Where Gaming Begins: Ep. 2 | AMD Radeon™ RX 6000 Series Graphics Cards - 11am CDT 10/28/20

123Lanoix

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It's not better image quality. Depending on implementation its a reconstructed image. Meaning it's not the same to native. So it's not better image quality. It can be a different image all together. I'm not saying it's not a good thing. But for something that only exists in like 19 games, I'm sorry there's no need to be pretending like it's everywhere when it's not.

Welcome to 2020 when marketing team come into forums to promote features that are not universal or available universally. So yeah they would.
DLSS 2.0 was just a stop gap or band aid to help performance while we wait for the future cards that actually have real world ray tracing performance to be created and sold. AMD may or may not come out with a similar feature in the future but who really cars. I believe what will probably happen is AMD will come out with a opensource solution similar to DLSS and RT that will come from the development of the new consoles. BTW the new consoles have 16gb of vram also and these new amd cards all have 16gb of vram guess what cards do not ! NVIDIA unless you spend $1500 on a 3090 but that's the real tradgey of all this. Nvidia so F'd Short nvidia stock Q4 and Q1 will be bad
 

FrgMstr

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Official Spec List.

Powerhouse Performance, Vivid Visuals & Incredible Gaming Experiences​

AMD Radeon™ RX 6000 Series graphics cards support high-bandwidth PCIe® 4.0 technology and feature 16GB of GDDR6 memory to power the most demanding 4K workloads today and in the future. Key features and capabilities include:

Powerhouse Performance

  • AMD Infinity Cache – A high-performance, last-level data cache suitable for 4K and 1440p gaming with the highest level of detail enabled. 128 MB of on-die cache dramatically reduces latency6 and power consumption7, delivering higher overall gaming performance than traditional architectural designs.
  • AMD Smart Access Memory8 – An exclusive feature of systems with AMD Ryzen™ 5000 Series processors, AMD B550 and X570 motherboards and Radeon™ RX 6000 Series graphics cards. It gives AMD Ryzen™ processors greater access to the high-speed GDDR6 graphics memory, accelerating CPU processing and providing up to a 13-percent performance increase on a AMD Radeon™ RX 6800 XT graphics card in Forza Horizon™ 4 at 4K when combined with the new Rage Mode one-click overclocking setting.9,10
  • Built for Standard Chassis – With a length of 267mm and 2x8 standard 8-pin power connectors, and designed to operate with existing enthusiast-class 650W-750W power supplies, gamers can easily upgrade their existing large to small form factor PCs without additional cost.
True to Life, High-Fidelity Visuals

  • DirectX® 12 Ultimate Support – Provides a powerful blend of raytracing, compute, and rasterized effects, such as DirectX® Raytracing (DXR) and Variable Rate Shading, to elevate games to a new level of realism.
  • DirectX® Raytracing (DXR) – Adding a high performance, fixed-function Ray Accelerator engine to each compute unit, AMD RDNA™ 2-based graphics cards are optimized to deliver real-time lighting, shadow and reflection realism with DXR. When paired with AMD FidelityFX, which enables hybrid rendering, developers can combine rasterized and ray-traced effects to ensure an optimal combination of image quality and performance.
  • AMD FidelityFX – An open-source toolkit for game developers available on AMD GPUOpen. It features a collection of lighting, shadow and reflection effects that make it easier for developers to add high-quality post-process effects that make games look beautiful while offering the optimal balance of visual fidelity and performance.
  • Variable Rate Shading (VRS) – Dynamically reduces the shading rate for different areas of a frame that do not require a high level of visual detail, delivering higher levels of overall performance with little to no perceptible change in image quality.
Elevated Gaming Experience

  • Microsoft® DirectStorage Support – Future support for the DirectStorage API enables lightning-fast load times and high-quality textures by eliminating storage API-related bottlenecks and limiting CPU involvement.
  • Radeon Software Performance Tuning Presets – Simple one-click presets in Radeon™ Software help gamers easily extract the most from their graphics card. The presets include the new Rage Mode stable over clocking setting that takes advantage of extra available headroom to deliver higher gaming performance10.
  • Radeon™ Anti-Lag11 – Significantly decreases input-to-display response times and offers a competitive edge in gameplay.

AMD Radeon™ RX 6000 Series Product Family​

ModelCompute UnitsGDDR6Game Clock12 (MHz)Boost Clock13 (MHZ)Memory InterfaceInfinity Cache
AMD Radeon™ RX 6900 XT8016GB2015Up to 2250256 bit128 MB
AMD Radeon™ RX 6800 XT7216GB2015Up to 2250256 bit128 MB
AMD Radeon™ RX 68006016GB1815Up to
2105
256 bit128 MB
 

123Lanoix

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I agree, but this doesn't happen until Nov 18th, and we see what kind of supply AMD has for everyone. If AMD has the same back orders and limited stock, then nVidia isn't in trouble at all, and AMD will be in the same boat. But at least AMD has big time sales coming due to the PS5 and new Xbox release, which I would imagine are HUGE sales for AMD.

Will be itneresting to see how this plays out this holiday season, when AMD should have cards on the street then, and nVidia?
I'm sure AMD will sell out first day but i believe that AMD AIB partners will have their cards ready on Nov 18th and that may actually help improve stock levels. Will have to wait and see. Nvidia didn't share any info with their AIB's so they could properly build and test their cards combined with poor yields. As long as TSMC can pump out RDNA2 to AIB's There will be only AMD on the shelves to buy. I don't think will see Nvidia do anything until like early Q2 where they will try to use harvested 3080 chips for a 3070 ti and harvested 3090 chips for 3080 ti.
 

///AMG

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I am surprised no one is talking about the difference in VRAM. I mean in a lot of rtx 3000 threads people wanted to get the 2x VRAM version but AMD essentially comes out with exactly that for less money and people are complaining about no DLSS and RT when both are proprietary implementations. I've tried DLSS in Monster Hunter world and it really doesnt make all that much a difference to me. I havent seen a game that DLSS is a must have feature so far and by the time it is next gen cards will be out anyways. RT could be good but IMO the performance hit right now isnt worth it and in a lot of games it seems hard to tell the difference since baked lighting has become so good. Also again by the time RT matters we will be talking about AMD 7000 and Nvidia 4000 series cards.

In my opinion AMD is giving everyone nearly the same or better raster performance (depending on which card), less heat, more VRAM for mostly less money (only the 6800 is more expensive but then again its faster and has 2x the VRAM). Nvidia is giving you DLSS and RT and half the VRAM for more money. There is really nothing to dislike about these cards other than if you are a fan of one company over the other.

EDIT: now I regret getting rid of my M1 since the 6000 series cards are the same length as my current 1070 FTW. I bought the NR200 because I thought all the new cards were going to be RTX3080 length. Might buy another M1 then.
 
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FrgMstr

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Some portion of the RAM is dedicated to system usage, so VRAM is going to inherently be less than 16 GB. Probably 10 GB at the most.
That is not the way it works. You are incorrect. This will be executed by the game devs, they just now have a larger allocations to work with. I think we should be getting a white paper soon. But I do know it is not a one size fits all system.
 
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stiltner

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I caught the start of the presentation, but had to skip out.

Only being a 1080 gamer, is there a reason for me to upgrade? CPU + GPU + Memory is gonna set me back $1200 or so. :-\
 

MavericK

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That is not the way it works. You are incorrect. This will be executed by the game devs, they just now have a larger allocations to work with. I think we should be getting a white paper soon. But I do know it is not a one size fits all system.
How so? Both consoles have 16 GB of RAM total - you are saying that 100% of that memory is going to be dedicated to VRAM at times? I don't think so.
 

Viper87227

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You're incorrect. From Anand:
https://www.anandtech.com/show/1620...-starts-at-the-highend-coming-november-18th/2

"AMD is also continuing to work on its FidelityFX suite of graphics libraries. Much of this is held over from AMD’s existing libraries and features, such as contrast adaptive sharpening, but AMD does have one notable addition in the works: Super Resolution.

Intended to be AMD’s answer to NVIDIA’s DLSS technology, Super Resolution is a similar intelligent upscaling technique that is designed to upscale lower resolution images to higher resolutions while retaining much of their sharpness and clarity. Like DLSS, don’t expect the resulting faux-detailed images to completely match the quality of a native, full-resolution image. However as DLSS has proven, a good upscaling solution can provide a reasonable middle ground in terms of performance and image quality."

Good to know? I assume this was detailed today then, alongside the launch, since AMD's own product page for Super Resolution makes no mention of this?
 

FrgMstr

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I caught the start of the presentation, but had to skip out.

Only being a 1080 gamer, is there a reason for me to upgrade? CPU + GPU + Memory is gonna set me back $1200 or so. :-\
No. Not IMO unless you are looking at buying a 300Hz panel or have some huge supersampling in mind.
 

FrgMstr

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You're incorrect. From Anand:
https://www.anandtech.com/show/1620...-starts-at-the-highend-coming-november-18th/2

"AMD is also continuing to work on its FidelityFX suite of graphics libraries. Much of this is held over from AMD’s existing libraries and features, such as contrast adaptive sharpening, but AMD does have one notable addition in the works: Super Resolution.

Intended to be AMD’s answer to NVIDIA’s DLSS technology, Super Resolution is a similar intelligent upscaling technique that is designed to upscale lower resolution images to higher resolutions while retaining much of their sharpness and clarity. Like DLSS, don’t expect the resulting faux-detailed images to completely match the quality of a native, full-resolution image. However as DLSS has proven, a good upscaling solution can provide a reasonable middle ground in terms of performance and image quality."
Yep, and every dev that builds games for PS5 and XBox are going to be implementing this. There still has to be some AI backend work, but I can certainly see Microsoft putting Azure resources to good use on this and doing it in-house while DLSS has to be farmed out to NV currently. Super Rez will be a much more open platform.
 

stiltner

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No. Not IMO unless you are looking at buying a 300Hz panel or have some huge supersampling in mind.

Appreciate the input on that. I kinda felt that way. I bought a board, and case for my gf's son in prep to upgrade, now I might just hold off till next generation and drop a 3600 in his system once the new chips go on sale.
I mean, I'm doing 150fps in CoDMW, and thats about all I play right now. While something might come out that interests me, it seems like I can skip this generation until the prices start to fall in a few years.
 

chameleoneel

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I don't think any of the current RT games will be a good benchmark for RNDA2 cards unless significantly updated to take any advantage or use RNDA2 hardware effectively. If any RT capable Console games come out for the XBox Series S or X, that might be the first good indication. If one wants to play current crop of RT games, top priority, then Nvidia Ampere is probably the better solution. Still if AMD is 22% behind so to speak, better than the 2080Ti I just don't see that as significant based on the lack of the number of RT games and their quality improvements when used.
Some of the PS5 launch games have RT in them. I don't know all of them, but I do know that the Miles Morales Spiderman game is confirmed with an RT mode.


DLSS 2.0 is literally the same or BETTER image quality than native res. This isn't a compromise. It's progress.

No one here would be touting DLSS as a feature if it wasn't at least on-par or better than the native renderer.
https://hardforum.com/threads/more-dlss.1990492/page-13#post-1044782983

I don't have all of the DLSS games to compare. But DLSS in Death Stranding is not the same and definitely not better. Please see that thread.
 
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Revenant_Knight

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Meh they are also using APU's. Is it GDDR6? that's what matters

Nothing wrong with that. APUs got a bad rep because on the PC side they're slow. At their core they're really just a CPU combined with a GPU, plus some assorted other silicon. In theory, that could reduce latency and increase bandwidth between all the components.
 

Epos7

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Red Team Bad
It's not sports, no reason to treat it as such. I've got a red team CPU and green team GPU. I'm interested in what AMD's cards can do in relation to Nvidia's cards. I'm not interested in your made up nonsense because it just muddies the discussion.
 

MangoSeed

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AMD has had their version of DSR for a long time now. They call it Virtual Super Resolution.

Yeah VSR and DSR. VSR is probably the more accurate name as there isn’t anything dynamic about it.

DLSS should really be DLUS, deep learning under sampling.
 

FrgMstr

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Let's not turn the conversation to a DLSS argument. Already had to ban someone over that today. Take it to the appropriate thread....like the one linked above. Thanks.
 

Chris_B

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I wish they could have touched on thermals and operating noise, the cooler looks pretty capable but so did the cooler on the 7990 and that was loud :(
 

tangoseal

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It's not sports, no reason to treat it as such. I've got a red team CPU and green team GPU. I'm interested in what AMD's cards can do in relation to Nvidia's cards. I'm not interested in your made up nonsense because it just muddies the discussion.
Well I deleted that reply because it was off topic and I absolutely agree with you.
 

exlink

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So are there going to be AIB versions of the 6900XT at launch? Early rumors claimed it was AMD exclusive but don’t recall anything mentioned during the presentation.
 

Brackle

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hmm. has anybody else noticed how little difference there seems to be between the 6800 vs the 6800XT?
AMD's own slide for the RX 6800XT at 1440 shows it is 201 fps for Forza Horizon 4, whereas the non-XT 6800 is 204.

Why is the 6800 non-XT faster than the XT version in Forza Horizon 4?
Screenshots below.

Also, I thought it'd be useful to see the fps difference between the two. So I made a table comparing 1440p performance.
It looks like about a 13% average performance gain after omitting the Forza Horizon 4 anomaly. I assume they made a mistake there.
oh, that's strange. AMD labelled the graphics setting on Forza 4 as "Ultra Nightmare" for the RX 6800. But the 6800XT they labelled the setting as "Ultra". Does Forza Horizon 4 even have an "Ultra Nightmare" graphics setting?

Other than that, the price points line up almost exactly. 12% more cost, 13% more performance.

RX 6800
RX 6800 XT
% XT diff
BF V
184​
198​
108%​
Borderlands 3
99​
111​
112%​
CoD MW
125​
148​
118%​
Div 2
118​
135​
114%​
Doom Eternal
180​
216​
120%​
Forza 4
204​
201​
99%​
Gears 3
127​
132​
104%​
RE3
201​
225​
112%​
SotTR
136​
155​
114%​
Wolf YB
219​
253​
116%​
Had anyone shown you the little difference between the 3080 and 3090? AMD is doing the same thing, but cheaper.
 

MangoSeed

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I wish they could have touched on thermals and operating noise, the cooler looks pretty capable but so did the cooler on the 7990 and that was loud :(
We don’t normally get thermal and noise info from these events.

What was surprising was no mention of HDMI 2.1, 4K/120Hz or any improvements to the encoder. I’m pretty sure they’re supported on 6x00 cards but does AMD believe gamers don’t care about those things?
 

Chris_B

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We don’t normally get thermal and noise info from these events.

What was surprising was no mention of HDMI 2.1, 4K/120Hz or any improvements to the encoder. I’m pretty sure they’re supported on 6x00 cards but does AMD believe gamers don’t care about those things?

Just noticed they did actually mention it at 11 mins 37db and "cool and quiet operation". So no real temps but at least it should be quiet.

 

tangoseal

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We don’t normally get thermal and noise info from these events.

What was surprising was no mention of HDMI 2.1, 4K/120Hz or any improvements to the encoder. I’m pretty sure they’re supported on 6x00 cards but does AMD believe gamers don’t care about those things?
I believe they were leaked as having AV1 support as well as HDMI 2.1. I can search and quote the AV1 but not the 2.1 claim. For some reason I cant find it but I believe it was that TUMAPISAK dude that mentioned all of these specs and were absolutely spot on. I believe he/they also mentioned the 2.1 but I cant find it for the life of me.
 

FrgMstr

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I wish they could have touched on thermals and operating noise, the cooler looks pretty capable but so did the cooler on the 7990 and that was loud :(
1603926363389.png

At the timestamp....

 

FrgMstr

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Thanks for that. Do you know if TRX40 motherboards will support this feature, assuming Zen 3 processors will work in them? May have to forgo that potential boost with the 3960x in the mean time.
No clue.
 

ELox

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Putting together a new build for 1080p 165hz G-Sync monitors. Planning on a Ryzen 5600x. Do I go with a 3070 for the Gsync or spend more for the 6800 to get the 15%+ performance (plus more with SAM and RAGE). I know either card will handle 1080p 165hz now but knowing I am building a Zen3 should I get the 6800 or save the money and get the Gsync but lose out on what looks like 20% performance on the 3070 with no SAM/RAGE....

Last option is convince my wife I need a new 1440P Freesync monitor. (That might be a tough sell until next year)
 

MangoSeed

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I believe they were leaked as having AV1 support as well as HDMI 2.1. I can search and quote the AV1 but not the 2.1 claim. For some reason I cant find it but I believe it was that TUMAPISAK dude that mentioned all of these specs and were absolutely spot on. I believe he/they also mentioned the 2.1 but I cant find it for the life of me.

I’m sure it’s there. It’s just strange that AMD didn’t mention it. Lots of people are looking forward to 4K 120 VRR.
 

FrgMstr

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Sounds good, but amd also claimed the 7990 was cool and quiet. I had one and it was a friggin tornado. Hopeflly this one lives upto the claims.
Sounds good, but amd also claimed the 7990 was cool and quiet. I had one and it was a friggin tornado. Hopefully this one lives upto the claims.

Well, are we doing history now? :p

 
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