Video Conferencing 3 users, 3 sites

B

BurntToast

2[H]4U
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Jun 14, 2003
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I have a potential opportunity to setup 3 locations for video conferencing. IMO this project is so small, it really isn't worth my time. But if I have the time available, I guess why not. It could always turn into something else.

This project will be setup at three remote sites, capturing audio and video from 3 users at their desktop. They will be discussing business as well as transmitting video of projects and prototypes that they are working on.

So they need to have a camera that focuses on themselves as well as rapid prototypes on the table. There would also need to be screen sharing capabilities.

I don't have much experience in the area but I would like to at least walk in knowing what I'm talking about.

If I had to do it right now, I would suggest Google Hangouts, purchasing 3 Logitech HD Pro C920 webcams and purchasing 3 actuating tripods for the cameras.

The Setup

Camera - Logitech HD Pro Webcam C920
Tripod - ZoomText Camera Stand
Software - Google Hangouts

I know that this setup is a little amateur. But in reality it seems to solve everything just fine.

I could add a document viewer to the quote and skip the arm all together. These range from $60-1000. I have used $600 Epson document projectors in the past, not exactly sure if they will capture on screen and transmit over a Google Hangout session, either by switching cameras or by sharing the desktop.

1) Would you recommend this setup? My only concerns are will Google Hangouts be the next project that Google axes and by adjusting the camera every so often, how long will the arm last.
2) Would I need a document viewer or will the webcam/arm do the trick?
3) Is Google Hangout professional enough. Sure Cisco Webex and Adobe Connect are available, but they are at a higher price point. Of the two I'm actually leaning towards Adobe Connect and just registering 1 host, not 3. I assume the host is fixed to a user, if the user is out sick there is no conference?

I have no idea of the budget so far. From the feeling I get cheaper is better. But they want is to have some sort of professional feel. It also needs to be extremely user friendly.
 
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Yeah I'll give that another look. Passed on it because they lacked some features a while back. Looks like they are a good competitor now.

Still wouldn't mind some recommendations on hardware. Tripod and document scanner. But might just go with the setup that I have now.
 
Do the users have any requirements with regards to the security of their conversations/video? Most people making prototypes and talking about proprietary stuff usually don't like google mining it for information..
 
David_Schroth said:
Do the users have any requirements with regards to the security of their conversations/video? Most people making prototypes and talking about proprietary stuff usually don't like google mining it for information..
Click to expand...

If you are a Google Apps customer, no data is mined.
 
Check out Zoom

http://zoom.us

I'm in the midst of rolling it out and it looks like it will allow us to slowly phase out our polycoms. Software based like google hangouts but polycom quality and its stone stupid simple.
 
Zoom.us looks very attractive. Same basic features and idea as Gotomeeting. Only difference is that Zoom.us is relatively a new player. Which throws in the question of how certain is their future.
 
The impression I have is zoom is the orignal gotomeeting devs. That left when Cisco bought the company. My supervisor has been talking to the owner of the company. The only thing I'm worried about is them being bought out.

Sorry if things don't make sense on my cell
 
That tripod is great.. have to bookmark that. I've been using IPEVO document cameras which are like web cams built into a table top stand. They are nicely designed and have an optional carry case.. only thing is you need an external microphone.

Looks like you have a nice, simple solution for them just need to find the right video service.
 
Yeah I have seen the IPEVO on Amazon.
http://www.amazon.com/IPEVO-Point-View-USB-Camera/dp/B002UBPBTC/

Really cheap all in one camera + stand solution. They list 2MP and autofocus. I assume this is 720p video? 720p seems to be the highest that most conference services offer anyways. Like you said, would just need to invest in a $20-60 mic.

BTW I came across this option. What do you think? It cost more, but maybe a more professional solution? The features are absolute overkill, but it may be more sturdy than the flex arm that I originally suggested. Only downside is that it is a paperweight. The flex arm seems like it has greater mobility.

AVerVision F50

http://www.averusa.com/education/document-camera/f50.asp

Thanks for the feedback guys. zoom.us looks awesome, would hate to deploy it just to see it be swallowed up by a competitor.
 
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Make sure you take a look at your bandwidth ... It is actually suprising how much bandwidth a HD video stream can take up.
 
Yeah for sure. I will be bringing this up if I come across a low bandwidth site. Ifthey choose to ignore the fact then I'm sure that the software will scale to their limitations. Usually audio takes top priority.

Question. At first I ignored Skype as I was considering free alternatives like Google Hangouts. Now that I'm considering going with a paid service, how would Skype work in this situation? Do they allow screen sharing?

Another thing what is your guys rate for mileage for traveling between sites? Im thinking 40-50 cents a mile or gas + 20% for wear and tear. Thanks.
 
BurntToast said:
Another thing what is your guys rate for mileage for traveling between sites? Im thinking 40-50 cents a mile or gas + 20% for wear and tear. Thanks.
Click to expand...

I've found it customary to charge the IRS Standard Mileage Rate, which is currently 56.5 cents per mile (this is to represent gas/weartear/depreciatoin of the car). Depending on how you bill your clients, anything above that you'd be charging them for your "time"...
 
Thanks I'll use the ORS figure.

With reliability being a main concern I'm leaning away from zoom and more toward Skype. Skypes recommends a 2/2 connection for 1080p among various HW specs. Does 2/2 really sound like enough?

Thanks guys
 
One other question. I have used Skype for voip and the quality is excellent. But I hear that video can be choppy. If so I just might consider Zoom and cross my fingers.

Adobe Connect is in the back of my mind. Just not sure about the ease of deployment, management and how user friendly it is. Considering that this will basically be a drop and go job.
 
This is a great thread and I was wondering if I could add some questions and maybe some more ideas to it. Like DeChache, we are also transitioning away from a Polycom VSX 8000 system to laptop-based video conferencing but our setup is a bit more complicated. We have had multiple cameras and wired/wireless audio connected to our system for over 13 years which has allowed us to broadcast our studio and two adjoining labs. Matching the multicamera setup we have now on a laptop has been a frustrating task but I am almost there. Here is what I have so far:

1. ManyCam Studio to handle video switching and desktop sharing
2. 1080p Webcam in my laptop
3. Logitech C920 1080p Webcam with tripod mount
4. IPEVO (to mimic our ELMO)
5. Affinity / Glowpoint to handle the bridging to conventional systems and laptop but I'm going to take a long hard look at Zoom linked above. WOW!
6. Dedicated RoadRunner line (15/2 I think)

This is where it's getting tricky. The problem with all of these video sources is there is no optical or user-controllable zoom on them, which is someone everyone takes for granted on a typical camcorder. The C920 has about three clicks of digital zoom but it will be awkward to control the camera and zoom with the software driver and that level of zoom isn't going to cut for product demos anyway. We use a camcorder over s-video for current productions, but ManyCam will not accept video from a composite video capture card. I have to capture the video with an EasyCap USB and then route it through e2esoft VCam first and then stream the VCam feed to ManyCam. This is obviously not stable at all and frankly my knock-off EasyCap sucks anyway..

1. Do any of you know of a good USB webcam with a tripod mount and a hardware zoom button? If not, how about a digital camera with USB streaming drivers for 64-bit Win 7 drivers for streaming? It's getting very frustrating trying to track down a solution.

2. What are some good options for a wireless microphone for the laptop? We tried Bluetooth headsets but the range and reliability was bad.
 
aldamon said:
This is a great thread and I was wondering if I could add some questions and maybe some more ideas to it. Like DeChache, we are also transitioning away from a Polycom VSX 8000 system to laptop-based video conferencing but our setup is a bit more complicated. We have had multiple cameras and wired/wireless audio connected to our system for over 13 years which has allowed us to broadcast our studio and two adjoining labs. Matching the multicamera setup we have now on a laptop has been a frustrating task but I am almost there. Here is what I have so far:

1. ManyCam Studio to handle video switching and desktop sharing
2. 1080p Webcam in my laptop
3. Logitech C920 1080p Webcam with tripod mount
4. IPEVO (to mimic our ELMO)
5. Affinity / Glowpoint to handle the bridging to conventional systems and laptop but I'm going to take a long hard look at Zoom linked above. WOW!
6. Dedicated RoadRunner line (15/2 I think)

This is where it's getting tricky. The problem with all of these video sources is there is no optical or user-controllable zoom on them, which is someone everyone takes for granted on a typical camcorder. The C920 has about three clicks of digital zoom but it will be awkward to control the camera and zoom with the software driver and that level of zoom isn't going to cut for product demos anyway. We use a camcorder over s-video for current productions, but ManyCam will not accept video from a composite video capture card. I have to capture the video with an EasyCap USB and then route it through e2esoft VCam first and then stream the VCam feed to ManyCam. This is obviously not stable at all and frankly my knock-off EasyCap sucks anyway..

1. Do any of you know of a good USB webcam with a tripod mount and a hardware zoom button? If not, how about a digital camera with USB streaming drivers for 64-bit Win 7 drivers for streaming? It's getting very frustrating trying to track down a solution.

2. What are some good options for a wireless microphone for the laptop? We tried Bluetooth headsets but the range and reliability was bad.
Click to expand...


You don't work with me do ya :p

Sounds alot like my setup but I have VSX 7000s.

What I'm doing at least in the short term is that I'm still using my Polycoms for video and audio and I have a desktop in wire closet with an Osprey capture card that pulls video and audio off the polycoms.

Gives me the full functionality of the room that my users are used to but the people on the far side don't need anything more than a laptop and a webcam. Starting to do it too with the HDX units we bought last year.


Zoom has been great we have been working with the owners of the company and they broke away from Cisco and don't seem to have any desire to go back to working for any one else
 
Thanks DeChache. It sounds like we really are dealing with some similar issues. I thought about doing what you're doing but I'm trying to upgrade to HD with inexpensive, off-the-shelf parts. Also, we're losing our building due to restructuring so I'm trying to package everything up into something that will work in a smaller space.
 
It appears video conferencing vendors such as Polycom best meet your needs because of exclusive video conferencing requirement. If you are looking to have web-video conferencing as well, then what I suggest is to deploy on premise web-video conferencing appliance such as RHUB appliances.
 
I've been up and running with Zoom now for a few weeks now and everyone I show it to is very impressed. We're starting customer-facing conferences today as long as the test calls go well with the two sites :) With internal testing, Zoom has worked through our firewall, over home Internet connections, over a 3G wireless card, on an iPhone over WiFi with a seamless transition to 3G, and European sites. It's rock solid.

Our final configuration for a laptop-based, multi-camera setup is

1. Zoom for video conferencing
2. Zoom for camera switching (ManyCam is out for quality and performance issues)
3. HD Webcam in my laptop
3. USB Logitech C920 1080p Webcam with tripod mount
4. USB IPEVO Point 2 View (to mimic our ELMO)
5. Canon HF-M41 HD camcorder hooked up to the laptop via HDMI with an StarTech HDMI to ExpressCard

If anyone does this, just keep in mind that the StarTech card is 34mm (they sell StarTech 54mm adapters on Amazon) and has a Mini HDMI connector so you'll need a dedicated Mini HDMI cable or some adapters.

Thanks for the Zoom recommendation DeChache! They're really nice guys and have addressed all of my questions/concerns.
 
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