Thoughts on Denon avr-590 DAC?

leetpyro

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I found a Denon avr-590 for $120 on craigslist (apparently new from an overstocked warehouse), and I was just wondering how the DAC on it is?

I just want to use it for my simple computer setup (Energy C-100s + Klipsch Sub-10), and I know its more than powerful enough to run the Energies, but since I'm still running off on-board sound, I was hoping it would provide a nice upgrade in sound quality.

So just wondering if anyone can comment on the quality of DAC, and of course, if its worth $120? (seems like a decent price to me)
 

Eugenester

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The AVR-590 uses a 24/192 DAC, which is the highest as far as consumer DACs go and is better than most of the 24/192 soundcards on the market. If you're not planning on using 3D anytime soon, then it's a great deal (AVR-591 is currently ~$250). Go for it!
 

Sycraft

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Denon uses good components in their stuff. Being one of their lower end units the components aren't top notch but they are plenty good. The 590 in particular uses an Analog Devices ADAU1328
 

Rossi~

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You can never really go wrong with anything Denon, and at $120 i say buy it now.
 

leetpyro

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Cool, sounds good! Hope the seller responds soon :p

Thanks guys

Edit: Damn it I'm always missing out on these good deals! :mad: It's already been sold -__-
 
Last edited:

Spooony

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All specs ^^^^^^^^^^^

The highest a Dac ever managed to reach was 24/96. THD, SNR and Dynamic Range. Thats trhe important factors
 

Gnasher

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Audyssey MultEQ = the shit

=) enjoy it bah too late nvm =p

I have Denon 789 and hate Audyssey because it adds too much bass. I found I get better SQ using my own ears and settings instead of some computer chip and mic. I have had two receivers with Audyssey now and in the future that will not even matter when I buy a receiver because I have no intention of using it.
 

Sycraft

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I love MultEQ XT. In my opinion, 100% worth the price of admission.
 

Vexerz

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I have Denon 789 and hate Audyssey because it adds too much bass. I found I get better SQ using my own ears and settings instead of some computer chip and mic. I have had two receivers with Audyssey now and in the future that will not even matter when I buy a receiver because I have no intention of using it.

You can still adjust the bass and keep the rest of the calibrated Audyssey settings. Anyways that's the first complaint I heard of, willing to bet you didn't calibrate it right.
Here is the best writeup on it, you can pretty much throw away the manual since its garbage. http://batpigworld.com/audyssey.html


Agree on MultEQ its awesome.
 

Sycraft

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Too much bass with Audyessy can for sure be a result of mis-calibration. There are also two other things that can cause it:

1) Dynamic EQ. That's another Audyssey product that many receivers have along with MultEQ. Basically what it does is to deal with the fact that we are less sensitive to bass than treble. You can see that with an equal loudness contour graph. So when you play a movie below reference volume, you also screw up the treble/bass balance because of this. Dynamic EQ helps to fix that. However it tends to make bass way too overbearing on music/games (because it is calibrated for movies), and also can be undesirable for movies as sometimes part of the reason you turn the volume down is to back off on the bass. The solution there is to shut Dynamic EQ down. It is a separate feature from MultEQ. I don't use it on my system since I use it for games and music.

2) Lack of realization of what the bass level is supposed to be. Frequently when people complain Audyessy has given them "too much" or "too little" bass the reason is that they had their system wrong in the first place. It is easy to do, particularly since the eigenmodes of a room can really screw with bass. You get used to listening to things one way and feel the change is "wrong".


Now if you mess with it and just flat out don't like the result no matter what, then by all means, do things your own way. When you are listening for pleasure, your enjoyment is all that matters. As Ellington said: "If it sounds good it IS good!" However, I think it is worth messing with and trying to get right because I find it does such a superb job.
 

spaceman

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Outstanding info given on this thread. I can't say enough for how important it is to follow the setup instructions for audyssey.

Turning off the dynamic eq is a MUST for games and music. Hell overall. It caused my sub to nearly blow my room apart when I had it enabled lol. Literally causing a breeze from all the air it was pushing.
 

SirMaster

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I've got an AVR-1910 myself with MultiEQ and It works great for any content for me. Movies especially, but it all works fine for games and music too. I usually have Dynamic EQ and volume on (day mode) as well.

And yeah, the 590 isn't overstocked. It's just past EOL.

590 = 1610 and is a 2009 model
591 = 1611 and is a 2010 model
1612 = 2011 model and they seemed to have dropped the 3-digit versions (no 592).
 

Eugenester

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All specs ^^^^^^^^^^^

The highest a Dac ever managed to reach was 24/96. THD, SNR and Dynamic Range. Thats trhe important factors

Lolwut? 24/192 DACs are commonplace in pretty much all soundcards, even the ALC892. Highest I've seen was 32/216.
 

Gnasher

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You can still adjust the bass and keep the rest of the calibrated Audyssey settings. Anyways that's the first complaint I heard of, willing to bet you didn't calibrate it right.
Here is the best writeup on it, you can pretty much throw away the manual since its garbage. http://batpigworld.com/audyssey.html


Agree on MultEQ its awesome.

I did it right, numerous times too. It made the high end too bright too IMO. Audiophile purists play their speakers flat and do not use EQ. Audyssey EQs each speaker individually and the only time I prefer it is with older music that lacks dynamics. I guess it depends on your speakers and room acoustics but my Totem speakers do not need adjusting to sound good.
 

Gnasher

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1) Dynamic EQ. That's another Audyssey product that many receivers have along with MultEQ. Basically what it does is to deal with the fact that we are less sensitive to bass than treble. You can see that with an equal loudness contour graph. So when you play a movie below reference volume, you also screw up the treble/bass balance because of this. Dynamic EQ helps to fix that. However it tends to make bass way too overbearing on music/games (because it is calibrated for movies), and also can be undesirable for movies as sometimes part of the reason you turn the volume down is to back off on the bass. The solution there is to shut Dynamic EQ down.

Yea, I played around with that and the various other modes too but in the end I prefer to set it all up manually and trust my own ears. I live in an apartment and it was just too overpowering and I don't want to get evicted. Audyssey sets your speakers to sound like a movie house which is just all wrong for a much smaller room in an apartment, it is wrong for music too but it is easy enough to switch to Pure Direct so that is no big deal but I prefer to use my own customized settings using Stereo mode and if you use Audyssey it affects Stereo mode too.
 

Gnasher

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Outstanding info given on this thread. I can't say enough for how important it is to follow the setup instructions for audyssey.

Turning off the dynamic eq is a MUST for games and music. Hell overall. It caused my sub to nearly blow my room apart when I had it enabled lol. Literally causing a breeze from all the air it was pushing.

Well, perhaps I will give it one more chance but when I look at the EQ curves I can see it increases the high end too, especially on the center and surround speakers. I don't care for bright high end either. I like tonally smooth speakers and mostly played at near flat or flat EQ.

If you like Audyssey that is great, I'm just saying it is no longer a selling feature for me.
 

Vexerz

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I did it right, numerous times too. It made the high end too bright too IMO. Audiophile purists play their speakers flat and do not use EQ. Audyssey EQs each speaker individually and the only time I prefer it is with older music that lacks dynamics. I guess it depends on your speakers and room acoustics but my Totem speakers do not need adjusting to sound good.

Contradiction noted....what was the whole point of complaining of audyssey in this thread?:D To brag about Totems I assume. Speaking of which don't you think they deserve a bit of an upgrade over the 789?
 

Gnasher

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You are wrong on all counts, including needing to upgrade the 789. Someone said Audyssey is the shit and I disagreed, it's as simple as that.
 

Deathwish238

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Nothing wrong with using an EQ if you a way to take measurements. Rooms effect your speakers/sound different. Optimally however, no EQ is needed as it usually lower sq. Audyssey can help some people's sound, but it will hurt other's as well.

I found a Denon avr-590 for $120 on craigslist (apparently new from an overstocked warehouse), and I was just wondering how the DAC on it is?

I just want to use it for my simple computer setup (Energy C-100s + Klipsch Sub-10), and I know its more than powerful enough to run the Energies, but since I'm still running off on-board sound, I was hoping it would provide a nice upgrade in sound quality.

So just wondering if anyone can comment on the quality of DAC, and of course, if its worth $120? (seems like a decent price to me)

Good price. The AVR-590 has full Blu-ray support. Only downside is it doesn't have digital upconversion...but for $120, it's a steal.
 

spaceman

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For surround, I use Audyssey. It takes a bit of tweaking but is still easier than doing it manually.

For stereo, I go with my ears and separate components.

I wonder if that receiver is hot though. I would be careful. I would be happier if it was used.
 

Sycraft

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Yea, I played around with that and the various other modes too but in the end I prefer to set it all up manually and trust my own ears. I live in an apartment and it was just too overpowering and I don't want to get evicted. Audyssey sets your speakers to sound like a movie house which is just all wrong for a much smaller room in an apartment, it is wrong for music too but it is easy enough to switch to Pure Direct so that is no big deal but I prefer to use my own customized settings using Stereo mode and if you use Audyssey it affects Stereo mode too.

It EQs them to be as flat as possible (in Audyssey Flat mode) or with a slight high frequency rolloff (in Audyssey mode). As I said, fine if you aren't in to that, but understand what it is.

Any speaker problems aside (and speakers do have problems) rooms mess with sound in a very big way. Low frequencies in particularly due to eigenmodes but high frequencies as well due to reflections. If you are interested you can get something like TrueRTA (pay) for RoomEQ wizard (free) along with a cheap measurement microphone and measure the actual response at your seat. You are likely to be surprised how non-linear it is. Variations of +-10-15dB (20-30dB peak to peak) are not uncommon in normal, untreated rooms.

Now as I always say, when you are listening for pleasure the only thing that is important is a sound you like. You tailor things in whatever way makes you happy. However I do like people to understand what is actually going on and not to confuse what you prefer with accuracy.

I far too many audiophile types who hate on EQ as though it "damages" sound and assume that because they paid a lot for their speakers, that means everything is perfect. That just means they need to learn more about acoustics.

So do whatever makes you happy sound wise because it is all about your enjoyment. :)
 

Gnasher

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Nothing wrong with using an EQ if you a way to take measurements. Rooms effect your speakers/sound different. Optimally however, no EQ is needed as it usually lower sq. Audyssey can help some people's sound, but it will hurt other's as well.

Yes, and I do use EQ on my headphones but that is to my setting and not a computer chip's setting. As you pointed out, and I agree, EQ can degrade SQ and that is what I feel Audyssey does to my main stereo setup.
 

Gnasher

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I far too many audiophile types who hate on EQ as though it "damages" sound and assume that because they paid a lot for their speakers, that means everything is perfect. That just means they need to learn more about acoustics.

So do whatever makes you happy sound wise because it is all about your enjoyment. :)

I understand room acoustics enough to know it is a more important factor than upgrading the amp section. I do use some room treatments but my setup is not optimal due to space restrictions. Totem speakers are designed by ear to have a certain sound signature and using Audyssey alters that sound signature to a point that I find it a negative and not a positive. But, I just removed the second sub so will go through the process again and follow that guide that was posted and see how it turns out this time. I wanted to download the file that has a diagram of correct mic placement during the calibration but it wants me to login when trying to download so I can't download it.
 

Sycraft

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Totem speakers are designed by ear to have a certain sound signature and using Audyssey alters that sound signature

That is what it does. Its goal is to destroy any sound signature, to have the system be a perfect reproduction of the audio it is being fed. Now of course it can't attain perfection, but that is what it tries to generate a filter to do. All well calibrated systems should sound fairly similar in that they should have no signature of their own.

So if your speakers colour the sound, and you like that, then you don't want any kind of room correction because they'll all do their best to eliminate it.
 

Team Obi Juan

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Dude...I bought my AVR-591 for $250 two months ago from Vanns. Nice try.

Dude.


That is its price. I own one.

[ame="http://www.amazon.com/Denon-AVR-591-Channel-Theater-Receiver/dp/B003H04Q8C"]Amazon.com: Denon AVR-591 5.1 Channel Home Theater Receiver with HDMI 1.4a (Black): Electronics@@AMEPARAM@@http://ecx.images-amazon.com/images/I/41lm8PDX9aL.@@AMEPARAM@@41lm8PDX9aL[/ame]

It was at its MSRP last year, when I bought mine, @ $350. It has been between $250 and $275 for several months now.
 

spaceman

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Obi, pretty certain he had a failure to comprehend in regards to your post.

I agree, no way a new model of this would sell so cheap. Used by a private seller maybe. Anyway, what happened to the OP? lol

We appear to have taken over his post.
 

Eugenester

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Obi, pretty certain he had a failure to comprehend in regards to your post.

I agree, no way a new model of this would sell so cheap. Used by a private seller maybe. Anyway, what happened to the OP? lol

We appear to have taken over his post.

Check again. The OP is looking at the AVR-590, which is a '09 model.
 

Team Obi Juan

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Exactly, you said that the AVR-590 was going for 65%, insinuating that it was stolen. It's two years old. Your price link was fail.

2 years old or not, it's being sold for $340 new. [ame="http://www.amazon.com/Denon-AVR590-5-1-Channel-Receiver-Connectivity/dp/B002AKKFQM"]Amazon.com: Denon AVR590 5.1-Channel Home Theater Receiver with 1080p HDMI Connectivity: Electronics@@AMEPARAM@@http://ecx.images-amazon.com/images/I/41f8DM42h2L.@@AMEPARAM@@41f8DM42h2L[/ame]

A new 591 at $120 or even $150 would make me raise an eyebrow. I hope it's legit and I'm not accusing the OP of anything. But it sure would suck to buy stolen goods by biting on a too good to be true Craigslist deal.
 

JohnleMVP

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2 years old or not, it's being sold for $340 new. Amazon.com: Denon AVR590 5.1-Channel Home Theater Receiver with 1080p HDMI Connectivity: Electronics

A new 591 at $120 or even $150 would make me raise an eyebrow. I hope it's legit and I'm not accusing the OP of anything. But it sure would suck to buy stolen goods by biting on a too good to be true Craigslist deal.

So what if someone is trying to sell them for $340 new on Amazon?

Someone is also trying to sell a Thinkpad T500 for retail price.
[ame="http://www.amazon.com/Lenovo-ThinkPad-T500-2056-fingerprint/dp/B001KAJ57S/ref=sr_1_3?ie=UTF8&qid=1308953936&sr=8-3"]Amazon.com: Lenovo ThinkPad T500 2056 - Core 2 Duo T9400 / 2.53 GHz - Centrino 2 with vPro - RAM 2 GB - HDD 160 GB - DVD?RW (?R DL) / DVD-RAM - Mobility Radeon HD 3650 / GMA 4500MHD - cellular wireless ready - Gigabit Ethernet - WLAN : 802.11 a/b/g/n (draft), Bluetooth 2.0 - TPM - fingerprint reader - Vista Business - 15.4" Widescreen TFT 1680 x 1050 ( WSXGA+ ) - GMP - Microsoft Office Ready: Computer & Accessories@@AMEPARAM@@http://ecx.images-amazon.com/images/I/41aMGzxBQwL.@@AMEPARAM@@41aMGzxBQwL[/ame]

Same laptop has been sold new for $300-400 else where.
 
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