Which Static Pressure fans? Noctua NF A25x12, NF-F12, NF-F12 Industrial 2000 or 3000, or Thermatake Toughfan 12 or Turbo 12

[kamikazi]

I've decided to replace the Corsair LL120s I have cooling my system. They are just not doing it for me sound/performance-wise. I have 3 radiators; Corsair R7 360, Corsair R7 240, and an XSPC TX240. The Corsairs are basically Hardware Labs clones that are 54mm thick with 13 FPI. The XSPC is only 20mm thick, but with 22 FPI. I'm not really worried about the XSPC as it doesn't take much to push air through it. The current Corsair LL120 white fans are rated for 3.00m-H20, but they also spin almost 2500 rpm at max, so they get loud when they are getting work done. So I'm looking at the following as replacements:

Noctua NF A25x12 - Great fan, I have a couple of these and they really don't make much noise even at full 2000 rpm speed (22.6 dB/A), but their max static pressure is 2.34mm - H20. They are the best do it all fan while staying relatively quiet, good at airflow and static pressure, but not the absolute best at either.
Noctua NF-F12 - According to the documentation 2.61 mm - H20 at 1500 rpm at 22.4 dB/A. Seems like a no brainer except for this:

They are actually lower in static pressure for the bulk of their range compared to the NF-A12 x 25

Noctua NF-F12 Industrial 2000 - 3.94 mm - H20 at 2000 rpm and just under 30 dB/A
Noctua NF-F12 Industrial 3000 - 7.63 mm - H20 at 3000 rpm and 43.5 dB/A
Thermatake Toughfan 12 - basically a clone of the Noctua NF-A12x25, stats on static pressure and noise are almost identical, also 2000 rpm. They look very similar as well.
Thermatake Toughfan Turbo 12 - 2500 rpm version of the fan above at 3.78 mm - H20 and 28 dB/A

I think I'm pretty much sold on either the Noctua NF-A12x25 or the NF-F12 Industrial 2000. I know that serious overclockers would good right for the NF-F12 Industrial 3000. I like the headroom, but I just don't see myself wanting to ever put up with that kind of noise above the 2000 rpm version. What I would like to do is run a fan so that it maxes at 1500 rpm and is way quieter than the LL120 fans that I'm replacing while giving me an equivalent static pressure.

Any thoughts on which fans I should get? Any other fans that are worth looking at? I'm sure there have to be some fans of the Corsair ML120 Pro or the EK Vardars out there.

 

[NightReaver]

I use ml120 pros in push/pull (no rgb, that robs power) on a HWlabs gtr 480 and can say they work pretty good. The noctua industrials are well regarded.

Have you given push/pull a thought? It's a good way to keep all the power while lowering the rpms. Of course you need the extra space, wires, money, etc.

 

[JSHamlet234]

For me it would be between the NF-A12x25 and Phanteks T30. From what I've been able to glean, the T30 can move more air at the same noise level, but has slightly more bearing noise at very low speeds. I'd go with the Phanteks for most setups, and maybe consider the Noctua for low-speed use on something like a MO-RA3 or multiple 480 rads for its slightly superior quietness at low RPM, which might become noticeable if you are running a very large number of them.

 

[kamikazi]

I use ml120 pros in push/pull (no rgb, that robs power) on a HWlabs gtr 480 and can say they work pretty good. The noctua industrials are well regarded.

Have you given push/pull a thought? It's a good way to keep all the power while lowering the rpms. Of course you need the extra space, wires, money, etc.

I have definitely given push/pull a thought. I already have two noctua nf-a25x12 fans that I can use as pull fans on the R7 240 if I modify the back panel of the case, but that would kind of lock me in to using that fan on the front of that rad as well. I can also do push/pull on the R7 360 rad as well, but the pull fans will be on top of the case, but I'm not scared to do it. No need to go push/pull on the TX 240 rad since it's so thin and the way the mount is for that one, I couldn't do it anyway.

I guess going push pull with nf-a25x12s all around wouldn't be a bad idea, just very expensive as I'd have to buy 13 of them, unless I just kept 3 LL120s as intakes. Then I'd only need 10. ;-). Unless, I want to mix fans. I could leave LL120s on the TX240 and as intakes. Then, I could get by with 8.

 

[kamikazi]

For me it would be between the NF-A12x25 and Phanteks T30. From what I've been able to glean, the T30 can move more air at the same noise level, but has slightly more bearing noise at very low speeds. I'd go with the Phanteks for most setups, and maybe consider the Noctua for low-speed use on something like a MO-RA3 or multiple 480 rads for its slightly superior quietness at low RPM, which might become noticeable if you are running a very large number of them.

Thanks for the heads up on the Phanteks T30s. Those are awesome. They seem perfect for the job. However, I don't think I could fit them on my 360 on the inside of the case without swapping out fittings on the radiator. I'd also have to find some way to reroute the cpu power cables at the top of the mobo. Looks like I'd have an issue on the right side as well with the fittings on the radiator below. I'll have to take a look at my 240 on the back of the case as well to see if they would fit there. The only place I know for sure I could fit them is as pull fans on the top of the case and as pull fans on the back of the 240 rad on the back of the case. I guess I could go Noctua push and Phanteks pull and run them at low RPMs.

 

[kamikazi]

For me it would be between the NF-A12x25 and Phanteks T30. From what I've been able to glean, the T30 can move more air at the same noise level, but has slightly more bearing noise at very low speeds. I'd go with the Phanteks for most setups, and maybe consider the Noctua for low-speed use on something like a MO-RA3 or multiple 480 rads for its slightly superior quietness at low RPM, which might become noticeable if you are running a very large number of them.

Having me look at the Phanteks T30 really sent me down the rabbit's hole. Apparently, they still make Gentle Typhoons and while not as good as the T30, they beat the Noctua NF-A12x25.



You can buy generic 2150 rpm PWM Gentle Typhoons with the crappy old red and yellow fan cables for $23.95 https://www.amazon.com/SERVO-Nidec-...ae2e87be&language=en_US&ref_=as_li_ss_tl&th=1

Or, you can get the ADATA XPG version that allows daisy chaining and has nice cables for $28.99 https://www.amazon.com/dp/B08S2QV3C...th=1&psc=1&ascsubtag=s1649173225764p496a53155

The ADATA site shows static pressure over 3 mm H20. https://www.xpg.com/us/xpg/691?tab=specification

I'm still running some 1850 rpm 3 pin gentle typhoons in my server that are over 10 years old.

The new Gentle Typhoons are very tempting at this point. I know they will fit.

 

[NightReaver]

Huh, first time hearing about these T30s. Might have to check that out. I do know that extra 5mm won't work with some of these extra cramped builds people do, but luckily isn't my case.

 

[D-EJ915]

Don't get the F12s, their sound profile is very loud and annoying and performance is poor compared to other options. Can't really go wrong with A12x25, T30, Gentle Typhoon or TL-B12 fans they all work well and have pretty similar sound profiles. GTs do have ball bearings though so they are noisier from the motor.

 

[kamikazi]

Now also looking at Artic P12s. I could buy enough to do push pull all the way around for less than it would cost to buy just push fans of the others I'm looking at.

 

[NightReaver]

Now also looking at Artic P12s. I could buy enough to do push pull all the way around for less than it would cost to buy just push fans of the others I'm looking at.

If it fits it's worth a shot. Took a look at those T30s...man are those expensive. $25/fan for triple packs at Newegg, come on. My twin pack ml120s were only like $33/pk.

 

[kamikazi]

If it fits it's worth a shot. Took a look at those T30s...man are those expensive. $25/fan for triple packs at Newegg, come on. My twin pack ml120s were only like $33/pk.

Tell me about it. I paid through the nose for the LL120s I have. I accumulated them over time, so it wasn't too bad. But now, they are $130 for a 3 pack direct from Corsair. You get a lightning node with it, but come on, that's over $40 per fan. I have 8 of those. When I sell them, I'll probably be lucky to get $15 per fan.

 

[kamikazi]

I decided to go Min/Max with this. I just ordered two 3 packs of the Phanteks T30s and two 5 packs of Arctic P12s.

One T30 will go on the bottom of the 360 rad in the middle and another on top for push pull. The other 4 slots on that rad will get P12s as I don't believe I can fit 30mm fans there. The thick 240 rad will get four T30s in push pull. The thin 240 rad and the intake area will get P12s.

I thought about going with gentle typhoons or Noctua NF A25x12s all around, but it would have been way more money. I also couldn't find gentle typhoons that would go below 900 rpms on pwm. I considered the Thermaltake Toughpower 120s as well and they are actually on sale for $30 for tow right now, but it still was going to be more expensive.

What I hope to do is make use of push/pull to run all the fans a little quieter, but still move lots of air. Ideally, it would have been T30s and Gentle Typhoons, but, I am already spending too much money. BTW, the XPG Vento Gentle Typhoons are buy 3 for the price of two on Amazon, so $58 for 3. But, you can only get one for free.

Thanks everyone for the advice. I'll update this once I get everything installed. Looks like the Phanteks fans are a week or so out.

 

[pendragon1]

im happy with my arctics, was just aboot to suggest them.

 

[NightReaver]

im happy with my arctics, was just aboot to suggest them.

Arctics are great because they remind me of these super cheap (like $5 each) Rosewill dual ball bearing fans you could get that actually had pretty decent amount of pressure for the time.

Were they GTs and whatnot? No. But they were very affordable and in push/pull individual fan performance matters less.

 

[kamikazi]

So, I have all the fans. I have one more question that all of you experts may know the answer to. Seeing as I have 6 T30 fans and a 360mm and 240mm radiator that I will be using them on, is it better to put all 6 in push pull on the 360mm and use Arctic P12s on the 240mm, or would it be better to use the T30s as pull fans on both radiators and use P12s as push fans on both? Obviously, it's best to use the same fan on both sides of the radiator, but I've read that if you use different fans on each side, it's best to use the more powerful one as a pull fan. I was thinking I may get more benefit out of spreading the T30s around to both radiators.

 

[JSHamlet234]

So, I have all the fans. I have one more question that all of you experts may know the answer to. Seeing as I have 6 T30 fans and a 360mm and 240mm radiator that I will be using them on, is it better to put all 6 in push pull on the 360mm and use Arctic P12s on the 240mm, or would it be better to use the T30s as pull fans on both radiators and use P12s as push fans on both? Obviously, it's best to use the same fan on both sides of the radiator, but I've read that if you use different fans on each side, it's best to use the more powerful one as a pull fan. I was thinking I may get more benefit out of spreading the T30s around to both radiators.

I would use all of the T30s as push fans (meaning that they blow air into the fins). I don't like the harmonics of the P12 so I wouldn't use them at all, but if I were using them, I would install the P12s as pull fans wherever they fit, with priority given to using them on the thicker and/or denser radiator(s). I would only use the P12s as push fans if I either ran out of T30s or I couldn't fit a T30 in a certain spot. In the case of the former, I would try to use the P12s on whichever radiator I thought had the coolest air supply and/or was receiving the warmest coolant. With those deltas being higher, the radiator will be able to dissipate more heat with less air flow.

 

[kamikazi]

I would use all of the T30s as push fans (meaning that they blow air into the fins). I don't like the harmonics of the P12 so I wouldn't use them at all, but if I were using them, I would install the P12s as pull fans wherever they fit, with priority given to using them on the thicker and/or denser radiator(s). I would only use the P12s as push fans if I either ran out of T30s or I couldn't fit a T30 in a certain spot. In the case of the former, I would try to use the P12s on whichever radiator I thought had the coolest air supply and/or was receiving the warmest coolant. With those deltas being higher, the radiator will be able to dissipate more heat with less air flow.

For my situation, both radiators are 54mm thick and are the same radiator, just one is a 360 and the other is a 240. There is another 240 that is last in line, but it's only 20mm thick and I'm going to use P12s in push only on that one. Coolant temp stays within .5 C throughout the loop. All rads are blowing air out from inside the case, so those air temp differences are probable negligible. There are 3 intake fans on the bottom of the case and the front panel is very open around the 20mm rad mounted there. I'm not 100 percent sure on being able to fit all T30s as push fans given the clearances involve. I could definitely fit them all as pull fans. That's why I'm asking the question.

 

[JSHamlet234]

For my situation, both radiators are 54mm thick and are the same radiator, just one is a 360 and the other is a 240. There is another 240 that is last in line, but it's only 20mm thick and I'm going to use P12s in push only on that one. Coolant temp stays within .5 C throughout the loop. All rads are blowing air out from inside the case, so those air temp differences are probable negligible. There are 3 intake fans on the bottom of the case and the front panel is very open around the 20mm rad mounted there. I'm not 100 percent sure on being able to fit all T30s as push fans given the clearances involve. I could definitely fit them all as pull fans. That's why I'm asking the question.

Understood. With all that radiator space, the differences in temperature that result from where you slot the fans in is going to be very, very small. Push/Pull fans do not actually need to match, and sometimes you can avoid certain annoying acoustics by having a slight mismatch. I doubt that you'll need to run them very fast anyway. Since the T30s can daisy chain, and so can the P12s, the ideal configuration might actually come down to ease of cable management and, of course, installing them where they actually fit

 

[kamikazi]

Found this old Linus gem comparing positioning of Corsair airflow vs. static pressure fans on a radiator. It worked best with the static pressure fan in push and the airflow fan in pull.

 

[pavel]

Now also looking at Artic P12s. I could buy enough to do push pull all the way around for less than it would cost to buy just push fans of the others I'm looking at.

Make sure they are 4-pin P12 PST PWM versions. It would be interesting if someone compared them to the Phanteks T30 - they are probably comparable. Also, T30 vs P12 PST PWM vs Be Quiet Silent Wings 3 120mm aka BL066/BL070 - would be a good benchmark comparison.

 

[kamikazi]

Make sure they are 4-pin P12 PST PWM versions. It would be interesting if someone compared them to the Phanteks T30 - they are probably comparable. Also, T30 vs P12 PST PWM vs Be Quiet Silent Wings 3 120mm aka BL066/BL070 - would be a good benchmark comparison.

Here you go.



T30 beats every other fan in every category.

 

[kamikazi]

They're all in. When I first bought the PC-O11 Dynamic, I never would have dreamed of adding 15 fans to it, but here it is. 13 in the front:

But wait, there's more....

Two on the back of the 240 rad in the back.

The bottom of the case has 3 Arctic P12 intakes. The XSPC TX240 in the front has 2 Arctic P12 push fans. The Corsair R7 240 has 2 Phanteks T30 push fans and 2 Arctic P12 pull fans. The Corsair R7 360 has 3 Arctic P12 push fans and 3 Phanteks T30 pull fans.

I'm pleased with the cooling and sound profile. I set the max fan speed for all fans to 1500 rpm in aquasuite. Here's my fan curve, it maxes the fans at 11 degrees water temp to ambient air temp delta:

I ran P95 and Heaven together and let it go for 30 minutes. Water-air delta maxed out at 9.6 degrees Celsius. Fan speed maxed at 1450 rpm which was perfectly acceptable sound-wise, much better than the LL120s that were replaced. GPU maxed at 54 degrees and cpu (Tctl/Tdie) maxed at at 68.1 degrees. That was with an ambient of 22 degrees C, so GPU 32 over ambient and cpu 46 over ambient. Now, I'm sure when I run MS Flight Simulator, it will get hotter and a little louder, but I haven't done it yet. I may up my pump speed. It barely got to one gallon per minute under the test I did.