Who here does NOT use any type of anti-virus or spyware? (windows users only)

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NormanNormal

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Jul 22, 2001
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I haven't used any sort of anti-virus or anti-spyware for the past 4 years. It seems to me that with these days most of the major security flaws that shipped with XP have been repaired. Back in 2001 when XP first came out it the flaws were so bad it was ridiculous. However since SP2 and all the RPC exploit fixes it's pretty solid.

I use a hardware firewall, make sure all my patches are up to date, I use a non-IE browser like firefox, watch very carefully what I download and install, what web pages I browse, etc. I frequently monitor my running processes via a 3rd party app. Now granted the fact that I've been a computer enthusiast for over 10 years and I am also an IT professional. So I do know what to watch for and what to do and not to do etc.

Using these techniques I haven't had a single virus, malware, or any kind of spyware infection in the past 3 years. (I say 3 because I think I had some kind of minor adware installed a few years back before firefox was around) Anyway for the average PC user this would not be recommended, they simply don't know enough to not have to use AV software.

I stopped using the software because it became so bloated and made comps slow to a crawl (Norton security is WORSE than the spyware it prevents). So I uninstalled it all one day and enjoyed the performance benefits. However these days with lightweight apps like nod32 and windows defender beta 2 this has changed...

So the question remains, how many of you do NOT use any kind of AV or anti-spyware?
 
This topic is very debatible, and i dont recommend anyone, noob or expert to run the system without any kind of protection, resources taken by antivirus like AVG/NOD32/Avast are barely noticeable even on low end computers, and windows firewall on service pack 2 actually does a good job on keeping the computer shielded from internet worms.

So on the original question, how many of us...i bet you'll get only a few answers, not everyone is brave enough to be unprotected these days ;)

oldmx
 
I ran windows with no anti-virus or spyware software a few years ago. I thought that since I knew what I was doing, I was safe. I'd never had a problem, since I knew what to look for and what to click on. This was back before Firefox was even close to 1.0, so I was using IE at the time. I was doing some research for a huge paper for school, which was due the next morning. I ended up on a web page somewhere that tried to install an activeX control Big deal, click no, right? Well, it happened to pop up with the "yes" button directly over the link I was going for on the page, at the exact instant I was going to click that link. Before I could get out of it, my system got pretty much wrecked. It took me until 2 or 3 am to get it all cleaned up, and I had to type the paper to turn in at 9 the next morning. I was not pleased.

Since then, I've switched to Linux as my primary OS. I still keep a couple of copies of XP around, mostly for use in virtual machines. Even the copies in VMs are locked down and protected. I won't take any chances with Windows anymore, and if malware ever becomes a real concern on Linux, you can bet I'll be protecting it too.
 
It amazes me how little effort people put into understanding current threats. Do so, and you'll see why it's assinine to run without AV software. If you choose to do so, please do all of us a favor, and unplug your network cable.

Basing AV software in general on Norton is a very poor way of evaluating it's need. If you think it's to bloated, get something else. Don't feel like paying for anything else? Then get something like AVG. There's absolutely NO excuse not to have AV software anymore.
 
I use a AV program but its not that turn your amd64 into a 386 thing called Norton! :rolleyes: As far as threats yeah its pretty serious but a AV program won't save you from the millions of XP exploits so doing updates is a big plus too! ;)
 
i dont browse porn sites or leet hacker bullshit sites full of warez or whatevr that shit is.... so really isn't a need for me to have AV... hijack this and http://virusscan.jotti.org/ is enough for me... and i have a 2 year sub for NOD32... just dont need it
 
I haven't run any antivirus software for years, but I do use adaware on occasion. No virii/spyware on my rig since early 2001...
 
saturnine2 said:
I haven't run any antivirus software for years, but I do use adaware on occasion. No virii/spyware on my rig since early 2001...
Click to expand...

Come to think of it my AV software never goes off as it is except on strange "torrent" files but thats about it hmmmm... thanks for making me realize this! :)
 
saturnine2 said:
I haven't run any antivirus software for years, but I do use adaware on occasion. No virii/spyware on my rig since early 2001...
Click to expand...
So how do you know you don't have a rootkit? You have no AV software to block it, and once it's installed, none of your tools will detect it.
 
There's a big difference between having a virus scanner watching everything that goes through your system and having one that's up-to-date and available to check questionable materials.
 
i use norton but it's never indicated my pc is infected with anything. it is updated.
recently my pc got some adware i needed to get rid of but i was already using windows defender beta 2. defender couldn't find anything after scanning! it's up to date also!

so i tried trendmicro's online free scan and it found 100 or so items.
i am now using spydoctor, which managed to find more than 200 spyware items (most of which were cookies for adware, trackers etc).

btw. see my other thread on defender.
 
I can definatly see where you are coming from. Knock on wood while I say this, but I am using Norton Anti-Virus, Windows Defender and Cisco Clean Access (as given by my school), but carefully watching what you do and don't download and your browser is crucial. I have not had a problem, meaning, norton and defender have no caught one thing in my system. It makes me believe that I can go w/o them. The fact that they are free (norton was also given to me by my school) is probably one of the main reasons I am running protection, other then a firewall, at all. I feel like I could get away w/o running protection. Maybe I'll do it sometime later to see how it goes. :)
 
I run a hardware firewall router and Norton 06. Before that I was and prolly still am a big fan of ZoneAlarm which always worked well for me.

The only time I have felt at risk from a virus is via email.

Norton does seem a little busy it has to be said - and it gives you a big red cross if you dont have automotic updates on! Rediculous! I want to choose when to update, not rely on bill to do it for me,
:confused:
 
I have antivirus software, but I do not choose to let it run in real time. What a waste of performance. If I have to sacrafice that much to it to use my computer, I'm not going to bother running winblows at all. I right click > scan pretty much anything I download. The statement that it is barely there I am going to disagree with.

There was another thread I read about who runs their computer with administrative privledges. I was shocked to see so many people did. Crazy. What can't ctrl+right click or runas not do? Security IS 99.9% the user. I have been running this way for 3 years or more and I've yet to have a problem. I am not advocating not using antivirus software, or that is not smart to do so. I just disagree that there are zero counter arguements to using it, and mine is the perceived performance loss. If it's all in my head, ignorance is bliss.
 
defuseme2k said:
I have antivirus software, but I do not choose to let it run in real time. What a waste of performance. If I have to sacrafice that much to it to use my computer, I'm not going to bother running winblows at all. I right click > scan pretty much anything I download. The statement that it is barely there I am going to disagree with.
Click to expand...


I can't see where losing 2-3% performance is that big of a deal, especially if you're just browsing the internet.
 
I ran xp pro with nothing for two years and went to the deepest, darkest nether regions of the internet.

Did I get shit left, right, and center? Yes.

Did a restart completly return my system back to normal? Yes.

Thank you deep freeze :cool:
 
Windows XP Pro

No AV, Anti-Mailware on the machine itself at all.

But I am 100% protected.

My firewall does Anti-Virus and Anti-Malware (ids/ips, anti-spam, RBL, and tons of other stuff). (The firewall is a SGS 1620)
 
Whenever I hear the reasoning behind not using an AV as "I've been running for X years without any viruses detected and it just ends up being a waste of resources so I don't run one" it just sounds like "I have never been in a car crash, and sometimes the seatbelt wrinkles my shirts a little bit so I don't wear one".

I will say that while having a fairly locked down system that is not running with Admin/Power user credentials with a semi-intelligent user at the helm is unlikely to get rootkits/trojans/major viruses, it is not impossible.
 
djnes said:
Why not just block them in the first place....why wait until you're already infected? If you are seeing a noticeable performance decrease, it's time to sell the Pentium II and get some upgrades.
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I never argued that anything you suggested wasn't smart, or best practice or anything of the like. Nothing I've seen refutes anything I've said, whether you or anyone else feels its neglible or not. Preventing a rootkit is much more intelligent than getting one in the first place, however that didn't protect people from sony.. did it? Rootkit revealer can find them after they are installed, contrary to your earlier comment.

I beg to question how any of this crap even happens to people if they are NOT running as the administrator. I did say that is what I'm doing, and I feel personally it is the best thing for me to do to protect myself.

By the way.. I have an athlon x2 4400+. My 1gb of memory needs upgraded, and I don't think my 7900gtx has anything to do with these utilities. The fact is a person can completely tell when antivirus software is installed, at least I can. You can disagree all you want, but the loss in performance is there.
 
It's simple common sense. As mentioned above, if you've never been in a car accident, does that mean you don't need to wear seatbelts? Why take that chance?

I beg to differ about the performance. I run Symantec Corporate on my home server and all of my computers at work. Some of these machines a 1 GB Pentium IIIs with 512 MB of memory. I run Windows LiveOneCare at home on all three of my home machines. Not one single computer loses anything even slightly noticeable in performance. The may boot a second slower because it's one more utlity to load, but there's certainly no performance difference once it's loaded. Not on the P3, and not on my C2D, and not on any of the computers in between. It's a ridiculous argument, so let it go. There is absolutely NO justification for not having AV software. None. The only legitimate thing you said was in regards to the admin account.
 
I ran no anti-virus for over a year thinking I was good to go. I am pretty careful. Only had Windows defender installed.

The other day I found a year free for Panda's Titanium Suite (thanks to the free forum) and the AV found a Trojan. doh! No spyware and one trojan. I learned I am not as careful as I thought. Of course I balemed it on my wife to make myself feel better, but it was probably me. :D
 
I've never really seen the need for antispyware. Anytime I run a scan all it finds is a whole bunch of cookies. Big Deal.

I do run AV, currently AVG Free and symantec corporate which I don't think slow anything down. I've run NAV and mcafee in the past and will agree that they're system hogs, especially the full 'internet suite' versions. Symantec corporate has used less than 4 minutes of CPU time over the last 7 days since I last rebooted and ~ 15MB of memory which I'm not too bothered about.
 
I always run A/V software. On a number of occasions it's caught infected e-mails.

I can't imagine not running any.
 
I stopped using antivirus software when it found my IRC daemon as a virus and helpfully autocleaned the shit out of it for me.

On the one occasion that i DID get infected (which was completly my fault, i remember thinking "you know, i bet you this is a virus and i shouldnt run it" AV does nothign to protect against the number one cause of infections, user stupidity) the antiviral software i had was NO use, and 4 hours into trying to fix it i gave up and reformatted and was back up and running to my previous days state in 24 minutes.


Last time one of these threads came up you lot told me to run a virus checked and "i would be surprised how infected i was". I was completly clean when i did so. I bet you it would be the same now.
 
defuseme2k said:
I beg to question how any of this crap even happens to people if they are NOT running as the administrator. I did say that is what I'm doing, and I feel personally it is the best thing for me to do to protect myself.
Click to expand...

Again, this could come down to the user. How many standard users know enough to change the login credentials on the admin accounts and don't just leave them set up with the default (generally blank) password? All the rootkit would have to do is execute as a runas: file and point to the default administrator password.
 
frequenicity said:
Again, this could come down to the user. How many standard users know enough to change the login credentials on the admin accounts and don't just leave them set up with the default (generally blank) password? All the rootkit would have to do is execute as a runas: file and point to the default administrator password.
Click to expand...
I don't know how many times I said it wasn't best practice, and don't go around suggesting it. I just simply stated that there are good counter arguements to running these utilities. I still use them, I don't know how it got missed that I have an antivirus program installed. I just don't let it run real time.

I don't feel like argueing about it, because it works fine for me. I should learn not to talk to people who think you're advocating something for other people to do also. People who have an alternate view point such as djines try and discredit you. Everything I said is legitimate. I know for a fact that if you benched a machine before and after, there would be a loss in performance, pure and simple. Enough to notice? Not for him apparently, and thats my point in the first place. It feels like this, it seems like that, all insubstantial arguements. Not that mine were, and back to my first post, igorance is bliss. Just like people who don't read what you've written entirely (or remember it) when they respond.
 
defuseme2k said:
I should learn not to talk to people who think you're advocating something for other people to do also.
Click to expand...
Here's you're first lesson then....when posting on an internet forum that's basically famous for providing answers to people asking questions, don't post something that isn't a good suggestion for others. See, what you don't realize is, not running AV software makes you a risk to everyone else. It's not like the RAID0 argument, where it's only going to hurt you and your data...not anyone else. AV software is to protect you from me, me from you, and everyone else on the internet. That's a common sense principle that should be very simple to grasp. Now, instead of trying to sound like you're taking the high road, accusing others of not reading, not is your time to do some reading. I'd suggest searching for two terms: rootkits and "WMF vulnerability". You do that, and take some time to read up on those terms, and you will begin to understand why AV software is necessary.

As far as performance, is there a measurable hit? Maybe, with the right software. Will anyone notice? Not on any somewhat recent computer. Is giving up 30 MB of memory out of my 2 GB going to affect anything? No, absolutely not. In fact, these programs sit idle, unless one of two things happen. First, it's looking for updates on boot. Second, you are copying or downloading files/e-mails, and the app is scanning them. Any AV software I've ever used sits idle when I game, rips CDs, encode and edit video, etc. Those are measurable facts. Each of the excuses you gave is very easily shot to pieces, and the performance argument is the easiest to dismiss.
 
defuseme2k said:
I don't know how many times I said it wasn't best practice, and don't go around suggesting it. I just simply stated that there are good counter arguements to running these utilities. I still use them, I don't know how it got missed that I have an antivirus program installed. I just don't let it run real time.

I don't feel like argueing about it, because it works fine for me. I should learn not to talk to people who think you're advocating something for other people to do also. People who have an alternate view point such as djines try and discredit you. Everything I said is legitimate. I know for a fact that if you benched a machine before and after, there would be a loss in performance, pure and simple. Enough to notice? Not for him apparently, and thats my point in the first place. It feels like this, it seems like that, all insubstantial arguements. Not that mine were, and back to my first post, igorance is bliss. Just like people who don't read what you've written entirely (or remember it) when they respond.
Click to expand...

I read it, I get it, and I am glad that you stuck up for yourself.

I just wanted to say I have been AV free for 6 years. Adaware and firewall, all I use for protection. Dont like it? Sorry :(
 
defuseme2k said:
I don't know how many times I said it wasn't best practice, and don't go around suggesting it. I just simply stated that there are good counter arguements to running these utilities. I still use them, I don't know how it got missed that I have an antivirus program installed. I just don't let it run real time.

I don't feel like argueing about it, because it works fine for me. I should learn not to talk to people who think you're advocating something for other people to do also. People who have an alternate view point such as djines try and discredit you. Everything I said is legitimate. I know for a fact that if you benched a machine before and after, there would be a loss in performance, pure and simple. Enough to notice? Not for him apparently, and thats my point in the first place. It feels like this, it seems like that, all insubstantial arguements. Not that mine were, and back to my first post, igorance is bliss. Just like people who don't read what you've written entirely (or remember it) when they respond.
Click to expand...

Just for the record, I wasn't arguing. Just answering the question you had thrown out there.
 
djnes said:
Here's you're first lesson then....when posting on an internet forum that's basically famous for providing answers to people asking questions, don't post something that isn't a good suggestion for others. See, what you don't realize is, not running AV software makes you a risk to everyone else. It's not like the RAID0 argument, where it's only going to hurt you and your data...not anyone else. AV software is to protect you from me, me from you, and everyone else on the internet. That's a common sense principle that should be very simple to grasp. Now, instead of trying to sound like you're taking the high road, accusing others of not reading, not is your time to do some reading. I'd suggest searching for two terms: rootkits and "WMF vulnerability". You do that, and take some time to read up on those terms, and you will begin to understand why AV software is necessary.

As far as performance, is there a measurable hit? Maybe, with the right software. Will anyone notice? Not on any somewhat recent computer. Is giving up 30 MB of memory out of my 2 GB going to affect anything? No, absolutely not. In fact, these programs sit idle, unless one of two things happen. First, it's looking for updates on boot. Second, you are copying or downloading files/e-mails, and the app is scanning them. Any AV software I've ever used sits idle when I game, rips CDs, encode and edit video, etc. Those are measurable facts. Each of the excuses you gave is very easily shot to pieces, and the performance argument is the easiest to dismiss.
Click to expand...

QFT

I'm pretty sure that's my first time using QFT. lol




AV free = Viruses free to do what they want.

Damn, and I use three different AV progs periodically. (Nod32 realtime)
And I'm currently using 7 different anti-spyware programs. (None realtime)
I must be friggin paranoid.compared to the norm :rolleyes: :rolleyes:
 
I run no AV or anti-spyware on my pc. I simply have no need of them.

I do however, run AVG Free on the family computers, even then, I have yet to encounter a virus.
 
L1ght said:
I run no AV or anti-spyware on my pc. I simply have no need of them.
Click to expand...
:rolleyes: Then tell me something. When you go away for a week on vacation, do you lock your house up?
 
honestly... I find it kind of fun to get a virus that totally fucks up my computer... trying to remove it and trying to restore everything.. i learn so much about the OS and the new flaws and threats... i keep my important stuff on another partion so i really dont mind doing a fresh install of my OS
 
djnes said:
It can certainly be a learning experience, I'll give you that.
Click to expand...

Back when I was doing idependant consulting 70% of my jobs were spyware/malware removal. I sure learned a lot of about the stuff and how to get rid of it. I think my anti-spyware toolkit had at least 20 different programs but in the end the core 3 or 4 I would use was adaware, MS antispyware, spybot, and hijackthis. I use to say I could remove any spyware infection there was using just those 4 programs. Things are different now though, this was back before the days of rootkits.
 
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