, pro, enterprise, ultimate and on and on.

If they can reasonably expect that everyone is on the same level of updates it becomes a lot easier to manage. I'm not saying that bad updated won't happen but reducing the amount of variables will probably keep them at a minimal compared to the recent past.
 
Ah this happens in win 10 pro too. I lost a days work because I walked away from the machine to have dinner and when I got back the machine had installed and rebooted because the update needed a reboot without saving any of the open text files... I work on note pad so there was no auto save there was no back up. all the work was simply gone. So yes it definitely will update and reboot on you. If you change to ask me it asks if you are sitting there to see if you want to post pone it but it does not let you chose when to update which is really annoying. Then again I'm still deciding if win 10 is just going to be my gaming machine since it is faster when the graphic drivers are not glitching. I got a blue screen of death without any real info saying the video memory error-ed and the system rebooted. I'm noticing that when the system wants to reboot it does and while this helps if the system is hung, it is still is bad thing. The thing is everything else compared to win 8.1 is better. The only thing I miss is recent files for some of my apps.
 
Windows has already done this for years if you just accept the default settings. If you're really that upset about it, block the Windows Update server in your router configs or something. For 99% of home users, keeping the system up to date is a very good thing. If you're in an enterprise environment, you're a developer, or some other edge-case user that may have a reason not to update, you should be able to figure out for yourself how to get around having the system update.
 
Darunion said:
They are looking at the bigger picture not the minority. Un-updated vulnerable systems are a bigger threat than the few people that have metered connections and also have to have the newest OS. I am so tired of fixing problems on pc's that all was needed was windows update and when I run it it takes hours.

It should be enabled by default to push updates but at least bury an option somewhere to disable it, because those that would need to hopefully are smart enough to google how to disable it.
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Unfortunately it's not a 'minority". For those of us in rural Canada, slow internet speeds and low data caps are very, very real with no change in the near or far future.
 
drakken said:
Ah this happens in win 10 pro too. I lost a days work because I walked away from the machine....
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You know you are running a Technical Preview, right? Microsoft provides the preview for you to test out the OS and provide feedback. Microsoft further advises you not to use it as your daily OS to do important work.
 
If that is what they are going to do then they should have it on by default but also allow more seasoned computer literate people to change it for updates to wait until the user wants to install them.
 
EarlKeim said:
Very true indeed. I have worked on many friends' and family members' machines and they have never updated, ever. Then, when I do update it, it takes forever, literally forever.

For enterprise users? Lots and lots of legacy hardware that gets broken by updates, thus the choice.

Home users? They only run antivirus updates and scan AFTER they have the virus.
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I second this statement! My experience as well, especially in our corp environment, we've had many a machine (before I took over as the admin) go down from a crappy windows update. As to the CCC driver, you can choose to not have windows automatically update device drivers exclusively...not sure if that will be the case in the future but it should be. Yes, they are "dumbing" down windows a bit, I actually think it's a good idea, as mentioned most users either don't install updates or install them after something catastrophic has happened. It's very frustrating. Never fear, I'm sure there will be a reg hack to disable within the first 10 days.
 
Bad updates? When has MS ever had one of those? A few win home user machines would go kaput, no big deal.
Why does MS even give a you know what if people update or not? They bought the product and gave MS money. They provide updates if the user wants it.
 
I agree with most of the comments. It really is a good thing for home users. Since most of them never do the updates.
 
Hagrid said:
Bad updates? When has MS ever had one of those? A few win home user machines would go kaput, no big deal.
Why does MS even give a you know what if people update or not? They bought the product and gave MS money. They provide updates if the user wants it.
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Primarily, I think they care because of PR reasons. Let's look at a hypothetical situation:

A user buys a laptop with Windows pre-installed. That user never installs updates. A flaw is discovered and exploited in such a way that the user gets a virus or some other malware on their computer. This infection could have been avoided entirely if they had simply updated the OS, but since they did not, they blame Microsoft for making a bad software product. They tell a dozen people how bad Microsoft sucks because they lost their files due to the compromised system. Microsoft loses out on half a dozen sales because half of the people that the user told about his situation believed that it was Microsoft's fault as well. Multiply this by the population of a moderately wealthy first-world nation and we're talking about a lot of missed revenues...

The average PC user does not want to be proactive, they do not want to follow safe-browsing guidelines, and they are quick to blame anyone else except themselves when they can't satisfy their fix for free streaming midget amputee aboriginal porn.
 
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