Upgrade Zen 2 to Zen 3? Worth it?

Xa3phod

Limp Gawd
Joined
Sep 19, 2012
Messages
148
I have a 3900x on an X470 mobo. Is it worth upgrading to the Zen 3? I know I can use the X470, but I won't get the benefits from Zen 3 like PCI-E 4.0, plus the IPC is supposed to be 20% better.
So, Sell the 3900x and wait for the Zen 3 to come out? Or stick it out with the Zen 2 til Zen 4 comes out with a new socket on 5nm process.

I mostly game with it, but may do some video editing in the future.

What do you think? Waste of money or something I should upgrade to?
 

KazeoHin

[H]F Junkie
Joined
Sep 7, 2011
Messages
8,242
I mean, in all honesty none of us know.

We don't have the chips to test. For all we know AMD's claims are BS and they're worse than 1st gen Ryzen.

Not likely, but without independent reviews, there is no guarantee these chips will meet what AMD claims they will.

wait. for. reviews.
 

Xa3phod

Limp Gawd
Joined
Sep 19, 2012
Messages
148
I mean, in all honesty none of us know.

We don't have the chips to test. For all we know AMD's claims are BS and they're worse than 1st gen Ryzen.

Not likely, but without independent reviews, there is no guarantee these chips will meet what AMD claims they will.

wait. for. reviews.
But...if you wait for reviews, the price of my Zen 2 will go down faster than a 5 dolla' hooker. I was hoping to get maximum cash for my current Zen 2 and use that cash for the Zen 3.
 

KazeoHin

[H]F Junkie
Joined
Sep 7, 2011
Messages
8,242
But...if you wait for reviews, the price of my Zen 2 will go down faster than a 5 dolla' hooker. I was hoping to get maximum cash for my current Zen 2 and use that cash for the Zen 3.

Then your decision is made.

I sold my 2080Ti months ago not because I thought the 3080 was going to be great, I sold it because I wanted to get maximum return on a card that didn't overclock for BALLS. If that card overclocked even 1MHz I would probably still own it. instead I sold it to a friend for 100% what I bought it for and I still don't have a replacement card and can't afford a 3090 (at the moment).

If your goal is maximum performance, then wait for reviews.

If your goal is to make back your money, sell sooner than later

If your asking what you should do, we can't tell you, unfortunately.


Also I'm drunk
 

Dan_D

Extremely [H]
Joined
Feb 9, 2002
Messages
57,208
But...if you wait for reviews, the price of my Zen 2 will go down faster than a 5 dolla' hooker. I was hoping to get maximum cash for my current Zen 2 and use that cash for the Zen 3.

Then you have no choice but to sell now and hope that Zen 3 is a substantial improvement or you are damn near re-buying what you sold off.
 

TheSlySyl

Gawd
Joined
May 30, 2018
Messages
725
Also you have no idea if they're gonna have shortages like the RTX 3000 launch did, so you can sell off your 3900X now and be stuck without a CPU for months.

Also you have no guarantee that your X470 is gonna be updated to support Ryzen 5000 series at launch as it is.

Too many variables at the moment.
 

smoothmove

Limp Gawd
Joined
Jul 11, 2004
Messages
207
What is your use? Gaming? Workstation? Work or play?

Most use, no it won't be worth it. If you want the max gaming fps- then you will need board, cpu, video card and ram. A new system. So many fps that you won't notice.

If you are using it for a work- workstation that is for a time critical job, then yes.

The 3080 does look nice.

Making your money back is a pipe dream. In one year, the Ryzen 4 will be rolling out and we go thru it all again.

That being said, Go for it. It is only money.
 

GotNoRice

[H]F Junkie
Joined
Jul 11, 2001
Messages
9,834
I have a 3900x on an X470 mobo. Is it worth upgrading to the Zen 3?

You should monitor your GPU usage while you play games. If your GPU is constantly pegged at 100% then you are GPU limited and won't get much benefit from upgrading your CPU. If your GPU is loafing along at <70% load most of the time, then chances are that you are probably CPU limited and would benefit from a CPU with a better IPC.
 

aldamon

Supreme [H]ardness
Joined
May 24, 2000
Messages
6,568
But...if you wait for reviews, the price of my Zen 2 will go down faster than a 5 dolla' hooker. I was hoping to get maximum cash for my current Zen 2 and use that cash for the Zen 3.
Zen 3 is priced higher than Zen 2 across the board, and the price increase is higher proportionally than the IPC increase, so Zen 2 prices are not going to tank anytime soon. Right now, Zen 2 is priced higher than it was months ago which is astounding. Even if prices dip in the used market, they'll still be higher than they've been historically.

Add 20% (max) IPC to your current performance and ask yourself if it's worth the upgrade of if you really need it. My Zen 3 build will be new but if I had Zen 2 already, there's no way I'd be upgrading.
 

deton8

Limp Gawd
Joined
Sep 27, 2007
Messages
435
Upgrading is only worth it if the upgrade allows you to do something your current setup doesn't, for an amount of money you feel is worth it.

Having a 3900x already and PCIe 4 not yet being "required" (hell, by the time it's required, PCIe 5 will probably be out), you'll probably be better served putting that CPU money into a new GPU.
 

LukeTbk

Limp Gawd
Joined
Sep 10, 2020
Messages
392
I mostly game with it, but may do some video editing in the future.

That description make it ambiguous, it depends on the target FPS you game on and so on, but if you are going toward a direction of high resolution/details trying to stay comfortably above 60 to never go under 60 FPS type of gaming there is very little difference between a 3900x and a 10900K in those range of FPS in most game (say you play in 4K), even with a GTX 3080.

If your upgrade of CPU/mobo cost you $200 and give you 5-10 fps in good case and 0 in bad case, $200 more spent in of GPU (buying a 3080 over a 3070 or a 3070 over a 3060/use 2070 super) will be a significant good difference.

If there is little difference between a 3900x and a 10900K we can expect to see not much between a 3900x and a 5900x in those same scenarios.

Now, if you have more strict FPS locked minimum in mind (120 FPS maintained even in a Metro Exodus type of game) with a 1080p/1440p monitor maybe spending on a CPU make more sense and the motherboard could wait for your current motherboard to lack anything you need.
 
Last edited:

Vengance_01

Supreme [H]ardness
Joined
Dec 23, 2001
Messages
6,226
Meh wait till refresh of Zen 3 unless you like playing with shinny new toys. As with Luke rather get a better GPU than CPU if your a gamer
 

Nobu

Supreme [H]ardness
Joined
Jun 7, 2007
Messages
4,880
Yep, retailers dropped the price and dumped all their stock. If you want zen2 now, you'll have to look for a good deal. Otoh, if you're selling, you could probably sell close to retail.
 

CarpeDiem99

Limp Gawd
Joined
Apr 19, 2004
Messages
163
X470 / B450 Motherboards will not get support for Zen 3 until January according to AMD, so you shouldn't upgrade now. Wait until there is bios available for your motherboard and then decide if the performance is worth it for you.
 
  • Like
Reactions: Nobu
like this

DrDoU

2[H]4U
Joined
Jun 4, 2007
Messages
2,632
There should be no lack of comparison reviews between zen 2 and zen 3. I’m going to wait and see. Basically because I need a bios update also.
 

exlink

Supreme [H]ardness
Joined
Dec 16, 2006
Messages
5,418
I bought my 3700X and X570 mobo fully intending to upgrade to Zen 3...and I still do. The question now is which one? 5800X, 5900X or maybe even splurge on the 5950X.
 

Lumpus

Limp Gawd
Joined
Sep 2, 2005
Messages
344
I'm having a similar sort of debate. I last upgraded two years ago (2700X & X470 Taichi) and upgraded my GPU earlier this year (5700 XT) and nothing, other than my old, old, computer case feels outdated. Work productivity + gaming are all fine. My current plan for Black Friday-ish sales is to upgrade my case from my 10+ year old Corsair 540 cube to probably a Lian Li 011, and start from there upgrading next year. I'm just scared that X570 is the final stop for the AM4 platform and everything new, bright and shiny from 2021 onwards will be AM5.
 

the_real_7

[H]ard|Gawd
Joined
Sep 10, 2007
Messages
1,253
I'm having a similar sort of debate. I last upgraded two years ago (2700X & X470 Taichi) and upgraded my GPU earlier this year (5700 XT) and nothing, other than my old, old, computer case feels outdated. Work productivity + gaming are all fine. My current plan for Black Friday-ish sales is to upgrade my case from my 10+ year old Corsair 540 cube to probably a Lian Li 011, and start from there upgrading next year. I'm just scared that X570 is the final stop for the AM4 platform and everything new, bright and shiny from 2021 onwards will be AM5.
it will be but it will all be the transition to ddr5 like DDR 2 DDR3 AND DDR4 will have growing pains and most likely start out with high bandwidth but terrible timings , meanwhile you'll be on matured chipset with blazing memory speeds
 

funkydmunky

2[H]4U
Joined
Aug 28, 2008
Messages
2,580
I'm going to get a new top end GPU and stick with my current system. I plan on going to Zen3 shortly but don't want to rush into it, but currently my RTX2080 OC is my limiting factor for my VR gaming. Although that CPU bump would be welcomed :)
 

polonyc2

Fully [H]
Joined
Oct 25, 2004
Messages
19,032
I don't think going from Zen 2 to Zen 3 is really 'necessary'...it's an upgrade but you can still rock a 3600 or 3700X and be totally fine...
 

vjhawk

Limp Gawd
Joined
Sep 2, 2016
Messages
323
Zen 3 is priced higher than Zen 2 across the board, and the price increase is higher proportionally than the IPC increase, so Zen 2 prices are not going to tank anytime soon. Right now, Zen 2 is priced higher than it was months ago which is astounding. Even if prices dip in the used market, they'll still be higher than they've been historically.

Add 20% (max) IPC to your current performance and ask yourself if it's worth the upgrade of if you really need it. My Zen 3 build will be new but if I had Zen 2 already, there's no way I'd be upgrading.

It's priced $50 higher to be exact. So if poster paid $499 retail for his 3900x, he will be paying $550 for the 5900x and realize a roughly 19%+ performance gain with a drop in upgrade. If he planned to go to Zen 4 he would need a completely new motherboard, memory etc. the nice thing about the 5900x is the amazing increases in single threaded performance which a LOT of apps and games will benefit from. The 5900X will also crush it in productivity apps. I'm planning to jump to 5900x if the availability is there. I get extra performance without having to change a thing except my CPU and probably a bios upgrade.
 

jeremyshaw

[H]F Junkie
Joined
Aug 26, 2009
Messages
12,463
It's priced $50 higher to be exact. So if poster paid $499 retail for his 3900x, he will be paying $550 for the 5900x and realize a roughly 19%+ performance gain with a drop in upgrade. If he planned to go to Zen 4 he would need a completely new motherboard, memory etc. the nice thing about the 5900x is the amazing increases in single threaded performance which a LOT of apps and games will benefit from. The 5900X will also crush it in productivity apps. I'm planning to jump to 5900x if the availability is there. I get extra performance without having to change a thing except my CPU and probably a bios upgrade.
5900x also resolves (on paper, at least), one of the quibbles with the 6/12 core Zen1/+/2 configs had: They relied on groups of 3 core CCXs. While this may have been beneficial for thermal balance, die harvesting, etc, it meant in more latency sensitive, threadded workloads, they took a light dive in performance vs the 4 core CCX configs (the most extreme example is the 2+2 3100X vs the 4+0 3300X). The 3900X is four 3 core groupings, whereas the 5900X should just be two 6 core groupings. Dunno if the unified cache will really work out that way in reality, but it makes the 12 core SKU more interesting to me, this time around.

Pending reviews, of course. We have seen performance regressions before, so nothing is guaranteed until silicon is actually in user hands.
 

Xa3phod

Limp Gawd
Joined
Sep 19, 2012
Messages
148
I'm honesty torn. I was so enthused to upgrade from my 6700K to the 3900x, but I really don't see much of a gaming improvement. I game at 1440p and usually with my RTX2070 (Its currently RMA'd again, so using my older R9 Fury X) With the 6700K at 4.5Ghz and the Fury X, sure it doesn't run at 144hz all day long, but its completely playable for the most part. So, I don't know whether to just keep playing on the 6700K or go back to the 3900x. I put it on Ebay, but it only went to around $325, and I won't sell it for so little. I was hoping for $380 or so. Back in April I did a back to back benchmark comparison with these two CPUs and its very close for gaming, obviously CPU benchmarks are apples and oranges as 8 threads vs 24 threads isn't in the same ballpark. I am attaching the benchmark results. Take a look, let me know what you think. Should I keep the 3900x and sell the 6700K?

(On a separate note: I have my AMD ram - the Flair DDR4-3200 and my older Trident Z DDR4-3000. For the 6700K, which is better? Thanks)

Thanks.
 

Attachments

  • Benchmark.pdf
    24.9 KB · Views: 0

kirbyrj

Fully [H]
Joined
Feb 1, 2005
Messages
27,108
I'm honesty torn. I was so enthused to upgrade from my 6700K to the 3900x, but I really don't see much of a gaming improvement. I game at 1440p and usually with my RTX2070 (Its currently RMA'd again, so using my older R9 Fury X) With the 6700K at 4.5Ghz and the Fury X, sure it doesn't run at 144hz all day long, but its completely playable for the most part. So, I don't know whether to just keep playing on the 6700K or go back to the 3900x. I put it on Ebay, but it only went to around $325, and I won't sell it for so little. I was hoping for $380 or so. Back in April I did a back to back benchmark comparison with these two CPUs and its very close for gaming, obviously CPU benchmarks are apples and oranges as 8 threads vs 24 threads isn't in the same ballpark. I am attaching the benchmark results. Take a look, let me know what you think. Should I keep the 3900x and sell the 6700K?

(On a separate note: I have my AMD ram - the Flair DDR4-3200 and my older Trident Z DDR4-3000. For the 6700K, which is better? Thanks)

Thanks.

Brand new they are $399 at MC, so $380 might not be realistic. Plus, most of the bidding happens in the last 20 seconds on stuff like that. You might have gotten it on ebay if you had just left it there rather than violating the TOS with some "I didn't get what I wanted so I didn't sell it" BS (I hate sellers like you). There are several right now with bids up to $360+ with just the bare CPU.

Honestly, I'd sell your 6700k on ebay. They are going for $180+ which for that old of a processor is a good deal for you, especially since the new i3 10100 is essentially the same thing and you can buy them brand new for $116 on NE right now if you had to replace it.

If you're gaming at 1440p (which your benchmark pdf seems to indicate your max resolution), the CPU isn't as relevant. I'd probably upgrade anyway personally, but for gaming alone, I'm not sure it will be $150 worth of improvement.
 
Last edited:

d3athf1sh

Gawd
Joined
Dec 16, 2015
Messages
737
prob be better off with a GPU upgrade and wait till next year for ZEN4/X670/DDR5/PCIE 5.0 imo

at least that's my plan. curently running a 3800X. Plus if you upgrade to ZEN3, to get maximum performance, you may also need a ram upgrade being that now with ZEN3 the sweet spot is said to be 4000mhz. so that's a lot of money to spend for what the actual fps uplift you'll get in games vs a new video card or just waiting till next year.

trust me i've been weighing it out and really want a 5800X, so i guess if you got money to blow go for it. I just don't think i can do it.
 

Xa3phod

Limp Gawd
Joined
Sep 19, 2012
Messages
148
prob be better off with a GPU upgrade and wait till next year for ZEN4/X670/DDR5/PCIE 5.0 imo

at least that's my plan. curently running a 3800X. Plus if you upgrade to ZEN3, to get maximum performance, you may also need a ram upgrade being that now with ZEN3 the sweet spot is said to be 4000mhz. so that's a lot of money to spend for what the actual fps uplift you'll get in games vs a new video card or just waiting till next year.

trust me i've been weighing it out and really want a 5800X, so i guess if you got money to blow go for it. I just don't think i can do it.
That is a great point! I would need a ram upgrade. So 6700k or 3900x?
 

d3athf1sh

Gawd
Joined
Dec 16, 2015
Messages
737
That is a great point! I would need a ram upgrade. So 6700k or 3900x?
stick w/ amd. plus using the 1usmus dram calc you'd be surprised what you can get out of your ram with the right settings. took my balistix 3200 ram to 3666 which puts me in the sweet spot for infinity fabric. may be able to go even higher but just don't feel like messing with it right now.

not sure where 6700k came from a gaming perspective that wouldn't be a good choice. especially for stuff like cyberpunk 2077 and other titles that are on the horizon. plus you're gonna need pcie 4.0 for microsoft's directStorage api whenever that gets released.
 

Ready4Dis

2[H]4U
Joined
Nov 4, 2015
Messages
2,427
Zen 3 is priced higher than Zen 2 across the board, and the price increase is higher proportionally than the IPC increase, so Zen 2 prices are not going to tank anytime soon. Right now, Zen 2 is priced higher than it was months ago which is astounding. Even if prices dip in the used market, they'll still be higher than they've been historically.

Add 20% (max) IPC to your current performance and ask yourself if it's worth the upgrade of if you really need it. My Zen 3 build will be new but if I had Zen 2 already, there's no way I'd be upgrading.
This isn't really true, but the point isn't lost. The prices went up a little bit, so the $/perf will be better than zen 2 but not by as much as it could have been if the prices didn't go up.

Since it was $50 across the board, the 3600x->5600x doesn't net you to much, you're basically paying 20% more money for ~20% performance, so while it's faster, the $/perf is about the same. Since the 3800x -> 5800x started at a higher price, you only have around 12.5% price increase for a ~20% performance uplift, so $/perf is better, same with 5900x/5950x as well. Since the OP has a 3900x I assume he'd be looking at a 5800x or higher, meaning the $/perf is probably going to be improved but 10%-15%.
 

SpongeBob

The Contraceptive Under the Sea
Joined
Jan 15, 2011
Messages
754
Good question OP. I'm trying to figure out if I should keep my 3800x which I haven't opened or buy a more expensive 5600x. The 5600x would cost me $10-$30 more from what I'm seeing in terms of pricing.
 
Last edited:

c3k

2[H]4U
Joined
Sep 8, 2007
Messages
2,238
Now that I've read the reviews, I can feel how my 3700x is slowing my typing on this forum. I mean, it seems like the characters are being sent through a molasses bath before they appear on the screen.

Sigh.

I feel the need for a 5800x. Or something.

;)

Seriously? Yeah, I'm gonna buy one of these, toss it in my X570, grab the 3700x that's being displaced and toss it into the x470, then grab that loose 2700x and buy a B550 mobo and get rid of the 8350 bulldozer that's holding up my htpc. So, yeah...AMD nailed it.

Crap. Once I swap out one 3700x, I may need to swap out the other...and replace the 2700x. I see future upgrades...

Lisa: thank you.
 

Chelica

2[H]4U
Joined
Aug 8, 2003
Messages
2,585
Now that I've read the reviews, I can feel how my 3700x is slowing my typing on this forum. I mean, it seems like the characters are being sent through a molasses bath before they appear on the screen.

Sigh.

I feel the need for a 5800x. Or something.

;)

Seriously? Yeah, I'm gonna buy one of these, toss it in my X570, grab the 3700x that's being displaced and toss it into the x470, then grab that loose 2700x and buy a B550 mobo and get rid of the 8350 bulldozer that's holding up my htpc. So, yeah...AMD nailed it.

Crap. Once I swap out one 3700x, I may need to swap out the other...and replace the 2700x. I see future upgrades...

Lisa: thank you.
lol, talk about playing CPU chairs.
 

Xa3phod

Limp Gawd
Joined
Sep 19, 2012
Messages
148
Think I will wait for Ryzen 4. Not worth the upgrade from Ryzen 2 to 3 to pay that much. I won't get enough for my 3900x to make it worth it. Also, I will need a new Mobo and ram for Ryzen 4. Might as well start saving up now.
 

Starfalcon

Limp Gawd
Joined
Jan 7, 2020
Messages
401
Yeah but if you do wait, you get to be the new tech beta tester. Plus you get to pay top dollar for the new DDR5, if you foget how expensive DDR 4 and DDR 3 were when they were brand new.
 
Top