The Polestar 2 Will Come With Google Integration

Discussion in 'HardForum Tech News' started by AlphaAtlas, Jan 25, 2019.

  1. AlphaAtlas

    AlphaAtlas [H]ard|Gawd Staff Member

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    Awhile ago, Volvo spun off a company called Polestar that seems dead set on competing with Tesla and electric offerings from other companies. While the Polestar 1 is a hybrid that's already been crash tested and seen out in the wild, the more mysterious Polestar 2 is set to be Polestar's first all-electric car, and a direct competitor to the Tesla Model 3. This week, Polestar announced an extensive partnership with Google, claiming that the Polestar 2 will be the first car to offer a "full" Android experience. Instead of being at the mercy of auto manufacturers, maps, software updates, and even the car's voice assistant will all come straight from Google, and it'll apparently be compatible with regular Google Play apps. Polestar even released an interactive preview of the user interface, which offers the first full (top down) view of the car we've seen. Thanks to Electrek for the tip, and the app screenshot.

    It will also come equipped with other features sorely missing in automotive UI. The first of which is a digital voice assistant that is as helpful as it is conversational: Polestar 2 comes with an embedded Google Assistant. From optimising the temperature to picking a song, the Google Assistant lets you control things with your voice, leaving you free to focus on driving. With significant advancements in machine learning, language understanding, and speech recognition, the Assistant can understand and respond to you naturally.
     
  2. katanaD

    katanaD [H]ard|Gawd

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    does that mean its NOT "cloud" based? that would be interesting if so.
     
  3. TheOne&OnlyZeke

    TheOne&OnlyZeke 100% Irish

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    I would say common commands would not need any kinda of data connection
    "increase driveer temp 2 degrees" That kinda thing.
    Anything outside of that would probably rely on your phones data connection to maybe update the command
     
  4. TwiceOver

    TwiceOver 2[H]4U

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    Do I believe a car manufacturer, any of them, is going to update Android for the life of the car? Nope. Why do we keep buying shit with Android embedded with zero promise of product life updates.
     
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  5. ND40oz

    ND40oz [H]ardForum Junkie

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    Sensus can currently use a bluetooth or wifi data connection or you can use the built in LTE modem and supply your own sim card. I suspect you'll have the same data connection options when they switch over to the full blown android system. There was talk of the current hardware being compatible and it will just require dealer update.

    Volvo currently has bi-annual Sensus updates (usually in May and November), they're free when you have your yearly service done.
     
  6. pcgeekesq

    pcgeekesq [H]ard|Gawd

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    They should have named it "Polecat."
    Because it stinks when your car is spying on you, too.
     
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  7. PaulP

    PaulP Gawd

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    I hope so, because this is one application where I can see voice control being more useful than annoying.
     
  8. Zarathustra[H]

    Zarathustra[H] Official Forum Curmudgeon

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    I don't want to talk to my car. I have the google assistant disabled on my pixel. I don't like that shit.

    Why can't anyone just make a honest decent 200+ mile battery-electric powered car without all this other technical wizardry?

    Other than the powertrain, I am happy if it feature wise is similar to my 20 year old Volvo wagon.

    I don't want autonomous driving, on board computers, voice controls or any other garbage like that. Can they please focus on making a car, not a mobile entertainment center?
     
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  9. Dan_D

    Dan_D [H]ard as it Gets

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    "Polestar" has to be one of the worst car brand names I've ever heard. Although, I do think of strippers when I hear it or read it.
     
    Last edited: Jan 25, 2019
  10. Dead Parrot

    Dead Parrot 2[H]4U

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    I can see this going horribly wrong.

    Panicked guy hops in car and yells "Start!"
    Car-"Voice not recognized, please restate command"
    Guy-"Start @#$% my wife is giving birth now!"
    Car - "Due to failed voice recognition, Two Factor Authorization required to start car. Please visit the following website to request access code......"

    (Scenario inspired in part by the recent posting about Google recommending 2FA to deal with Nest security issues)
     
  11. travisty

    travisty Gawd

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    Manually driven cars is not the future. Car companies know this. Future cars are aimed at the future (5-10 years from now) where individuals no longer buy cars (they're too expensive for how long they go unused) and instead pay per (autonomous) ride/mile from waymo/uber/lyft/telsa/gm/ford which will be far cheaper.
     
    Last edited: Jan 25, 2019
  12. Zarathustra[H]

    Zarathustra[H] Official Forum Curmudgeon

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    Maybe some day, but I don't want a shared taxi as my vehicle. I want a car I own outright and drive manually, and that will never change for me.

    I wouldn't be opposed to some sort of optional autonomous mode I can switch on and off, as long as it doesn't add much expense, and doesn't compromise the manual driving experience.

    I LIKE driving, and don't want to cede control to some AI. I don't even like AI in a "virtual assistant" or "smart speaker". I sure as hell don't want it in my car.

    I also don't want to stream games from some cloud service. I LIKE owning and building my own capable PC.

    Something is lost when we no longer own our stuff.

    The "sharing economy" can suck it.
     
    Last edited: Jan 25, 2019
  13. oldmanbal

    oldmanbal [H]ard|Gawd

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    individuals should be buying cars based on the car, not on the softwear available in the car. Unfortunately a certain class of individuals buy cars based on how the radio sounds when they turn it up, fancy lights, dials, and buttons inside.
     
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  14. kamxam

    kamxam [H]ard|Gawd

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    So it will come to this?
    (Inserting Obligatory JohnnyCab Image :notworthy:)

    upload_2019-1-25_16-1-31.jpeg
     
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  15. travisty

    travisty Gawd

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    That's fine. Again it's not up to you. This is what's coming whether you want it or not. Highly unlikely you'll even be able to get affordable insurance with such a small pool and how bad human drivers are comparatively speaking.
     
  16. Zarathustra[H]

    Zarathustra[H] Official Forum Curmudgeon

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    I think you are overly optimistic about the success of autonomous vehicles. It certainly is coming, but it's not going to switch over overnight. There is going to be a several decades long transition period, especially in areas that have snowy winters, as snowy weather is particularly difficult to program AI to tackle.

    Just like how streaming game services will likely gain inroads among young people with limited disposable income, so will these autonomous car services at first. There is a real chance my 11 year old stepson will never have a drivers license. Me, and others my age, however? Some might switch, but old habits die hard.

    Us older fellas who grew up with cars are unlikely to just stop wanting to own our own and drive them ourselves. So it will be a generational shift, and my generation isn't about to die off quite yet. I'll be driving my own car for at least 45 more years, if something doesn't kill me first.
     
  17. travisty

    travisty Gawd

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    You're stuck in a linear mindset. This is an exponential technology. I am basing my statement of history, not some belief. It's the 6D's of exponential technologies.



    How long did it take for digital cameras to displace film cameras?
    How long did it take for cell phones to be in everyone's pockets?

    ~5 years

    As soon as an exponential technology reaches the point of Disruption (coming 2-3 years for autonomous driving) and Dematerialization will cause people to realize paying thousands for insurance, maintenance, and loans is just not smart for something that sits unused for 95% of the day (on average).

    Cars are expensive. That's why people try to hang onto them. Guess what? Electric cars are exponential as well. Battery prices are halving at roughly 4-5 years which means in about 4 years it'll cost about 20k w/o rebates for a 200 mile range EV.

    There's also the safety side. Insurance for manually driven vehicles will cost much more because fewer insurance companies will exist due to the much smaller pool and comparatively speaking humans are terrible drivers.

    Before you come back saying, "But that EV hit that person". AI is an exponential technology with a doubling time of about 2 years. Something done incorrectly yesterday is trivial the next.


    To your point of 2 feet of snow, no one should be driving in that at that point. I live in an area where that can happen and when a big snow is coming i just plan to stay inside. In either case GM, Tesla, and Waymo already have the ability to navigate roads that are covered in snow and lane markers are not visible.

    Here's a video done over a year ago


    Ford's been at it for over two years testing in Michigan


    A personal anecdote (no video). I was driving in my Tesla Model 3 and it was raining. I hit a cell where it was a true downpour. I took control from autopilot just to be safe. I could barely see 10 feet ahead of me / see the lines on the road. I looked over and saw the navigation could see the car in front of me (3 car length ahead, out of my sight) and it could see the lane lines just fine. I prometly re-engaged autopilot as i was in safer hands with it.

    Before you ask, no i could not pull over safely as the road is a narrow 2 line (1 lane in both directions) with no bike lane and a steep slope on the edge.
     
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  18. ND40oz

    ND40oz [H]ardForum Junkie

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    Two feet of snow isn't that much, you seriously don't go about your daily routine because you get a some snow? I've driven to DIA and caught flights in snow fall deeper than that. Pay extra to park in the garage so you don't have an issue finding your car when you fly back and you also don't have to clean it off.

    Tesla autopilot must be ridiculously good for you to want to hand over control of your vehicle in inclement weather. I don't even bother using Pilot Assist II in nice weather in my Volvo, I certainly don't want something driving for me in the snow when I can't stand how it drives in the sunshine.
     
  19. Zarathustra[H]

    Zarathustra[H] Official Forum Curmudgeon

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    I agree that you are right about that this will happen, and I also agree that autonomous cars either are already or are very close to surpassing typical human driver safety levels due to distraction, substance use, exhaustion, reaction time, risky driving behaviors, etc.

    (The data here are less clear, as autonomous accident rate data is currently not a proper random sample, but rather a subset of tests under ideal conditions. You can't compare that to overall human driver rates, as an applied statistician, I am very well versed with the need for a true random sample.)

    Where we disagree is twofold.

    Firstly, while autonomous cars either are or are close to beating humans at their worst or average condition, they are a VERY LONG way away from being able to match human drivers at their best. You know, sober, not tired, not distracted, obeying the rules of the road, etc. etc. Some of these conditions can likely be solved over time with better sensors and better logic, but I'm not convinced all of these gaps are technically solveable at all, particularly the inclement weather problem. Tell me again what an autonomous vehicle does when encountered with a light coating of snow obscuring road likes and the edges of the road?

    Secondly, it's timing. I think we are much further off than you think. Sure there will be some early adopters who are OK with having a car that just doesn't go anywhere in bad weather, for the novelty of it, but mass adoption depends on people not being scared about the shortcomings of the tech. Just look at the range anxiety debate.

    More likely - in my mind - is that in the short to medium term, we will see more and more adoption of assistive technologies. You know, auto breaking, lane departure warning, rear view cameras, auto cruise control, parking assist, etc. etc. with the full auto experience, tying all of these things together being a ways off.

    Also, don't underestimate how resistant people can be to change, especially in the country with a love affair with the car.

    I generally am very skeptical of those who evangelize new "transformative" technologies. Sure, they are right on occasion, but most are not. Everyone remembers being right about digital photography changing everything. Everyone forgets about proclaiming SmelloVision being the next big thing.
     
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  20. chockomonkey

    chockomonkey [H]ardForum Junkie

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    Lol yeah. Sounds like guitar hero, but for strippers
     
  21. Zarathustra[H]

    Zarathustra[H] Official Forum Curmudgeon

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    Yeah, I have to agree.

    After Volvo discontinued their R line of performance cars, Polestar became the in house tubing brand.

    I have no idea where that name came from, and why they decided to create a new brand for electric cars around it rather than just sell them as Volvo's.
     
  22. Paul_Johnson

    Paul_Johnson [H] Admin Staff Member

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    It's been Volvo's racing/performance presence since the '90's.......................
     
  23. Zarathustra[H]

    Zarathustra[H] Official Forum Curmudgeon

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    Interesting.

    I've owned Volvo's all my life, never heard of it until the R cars went away, what, 10 years ago?

    Of course the only Volvo racing I've ever heard of were the 850 R BTCC cars of the 90's
     
  24. Paul_Johnson

    Paul_Johnson [H] Admin Staff Member

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    The R-Design performance package with the 325HP B6304T4 was still available until 2016 (though it wasn't the top of the line performance option as the Polestar model had 346HP and 362HP options in the same time period to current) on the S60. New R-Design is still available on most models as trim and handling package.
     
  25. Zarathustra[H]

    Zarathustra[H] Official Forum Curmudgeon

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    I realize I may come across as Luddite on this subject, but I am generally positively inclined towards new cool technology.

    It's just that everything in the last 10-15 years in our mobile first, big data, AI/Machine Learning, cloud era has just been one one eous leap after another into one Orwellian sci-fi dystopia or another.

    New technology peaked in the early 2000's. Everything new since then has been universally bad for humanity. Concepts that already existed have continued to improve, though at an alarmingly slow rate, but just about all new ideas since then are horrible and ruinous to society.
     
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  26. Zarathustra[H]

    Zarathustra[H] Official Forum Curmudgeon

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    Ah. I was referring to when they dropped the R cars as distinct models. I've heard of R-Design, but I just assumed it was like Audi's S-Line, just a styling package that evoques the real performance of the S cars with nothing to back it up.

    I honestly haven't paid any attention to racing or performance cars in over a decade. I kind of cinsider it lame and immature. Everyone should just drive a boring, reliable, slow and practical car :p . Maybe we'd have fewer raceboys killing people on public roads :p
     
  27. Paul_Johnson

    Paul_Johnson [H] Admin Staff Member

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    The R cars weren't really any more distinct a model than the later R-Designs. The originals were just 850 performance option packages. The next were just a S70 performance option packages. Then the next were the S60's I mentioned above.
     
  28. kamxam

    kamxam [H]ard|Gawd

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    Polestar is the racing line? And the Stripper line is the Polecat? :meh:
     
  29. theBrownLlama

    theBrownLlama Gawd

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    too expensive = being taxed to death by the municipal council/city/state/gov.

    all the crap that companies like waymo/uber/lyft can write off as business expenses ( and thus skip out on the associated corporate taxes later on)
     
  30. ND40oz

    ND40oz [H]ardForum Junkie

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    The Polestar name comes from the other name of the north star, hence their badging looking like the bright Pole star. Volvo purchased Polestar Performance back in 2015 and slowly integrated them into their own brand. Before this they were known for their tunes, performance parts and performance variants of production model Volvos. Volvo didn't purchase Polestar Racing and they changed their name to Cyan Racing which IIRC, takes their name from the signature blue Polestar color.
     
  31. cattix

    cattix n00b

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    Your response and reasoning reminds me what is the median baseline of abilities in driving population. For such abilities, it is safer to be driven by computers. You know you cant safely drive in those conditions, and it is better that way that you do not try. Computer has a fair chance of driving you safely. If it fails, as you say, it learns from its mistakes. Sometimes there will be causalties, because no computer is perfect, but as you said, it will all be better next year. If you consent to being the guinea test animal, it will make driving safer for the rest of us, off course, when they are done reviewing the black boxes and compiling the data pulled from the wreckage.

    Problem is, there are others who are better drivers, who do not like putting their lives in the hands of a software code, and those of us who actually build these things, y know those pesky auto drive systems. Knowing how it works and what will it do when encountering a problem, no way would I ever never drive or better said, let it drive me around wihout having a hardwired killswitch for all of the cars power. Just in case it goes bonkers, and that sure does happen here and there, very very infrequently but it does happen. And because of the nature of the system it probably will never be able to work 100% reliably, so ask yourself this - am I ready to bet my life on it? Because that is what you do when you use autodrive feature in any car, any manufacturer. All those caveats and disclaimers you go trough to activate auto drive systems are not there just because the are pretty to look at. The are there because the manufacturers know the hard truth - and they want to shed all responsibility when wreck happens.
     
  32. motomonkey

    motomonkey [H]ard|Gawd

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    Sure it is.

    I can link articles from when I was growing up talking about flying cars and global cooling. and we see how THAT worked out.

    People are not going to magically disappear from the 'burbs/rural areas and suddenly not drive anymore.
     
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  33. MV75

    MV75 [H]ard|Gawd

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    Irrelevant. Not a car.
    Irrelevant. Not a car.

    As for the car; people are not going to wait around for an autonomous car when they can just get in their own and drive. Nor will they then enjoy being at the mercy of no available car when they just want to go home, nor a car that may turn up that isn't large enough to take something home they just bought from ikea when their other car was.

    Leasing a vehicle every 5 years is a thing.

    You're on the wrong path of autonomous cars, they're just there for some company to make money. Time to leave the euphoric vision and get back to the reality of the world that has been shaped by scum like google in that everything must be monotonised and every bit of useless data gathered. The only use for them for regular people is for the disabled and elderly. Stick to the electric car being the future as that is something all sides can get behind.

    There are more insurance companies than ever and are growing and guess what? Everything is manually driven.
     
  34. travisty

    travisty Gawd

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    So much fun seeing people try to fight reality :)
     
  35. jedijeb13

    jedijeb13 Limp Gawd

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    So what you are saying is that I won't be able to own and drive my own car, and that if I need to go to town I need to call an autonomous car and wait for it to drive twenty miles out in the middle of nowhere to pick me up and take me to town. Why would anyone ever want to wait for the autonomous car to arrive when they could already be in town by the time the car would arrive? I also know people who live farther out that this and waiting for an autonomous car to arrive for pickup would be infuriating.

    Seriously, some people think the entire world operates the same as in their own little bubble of experience. People in rural areas where most roads don't have lines painted on the sides and some don't have lines painted in the center and even some are just one lane gravel, would never want such things, and without a huge leap forward in technology those things would fail to perform in such conditions. If an autonomous vehicle gets stuck in the mud will it simply give up and call a tow truck or will it try to rock itself free, or even ask you to get out and push?

    Another thing concerning this one having Android, and so much of the operation of the vehicle based on that technology, what will it be like twenty or even thirty years from now? Or will be be forced to throw away a perfectly good vehicle simply because it doesn't support software updates any longer? Were I live, the number of vehicles 15+ years old easily outnumbers the newer ones. It costs me much less each year to keep my 85 Jeep Cherokee and 96 F150 going than it would to buy a new vehicle. I would like to invest in an electric vehicle, but as one of the first posters said, I want one that is simple and rugged, not something that will leave me sitting on the side of the road while a spinning circle displays and repeats the message "do not turn off the power until updates are complete" :)
     
  36. travisty

    travisty Gawd

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    Don't blame me if your imagination is not up to the task. Going to the store? Summon a car 5-10 minutes ahead of time. People will be able to have manually driven cars, it just won't be affordable for most.
     
  37. ND40oz

    ND40oz [H]ardForum Junkie

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    What is going to affect their near term affordability, you think manufacturers are just going up and stop making regular cars all of a sudden? Every existing car is going to be forced off the road due to some self driving car regulation? The only thing that will dictate their affordability is demand, as long as there is demand for them, manufacturers will continue to build them.
     
  38. N4CR

    N4CR 2[H]4U

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    '18 550d m wagon I went in recently swerved pretty badly in the lane whilst engaging auto mode in light snow... Not confidence inspiring on the autobahn at speed. I'll wait a few more years until trusting autonomous cars. They are doing well but need a lot of training.
     
  39. travisty

    travisty Gawd

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    Gas cars are going away for three reasons
    1. They are dirty and contribute to greenhouse gas / glabal warming - yes it is man made
    2. EVs are an exponential technology. The cost to manufacture drops at the rate of blthe battery's cost.
    3. Safety features can be rolled back when humans are no longer driving as accidents will he non-existent decreasing the cost of manufacturing
    4. The price of electricity is dropping exponentially because solar and batteries are both exponential technologies



     
  40. motomonkey

    motomonkey [H]ard|Gawd

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    So fun watching someone's condescending attitude about what he thinks reality is, get shot all to hell.