Tim Cook: "iOS Will Never Merge With OS X"

Megalith

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Cook suggested that they will never go the Windows 8/10 route this week, and my first thought was “won’t—or can’t?” At the very least, I think they should try to figure out how to get OS X on the iPad Pro.

"We don't believe in having one operating system for PC and mobile," said Cook. "We think it subtracts from both, and you don't get the best experience from either. We're very much focused on two."
 

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"We don't believe in having one operating system for PC and mobile," said Cook. "We think it subtracts from both, and you don't get the best experience from either. We're very much focused on two."

I don't agree with him often, but I do 100% here.
 

Ocellaris

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except he just COMPLETELY invalidated the entire future for the ipad pro

No they just ensured people will create apps for the iPad Pro that are designed to run on a touchscreen tablet. A lot of people don't want to run PC apps on a tablet, they want to run tablet apps on a tablet.
 

heatlesssun

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except he just COMPLETELY invalidated the entire future for the ipad pro

No they just ensured people will create apps for the iPad Pro that are designed to run on a touchscreen tablet. A lot of people don't want to run PC apps on a tablet, they want to run tablet apps on a tablet.

The iPad Pro is an $800 12.9" screen device designed to take a keyboard. I think it could be argued that many would want to run desktop apps on such a device. Cook is saying what he has to but clearly Apple is embracing hybrid hardware with the iPad Pro. Hybrid software will follow.
 

Ocellaris

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The iPad Pro is an $800 12.9" screen device designed to take a keyboard. I think it could be argued that many would want to run desktop apps on such a device. Cook is saying what he has to but clearly Apple is embracing hybrid hardware with the iPad Pro. Hybrid software will follow.

iPads have worked with Bluetooth keyboards since launch.
 

Ididar

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Apple won't merge OSX with iOS .... until they do. You can bet that if, a year from now, they get it in their head that merging the two will benefit then they'll do it. At that time they'll trot people out to declare that Apple had to wait until it could be done "correctly" to do it and that they weren't going to be rushed into doing it.

That's their basic tactic ... declare a concept stupid until they embrace it and then declare that they invented the concept.
 

SonDa5

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Focused on two because they have a loyal market that will buy both "different" devices...

While Apple can continue to make max profit goals they have no reason to change anything.

I'm sure they will change their tune some day when they begin to fail or the competition begins to beat them.
 

Trimlock

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Cook suggested that they will never go the Windows 8/10 route this week, and my first thought was “won’t—or can’t?” At the very least, I think they should try to figure out how to get OS X on the iPad Pro.

"We don't believe in having one operating system for PC and mobile," said Cook. "We think it subtracts from both, and you don't get the best experience from either. We're very much focused on two."

They are very separate and should stay separate as most of their money comes from iOS. They should never try to wreck their main source of income for novel ideas that may or may not work. It works for Microsoft because they were both late comers and their core business is in desktop applications.

No they just ensured people will create apps for the iPad Pro that are designed to run on a touchscreen tablet. A lot of people don't want to run PC apps on a tablet, they want to run tablet apps on a tablet.

lol wut :confused:

People want to run what they want to run on what ever device they buy. The Surface Pro is evident that people WANT to run desktop applications on the mobile.
 

jbltecnicspro

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And before that, even the first generation iPhone released in 2008 supported Bluetooth keyboards too.

You mean the iPhone 3G or do you mean the first gen iPhone? Not trying to be picky, but the first iPhone was released in 2007. So I just want to be sure I know what phone you're talking about. :) Thanks.
 

Yakk

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I agree, they don't have to merge.

Either Intel will make extreme low power CPUs which could bring OS X to iPads and phones, or ARM keeps upgrading up their chips to do enough for laptop and desktop use. Eventually Apple can have one OS across all devices, but no hurry right IMO.
 

mi7chy

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Cook is a dumbass. He's going against what his customers are desiring which is a real iPad Pro running OS X and not the iPad Prosumer running iOS designed for iPod which will die the fate as Surface RT.
 

Freebo

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And this guy is the head of Apple... wow...

How is it anything but a great idea to have one OS do it all. Its like when they said larger screens were dumb... now look at them, I had apple fans laughing and making fun of people with larger screens now they all have larger screens saying "OMG this is awesome".

The simple fact is right now they cant pull it off. So they copy MS and call their Ipad "pro" when there is nothing pro about it.
 

pxc

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You mean the iPhone 3G or do you mean the first gen iPhone? Not trying to be picky, but the first iPhone was released in 2007. So I just want to be sure I know what phone you're talking about. :) Thanks.
Typo. I meant 2007.
 

Vexorg

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At this point, it seems to me that the main reason the distinction between OSX and iOS still exists is because developing for iOS requires Macs, and Apple seems to have no interest in providing tools to develop iOS apps in iOS itself for exactly that reason. After all, why let people develop apps on their $400 tablets when they can make them buy $1000+ Macs to do it?
 

Trimlock

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At this point, it seems to me that the main reason the distinction between OSX and iOS still exists is because developing for iOS requires Macs, and Apple seems to have no interest in providing tools to develop iOS apps in iOS itself for exactly that reason. After all, why let people develop apps on their $400 tablets when they can make them buy $1000+ Macs to do it?

While you don't need a $1000 Mac to develop for iOS (I do it on one I paid $300 for) I do wish they would allow development on Windows.
 

kbrickley

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The hardware is not identical yet and there are distinct differences in running software designed for touch vs software designed for mouse and keyboard interface ... that said, never say never ... the PC form factor has slowed in development since it is mature ... I don't expect to see any more paradigm shifts in the PC like we have had in the past (other than the future transition to touch ... which is hopefully years away) ... the mobile form factors are still in flux with changes occurring every generation or every other generation that are designed to bring them closer to the PC form factor in terms of performance

At some point (years in the future) when the battery technology has improved more, as well as storage capabilities, then you will finally get a hybrid device that won't fry your nads but still can use powerful PC processors, have 8 GB of RAM for operations, have graphic acceleration equivalent to the laptop world and have storage in the 256 GB to 1 Terabyte range ... once we reach that point then the merger of the PC and mobile architecture is possible ... I just don't see it while one is ARM based and the other based on the Intel/AMD environment
 

Diseaseboy

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Have you guys tried Windows 10 on a tablet in "tablet mode?" If you have you may actually agree with what Cook said. I think he's got a valid point.
 

TechLarry

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When he's right, he's right. I HATE the phonization of windows.
 

Yakk

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While you don't need a $1000 Mac to develop for iOS (I do it on one I paid $300 for) I do wish they would allow development on Windows.

Agree 100%. I also just lately had to get an old Mac Mini to start development on iOS.
 

Snowdog

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Cook suggested that they will never go the Windows 8/10 route this week, and my first thought was “won’t—or can’t?” At the very least, I think they should try to figure out how to get OS X on the iPad Pro.

Nope. OSX doesn't belong on iPad Pro.

Really, iOS is OSX at its core. Except iOS UI is actually designed for Touch, it is the OS, that Apple should have on convertibles. OSX would suck on the iPad Pro, because it doesn't support touch, and also has no ARM software.

iPad Pro is clearly a sign of Apple intentions, iOS will keep adding capabilities and taking over more from OSX.

I could see a few years down the road where all Apple portable machines are iOS, and only desktops run OSX.
 

heatlesssun

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Have you guys tried Windows 10 on a tablet in "tablet mode?" If you have you may actually agree with what Cook said. I think he's got a valid point.

I do everyday. Sure, the tablet app count isn't there with Windows but functionally what's the difference between iOS, Android and Windows on tablets? Tap icon or tile, play game, read book, watch movie or surf web. Not a whole lot of difference.
 

heatlesssun

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I could see a few years down the road where all Apple portable machines are iOS, and only desktops run OSX.

That would imply that laptop OS X users don't have much need for desktop software. I don't think touch oriented tablet apps would be able to fill that need within only a few years.
 

Snowdog

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That would imply that laptop OS X users don't have much need for desktop software. I don't think touch oriented tablet apps would be able to fill that need within only a few years.

A few years was a mistake on my part. I was really thinking 6-7 years, and I do figure there would probably be a lone OSX laptop for holdouts, for quite some time after that.
 

heatlesssun

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iPads have worked with Bluetooth keyboards since launch.

But the Smart Keyboard for the iPad Pro isn't a Bluetooth keyboard. It uses a special connector that Logtiech is already using in making its 3rd part keyboard. Apple's own literature even makes note of the fact that this isn't a BT keyboard:

With new technologies that free you from switches, plugs, and even pairing, the Smart Keyboard is the perfect blend of full‑size utility and outstanding portability.

http://www.apple.com/smart-keyboard/
 

DPI

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8 wasn't good on Tablets?

This horse has been beaten to death. It was irrelevant since the amount of windows tablet users could be counted on one hand, relative to the installed base of desktop users. And the metro apps sucked (and still do in 10).
 

heatlesssun

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This horse has been beaten to death. It was irrelevant since the amount of windows tablet users could be counted on one hand, relative to the installed base of desktop users. And the metro apps sucked (and still do in 10).

The story for convertibles and 2 in 1s is a bit different. Sure they are small part of the market, but they are experiencing very good growth and many of the devices command price premiums well above the average selling price of a cheap PC. The faltering tablet market and the growth of Windows convertibles is the primary business motivation behind the iPad Pro.

And there are a number of good Windows Store apps particularly for things like social media. I use Hyper or TubeCast for YouTube and rarely the web site as those are much better video players than the YouTube site.
 

Michaelius

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Actually OS X would work quite nicely on tablet imho.

lpad1.png


and the trackpad gestures are set on default to use alternative methods to distinguish right click.
 

heatlesssun

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Actually OS X would work quite nicely on tablet imho.

The problem would be how well OS X apps worked with only touch. One of the purposes of modern Windows apps was to provide an ecosystem for a new generation of touch aware apps that would have never happened with only desktop apps. Apple obviously has that touch app ecosystem that it could bring over to OS X but melding the two isn't the easiest thing to do. But Microsoft did make good strides with Windows 10 in this area.

Still not perfect, many 8.x tablet users see Windows 10 as a step back, many desktop users still don't like "apps" on their desktop. It's not elegant, the desktop isn't as separated from tablet mode in Windows 10, nothing prevents a user from running any desktop app they want in tablet mode or with touch and most desktop apps just aren't well suited for that.

It's the flexibility of it all that makes it cool IMHO. But it does require the user to know what works well where and what doesn't.
 

nb14

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I personal don't belive they merging them will benefit either. iOS will constantly add little feature designed for on the go devices. OSX will concentrate on work features.
 

heatlesssun

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iOS will constantly add little feature designed for on the go devices. OSX will concentrate on work features.

They aren't necessarily mutually exclusive or even separate things. iOS 9 added split screen multitasking with is certainly a work feature.
 

bman212121

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Actually OS X would work quite nicely on tablet imho.

and the trackpad gestures are set on default to use alternative methods to distinguish right click.

It might if they could figure out how to make their OS work with touchscreens... Unless you do onscreen for gestures then you would have the requirement of a trackpad, which at that point it's basically a laptop if you cannot detach it.


My take is there would be no reason to merge the two operating systems if they plan on dumping OSX in the next 5 years. (Which I think could happen) Apple would likely be happier to simply keep everything in house and do it themselves. If an Ipad Pro is successful enough, it's not really a huge proposition to make the cover into a solid piece of aluminum that doesn't detach from the screen, aka a MacBook Air. If they decide they even need a laptop around still since a tablet is basically a laptop without the base. In the past apple offered stop gap solutions to transition users from one system to another, but it's also not unlike apple to have a clean break where you have to jump ship to continue using their products. We'll just have to wait and see what actually ends up happening.
 

bman212121

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I personal don't belive they merging them will benefit either. iOS will constantly add little feature designed for on the go devices. OSX will concentrate on work features.

Probably should have quoted this so I didn't make two posts in a row, but I'd argue that isn't the case at all. What are two of the biggest productivity apps that you might use on OSX? Office and Creative Cloud. What two vendors came on stage when they announced the iPad Pro, Microsoft and Adobe. They also spent a considerable amount of time talking about how the iPad Pro fits perfectly in the medical field, and can be used for all kind of functions. Make no mistake about it, it was designed to be used for work purposes. Whether that means replacing your existing device or supplementing it remains to be seen.
 

DPI

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Actually OS X would work quite nicely on tablet imho.

..until you actually try to work a program with your finger. Can't imagine poking at dense clusters of function buttons in a program like Photoshop or Final Cut Pro with a finger.

It's not like Apple hasn't spent tens or maybe even hundreds of thousands of hours testing a more touch focused OSX. The ergonomics just aren't there. Jobs said it himself in describing all the testing and focus groups they did that all hated vertically oriented touchscreens when trying to get any meaningful work done that requires a lot of user input (creation oriented tasks).
 

DPI

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Probably should have quoted this so I didn't make two posts in a row, but I'd argue that isn't the case at all. What are two of the biggest productivity apps that you might use on OSX? Office and Creative Cloud. What two vendors came on stage when they announced the iPad Pro, Microsoft and Adobe. They also spent a considerable amount of time talking about how the iPad Pro fits perfectly in the medical field, and can be used for all kind of functions. Make no mistake about it, it was designed to be used for work purposes. Whether that means replacing your existing device or supplementing it remains to be seen.

Read-oriented work tasks perhaps. A doctor poking at a screen to bring up a chart is a little different than an accountant losing his or her mind poking at cells in Excel and trying to input numbers for 8 hours a day.
 
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