Toms Hardware $300 projector

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ninethreeeleven

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I did 3 searchs and found nothing, so point me to the thread if this is a repost.

This is frickin awesome, and definetly something I will consider if I come across a sale on these types of projectors (Note: I am broke, I will not, in any short span of time, be able to afford a $1000 TV, so this might be worth it for the time being).

Friendly Linkage

EDIT: Got rid of hotlinked pic, sorry the image host is down (iupload is not uploading on my machine?)
 
Well that picture is not very usefull. You can NOT link pictures directly from other sites, and this site is actually smart enough to replace the image when it detects outside links.
 
Don't mean to diss but Tom's DIY projector guide is filled with inaccuracies and hence your results will look like garbage (comparatively speaking dollar per dollar). Tom's projector guide/review are as inaccurate as his computer hardware reviews. If you want the best diy projector then lumenlab is the only way to go. $375-$600 will get you a nice xga setup.

http://www.lumenlab.com/
http://www.lumenlab.com/forums/index.php?act=idx

The up-to-date design and support they give is worth every bit the $20 cost of membership. The parts they sell are higher end as well, no mismatched focal lengths or anything else to worry about. The propietor just recieved some newer, even higher end parts, can't wait to see all of these new results in their forums! I'll be finished with my LL PJ come mid january and i'm going to try and post the highest quality pics i can muster ;)
 
I really dont see any major flaws with it. I watched the video too, and from what it shows, its not that bad, especially for $300. Only major problem that I saw was the diagonal corners around the projected image.

Damn I am a newb to the whole idea of these things (I found the Toms Hardware guide on Collegehumor and just brought it here.) But those things (in their user galleries) look huge. I guess I should show pics of my room (basically a dorm room size).
 
ninethreeeleven said:
I really dont see any major flaws with it. I watched the video too, and from what it shows, its not that bad, especially for $300. Only major problem that I saw was the diagonal corners around the projected image.

Damn I am a newb to the whole idea of these things (I found the Toms Hardware guide on Collegehumor and just brought it here.) But those things (in their user galleries) look huge. I guess I should show pics of my room (basically a dorm room size).
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First off, sorry to have come off so strongly and troll-like, i should have chosen my words better.

By "inaccuracies" i should have been more specific. The problem is i can't remember exact details but there's an ongoing thread about tom's article in the Lumenlab protected forums. In that thread diy'ers had exposed a bunch flaws, inacurracies and assumptions in tom's approach. Basically the way to sum it up is: Tom is noob at DIY projection but he's posing as some sort of expert. You'd better serve yourself by picking a proven design at www.lumenlab.com or www.diyaudio.com and proceeding from there ;). I recommend Lumenlab so strongly because they have a superior design + antiquated ideas seem to never die at diyaudio.com and it can lead to much confusion and questionable results imho.

The positives about Tom's article, well he seems to have generated a lot of interest in the topic and people are signing up in droves at lumenlab because of stumbling upon his article :)
 
I dont have anything to add, I just wanted to say no offense taken, I understood what you meant.
And thanks for the links. I'll check them out if I ever partake on this sort of thing.
 
i followed that guide about a month ago, got me a projector for 50, broken lcd for 20. <3 craigslist.org
i dont need a fan, it doesnt heat up enough. It looks really horrible, the actual structure i mean, but the quality is great. The LCD is too big for the projector and as such the sides are cut off about .5 inches on each but it still works great for watching movies and playing console games. It is however only usable in the dark but i suspect that is dependent entirely on the bulb strength.

It doesnt look that great but for 70 bucks and a lil bit of work it cant be beat. I did however get really lucky on that broken lcd :D (just the cathodes were dead, inverters actually)
 
Would you say it looks good for around $200? Or would you say go deeper into the pockets and get the tried and true $400-600 like Lumenlabs has?
 
looks amazing.

was looking at lumenlabs store... all their lens' are sold out, are they made especially for the kits?

how many total parts are there to complete a unit? how much more does it cost to run in 16:9?
 
Jason711 said:
looks amazing.

was looking at lumenlabs store... all their lens' are sold out, are they made especially for the kits?

how many total parts are there to complete a unit? how much more does it cost to run in 16:9?
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Their standard lense good is still in stock: https://secure.lumenlab.com/shop/group.php?id=2 They're made to be paired with lcd monitor's up to 15" in size. Their pro lense kit is made for lcd monitors up to 19". Running 16:9 full time can be achieved for "free" by using a proggie called powerstrip ;), otherwise if you pop in a 16:9 dvd movie it does the resizing automatically. It is claimed that the highest quality results can be achieved using an htpc.

I don't have the time atm to draw out a parts list but if everyone's patient enough i can have a parts list by about 10:00PM tonite at the latest. I'll base it upon a "budget setup" built around a 15" xga lcd and i'll include linkage to better deals i've bookmarked. Pretty sure it'll range between $350-$450 for a complete setup.

I've personally been waiting on some specialty bulb and powersupply otherwise i would have been finished a month ago (its coming this week so i can start building already!)
 
ninethreeeleven said:
Would you say it looks good for around $200? Or would you say go deeper into the pockets and get the tried and true $400-600 like Lumenlabs has?
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I'd be willing to wager that tom's OHP looks great in the $200 range. Putting tom's flaws aside, the only other issues i see are very low bulb life and maintence costs. Once you replace 2 or 3 bulbs on an OHP, you've already reached the cost of a lumenlab design (whose bulbs last for 20,000 hrs!)

stay tuned for later tonite ;)
 
I am very interested in this. I have a projector already, but building one would just be fun. I am going to read these write ups, but a lazy man's question...Can I use a laptop LCD? I have a couple of 14" laying around that work fine, but the laptop main boards are shot.
 
IDversusEGO said:
I am very interested in this. I have a projector already, but building one would just be fun. I am going to read these write ups, but a lazy man's question...Can I use a laptop LCD? I have a couple of 14" laying around that work fine, but the laptop main boards are shot.
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Ahh, unfortunately, a laptop lcd is useless without its god darn expensive controller board. Too bad because those badboys are small and have high resolution.

I'll try to get two price lists going, both of them will be budget+quality options though since i feel IQ/PQ is very important and some standards should be met.
 
I looked at some of the pictures of peoples DIY projectors on the lumnilabs forum.

While the price can not be beat, those things are FREAKIN UGLY boxes. Guess it is more for the single guys or guys who like watching big screen in the garage, cause my wife would not allow that thing in the house.
 
some of them aren't too bad.

http://www.lumenlab.com/forums/index.php?showtopic=3215

takes some woodworking though. Of course, that is part of the appeal to me. I built my current screen from scratch, as well as an end table and my DVD shelves in my Theatre. I am planning on takcling an entertainment rack in my next house. building my own projector would making it super pimp.
 
One thing i noticed, not to diss the good fellows at LL, but the camera pic quality in their results forum are usually horrendous. It's rare to find someone using a decent camera, or decent shutter speed at least :( .

Oh well, i'm one to talk, i broke all my good digital cameras. And haven't replaced them yet (these projects are spreading me thin!)
 
IDversusEGO said:
some of them aren't too bad.

http://www.lumenlab.com/forums/index.php?showtopic=3215

takes some woodworking though. Of course, that is part of the appeal to me. I built my current screen from scratch, as well as an end table and my DVD shelves in my Theatre. I am planning on takcling an entertainment rack in my next house. building my own projector would making it super pimp.
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That one does not look too bad, course the pics near the bottom of the page will discourage anyone from playing around with a tablesaw.

The scariest tool I own is my tablesaw, that thing scares the crap out of me. My wife wont let me use it without her being in the room with me.
 
SJetski71 said:
Ahh, unfortunately, a laptop lcd is useless without its god darn expensive controller board. Too bad because those badboys are small and have high resolution.

I'll try to get two price lists going, both of them will be budget+quality options though since i feel IQ/PQ is very important and some standards should be met.
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he said the laptop mainboard was screwed up... if the controller for the LCD (which should be in teh LCD housing, not on the motherboard, right? or are the inverter and controller board different things?) still works, should he be able to use them?
 
lithium726 said:
he said the laptop mainboard was screwed up... if the controller for the LCD (which should be in teh LCD housing, not on the motherboard, right? or are the inverter and controller board different things?) still works, should he be able to use them?
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I'm not 100% sure but i think it would. As long as there's a little breathing room with cable lengths then it ought to work. I'd hate to say "yes" then have someone discover $300 later that they can't incorporate it. It'll take some studying and measuring to figure out for sure.

See ya's again later tonite ;)
 
m1abram said:
That one does not look too bad, course the pics near the bottom of the page will discourage anyone from playing around with a tablesaw.

The scariest tool I own is my tablesaw, that thing scares the crap out of me. My wife wont let me use it without her being in the room with me.
Click to expand...

lol, my gradnfather did the exact thing that the guy in that thread did. I use jigs and guides to push the wood through. even a scrap of 1x4 is handy to keep on hand. put a quick nothc in it and you can push the wood through with it.
 
Laptop LCD controllers are generally (if not always) integrated into the motherboard.
 
I say we take a little bit from each unit, and make our own [H] projector.

Another thing I thought of, since someone brought it up, was bulb life. These bastards are expensive. Solution? LEDs! But how can we get a LED array bright enough to power them? Well I remembered an article in Popular Science about new LED spotlights with Lamp Life of an estimated 50,000 hours!

Only problem is these things get warm (notice the heat sink setup) they should be super bright (but are rated at 300 Lumens?, Toms bulb is 3,500 ANSI Lumens.), and they are bulky. I will continue my search for a nice LED light (super brightness, low cost, and low power consumption), but in the mean time can anyone tell me if ANSI lumens are different from Lumens? I mean this LED is supposed to be a floodlight, how can it be only 10% of a overhead projector light? Educate me people.

Link to the LED lamp.

EDIT: I understand it would take some modding to get this thing into a projetor (of if you made one your self maybe not) but isn't that what the [H] is all about.

Also I know nothing about lighting, and output strength. But here is another LED setup that I thought might stir some intrest. Lumeous Intensity >7000 mcd, 100,000 hours, $39.00
 
k1114 said:
Laptop LCD controllers are generally (if not always) integrated into the motherboard.
Click to expand...
then are the controller and inverter something different? cuase on all three laptops i have, the inverter is iside the LCD casing
 
ninethreeeleven said:
I say we take a little bit from each unit, and make our own [H] projector.

Another thing I thought of, since someone brought it up, was bulb life. These bastards are expensive. Solution? LEDs! But how can we get a LED array bright enough to power them? Well I remembered an article in Popular Science about new LED spotlights with Lamp Life of an estimated 50,000 hours!

Only problem is these things get warm (notice the heat sink setup) they should be super bright (but are rated at 300 Lumens?, Toms bulb is 3,500 ANSI Lumens.), and they are bulky. I will continue my search for a nice LED light (super brightness, low cost, and low power consumption), but in the mean time can anyone tell me if ANSI lumens are different from Lumens? I mean this LED is supposed to be a floodlight, how can it be only 10% of a overhead projector light? Educate me people.

Link to the LED lamp.

EDIT: I understand it would take some modding to get this thing into a projetor (of if you made one your self maybe not) but isn't that what the [H] is all about.

Also I know nothing about lighting, and output strength. But here is another LED setup that I thought might stir some intrest. Lumeous Intensity >7000 mcd, 100,000 hours, $39.00
Click to expand...
Led's won't work (currently anyways) for several reasons but first and foremost: they aren't focused enough, they spread light everywhere except where it needs to be. Its a question often asked by the newer fellas at the diy forums ;) EDIT: Metal hallide bulbs are good for 20,000 hrs and are relatively cheap.

figgie said:
hmm

i will stick with my $500 CRT based fpj ;)
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What kind do you have? i love those suckers



Be back in a short while with a nice price/parts list
 
Basic parts list for tube/box oriented design. Some of these following parts can be substituted for higher-end components but they represent a base level for quality results, you want it to look nice don't you? :). An easy upgrade is the light bulb, an extra $10-$20 can get you a slightly better picture quality.

Standard Lens kit (for a 15" lcd) $63 + s/h: https://secure.lumenlab.com/shop/group.php?id=2
400w MH Basic Lamp kit $66 + s/h : http://www.lightingcloseout.com/product_detail.cfm?ProductID=383&CategoryID=3
Wood for a case, Free~$50: http://search.ebay.com/_W0QQgotopageZ1QQsassZbuxwoodsQQsorecordsperpageZ50QQsosortpropertyZ1
Lexan UV "glass" 2~6 panels~$15: Amount of panels used depends on design or preference. Home depot/Lowes item: Lexan XL10 barcode: 7 26941 13201 2 (ubercheap)
15" strippable lcd monitor: $50~$200. Be patient here, deals crop up everywhere. Educate thyself before selecting. PM me if with any questions on lcd's ;)

Misc hardware:
- Sufficient electrical wire ~$5: here & here & here
- 2 standard 10amp light switches, (at most dollar stores) $2 total
- 2 standard 10 amp wall plug sockets (at most dollar stores) $2 total
- 120v 10amp power entry, free from an old psu or $2 here: http://www.allelectronics.com/cgi-bin/category.cgi?category=485&item=FTR-42&type=store
- thermometer, free~$1
- 120mm 90cfm fan (AC or DC): free~$12: http://bestbyteinc.com/prodinfo.asp?number=FAN-TTA-A2018&variation=&aitem=12&mitem=14
- Terminal strips (optional) $1-$3: http://www.allelectronics.com/cgi-bin/category.cgi?category=755&type=store
- Fasteners & thumbtacks & clamps ~$10: Not all are necessary but would help.
- 12v DC wallwart, optional but may come in handy for 12v DC fans etc. free~$3.75: http://www.allelectronics.com/cgi-bin/category.cgi?category=815&item=DCTX-9102&type=store

Optional bulb upgrade: http://www.1000bulbs.com/product.php?product=227 or better: http://atlantalightbulbs.com/ecart/10Expand.asp?ProductCode=UHI-S400DDUSHIO
Optional cans of spraypaint: black/heat resistant for interior and ? for the exterior.
Optional hemisphere reflector: Linen's N Things has one in-store for $8 labeled "stainless scrub holder": http://66.235.184.120/~qnhrbod/images/scrub holder stainless.jpg
Optional pre-made enclosure $80 + s/h

Estimated cost range: $300-$450 depending on your patience and upgrade preferences. The LCD is a major factor so keep a shortlist of lcd's handy and jump on a deal when it surfaces. Ebay often has lcd monitors with burnt-out backlamps at a discount (we don't need the backlamp for a PJ). Most forums have a "compatible LCD" sticky thread to help you choose which ones to buy. PM me if you want my home-brewed compatible LCD list in txt format.

Membership at a DIY forum: free~$20. I highly recommend Lumenlab for their plan's ease, their high end results and their forum's orderliness (comparatively speaking). The learning curve is shortest there as well, well worth the $20 membership fee. The store stocks only high end components at the cheapest price available (i checked!). Otherwise look for my related forum links listed below.

Disclaimer: Always use extreme caution when working with high voltage. A 400w metal hallide assembly will kill you in a similar fashion to a squirrel playing hopscotch in a utility transformer. Educate yourself in basic wiring techniques before proceeding, i'm not responsible for anyone's accidents.

Join a community: educate yourself ;)
- www.lumenlab.com & the Lumenlab forums Highly recommended.
- DiyAudio Moving Image forums great for general research. Get used to the search function because the PJ forums are unorganized imho.
- diyprojectorcompany and their store The stores a tad expensive and fresnel lens quality has been inconsistent. Free plans here but parts are pricier.
- http://www.diybuildergroup.com/index.php & their store: (navigate via dropdown at top right corner)

Hope you have as much fun as i'm having :)
 
Let me reiterate: Membership at a diy forum is essential, you will not be able to build a PJ without a set of plans and a solid forum support structure. Building a PC is much easier than a diy PJ but don't let that deter you, most of you already have diy and tweaking in your blood ;). A diy PJ is a perfect mate for a diy htpc and brings our home entertainment quest full-circle imho. You get a quality 80"~120" image for the cost of an decent 27" television.

Forgot to mention in the other post: Just as in the PC world, a few extra dollars invested in your PJ increases your results and flexibility. Let me list a few examples and options:

Upgrade examples:
Ballasts: You can upgrade to a pulse-start ballast for slightly brighter/efficient results.
You can upgrade even higher by going with an electronic ballast for even more brightness/efficiency. (the lamp kit supposedly kicks ass)

Bulbs: A pulse-start MH bulb is needed for a pulse-start/Eballast assembly. A bulb with 65-85 CRI (color rating index, higher=more accurate color) is desired and 4000K-6000K color temp is necessary. (don't forget you need a compatible socket to plug into $10).

LCD monitor: You can go with an old ebay special that has 250:1 contrast and 50ms response BUT your movies and games will look nicer with higher specs. I myself recently upgraded by swapping a nice CMV 522a for the highly rated BenQ FP791. Stupid and unnecessary? probably, but i wanted a proven high-end 15" lcd with DVI inputs ;). The current mother-of-all diy LCD's is the SGI 1600SW @ 1600x1024 uxga.

Lenses: An upgrade that allows for much higher IQ. Bigger better lenses allow for up to 19" widescreen LCD's with their higher resolutions.

You can PM me with basic questions but all other inquiries will be referred to Lumenlab ;)

Edit: The creme-de-le creme of bulbs, Ushio S400DD 5200k 85 CRI: http://atlantalightbulbs.com/ecart/10Expand.asp?ProductCode=UHI-S400DDUSHIO
 
well, I have subscribed to this thread and will be tackling this project when I move to my new house. probably a year. I will keep an eye on this area. As, I said before, my goal is to have a theatre room construced as much by me as is possible.
 
Bump

Any converts ? Just wondering if anyone has committed themselves yet

I personally have subscribed to this thread and will bump it on occasion as i add more info :)
 
yea, id really like to know if anyone has done this yet. im VERY VERY VERY interested in doing this, since i was looking in a new TV for about this same price.

what id really like to know about is the color quality, picture clarity, and response time. ive seen the pics, and they looked really really good, but i still want to hear what other people have to say about it. IE: how easy/hard, any difficulties, stuff like that.

id be watching movies, playing console games, probably computer games, and maybe general computer stuff (im assuming that it connects through a PC since youre using a LCD).
 
TSS Modder said:
yea, id really like to know if anyone has done this yet. im VERY VERY VERY interested in doing this, since i was looking in a new TV for about this same price.

what id really like to know about is the color quality, picture clarity, and response time. ive seen the pics, and they looked really really good, but i still want to hear what other people have to say about it. IE: how easy/hard, any difficulties, stuff like that.

id be watching movies, playing console games, probably computer games, and maybe general computer stuff (im assuming that it connects through a PC since youre using a LCD).
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Well i can't answer all your questions but imho building a lumenlab-type projector is a lot easier if you know the basics of electrical wiring. I'm currently adding components in my enclosure such as wiring, fuses, fans etc. I'm also currently burning in my metal hallide bulb (100hrs -+) and my eyes ache from staring at it so much :cool:. Was it easy for me? kinda sorta not really, but i'm taking it real slow. Others seem to breeze thru it but oh well :)

Color quality is mostly determined by the LCD and bulb you use, response time hinges on your LCD, picture clarity is a combined result of lens quality/placement and the lcd you use (htpc's can help clarity a lot as well). Can a person get a great 100" picture for $350-$400? They most certainly can...
 
i have a 14" LCD using on an overhead, does that lumen design have instructions for LCDs other than the 15" they advertise? also would i be able to reuse the frenzel from my overhead?
 
CzarDestructo said:
i have a 14" LCD using on an overhead, does that lumen design have instructions for LCDs other than the 15" they advertise? also would i be able to reuse the frenzel from my overhead?
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A definite "Yes" to your lcd question and "maybe" to your fresnel question. I forsee two potential issues with your overhead fresnels though, focal length and quality of material used. I'd suggest more research before attempting though. The good news is fresnel kits are inexpensive if you find you cant use your ohp fresnels.

BTW what exact model 14" lcd are you using? Finding out what monitors are strippable can be difficult and you can really help the DIY PJ community by sharing any info you have ;)
 
the Mag 14" LCD, they only have two variants, one with speakers and one without.extremely easy strip, your welcome to post that anywhere you care :)

they are hard to get now though, don't make them anymore. i got mine off e-bay brand new for $140.

i originally got a KDS 15" LCD(i forget the model,no longer have it), wasn't strippable. wasted some money on that goof, then it sat for awhile until i dropped it when moving stuff around. good bye money.
 
There's a new welcome addition to the diy PJ world. It's this "widescreen" 15" lcd monitor with native 1280 x 800 15"...perfect for building a true 720P high definition PJ. Staples description is a bit misleading but it's been proven beyond doubt that its a true 1280 x 800 native resolution (per users and mfr info).
ProView PL576Ws : http://www.staples.com/Catalog/Browse/Sku.asp?PageType=1&Sku=583758

Key selling points:

-supposedly $229 in-store and even less with a coupon.
-No FFC cable issues, only real video wires used inside.
-Extremely easy to strip
-Compatible with the cheaper/standard lumenlab lens kit
 
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