Time to drop the E8400 back to stock?

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GJSNeptune

[H]F Junkie
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Mar 31, 2004
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I've been running my E8400 at 3.6 on stock voltage since I built the system. It's been about a year and a half. I know overclocking reduces chip life, but I'm under the impression that increasing the voltage is the main killer.

About ten minutes ago I suffered a PFN_List_Corrupt BSOD. Firefox suddenly crashed. I went to hit Cancel on the prompt, and instant BSOD. This has me thinking about both my overclock and my replacement EVGA GTX 260. It isn't the first crash I've had lately. Ever since I got my replacement GTX 260, I've had strange things happen. Even after wiping the NVIDIA drivers and installing the latest available. Aero suddenly fails and my theme reverts to the basic theme. Choppy video playback (even little AVIs). And BSODs.

Windows 7 x64 Ultimate
Asus P5Q Pro
2x2GB Corsair XMS2 DDR2-800
Corsair HX620
Few hard drives

Before I power off and prepare to run memtest and possibly drop to 3.0GHz stock speed, I wanted to see what people thought. It seems that all my issues are graphics related, although the PFN BSOD could simply be bad memory or hard drive. I haven't had any issues reading files, and I frequently use all the hard drives in this system.
 
Your symptoms sound like a bad video card, especially since you say this happened after you replacement video card. Was this card a RMA replacement from EVGA? Usually you get a card someone else sent in RMA that was fixed and recertified. However, it would not hurt to make sure it isn't the RAM or your overclock or your hard drives. All these things can cause instability.
 
Yeah, it's from EVGA. As far as I could tell, the PCB is impeccably clean. It looks unused. I don't know how well they can clean cards they get that've been in use for awhile, but it makes me wonder if maybe the card was DOA. I dunno though.

When my Aero fails and my theme is reverted, there's a soft squealing noise coming from (probably) my PSU. My original GTX 260 made my PSU squeal like a pig during games and game menus. This card was made about a month before my original card. The replacement has 192 shaders and was made in June '08. My original had 216 shaders and was made in July '08 if I remember correctly.
 
Sounds like the problem is the card, not the CPU. I get PFN_List errors when the videocard power state change doesn't work properly like after a hibernation/sleep restore. When I put in an older card that only has a single power state, this didn't happen.

EVGA can clean the card so well it looks brand new. It's pretty easy to wash PCBs. They can even put on a new shroud or a new shroud sticker with plastic covering so it looks new but it could be very old.
 
Like Spare-Flair said above, they have ways of cleaning up the card to make them look new. As far as I know the 192 SP version has not been made for quite a while now (I believe the 216 SP replaced it completely, not 100% sure), meaning the card can be older.
 
I already mentioned that it's older.

GJSNeptune said:
This card was made about a month before my original card. The replacement has 192 shaders and was made in June '08. My original had 216 shaders and was made in July '08 if I remember correctly.
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Why did they send you a lesser card?

Also, if ti is making your PSU squeal, then you probably have some blown caps in the PSU.
 
It isn't a lesser card. It's the same model. They just started shipping them with 216 while keeping the same model #.

My PSU is fine. The video card has lame voltage regulation.
 
GJSNeptune said:
My PSU is fine. The video card has lame voltage regulation.
Click to expand...

Another reason to consider the videocard power state issues as a cause for your BSODs. I don't know why you think it's your CPU when all these issues appeared after your videocard was RMAd and put back in.

If it is your CPU, then, why not just go back to stock for a month and see what results you get. Easy diagnose, easy fix.
 
GJSNeptune said:
It isn't a lesser card. It's the same model. They just started shipping them with 216 while keeping the same model #.

My PSU is fine. The video card has lame voltage regulation.
Click to expand...

So what if it is the same model number.... the 192 shader card is a lesser card then the 216 shader card.

That is like saying that two different year cars that are the same model are the same car even if the newer year's model has 50 more horsepower due to changes in the engine.
 
cyclone3d said:
So what if it is the same model number.... the 192 shader card is a lesser card then the 216 shader card.
Click to expand...
Technically a "lesser" card, but still the same card.

cyclone3d said:
That is like saying that two different year cars that are the same model are the same car even if the newer year's model has 50 more horsepower due to changes in the engine.
Click to expand...
No, it's really not. Analogies and similes are used incorrectly on message boards and forums. Save them for the classroom, okay?
 
I... highly doubt an E8400 is dead/damaged from overclock at this point. My 3800 x2 was watercooled and run ragged at 3.0 with more than "safe" voltage and now it's happily chugging along at 2.4 or so in my parents' computer.

I've never seen a cpu die that quickly unless a board fried it, someone ran a TON of voltage through it, or there were lightning/power issues.
 
Just RMA your card again.


GJSNeptune said:
Technically a "lesser" card, but still the same card.


No, it's really not. Analogies and similes are used incorrectly on message boards and forums. Save them for the classroom, okay?
Click to expand...

:rolleyes: Stop being a troll.
 
Why the hell would your CPU be at all related to your current problems? You yourself noted the problem began ever since you got your RMA'd GTX 260.

All RMA-received parts are suspect until proven otherwise, that's the rule of thumb I use. Companies hand you shit that someone else thought was broken and that they test for 10 seconds before declaring them "good."
 
Normally if a CPU Dies. the Symptoms crawls up, one by one shortly after you get hit by massive amounts of error messages, Random shut downs, and then the CPU wont post at all no more.

And most of the times its heat issues, or too much voltage, or pure defectives core but you would have seen errors way before or it not being oc able.

The only ones I seen die very slowly are AMD with Unlockable cores. 8xx Phenom series. and if its the locked cores u can jsut lock them back up and chug along at stock speeds.
Oh the joy of killing all them tri cores i had LMAO
 
GJSNeptune said:
Technically a "lesser" card, but still the same card.


No, it's really not. Analogies and similes are used incorrectly on message boards and forums. Save them for the classroom, okay?
Click to expand...

It is NOT the same card... it may happen to bear the same model number.. but the 216 has a different/better core.

Most of the GTX260 cards were differentiated by the shader count when both the 192 and 216 cards were still being sold at the same time.

The 216 is faster then the 192 all other factors being the same, and as such, the 192 IS a LESSER and DIFFERENT card.
 
This also happened to my 4 years old rig. The E6600 was rock stable at 3.2Ghz for almost 4 years and recently started crashing, so it's no longer stable on that OC. Had to lower it.
 
cyclone3d said:
It is NOT the same card... it may happen to bear the same model number.. but the 216 has a different/better core.

Most of the GTX260 cards were differentiated by the shader count when both the 192 and 216 cards were still being sold at the same time.

The 216 is faster then the 192 all other factors being the same, and as such, the 192 IS a LESSER and DIFFERENT card.
Click to expand...
Calm down. I know the differences. I can't bitch at EVGA for 24 additional shaders because they shipped me the same model #. Try looking at it from EVGA's perspective.

I am, however, bitching about these system crashes.
 
EVGA is making me go through all the troubleshooting procedures, but I can't imagine it not being the video card.

Yesterday
Booted into safe mode to use Driver Sweeper for NVIDIA Display drivers. Booted normally and installed the latest drivers from EVGA.com as instructed. Last night I got a System_Service_Exception BSOD.

Today:
Two passes of memtest. No errors. Memory is running at stock speeds. Just recovered from a Memory_Management BSOD.


Ran Orthos and got this calculation error. Doesn't that point to the CPU?

jacdw7.png
 
GJSNeptune said:
EVGA is making me go through all the troubleshooting procedures, but I can't imagine it not being the video card.

Yesterday
Booted into safe mode to use Driver Sweeper for NVIDIA Display drivers. Booted normally and installed the latest drivers from EVGA.com as instructed. Last night I got a System_Service_Exception BSOD.

Today:
Two passes of memtest. No errors. Memory is running at stock speeds. Just recovered from a Memory_Management BSOD.


Ran Orthos and got this calculation error. Doesn't that point to the CPU?

jacdw7.png
Click to expand...

A blend test failure is more likely to be ram than CPU. Run Prime95. Do Small FFT to isolate the CPU more and do stress testing with it until you hit an error. If so, it's more likely to be the CPU. If you do the blend test, it includes a lot more memory so if you get an error in a blend test and not a small fft test, it's the memory.

Now all your problems could just be a lack of voltage as well as a stress test failure can result from not having enough voltage on your memory controller. Bump up MCP/Northbridge/Southbridge, etc. voltage.
 
I was getting your exact errors (PFN list and System Service BSODs) when I reset my BIOS and dropped in a Q9550 from a E7300. Windows wouldn't boot, couldn't even use the installation disk to repair Windows. Turns out the Q9550 didn't like where the RAM was sitting (only have one stick because my main kit is being RMA'd) so I moved it to the opposite channel. Fixed my problem and now everything is running fine. I'd double check your RAM.
 
Aye, blend failure usually points to bad ram or possibly unstable north bridge. Could be CPU but very unlikely, especially since you've been running the e8400 at 3.6ghz, which can be considered mild overclock for that chip.

On a side note, I recommend using Prime95 instead of Orthos since it hasn't been updated in years.
 
About to run prime95.

Tomorrow while I'm reading for classes, I'll run memtest for maybe four or five passes.
 
Been running prime95 on Small FFT since about 1am, so almost three hours now. It's passed all tests through 40k, and so far no hiccups for the 48k.
 
If it's passing Small FFT but failing on blend, tells me the issue is memory or memory controller related.
 
keep in mind, it may not be system ram, as the video card ram shares address space with the system. if its passing memtest, it could still be the northbridge, but i would suspect the video card above and beyond that.
 
Which is why I was concerned about the overclock starting to corrupt data passing through the Northbridge.

Note that prime95 only ran for about three hours and fifteen minutes, and memtest only did a couple passes. Neither were long enough. Hopefully I can find a good chunk of time to let them both run for much longer.

EVGA wanted to know what my BIOS shows as my +12V reading, which is 12.152V (well within stable specs). They also wanted me to wipe drivers yet again in safe mode, scan for viruses, and reinstall display drivers. So I've done all that, and let them know. Wonder what they'll have me do next.
 
Yesterday was crash-free. It was fortunate because I worked on a Networking 1 assignment for about eleven hours straight.

I just recovered from two consecutive crashes. First was a DRIVER_IRQL_Not_Less_Or_Equal BSOD. I got back into Windows, fired up Firefox to report to EVGA, and after typing one sentence, I crashed again with a Bad_pool_header BSOD. Are these or can they be graphics related?
 
bad pool header is ram or HD related, or that is how it can appear if you happen to have bad signal data running across the northbridge, either you motherboard is failing (check for leaky caps) or your video card is indeed bad (despite how much you dont want to admit it) and it is just throwing a ton of dirty noisy power ridden bad data across the bus.

i have seen these symptoms with bad audigy cards in the past.. just such a dirty signal buss side.
 
It seems to me your chipset and ram are unstable. Pump up the voltage to the northbridge. My system wouldn't stabilize until I sent 1.3v to the memory controller.
 
So my Northbridge needs more voltage because of the refurbished video card EVGA sent me?
 
the easiest way to test this would be to simply borrow a card from a friend, or pick or a cheap card pop it in and just see if it goes away.. if it dose.. then you have your answer. if it continues, i would suspect your motherboard before i looked at the ram or cpu. you had a board fail in that mother board befor, it could have damaged something, just not to the point it dosent work. however, there are bits and pieces between the card and the other parts in the system. your northbridge being one of them..
 
I used the cheap GeForce 8400 I use in my file server during the RMA process of about two weeks. No crashes. And I didn't have stability issues with my original card either.

Nothing failed in the previous configuration. The fan was starting to go bad on my original GTX 260.
 
and they sent you a bunk card, its putting out a dirty signal that is manifesting its self as all sorts of errors... you just proved my point.. your 8400 didnt case crashes.. your old card.. didnt cause crashes.. this card is causing crashes.. they are manifesting as ram and IO errors. it either has bad ram, or is just plain dirty.. (nothing you can see, its a bad silicon issue) swap your file server card back in and send that 260 back now, before it dose some real damage.
 
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