The Radeon Rebellion Marches Forward with the Gamer-Optimized Radeon RX 470 GPU

Pieter3dnow

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Wow people complaining about the price of an AMD card I thought I had seen everything on this forum. Even suggesting that you better buy a GTX 1060 , newsflash bring your $179 USD and buy a GTX 1060 go for it.
 
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Deleted member 93354

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Well over half the 4GB products are over $199+. That's the same price as the RX480. Only the Powercolor Devil is reasonable at $179....and possibly the Sapphire (stock design)

STILLBORN if mfg can't get the price down. XFX is freaking loopy if they think they are going to get that pricing.
 
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Plenty of reason to buy one if the $199 4GB 480 remains a myth.
If the manufacturers are intentionally creating a unrealistically low MSRP to grab product recommendation from editors, then somebody in their marketing department needs a serious smackdown. (That goes for NVIDIA too) because it makes determining true value very VERY difficult. It's as bad as trying to establish what your true cable or phone bill will be after they slap on a bunch of taxes and fees. It's quite frankly deceptive and dishonest.

Markups on this generation are just absurd. I know it happened in the past, but this is getting rediculus. Their price hikes are NOT EVEN CLOSE to generating value over stock OEM. I can justify maybe a 2%->4% price increase for 1% improvement in performance. (With the exception of overclocked RX480's against 1060s...in which is will lose in every metric)

videocard company said:
"Sure we'll give you a card for MSRP of $199.*

(But our polished out connector will cost you $5 more. Our Fans $15 more. Our special shroud $20 more. Extra testing is $15. Our pretty packaging is $15)"
Both AMD and NVIDIA need to establish an average AND maximum recommended retail price. If you go over, your supply gets cut off.

Think about it, AMD and NVIDIA might claim $199 RX480 and $379 1070, but if they only release 2 of those per year. That's just pure BS to grab press and they should be smacked down for it.

Yeah yeah I know it's free market. I do believe in free market. But AMD and NVIDIA are the only suppliers and therefore have the ability to control the market. A reference board or chip to XFX cost the same as it does to Sapphire. So they can shift supply to preferential builders who are closer to MSRP and not affect AMD's/NVIDIA's bottom lines. I'm sure some companies would love to have a larger allotment.

And they should really think about this strategy. If an average user believes he can get one at $199/$379 respectively and ends up waiting a year to grab one at that price....well then that user isn't going to believe or trust that company again and will mark them up as either greedy or dishonest.

Or maybe we should judge them based on AVERAGE available street price.
 
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Nobu

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To be fair, Newegg is (when they're in stock) selling Sapphire's reference design RX 480s at MSRP, I can't speak for other retailers and IHVs. The Nitro is being sold for what sapphire suggested (well, $10 more for the 8GB OC). The problem is the people who buy them up and resell them at higher prices, IMO, not the people who set the original MSRP.
 

Ocellaris

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To be fair, Newegg is (when they're in stock) selling Sapphire's reference design RX 480s at MSRP, I can't speak for other retailers and IHVs. The Nitro is being sold for what sapphire suggested (well, $10 more for the 8GB OC). The problem is the people who buy them up and resell them at higher prices, IMO, not the people who set the original MSRP.
I would think people planning on reselling for profit represent a small part of the market. If buyers were going to spend a lot more money to get a 480, they could buy a better card.
 

Nobu

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Sure, the people who plan to do that represent a small part of the market, that doesn't make them a small problem.
I mean, the only ones who have stock most of the time are 3rd party sellers on Amazon/Newegg. If you go on ebay there are lots, with a pretty mark-up to go with 'em.
 
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pendragon1

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apparently if you're considering a 470 skip the sapphire version...

 
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NKD

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Why? he is Right.. this card at the actual price (179$) is a joke.. a flawless POS in comparison to the RX 480.. the RX 480 sells are only for miners which have the largest amount of those cards, and for people with ancient GPU looking to upgrade the aging of the good old 7950/280 7970/280X which it's already a vastly minority of the market.. once the GTX 1060 was launched it killed most of AMD sells except for those who have a brand loyalty and still buy AMD even for Side-grade.

This RX 470 card have even less market than the RX 480.. AMD is not going to win any market if they don't make Nvidia Guys jump the fence..
You really sound like a fanboy. Just stop it already. I have gotten bunch of notificatons (around 4 today already) notifications in the last week of rx 480s coming in stock. And all sold within minutes. As long as AMD is selling them what you say doesn't hold any water, sorry.

At 179 its a decent card. I mean when was the last time you got a card for 179.99 that could play everything at 1080p at decent framrate?

On the other hand anything over that is a joke. ASUS/Sapphire/XFX/Powercolor AIB cards all 200 or above, heck even reference 470 by sapphire is listed at 200. If they are at 200 that is indeed at big fucking fail at that price point. Only because you can get reference 480 for 239. Pricing at 200 or 210 does not make any fuckin sense what so ever. Why wouldn't anyone get the 4gb after market 480 for 219? Unless we won't be seeing 4gb rx480 cards in this market ofcourse. Pricing is certainly a mess for AIB cards.

Then again there is absolutely nothing competitive against it at 200 or below. I mean it indeed destroys anything in that price range. So that is why I think there is certainly some price guoging going on here. I bet these cards eventually settle below 200. I am thinking no 4gb rx 480s from the looks of it.
 
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primetime

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Sooner or latter the will fall in price to 149 where they should be at. (end of the year?) They be sweet values then! Me i can wait till the XFX RX480 DD 8GB hits $249 sale prices....I can wait lol;)
 

Ieldra

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Dude what is that from? funny as hell! LOL
Looks like it belongs in Monty Python :p

Sooner or latter the will fall in price to 149 where they should be at. (end of the year?) They be sweet values then! Me i can wait till the XFX RX480 DD 8GB hits $249 sale prices....I can wait lol;)
This is a good ~ 170$ card, it's too expensive for what it offers though.

You know a few years ago I don't think there were that many custom AIB versions of low end cards with huge coolers. It's a new fad, "high end" features trickle down to low end parts kind of thing, but a 30$ premium on a 170$ card is silly.
 

NKD

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Looks like it belongs in Monty Python :p



This is a good ~ 170$ card, it's too expensive for what it offers though.

You know a few years ago I don't think there were that many custom AIB versions of low end cards with huge coolers. It's a new fad, "high end" features trickle down to low end parts kind of thing, but a 30$ premium on a 170$ card is silly.
Only thing wrong with it is how it almost makes the rx480 4gb price range with custom cards. Now at that point its irrelevant if 4gb rx 480 aftermarket cards can be had for 219 like the sapphire nitro. Like I have been saying unless those cards are not going to make it to U.S market then these prices make more sense.

But at 180 though it is still one hell of a card. It destroys anything below 200. Reason there is price gouging going on because there is actually absolutely no competition it has at that price range. So if we see no 4gb rx 480s then these will probably stay around 180-210 since there is nothing that beats it in that price range.

I don't see the point of all these after market cooling for this card. Look at asus, they have a basic fuckin after market cooler on it with 2 heat pipes and they are charging a 30 dollar premium over reference. I guess pure profit there since its the cheapest you can find for decent 1080p performance.
 

KazeoHin

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I would like to hear the rationale behind that one, unless you're going to cite UK consumer laws, which don't apply here....
Newegg does not decide the prices of items freely. They negotiate with the AIB manufacturers, and they need to sell the cards under the conditions that the AIB manufacturers set. If one of MSI's video cards big selling point is a $10 advantage over the Asus model, then Newegg would screw up MSI's brand image by straying from that price: Newegg still has a little bit of a say in pricing, but this is discussed with the AIB manufacturer and agreed upon before an item ever goes on sale.

The AIB manufacturers, in turn, have similar agreements with AMD. a lot of handshaking goes down the line, and AMD's target price of course gets left behind by value-adds, but the final product price is very much in AMD's control.

Not to mention, short stock levels cause price gouging by private resellers, who have no agreement with anyone. Such stock levels are entirely in AMD control.
 

Sodapopjones

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Newegg does not decide the prices of items freely. They negotiate with the AIB manufacturers, and they need to sell the cards under the conditions that the AIB manufacturers set. If one of MSI's video cards big selling point is a $10 advantage over the Asus model, then Newegg would screw up MSI's brand image by straying from that price: Newegg still has a little bit of a say in pricing, but this is discussed with the AIB manufacturer and agreed upon before an item ever goes on sale.

The AIB manufacturers, in turn, have similar agreements with AMD. a lot of handshaking goes down the line, and AMD's target price of course gets left behind by value-adds, but the final product price is very much in AMD's control.

Not to mention, short stock levels cause price gouging by private resellers, who have no agreement with anyone. Such stock levels are entirely in AMD control.
I understand that concept entirely, however most manufacturing agreements set a floor, call for there to be no ceiling, this applies to more then just electronics. Hence the phrases, supply & demand, free market and my favorite "Capitalism".
 

KazeoHin

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Thats what I was thinking but I've watched them all, and can't remember that scene lol.
That scene is computer-generated: most likely in a game engine. I have no idea where it is from.
 

NKD

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Not a myth... I have 2 of them right here.
you may have. But best buy removed their listing already. Newegg doesn't seem to be getting any stock. Looks like this thing is a myth. Why are AIBs pricing their rx 470s little above 200 or little above? I don't think they are stupid. I am thinking they will just be sold in the over seas market as cards tend to be more expensive there, so the pricing might be more spread out. It seems like rx 470 cards just priced the rx 480 out of existence here.
 

NKD

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You were also given an R9 Nano by AMD directly so.... not exactly the normal use-case?
Doesn't matter though he could have bought them. They were available at launch. I have notification set from nowinstock, and I have never gotten even one email for the 4gb model from anywhere for last month or so. then best buy even removed their listing of it. Looks like these might just be limited to other markets since there is bigger price gaps there. Here in the states the Rx 470 just killed it when some AIB models over took it in price or matched it at 199
 
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I would like to hear the rationale behind that one, unless you're going to cite UK consumer laws, which don't apply here....
Easy
AMD is the sole supplier. If they wanted to, they could give preference to AIB partners that keep their prices low. It wouldn't cost them a dime to do so as the price is the same no matter whom they sell to.

(Same is true for NVIDIA also)
 
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Deleted member 93354

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According to your own rules you are breaking rule #5
Rasterization methods employed by NVIDIA/AMD - David Kanter

Already you don't know what to do with yourself. When you are bitching about the price and can't say really anything more what are you doing here. Your argument holds no water you can't even explain why it is to expensive beside that it does not offer enough, your usual thread crapping style when you enter the AMD forums



Not really bad value for money.

Obey your own rules n00b!
That's not really an apple to apple comparison. This is a overclocked RX470 against a stock RX480. You can still overclock the RX480. Then numbers become meaningless.

It would make no sense that a 470 which is a cut down die can match or beat a 480 full die. That's like saying a 6950/7950 can beat a 6970/7970. Early on they were close, but later driver developments just extended the difference between them.

Basically we are getting shafted on prices by both AMD and NVIDIA AIB vendors. And quite frankly RX400 series really doesn't overclock that well. The differences between custom cooling and stock is NOT justifiable in any way or shape performance wise.
 
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Pieter3dnow

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That's not really an apple to apple comparison. This is a overclocked RX470 against a stock RX480. You can still overclock the RX480 and these numbers are meaningless.

It would make no sense that a 470 which is a cut down die can beat a 480 full die. That's like saying a 6950/7950 can beat a 6970/7970. Early on they were close, but later driver developments just extended the difference between them.
The argument was about the AIB card for $179. if you check AMD Radeon RX 470 - PowerColor Red Devil Radeon RX 470 Video Card Review
they gave it a gold award.

It is what you pay for rather then what you can do with it. It is also a different market where people not bound to overclock their card to begin with ,...
 
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The argument was about the AIB card for $179. if you check AMD Radeon RX 470 - PowerColor Red Devil Radeon RX 470 Video Card Review
they gave it a gold award.

It is what you pay for rather then what you can do with it. It is also a different market where people not bound to overclock their card to begin with ,...
I do understand what you are saying. But I simply can't agree.

If Power color (and bravo to them for the pricing) can only release about 100 of these a year, then the value standpoint of the whole series is questionable. (Especially when custom cooling is showing no real benefit other than noise....You can crank the fan to 80%->100% on stock and maintain boost) (BTW: NVIDIA is just as guilty)

This is all marketing shenanigans and it pisses me off because it's deceptive. It's like waving a steak in front of a hungry dog and then telling him we are going to add A1 steak sauce to it for 50 bones more and he doesn't have an option not to get the A1.
 

Ocellaris

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I do understand what you are saying. But I simply can't agree.

If Power color (and bravo to them for the pricing) can only release about 100 of these a year, then the value standpoint of the whole series is questionable. (Especially when custom cooling is showing no real benefit other than noise....You can crank the fan to 80%->100% on stock and maintain boost) (BTW: NVIDIA is just as guilty)

This is all marketing shenanigans and it pisses me off because it's deceptive. It's like waving a steak in front of a hungry dog and then telling him we are going to add A1 steak sauce to it for 50 bones more and he doesn't have an option not to get the A1.
Marketing is close to pure deception by design. Products should be valued at the prices they are available for, not for prices mentioned in a slide show. A $199 480 4GB card simply isn't available and people need to accept that. From AMD's perspective, it doesn't even make sense to sell those 4GB cards in the NA market when they can't keep high margin 8GBs in stock as it is. I suspect the 4GBs will be back in a few months. Until then, the 470s are the best value under $200.
 

Sodapopjones

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Easy
AMD is the sole supplier. If they wanted to, they could give preference to AIB partners that keep their prices low. It wouldn't cost them a dime to do so as the price is the same no matter whom they sell to.

(Same is true for NVIDIA also)
AMD is essentially a failing company, they're not in the place of stating who, what, when and where their goods can be sold, they're happy they're even being sold. Once again see my list of favorite phrases.
 

Pieter3dnow

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I do understand what you are saying. But I simply can't agree.
If Power color (and bravo to them for the pricing) can only release about 100 of these a year, then the value standpoint of the whole series is questionable. (Especially when custom cooling is showing no real benefit other than noise....You can crank the fan to 80%->100% on stock and maintain boost) (BTW: NVIDIA is just as guilty)
This is all marketing shenanigans and it pisses me off because it's deceptive. It's like waving a steak in front of a hungry dog and then telling him we are going to add A1 steak sauce to it for 50 bones more and he doesn't have an option not to get the A1.
I could not see what you are suggesting with a low number, why would they not want to keep selling a "popular" product?
The HSF solution is only about noise since that seems to be drawback of Polaris hardly overclocks ...

Where does the deception part for you come from? It is a product only people on a budget would buy within certain goals for gaming if this was/is so deceptive how come [H] gave it such a good review if there was no value at all ........
 
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I could not see what you are suggesting with a low number, why would they not want to keep selling a "popular" product?
The HSF solution is only about noise since that seems to be drawback of Polaris hardly overclocks ...

Where does the deception part for you come from? It is a product only people on a budget would buy within certain goals for gaming if this was/is so deceptive how come [H] gave it such a good review if there was no value at all ........
Oh I don't fault the value of the specific red devil at all. I think it's a great value. I'm just griping about all the other brands that are charging an arm and leg above MSRP. It's like when you see a Volvo and they say "Starting at 22,500" I mean for a Volvo that's great isn't it? Then you add $80 for cup holders. $500 for a radio. So on and so forth. And you really can't find one at 22,500. It's just not representative of value. So you just kind of walk away from the brand as a whole disbelieving their pricing.
 
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