Tim Cook to Investors: People Bought Fewer New iPhones Because They Repaired Their Old Ones

Krazy925

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It's crazy to think that anything in this world got done before the advent of "smart" phones, am I right?
LOL what’s funny is you having to use a much larger device for something simple. I guess you can’t teach old dogs new tricks.
 

GoodBoy

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Repairing the old device is only a contributing factor to lower sales on the new devices.

A bit scary if he is trying to make a case against the right to self repair... between Apple and Microsoft, there will be no unbought congressmen who can pass some common sense laws regarding the right to self repair... Oh wait, it's too late, all of congress is already owned by these corporations...
 

sirmonkey1985

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I bought my first "smart" phone about a year ago, slashed to $400 from $800, and I still feel like I paid too much. Still the only thing I use it for is calls and texts. What, exactly, do we need handheld computers for again? Supposedly the battery in this thing only lasts 18-25 hours and I can go nearly 2 weeks without charging it.
then as a consumer i'd say you're failing to do your research since there's a whole hell of a lot better options that fit your use case like the moto G series for example that can be had for 150-250 dollars and still last just as long as the big name phones if not longer and do everything you need a phone for plus most of what the over priced ones can do just a little slower in certain applications.
 

Aurelius

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Apple Maps is a poor replacement for Waze. Apple Music I used the trial and found it to be lacking in content (let’s chalk this up to musical preferences because Spotify has most major and minor punk releases). The radio stations were pretty poor but pandora IMO owns that space anyways. I don’t find the queue system to be an issue with Spotify.

I don’t wear an Apple Watch because I have several very expensive watches I wear. It definitely is the best. Love my AirPods. Love iChat. I like my iPad and it’s ability to sync with an Xbox one controller.

I actually like the email app since inbox closed. But the rest whether it be their news app, or a bunch of the others sucks. I also don’t like that they force Apple Music and Apple Maps down your throat when you click on an address or plug your phone into a stereo.
Oh, I'm not saying Apple Maps is the best, certainly not the best at everything; it doesn't do crowdsourced navigation like Waze does. And I know there are areas where you might prefer Spotify, Pandora or another music service. But the point is to call out the myth that Apple's included software is largely junk. It's often just dandy, and there are some areas where Apple pulls ahead.
 

scojer

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Are you suggesting that Android sales would tank if Google didn't abandon feature updates after two years?
No.

Because if Google didn't add new features, manufacturers and users will. Also, Android devices really do become obsolete after a couple of years anyways.
 

Dark12

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No point in making this an Android vs iPhone thread.

We all have our preferences. Personally I think Android is slow and clunky. And I'm already invested in the Apple ecosystem.

No point in trying to convince me otherwise. It's my personal preference.
 

sirmonkey1985

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No point in making this an Android vs iPhone thread.

We all have our preferences. Personally I think Android is slow and clunky. And I'm already invested in the Apple ecosystem.

No point in trying to convince me otherwise. It's my personal preference.
nothing wrong with that, go with what ever works for you personally. the whole apple vs android or X vs Y arguing is a waste of time and energy that could be better used doing something productive in my opinion.
 

mlcarson

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Apple has made the IPhone as expensive as a PC and the same thing that happened in the PC world is going to happen to phones. The growth of phone sales has been so high in the past because prices seemed relatively low compared to computer purchases and users actually saw more than just incremental hardware upgrades. Battery life, CPU power, and screen resolution were all getting noticeably better with each incremental hardware update and cellular data standards were changing along with Wifi standards. Phones have gotten good enough now so that upgraded models are simply seen as small incremental updates and not must have's. I predict that the Wifi 802.11ax and the cellular 5G standard changes will drive some updates but not until users see the standards adopted in their area. After that, what can Apple or any other company do to make a new phone a must have purchase? I think it's more likely they start becoming more of a commodity item which kills sales for a company like Apple since they don't compete on price. Even now, I can't see what phone users are going to do with the new cellular 5G standards or Wifi-6 -- cell phones just don't need those types of data rates. What cell phone app requires that?
 

Aurelius

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No.

Because if Google didn't add new features, manufacturers and users will. Also, Android devices really do become obsolete after a couple of years anyways.
Well, manufacturers don't. When OS updates stop after two years, that usually means the end of all feature updates that aren't tied to independently updated apps.

And when Android devices become obsolete after a couple of years, that strikes me as more of a compliment to Apple as anything. Yeah, some of it policies aren't conducive to long-term use, but getting major OS updates for four to five years? That's a damn sight better than what Google promises.
 

Lakados

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In the past few months I have been replacing a lot of the iPhone batteries, if they still get OS updates I am not paying to replace them yet, that and the overwhelming response from my admins who have the new 11's is they don't like them, they all miss the button and the gestures aren't intuitive.
 

1_rick

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That's actually why I "downgraded" to a Pixel 3a. $400 still isn't cheap
This is where it's worth looking at alternatives like buying last year's phone. I picked up an unlocked Galaxy S9 just a couple months ago on sale for $499, and you can get a carrier-locked version for a little less. We're at the point now where there's not that much difference between years in flagship models. And if you want to go a little bit afield you can do better. I got a Xiaomi Mi Mix 2S last year on sale for, I don't recall, $400 or $430 or so? It has basically the same specs as the S9 but was a couple hundred dollars cheaper, and it was fully unlocked--even usable on Sprint, subject to their usual goofiness with phones you didn't get from them.
 

zehoo

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Maybe they should start making routers again to add a small amount to their bottom line.
 

Krazy925

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6664AAF4-4082-43FB-B07B-DB28245009B1.png
Based on your next sentence, that includes the battery, right? Is that price for anyone or only for people who have Apple are?
Yup includes battery and service. No AppleCare required (I’ve actually never purchased that before lol). Picture attached below for proof.

Oh, I'm not saying Apple Maps is the best, certainly not the best at everything; it doesn't do crowdsourced navigation like Waze does. And I know there are areas where you might prefer Spotify, Pandora or another music service. But the point is to call out the myth that Apple's included software is largely junk. It's often just dandy, and there are some areas where Apple pulls ahead.
I agree 100%. I buy Apple for its great software. I just don’t always love that I can’t change my default. You could when I bought my first iPhone.
 

GhostCow

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I used to repair cell phones for a living. I feel bad for anyone who works on iPhones. I still have nightmares about those tiny screws that you need a jeweler's eyeglass for and getting them back together only to find the phone isn't getting a signal anymore.
 

cjcox

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Complete message now available, "People bought fewer new iPhones because they repaired their old ones; found it was impossible and moved on."
 

sfsuphysics

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Repaired their old phones? How does he know this? Maybe people are simply being a bit more careful with $1000 devices you shove in a pocket now? (nahhhhh)

That said, wonder if they're primarily showing the actual price of the device, or the 24 month cost? Because if you show that it's "Only $35/month" it doesn't sound too bad however if you say $839 that may make people back off a bit.
 

Darunion

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Wife and I jumped on the apple plan (where you pay and can upgrade yearly). Just crossed the two year marker, payments stop (never upgraded) and i have no desire to buy a new phone. Not going to eat that much of a price hit anymore, gonna just buy a few year old phone when these die.
 

GoldenTiger

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I've been eyeing the samsung a10 for $100, seems to do everything 99.9% of people actually need... maybe that's a hint as to why "people bought fewer new iphones"
Got my three Samsung a50 phones for 100 each after 250 visa card rebate. They seem better than my s6 had been and fulfill everything my family needs for a phone. I think you're right.
 

TordanGow

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Unless they are talking about replacing broken screens, I think this is complete BS. Even with broken screens, it is ludicrous to think a person should buy a brand new Iphone because the glass cracked.
You see the problem is that when a window breaks the person fixes it instead of just buying a new house. We need window DRM now!
 

TordanGow

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partially true. I have an iphone 6. I replaced the battery in it to keep it running. I would not buy any of the newer phones because 1) lack of headphone jack 2) camera quality increases have not been drastic enough for me to say I must have a new one 3) price... 1k is far too much for a phone; i don't care if they are breaking it out monthly.
Monthly payments are a suckers marketing ploy. They'll tell you yeah it's only 33 dollars a month for only 3 years! What they're really saying is it's just shy of $1200, but since the average American is weak in math skills they go along with it. If they just came out and told you the price you end up paying they'd sell a lot less of them.

The idea of buying an electronic item on a multi-year payment plan is absurd.. I liken it to getting a loan for a toaster. If you need a loan for a particilar toaster you should probably look at another toaster or pause to investigate your finances. The same applies to phones etc.
 

HAL_404

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"Apple has long fought efforts that would make iPhones easier to repair: It has lobbied against right to repair efforts in several states, doesn’t sell iPhone replacement parts, sued an independent repair professional in Norway, worked with Amazon to get iPhone and MacBook refurbishers kicked off Amazon Marketplace, and has deals with electronics recyclers that require them to shred iPhones and MacBooks ..."

and people say the devil isn't real ...

this is only the beginning. Just wait until you see what's coming down the road a piece ... it's a doozie :barefoot:
 

aokman

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If they want to move product, they need to make the old products obsolete. They need to stop updating the software of the old devices (aside from security patches) and, oh, I don't know, how about actually innovate something on their own for their next device, rather than copy from something Android did a few generations ago?
Yes because Android phoes had 2020 class leading camera’s now 3 years ago...
 

DukenukemX

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People aren't buying new iPhone because the Law of Thermal Dynamics says there's a limit to how much performance you can get out of something that small as well as limited power source. If Moore's Law is dead for desktop PC's then it was beating to a pulp on phones and tablets. People realize the benefits from buying a new phone are less, and Apple is pulling features like headphone jacks.
 

sleepeeg3

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If they want to move product, they need to make the old products obsolete. They need to stop updating the software of the old devices (aside from security patches) and, oh, I don't know, how about actually innovate something on their own for their next device, rather than copy from something Android did a few generations ago?
I've gone for 15 years with whatever phone has the best camera and, like it or not, the iPhone 11 brings a better camera/filtering software than everyone else. It also has a second wide-angle camera, like the LGs. ...and a zoom, if you have the Pro.

There may be phones with better lenses and sensors out there, but I've come to realize it is all about the image processing software on the phone that creates the best pictures.

Apple considers replacing a dead battery to be a "repair." The fuckers glue them into the case with industrial adhesive and then warn people that the battery might explode if you try to remove it. Then they added a "feature" to the phone that warns users with a service error if you replace the battery not using an Apple repair center. "Fake" batteries are dangerous!
To be fair now the other manufacturers to the same. ...even if they started that trend.
 

tunatime

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I don't know about y'all but I will never play anywhere near $1000 for a phone. There's no reason to. Also all my iPhone friends are sticking with older ones when most of them upgraded every 2 years or so...they all say the same price to high and one of them switched to a OnePlus 7t after I showed him how nice mine is.
 

Mazzspeed

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I'd still be using my Nexus 5 if the sat nav antenna didn't die along with the battery after a good five years of flat out use. Easily the best phone I ever owned at an outstanding price.
 

Staples

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Just like computers, smart phones have not innovated as much year over year. They are moving into new markets because they realize this.

I am sure flagship android sales are falling for the same reason.
 

sfsuphysics

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Just like computers, smart phones have not innovated as much year over year. They are moving into new markets because they realize this.
What?! But the new iPhone 11 pro has slow-mo selfies! I mean hell I've been overwhelmed with those commercials during football ... like seriously that's the audience that needs to do that shit?
 

Aurelius

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No Tim. People are buying fewer new iphones because you've raised the price to beyond what the market will willingly pay for in the quantity that is expected.
As I pointed out earlier, the letter is from a year ago. Apple priced the iPhone 11 $50 lower than the iPhone XR; sales jumped. But yet I still see plenty of people buying iPhone 11 Pro and Pro Max models as well. I don't know if Apple has hit a proper price equilibrium yet, but it clearly figured out a sweeter position. I'm expecting the 2020 iPhone line's sales to represent a big spike since it should be a significant redesign with new displays, 5G and other tech.
 

Algrim

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If rumors are correct my current phone (6s Plus) will not be supported by the next iOS major version number. I'm definitely thinking about getting the next SE release instead of the flagship phone. I love new tech and I like the flagship phone but I can't comprehend spending over 1000 USD for something that I primarily use as 2FA (for work), reading news/books, and email.
 

Ihaveworms

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I don't think its because people are repairing their phones. It is because phones are stupidly expensive now and people are not wanting to fork over $1000 every year for the latest and greatest.
 

Aurelius

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If rumors are correct my current phone (6s Plus) will not be supported by the next iOS major version number. I'm definitely thinking about getting the next SE release instead of the flagship phone. I love new tech and I like the flagship phone but I can't comprehend spending over 1000 USD for something that I primarily use as 2FA (for work), reading news/books, and email.
You don't have to spend $1K to get an iPhone with some cutting-edge features -- right now, you can spend $700 for that. Still not trivial, but much easier to swallow. With that said, if the iPhone SE equivalent has a current-gen CPU and at least 3GB of RAM, I wouldn't fault you at all for getting one.
 

SomeoneElse

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But, I'm not running a company, and, Android devices aren't updated nearly as long as iPhones, so, maybe Apple should copy another Android feature and just not update older devices.
This is not a true statement because it depends on the phone maker. Samsung, yeah they suck at keeping their old phones up to day. I have a Pixel 3XL and had a pixel XL before that and up until the day i dropped it and it broke (had the phone for 2 1/2 years) it was still getting security and OS updates regularly...... Its 100% on the phone manufacturer and not Android in general.
 
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