Where are we with video cards?

[CustomModAddict]

I have been out of the GPU scene for long enough that it all changed. Hell nVidia had the world by the you know whats, when I was modding like crazy. Now it seems ATI has pretty much dominated the market. I have been reading for weeks, doing my research trying to catch up. But I thought I would get some feedback from the people using the stuff. I see ATI has eyefinity which is a nice thing. There clock speeds seem to be faster. But nVidia seems to have the bit rate better (think the 470 series is at 320 bit).

So for gaming what the more important things to look at? Clock speed, memory, bit rate, etc? I was always an nVidia guy, but that doesn't mean that its the best bag for the buck. I hear so many horror stories about the ATI CX issues, it scares me. But they seem to have the best bang for the buck.

So if someone can school me in GPU technology a little bit, it would be a big help.

I was looking at either:

Radeon single 5870 card.
Radeon Crossfire two 5850's.

nVidia single GTX 480
nVidia single GTX 470 OC'd
nVidia SLI 460 superclocked

I never SLI'd GPU boards before. So not really sure if you get better results from CX or SLI over a higher end single card. So I would like to hear what you guys think about the pro's and cons of each GPU?

Thanks

 

[ClearM4]

Shaders, memory bus, clock speeds, etc..... who cares, look at performance. Its all that matters (and might want to factor in heat/power requirements, noise). There are tons of reviews you can google for this info.

I'd suggest the HD5870 if you want a single card,

or SLI GTX460 if you dont mind trying out SLI. This solution will give you great prefomance a good price. Make sure the motherboard you buy supports SLI.

 

[chinesepiratefood]

CF 5850s would be the fastest of those setups, but not a whole lot faster than SLI 460s, despite being quite a bit more expensive.

Lately 460 SLI is bang for the buck king, at ~ $400 you get better than GTX 480 performance.

 

[BaldHeadedDork]

Some things never change - how big is your monitor, what resolution do you run at, and what kind of games do you want to play?

 

[GriFF3n]

So many problems with SLI. Single cards are the way to go and depending on what your doing a single 5870 can do what you need.

Shaders, memory bus, clock speeds, etc..... who cares, look at performance. Its all that matters (and might want to factor in heat/power requirements, noise). There are tons of reviews you can google for this info.

I'd suggest the HD5870 if you want a single card,

or SLI GTX460 if you dont mind trying out SLI. This solution will give you great prefomance a good price. Make sure the motherboard you buy supports SLI.

 

[CustomModAddict]

Some things never change - how big is your monitor, what resolution do you run at, and what kind of games do you want to play?

42" HDTV (was hoping he could go right into the television I just got him, if not then I will pick him up a nice 24" PC monitor)

He likes to play a lot of the first person stuff, ie fallout, battlefield, etc.

I do like that nVidia EVGA 460 superclocked at $250.00 put that in SLI....
or if I went the Radeon route, looks like it would be the 5850...

Any experience on the CF versus SLI?

 

[Bman123]

You can get the 460 fr cheaper then $250 each, just look around you should be able to get them for $400

 

[CustomModAddict]

You can get the 460 fr cheaper then $250 each, just look around you should be able to get them for $400

And the 460 super clocked is $250.00 best price, now the regular 460 you can get dirt cheap. But from all the stuff I have been reading about the GTX 460 SC, there is no touching it. And I am thinking 2 of them in SLI has to be insane...

 

[QES]

And the 460 super clocked is $250.00 best price, now the regular 460 you can get dirt cheap. But from all the stuff I have been reading about the GTX 460 SC, there is no touching it. And I am thinking 2 of them in SLI has to be insane...

Just overclock a regular 460 yourself and bam save a hundred bucks for the same thing.

 

[BaldHeadedDork]

42" HDTV (was hoping he could go right into the television I just got him, if not then I will pick him up a nice 24" PC monitor)

He likes to play a lot of the first person stuff, ie fallout, battlefield, etc.

I do like that nVidia EVGA 460 superclocked at $250.00 put that in SLI....
or if I went the Radeon route, looks like it would be the 5850...

Any experience on the CF versus SLI?

HDTV resolution maxes out at 1920x1080. That would be what you're looking at for a decent 24" monitor if you go that route, so your card choice will work equally well on either.

You can run a CF/SLI setup at that resolution but it's really not necessary. A single 5850 or 470 will average over 40fps in Battlefield Bad Company 2 with all the bells and whistles turned on. You could probably get away with a single 460 1GB, especially if you're willing to overclock it, but there isn't going to be a lot of headroom for next year's games.

It's geek cool to run CF/SLI, and a pair of 460's is a smoking performer for the price. But if you play enough games any CF or SLI setup will eventually run into stability issues, and when you hit them they're typically a bitch to fix unless it's sufficiently widespread to get a driver update.

I had this conundrum when I was putting together the parts for the rig I'm building now. I eventually decided against SLI because one of the games I know I'm going to spend a lot of time with (X-Plane) with has big issues with CF/SLI, and because I was able to snag an EVGA 470 for $260 after a rebate.

 

[Dark Shroud]

Prices are finally coming down so try waiting until at least the end of next week to buy a card, around Thursday.

A HD 5850 would probably be best for you as you wouldn't need SLI/Crossfire and you won't need to replace it again in a year.

 

[IRSmurf]

Do you want to game at 40fps or do you want a reliable 60fps? 40fps isn't too bad... but if a card is choking enough to receive 40fps, it likely has dips in its frame rate, as well.

If you have the means to acquire two GTX 460's, then do so. The 5870 is noticeably slower than the GTX 480. The GTX 480 is noticeably slower than SLI GTX 460.

All this "fast enough" talk makes me sick. People say things like the 5830 is powerful enough for 1920x1080 and frame rates of 40fps are acceptable even when a person says they have the means to spend $400 on GPU(s). Stop projecting.

So many problems with SLI.

Maybe for you. You should contact technical support if you can't work it out on your own.

My SLI works well and scales well. I am going to perform the test I have recently seen pop up on [H] about microstuttering to learn more about the issue, but I have not noticed it on my system, yet.

 

[Valset]

42" HDTV (was hoping he could go right into the television I just got him, if not then I will pick him up a nice 24" PC monitor)

He likes to play a lot of the first person stuff, ie fallout, battlefield, etc.

I do like that nVidia EVGA 460 superclocked at $250.00 put that in SLI....
or if I went the Radeon route, looks like it would be the 5850...

Any experience on the CF versus SLI?

there is no point in going SLI or crossfire at that resolution. (that's 2mp, 1920 by 1080). a single 5850 would be just fine. even with crysis. if you want to spend the money a 5870 would be awesome. If you want to save some money there are some awesome deals on the 460 floating around. I would just get a single good card. I have a 5870 and so far there isn't anything I haven't been able to max out.

 

[Valset]

Do you want to game at 40fps or do you want a reliable 60fps? 40fps isn't too bad... but if a card is choking enough to receive 40fps, it likely has dips in its frame rate, as well.

If you have the means to acquire two GTX 460's, then do so. The 5870 is noticeably slower than the GTX 480. The GTX 480 is noticeably slower than SLI GTX 460.

All this "fast enough" talk makes me sick. People say things like the 5830 is powerful enough for 1920x1080 and frame rates of 40fps are acceptable even when a person says they have the means to spend $400 on GPU(s). Stop projecting.



Maybe for you. You should contact technical support if you can't work it out on your own.

My SLI works well and scales well. I am going to perform the test I have recently seen pop up on [H] about microstuttering to learn more about the issue, but I have not noticed it on my system, yet.

sli is currently awesome, and except for the lower end cards wasted on a 2mp screen. and yes there are ALWAYS going to a few issues with dual cards. and the 5870 is only notably slower in dual card configurations. it provides more or less the same game play as a 480. and at 2mp there is no difference at all. both require higher resolutions to show their limits. benchmarks do not represent the real world. Hence the awesomeness of H reviews.

as for microsuttering if you haven't seen it yet your not likely to (unless you go looking for it) the effect is there but the majority of people don't perceive it. (I unfortunately can, hence my single card solution)

 

[silent-circuit]

there is no point in going SLI or crossfire at that resolution. (that's 2mp, 1920 by 1080). a single 5850 would be just fine. even with crysis. if you want to spend the money a 5870 would be awesome. If you want to save some money there are some awesome deals on the 460 floating around. I would just get a single good card. I have a 5870 and so far there isn't anything I haven't been able to max out.

This. A single higher end modern card can destroy just about anything at 1080p. No reason to go dual, it's just adding complexity, heat, further points of failure... not worth it.

 

[BaldHeadedDork]

Do you want to game at 40fps or do you want a reliable 60fps? 40fps isn't too bad... but if a card is choking enough to receive 40fps, it likely has dips in its frame rate, as well.

If you have the means to acquire two GTX 460's, then do so. The 5870 is noticeably slower than the GTX 480. The GTX 480 is noticeably slower than SLI GTX 460.

All this "fast enough" talk makes me sick. People say things like the 5830 is powerful enough for 1920x1080 and frame rates of 40fps are acceptable even when a person says they have the means to spend $400 on GPU(s). Stop projecting.

The average 40fps I cited was from the H tests. That means real gameplay and if you look it up (find the story yourself) you'll see there isn't a drop with the 5850 or 470 that would affect gameplay for everyone whose eyes track at ~30fps.

Not everyone with the means to spend $800 on video cards will choose to do so just so they can get a chub when they run a benchmark, or equate their Newegg order history with the size of their junk.

 

[CustomModAddict]

So basically if my son choices to just use his 42" HD television for a monitor one good card is plenty. But what if he decides to do multiple monitors, or wants to use good pc monitors? I would really like for him to get a few years out of this build, before I have to go in replacing stuff again.

For his system, I don't think eyeinfinty is needed for him, I would think 3D and some of the other stuff the nVidia offers over ATI might be better for him. But you know how it goes, in a few months someone else will bring out new technology to futher the race.

But as I hear there maybe some changes in video cards in the next month, hopefully the 480 drops a little in price before I am ready to buy, if they hit 450.00 or better yet low 400's then I think the 480 is the way to go. I dont see the 5890 dropping in price any time soon.

Any other thoughts from people?

 

[IRSmurf]

The average 40fps I cited was from the H tests. That means real gameplay and if you look it up (find the story yourself) you'll see there isn't a drop with the 5850 or 470 that would affect gameplay for everyone whose eyes track at ~30fps.

*groan* - one of those people If you can't tell the difference between a monitor running 30fps and 60fps (or in my case 120fps), that's your problem. Most people can see the difference. Can you also not tell the difference on a 29fps movie vs a 120fps blu-ray during a panning shot?

Not everyone with the means to spend $800 on video cards will choose to do so just so they can get a chub when they run a benchmark, or equate their Newegg order history with the size of their junk.

Your argument is moot. The OP has the means and the interest to spend $400 on graphics card(s). Sure, not everyone wants or needs one. Are you saying anyone with a GTX 480 or SLI is compensating for their small pecker? Stop projecting your financial constraints on people who are not subject to the same restrictions. It's not just about performance today, it's about buying a card today and not having to upgrade for years.

So basically if my son choices to just use his 42" HD television for a monitor one good card is plenty. But what if he decides to do multiple monitors, or wants to use good pc monitors? I would really like for him to get a few years out of this build, before I have to go in replacing stuff again.

A GTX 480 or 5870 will handle one 1920x1080 display just fine, at high frame rates. On a screen that large, you're going to want to turn up those graphical settings and either one will do. I would go with NVIDIA, whose drivers aren't a mess (ATI current issues for single cards: BSOD on some flash video / random GSOD / not actually using AA in a small number of games, despite selecting it in games), at this time and provides better frame rates in all but one or two current games.

But as I hear there maybe some changes in video cards in the next month, hopefully the 480 drops a little in price before I am ready to buy, if they hit 450.00 or better yet low 400's then I think the 480 is the way to go. I dont see the 5890 dropping in price any time soon.

Any other thoughts from people?

You can find the 480 for under $400 on average one weekend a month. The GTX 480 has been $430 AR (after rebate) every day for more than a month. Last week, you could get the MSI GTX 480 with Mafia II for $375AR at Newegg. TigerDirect posts great deals as well. Keep an eye on the hot deals section of [H], Slickdeals, Fatwallet, etc.

$450: EVGA: http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16814130552&cm_re=gtx_480-_-14-130-552-_-Product

$430: Galaxy: http://www.tigerdirect.com/applications/SearchTools/item-details.asp?EdpNo=6051051&CatId=3669

$430: Gigabyte: http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16814125319&cm_re=gtx_480-_-14-125-319-_-Product

$425: Palit: http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16814261069&cm_re=gtx_480-_-14-261-069-_-Product

Alternatively, you can also get one of those newfangled MSI Hawk GTX 460's that are rumored to hit 1GHz. That would provide very good performance and leave you with an upgrade path of simply adding a second GTX 460 when you need more performance.

 

[brownkc]

Rumor has it ATI's next round of cards is due out in Oct/Nov. That should drop prices on the current crop of cards (which we are already seeing) plus their new 6870/top single GPU card should at least equal the 480GTX if not best it. I'm basing that comment on what has happened in the past and not the leaked numbers. I would think something like a 6870 would give a couple of solid years of good performance on top end games even at higher resolution. I would stick with one video card just to make your life easier. It sounds like you are the one doing the build and CF or SLI just means one more possible problem for you to deal with. Plus, if you start with a powerful single card, you always have the option of picking up a second one for SLI/CF later when you need the extra horsepower. By that time, you can usually pick up a used/clearance one for a good price.

 

[Delusion]

Look at all the Nvidia love these days. It is amazing how fast that changed within the last few months. WTG Nvidia for taking back the spot.

 

[Mr. K6]

So basically if my son choices to just use his 42" HD television for a monitor one good card is plenty. But what if he decides to do multiple monitors, or wants to use good pc monitors? I would really like for him to get a few years out of this build, before I have to go in replacing stuff again.

Then I would wait, AMD should be dropping the first parts in their new 6xxx series within a couple of months, which is going to shake up the market anyway. Even if you don't want the new 6xxx cards, they'll drop the prices on current hardware.

For his system, I don't think eyeinfinty is needed for him, I would think 3D and some of the other stuff the nVidia offers over ATI might be better for him. But you know how it goes, in a few months someone else will bring out new technology to futher the race.

Ask him what he's interested in and go for it, everyone's going to have different requirements for their best gaming experience.

But as I hear there maybe some changes in video cards in the next month, hopefully the 480 drops a little in price before I am ready to buy, if they hit 450.00 or better yet low 400's then I think the 480 is the way to go. I dont see the 5890 dropping in price any time soon.

Any other thoughts from people?

There have been deals for the GTX 480 for less than $400 recently: http://hardforum.com/showthread.php?t=1542715&highlight=GTX+480 . Just keep your eyes on the Hot Deals section and slickdeals.net, etc. Personally, I'd stay away from the GTX 480 as it's hot, it's loud, and and not very impressive for the price.

 

[Valset]

So basically if my son choices to just use his 42" HD television for a monitor one good card is plenty. But what if he decides to do multiple monitors, or wants to use good pc monitors? I would really like for him to get a few years out of this build, before I have to go in replacing stuff again.

For his system, I don't think eyeinfinty is needed for him, I would think 3D and some of the other stuff the nVidia offers over ATI might be better for him. But you know how it goes, in a few months someone else will bring out new technology to futher the race.

But as I hear there maybe some changes in video cards in the next month, hopefully the 480 drops a little in price before I am ready to buy, if they hit 450.00 or better yet low 400's then I think the 480 is the way to go. I dont see the 5890 dropping in price any time soon.

Any other thoughts from people?

if your wanting a Nvidia spec feature (they don't do much for me) and you have some time to kill wait for the 475 (rumored to be an non crippled GF104) The 480GTX claim to fame is that its currently the benchmark king. playability it doesn't offer much more then what a 5870 does. it does much better in sli. its also hot and noisy. (refer to H reviews plus videos)

ATI does not have a 5890 out yet (if they do, I doubt it with the 6800 only a month or so out) they are dropping a little now, probably a lot more latter and so are the 480GTXs. you can get them now for around 425 pretty regularly, sometimes much better if you keep an eye out

 

[Fenix793]

With $400 to spend on a video card I would get either a GTX480 or GTX460 SLI. That being said AMD's 6xxx is just around the corner and I would wait for that because $400 should get you a much nicer board in just 2 months. If it must be now then the above choices are solid and will play any game available today and should at least hang in there for 2 years. I don't know how people are saying video cards can last for years since my 5850 I bought last year is already struggling with Metro 2033. I suppose it's usable but not anything like last years games.