The Router Recommendations Thread (Consumer)

netbrad said:
The cost is the same for me since I work for the company providing the service. We were getting close to our limit every month so I thought why not. I also needed a wi-fi upgrade anyway.
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Im guessing at&t, same here 😂

Time to make the jump to sfp equipment. Mikrotik makes affordable 10gb stuff. For the uplink between the RG and your router i recommend the

MikroTik S+RJ10​


It can negotiate 1gbe/2.5gbe/5gbe/10gbe reliably

Then some ubiquiti wifi 6/wifi 6e APs
 
att offers the 5Gb service to me too now, and while there's no way I'm getting it, finding a used enterprise router that can do 10Gb is pretty cheap and easy like this watchguard M440 for <$150 shipped:
https://www.ebay.com/itm/2660987406...Bdnz9mvw=|tkp:Bk9SR7r777e9YQ&autorefresh=true

Plus, most enterprise will support multi-wan out of the box so you can have a second wan like comcast as a backup and it will load balance and failover automatically. Once you've felt that speed and reliability, you can't go back to consumer anything anymore.
 
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SamirD said:
att offers the 5Gb service to me too now, and while there's no way I'm getting it, finding a used enterprise router that can do 10Gb is pretty cheap and easy like this watchguard M440 for <$150 shipped:
https://www.ebay.com/itm/266098740622?hash=item3df4b88d8e:g:YWsAAOSwcvtjzwws&amdata=enc:AQAHAAAAoDBqXz8ypc/VQarFNMVIPqNXIfCzXSDPdnCBRKs0EdWBUPfSyIqf6lgh3lMbDhhQcGJ0WpIiz8P1rRCRfgCr6TFdDRrt4QEyeLN/dTMiBaToqoJtFhV8LED2DbBAHr+a34XPTbVoQ0KCUh+YluCAJ/aoM/H91VrynFq0lbj8BY03ZuIAgZkamRyH/KQYBAi5O4kR8I0NGpDR0NzBdnz9mvw=|tkp:Bk9SR7r777e9YQ&autorefresh=true

Plus, most enterprise will support multi-wan out of the box so you can have a second wan like comcast as a backup and it will load balance and failover automatically. Once you've felt that speed and reliability, you can't go back to consumer anything anymore.
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That's a good deal. Do they still get updates as well for security patches, etc?
 
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That box can only do 6.7gbps in full passive mode. You start using intrusion prevention and your basically cutting your bandwidth in half. I guess to some that might not matter but i prefer to have an appliance that can do IPS at carrier line speed.

There is also reason those are so cheap. They have the Intel Atom C2000 series chips that have a extremely high failure rate after 3 years. All appliances and switches that have them are being offloaded super cheap. Watchguard has other models that dont have these chips and i would advise checking those out instead.

https://www.servethehome.com/intel-atom-c2000-avr54-bug-strikes-sth/
https://www.servethehome.com/intel-atom-c2000-series-bug-quiet/
 
German Muscle said:
That box can only do 6.7gbps in full passive mode. You start using intrusion prevention and your basically cutting your bandwidth in half. I guess to some that might not matter but i prefer to have an appliance that can do IPS at carrier line speed.

There is also reason those are so cheap. They have the Intel Atom C2000 series chips that have a extremely high failure rate after 3 years. All appliances and switches that have them are being offloaded super cheap. Watchguard has other models that dont have these chips and i would advise checking those out instead.

https://www.servethehome.com/intel-atom-c2000-avr54-bug-strikes-sth/
https://www.servethehome.com/intel-atom-c2000-series-bug-quiet/
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Yep, I just saw that so even with a 10Gb connection, still limited. :( Interesting to know about the C2000--is this the one that a resistor fixed?
 
NIZMOZ said:
That's a good deal. Do they still get updates as well for security patches, etc?
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Nothing unless you have a warranty from what I recall. I know they publicly released some for some really bad stuff that was hitting their boxes, but aside from that once it's outside of warranty, it's got support like any consumer router except they take their security seriously. :D
 
What's the latest thin client or off lease system people are using to build pfsense boxes nowadays? I converted one of those T-Mobile hot spots to an RT-AC68U but want to upgrade the router and use this as an ap until I can get something better for the wireless. I am trying to do it cheaply but I will spend more if it's significantly better. I don't see the wan ever going beyond 200Mbps and internal network is just 1Gbps so nothing super powerful required but would like some overhead.
 
LTZ said:
What's the latest thin client or off lease system people are using to build pfsense boxes nowadays? I converted one of those T-Mobile hot spots to an RT-AC68U but want to upgrade the router and use this as an ap until I can get something better for the wireless. I am trying to do it cheaply but I will spend more if it's significantly better. I don't see the wan ever going beyond 200Mbps and internal network is just 1Gbps so nothing super powerful required but would like some overhead.
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search ali express for "fanless mini pc firewall"
 
Ehren8879 said:
search ali express for "fanless mini pc firewall"
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Yes will do. I have heard of some of these models but one advantage I was hoping for with the off lease type systems is being able to buy a cheap replacement on ebay but I will check ali out again. I worry about reliability as this is going to be for the parents but getting sick of the consumer stuff.
 
LTZ said:
What's the latest thin client or off lease system people are using to build pfsense boxes nowadays? I converted one of those T-Mobile hot spots to an RT-AC68U but want to upgrade the router and use this as an ap until I can get something better for the wireless. I am trying to do it cheaply but I will spend more if it's significantly better. I don't see the wan ever going beyond 200Mbps and internal network is just 1Gbps so nothing super powerful required but would like some overhead.
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There are a few ways with Dell Optiplex.
-Get a micro tower with two m.2 slots and put a m.2 nic in one slot and run the cable and RJ45 to the back of the case and punch out the hole for it and then drop a drive in the other m.2. If you can get a single m.2 and do the same except use SATA drive or you can add in the secondary NIC accessory that dell has.
-Get a optiplex sff in which you have pcie slots and add in your preferred nics.

Optiplex x050 is 7th gen Intel, x060 is 8th gen Intel, x070 is 9th gen Intel, x080 is 10th gen Intel, x090 is 11th gen Intel, x000 is 12th gen Intel
 
LTZ said:
What's the latest thin client or off lease system people are using to build pfsense boxes nowadays? I converted one of those T-Mobile hot spots to an RT-AC68U but want to upgrade the router and use this as an ap until I can get something better for the wireless. I noam trying to do it cheaply but I will spend more if it's significantly better. I don't see the wan ever going beyond 200Mbps and internal network is just 1Gbps so nothing super powerful required but would like some overhead.
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Latest things?

Nexcom https://www.ebay.com/itm/2041995035...90kw-2stnw&var=&widget_ver=artemis&media=COPY

Or a qualys if you want rack mount

https://www.ebay.com/itm/1554556098...90kw-2stnw&var=&widget_ver=artemis&media=COPY
 
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Hello network gurus, so at home we have a Shaw Blue curve modem which also acts as a wifi router. Part number is CGM4141 which I believe is a Technicolor CGM4141. Keep in mind I don't typically do much networking stuff so bear with me. I have a steam link (little hardware guy) plugged directly into the CGM4141 and it's network connection seems flimsy I get network symbol flashing at times. I get some image lag fuzziness and I have all the network features turned down.

My gaming PC (HOST) which is broadcasting to the steam link it is on wifi, I have a wifi 6 AX200 wireless card but this router I believe is only wifi 5. Shaw sucks and limits a lot of features and now we have to use an app to make changes so I'm not even sure if bridging will work. Do you guys think using a wifi 6 router will work better? The crazy thing is our internet is fast when I test it, gaming is fine on the internet playing 2042 at my PC, but utilizing the steam link is weak. We used it a couple years ago with our old modem before it died and I'm pretty sure we even only used wifi and it seemed better than plugging it into the lan port now.

Does anyone know what the CGM4141 would be equivalent to in terms of AX speeds when comparing it to routers? I'm having trouble figuring this out. Also what is a good wifi 6 router that isn't too expensive and isn't full of headaches. 1 USB port on it would be great as well. Is wifi 6E worth it? Is a tri-band 5Ghz better than dual band wifi6? Thank you!
 
SpongeBob said:
Hello network gurus, so at home we have a Shaw Blue curve modem which also acts as a wifi router. Part number is CGM4141 which I believe is a Technicolor CGM4141. Keep in mind I don't typically do much networking stuff so bear with me. I have a steam link (little hardware guy) plugged directly into the CGM4141 and it's network connection seems flimsy I get network symbol flashing at times. I get some image lag fuzziness and I have all the network features turned down.

My gaming PC (HOST) which is broadcasting to the steam link it is on wifi, I have a wifi 6 AX200 wireless card but this router I believe is only wifi 5. Shaw sucks and limits a lot of features and now we have to use an app to make changes so I'm not even sure if bridging will work. Do you guys think using a wifi 6 router will work better? The crazy thing is our internet is fast when I test it, gaming is fine on the internet playing 2042 at my PC, but utilizing the steam link is weak. We used it a couple years ago with our old modem before it died and I'm pretty sure we even only used wifi and it seemed better than plugging it into the lan port now.

Does anyone know what the CGM4141 would be equivalent to in terms of AX speeds when comparing it to routers? I'm having trouble figuring this out. Also what is a good wifi 6 router that isn't too expensive and isn't full of headaches. 1 USB port on it would be great as well. Is wifi 6E worth it? Is a tri-band 5Ghz better than dual band wifi6? Thank you!
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I have an AX200 wifi card in my desktop* and a Wifi 6e router (Asus GT-AXE16000) and the wifi card is absolutely miserable at anything wifi 6. I would not upgrade if you think Wifi 6, at the moment, is going to be your savior. Wifi 6 is better on our phones but the distance is super limited, so we tend to fall back to Wifi 5 anyway, which has more than usable speeds.

I do think a better router would help you out, but you don't need to go all in on an expensive WiFi 6e one like I did.
*The desktop, and most of our houses desktops and TV devices, are hardwired if they can be.
 
TheSlySyl said:
I have an AX200 wifi card in my desktop* and a Wifi 6e router (Asus GT-AXE16000) and the wifi card is absolutely miserable at anything wifi 6. I would not upgrade if you think Wifi 6, at the moment, is going to be your savior. Wifi 6 is better on our phones but the distance is super limited, so we tend to fall back to Wifi 5 anyway, which has more than usable speeds.

I do think a better router would help you out, but you don't need to go all in on an expensive WiFi 6e one like I did.
*The desktop, and most of our houses desktops and TV devices, are hardwired if they can be.
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Good to know. From doing a lot of research and hating buying routers cause things are always changing I've been looking at Amazon warehouse deals. Do you think I'd honestly see much difference with a AX1800 vs. a AX3000 with a 500 Mbps download speed service?
 
You won't see much difference if everything else is perfect and your area isn't congested with a bunch of other signals. The router hardware might dramatically change stability and range though.

My AC-5300 wasn't keeping up with my network because the chipset was too slow, despite everything being rated as "enough".
 
Need a simple reliable (and cheap) router to get comcast gigabit speeds.

I currently have a Netgear Nighthawk R740 AC2600 home router.

I know, not the best router (never really been a netgear fan myself) but I got it as a refurb stupid cheap a year or 2 ago for something like $20 or $30.

It works perfectly. No drops. The problem is I dont get near full gigabit speeds thu its LAN ports. (maybe 66% at best) I know this because I do get near perfect gigabit speeds when plugged directly into the comcast gateway LAN. The spec sheets claim that its (the R740) WAN port is gigabit, but yeah its thuput just doesnt seem to be up to snuff, or is bottlenecking somewhere or something. I have not upgraded its firmware because a) I am of the crowd of "dont update if it aint broke" and b) heard many horror stories of upgrading firmwares on netgear devices.

Can anyone recommend a bread-and-butter router to get excellent gigabit performance and is reliable? I could care less about fancy features, security, controls, meshing etc. Including devices, echos and smart home stuff I have maybe - 15-20 devices connected? I have most the IoT stuff direct on the comcast 2.4 as they have no real need to be on my network and Im assuming it clears some stuff up.

Oh yeah.. and Im cheap lol. (~$50 for a used/refurb maybe?)

Thanks!
 
Since you don't care about security just plug your computer into the Comcast and call it a day. Add a dumb switch if you need ports. /s

Fwiw it's likely less because it is monitoring and securing the connection. Takes off headroom to protect your connection. If you want full 1gps that is secure the router has to be able to do higher than that in very general and broad terms.

And for the record full 1gpbs for less than $50, nope not a thing to recommend other than to get slower internet speeds, since you are cheap.
 
kydsid said:
Since you don't care about security just plug your computer into the Comcast and call it a day. Add a dumb switch if you need ports. /s

Fwiw it's likely less because it is monitoring and securing the connection. Takes off headroom to protect your connection. If you want full 1gps that is secure the router has to be able to do higher than that in very general and broad terms.

And for the record full 1gpbs for less than $50, nope not a thing to recommend other than to get slower internet speeds, since you are cheap.
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I guess Im not really * that * cheap, I mean, I pay comcast for gigabit and have iphone 14s n tons of computers n junk, maybe just "like to be cheap when I can"

Sometimes the simplest solutions are overlooked and the best. As you mentioned go thu the comcast - I could get a cheap switch for more wired connections (shoot I think I have one in the garage) and then "reverse" the roles of the comcast/router of on/off private network (keep the router, put the IoTs on its wifi, and put my laptops on comcast wifi and wired on the switch -> Comcast.

Thanks!
 
SpongeBob said:
Good to know. From doing a lot of research and hating buying routers cause things are always changing I've been looking at Amazon warehouse deals. Do you think I'd honestly see much difference with a AX1800 vs. a AX3000 with a 500 Mbps download speed service?
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I just did two of this exact upgrade, except in my case it was the TP-LINK AX1800 to the TP-LINK AX3000.

Here's what you can expect:

Assuming you don't currently have WIFI 6 Devices

There's a pretty large functional feature set difference between the two. Mostly features you don't configure. For example, things the newer AX3000 brings are: symmetrical beamforming on 2.4Ghz and 5.0Ghz, and the ability to channelize the in use Wifi so concurrent traffic is treated fairly at an airtime level. There's more CPU and RAM on the AX3000 to support those features. If you are the only one in the house, and have a single high-use Wifi device and you have a strong "send and receive signal" then YES you won't see much of a difference. Otherwise... you may notice more consistent speeds, a bit better signal and negotiated rate at the far ends away from the AP and less hiccuping behavior when there are 6-10 wifi devices operating concurrently.


In short.... if you are performing speed tests at normal distances, you will see/measure little or no change, but if you load the AP, have lots of devices and users, or operate at the fringes of your wifi... yeah you'll notice it.... if only from the lack of issues.

Now if you do have Wifi 6 devices then the AX3000 will also negotiate higher connection rates and you will potentially be able to measure that in a benchmark......that's also assuming your Internet isn't the bottleneck
 
TheSlySyl said:
I have an AX200 wifi card in my desktop* and a Wifi 6e router (Asus GT-AXE16000) and the wifi card is absolutely miserable at anything wifi 6. I would not upgrade if you think Wifi 6, at the moment, is going to be your savior. Wifi 6 is better on our phones but the distance is super limited, so we tend to fall back to Wifi 5 anyway, which has more than usable speeds.

I do think a better router would help you out, but you don't need to go all in on an expensive WiFi 6e one like I did.
*The desktop, and most of our houses desktops and TV devices, are hardwired if they can be.
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Things WIFI 6 brings over WIFI 5

If the mobile client is WIFI 6, you'll leverage TWT which allows for less battery consumption when connected and idle
WPA3 brings better security (yeah I know it's not practically ready)
Supports 1024-QAM modulation resulting in higher connection speeds.... this is MORE useful then you think as many (most) WIFI 5 routers do not support all the official speeds...unless you are lucky enough to have a high end WIFI 5 router or AP, a WIFI 6 router will support all the WIFI 5 speeds resulting in better speeds for your WIFI 5 device in those instances
Better beamforming by default, not all WIFI 5 routers actually have 4 spatial streams.... ALL of the WIFI 6 routers do.... the WIFI 6 spec supports up to 8
WIFI 5 uses OFDM or Orthogonal Frequency-Division Multiplexing, WIFI 6 uses OFDMA Orthogonal Frequency-Division Multiple Access, surprisingly you can get some benefit from this with a WIFI 5 client
WIFI 5 Beamforming is downlink enabled, WIFI 6 is bi-directional and do to OFDMA can even partially leverage it with WIFI 5 clients
WIFI 6 allows for band handoff... Most WIFI 5 routers do not do this well or at all

You can read all about ALL the WIFI versions, features, etc here: https://www.duckware.com/tech/wifi-in-the-us.html#wifi6e


I'm not certain about your AX200 config with your router, but I can tell you that many people have benchmarked your AX200 on a WIFI 6 router vs a WIFI 5 router at a 60' distance and it transfers at 3x faster. At 5' most people can get near 900Mbps of throughput unidirectionally on 5Ghz with a clean 1200Mbps connection over WIFI 6.


I have a very high end WIFI 5 AP which has 4 spatial streams, and I'm tempted to upgrade to WIFI 6E... but honestly, I have a difficult time justifying it. My 2.4Ghz runs at 20Mhz channel width for maximum distance connectivity reasons. My 5Ghz is configured at 40Ghz channel width. Most of my older devices connect at either 144Mbps (2.4Ghz) or 300Mbps (5Ghz), the newer ones connect at 173Mbps (2.4Ghz) or 450Mbps.

Upgrading to WIFI 6E would technically provide a 40-50% speed boost for my newer devices and lower overall wireless latency... the only problem is I have flawless connectivity, a 100Mbps Internet Service and frankly................ I 'm not interested in spending $300 to upgrade my WiFI
 

ASUS ROG Rapture GT-BE98 PRO​

Quad-Band Wi-Fi 7 Gaming Router​


20231221_120716.jpg

20231223_085353.jpg
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Mike211 said:

ASUS ROG Rapture GT-BE98 PRO​

Quad-Band Wi-Fi 7 Gaming Router​


View attachment 621590
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Head over to the SNBforums Merlin forums and install entware and amtm on that thing to really see what it can do*. Having a DNS server / Adblocker / VPN etc. built directly into your router is awesome.
Yes, yes I know that PFsense boxes can do all that - and more - but PFsense boxes also don't have quad band wifi 7! (unless I'm an absolute fool and they can.)
1703234689443.png

*I actually don't know if the GT-BE98 Pro has a Merlin version yet, but when it does you should update to it ASAP. It's so much better than the stock Asus.
 
Usually when someone goes pfsense it's also separating router from wifi. Upgrading an access point to wifi 7 or whatever becomes easier and cheaper over time. I mean if that matters to you. I'm still on 5 in the house. Only a handful of devices support 6, just isn't worth the upgrade.
 
ng4ever said:
Is Wifi 6e or Wifi 7 worth it yet?
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Depends, I have a 4x4 AP on both 2.5 and 5Ghz which is WIFI 5 and has almost every 802.11 AC feature implemented and functionally working. My next minimum jump will be to WIFI 6E. Frankly, I haven't seen a single WIFI 7 AP or router that is even remotely worth what they are charging compared to the more mature WIFI 6E variants.
 
Mackintire said:
Depends, I have a 4x4 AP on both 2.5 and 5Ghz which is WIFI 5 and has almost every 802.11 AC feature implemented and functionally working. My next minimum jump will be to WIFI 6E. Frankly, I haven't seen a single WIFI 7 AP or router that is even remotely worth what they are charging compared to the more mature WIFI 6E variants.
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Not to mention how well enterprise APs like ones from Ruckus do with the 'old' standards. If you have one of these, you're getting speeds closer to theoretical maximum vs the marketing maximum with consumer stuff.
 
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