Swap 5950X for 5800x3d?

1Wolf

1Wolf

Limp Gawd
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Built a new system about a year and a half ago (May 2021) for flight sims (Microsoft Flight Simulator 2020 & DCS) & gaming. For flight sims I use only VR. For non-flight sim games I use a monitor.

AMD 5950X
ASUS Crosshair VIII Dark Hero
GeForce RTX 3090

Over the past year and a half the system has worked great at regular gaming (Like Cyberpunk 2077).

However, for DCS in VR I am GPU limited and it struggles. Common problem. DCS is always a battle for more GPU and turning up graphics options ;) I'm considering an upgrade to a 4090 for this.

For MSFS 2020 I am CPU limited. I've spent the past couple months trying everything I could to get every last drop of performance out of that 5950X. Its better than it was, but I started reading here and on other forms about some decent performance gains in flight sims and gaming for the 5800x3d. I don't do much productivity work with my machine - mostly flight sims and the occasional other game as well.

Anyone here run MSFS 2020 and DCS and made a similar CPU switch? Were you happy with the result?

Can I just swap out the 5950X for a 5800X3D without re-installing my OS? Or would swapping a CPU require a complete OS reinstall to get best performance or avoid problems? I've never actually JUST swapped a CPU before. In the past, I've stuck with one CPU until it was time to upgrade the entire machine.

Any advice or personal experience would be appreciated. Thanks!
 
1Wolf said:
Built a new system about a year and a half ago (May 2021) for flight sims (Microsoft Flight Simulator 2020 & DCS) & gaming. For flight sims I use only VR. For non-flight sim games I use a monitor.

AMD 5950X
ASUS Crosshair VIII Dark Hero
GeForce RTX 3090

Over the past year and a half the system has worked great at regular gaming (Like Cyberpunk 2077).

However, for DCS in VR I am GPU limited and it struggles. Common problem. DCS is always a battle for more GPU and turning up graphics options ;) I'm considering an upgrade to a 4090 for this.

For MSFS 2020 I am CPU limited. I've spent the past couple months trying everything I could to get every last drop of performance out of that 5950X. Its better than it was, but I started reading here and on other forms about some decent performance gains in flight sims and gaming for the 5800x3d. I don't do much productivity work with my machine - mostly flight sims and the occasional other game as well.

Anyone here run MSFS 2020 and DCS and made a similar CPU switch? Were you happy with the result?

Can I just swap out the 5950X for a 5800X3D without re-installing my OS? Or would swapping a CPU require a complete OS reinstall to get best performance or avoid problems? I've never actually JUST swapped a CPU before. In the past, I've stuck with one CPU until it was time to upgrade the entire machine.

Any advice or personal experience would be appreciated. Thanks!
Click to expand...
Heres link to your asus cpu support page Asus Link to Cpu support

It does support. you need bios 4006 for it work.
Ryzen 7 5800X3D (3.4GHz,105W,L3:96M,8C)ALL4006
 
Check out the CPU benchmarks for MSFS 2020 and DCS and determine if it's worth it for you.
And yes you can just swap them out without worrying about drivers or anything like that, but your board might need a bios update first.
 
because MSFS 2020 is just a steaming pile of poorly optimized crap like every other version before it.
Have you look at some benchmarks and reviews of MSFS with other CPUs to confirm if the extra Mhz would make any difference?
 
Microsoft Flight Simulator benefits from the extra L3 cache more than most games. The 5800X3D would be faster than the 5950X without a doubt. Do you do anything with your computer that uses more than 8 cores?
 
Thanks everyone for chiming in. There are quite a few threads here, and other places, about some gaming advantages to the 5800x3d and even a few comments of switching from a 5900x or 5950x to a 5800x3d. Especially in MSFS 2020. However, I figured I'd pop in here and see if anyone had done this and also uses my two favorite sims (DCS & MSFS 2020) to see what their personal feelings were.

Answering some of the questions/comments below thus far...

Gulkor said:
Heres link to your asus cpu support page Asus Link to Cpu support

It does support. you need bios 4006 for it work.
Ryzen 7 5800X3D (3.4GHz,105W,L3:96M,8C)ALL4006
Click to expand...

Thanks Gulkor. Thats the BIOS I'm currently on now. I had previously updated to 4201 but rolled it back to 4006 due to some tales I was hearing of OS corruption and other issues.

Phazer Tech said:
Check out the CPU benchmarks for MSFS 2020 and DCS and determine if it's worth it for you.
And yes you can just swap them out without worrying about drivers or anything like that, but your board might need a bios update first.
Click to expand...

All of the benchmarks I've seen for MSFS 2020 look outstanding. However, so far I'm concerned that, while it might be great for MSFS 2020, it might actually reduce my performance in DCS. I haven't read any stories so far of anyone in DCS switching from a 5950x to a 5800x3d. I don't play a whole lot of other games that often so I'm a little concerned about hurting my DCS performance to gain MSFS performance, especially when in DCS I was GPU limited and my CPU was doing ok.

Great news about being able to just swap the CPU's because it wasn't going to be worth it to me at all if I had to do a reinstall and reconfigure of windows.

MrGuvernment said:
because MSFS 2020 is just a steaming pile of poorly optimized crap like every other version before it.
Have you look at some benchmarks and reviews of MSFS with other CPUs to confirm if the extra Mhz would make any difference?
Click to expand...

Yup. My concern is that maybe Asobo cleans it up. I don't know enough about the way games/sims work and how they use threads/cores to know whether its likely or unlikely that Asobo improve MSFS's use of Multi-Core. I'd hate to swap CPU's only to find out in 3 months that the 5950X would have been better for me after a few updates. Its always interesting to me how DCS is so GPU limited and the CPU is fine, yet MSFS (especially in heavy photogrammetry areas) just hammers the CPU and becomes main thread limited. I just never know if its realistic to believe they will significantly improve that in the near future or that just is really unlikely to happen,

GotNoRice said:
Microsoft Flight Simulator benefits from the extra L3 cache more than most games. The 5800X3D would be faster than the 5950X without a doubt. Do you do anything with your computer that uses more than 8 cores?
Click to expand...

Hate to say it but I'm really not sure. DCS and MSFS is 90% of the use of my machine...maybe more. Every now and again some other game comes out that I mess with for a while, like Cyberpunk 2020. But thats about it. Mostly single player strategy, adventure, or RP stuff. Every now and again a massively multiplayer game like one of "The Division" franchise or a military type shooter. Never do any online competitive multiplayer twitch gaming, Call of Duty stuff, or what not.
 
1Wolf said:
Can I just swap out the 5950X for a 5800X3D without re-installing my OS? Or would swapping a CPU require a complete OS reinstall to get best performance or avoid problems? I've never actually JUST swapped a CPU before. In the past, I've stuck with one CPU until it was time to upgrade the entire machine.

Any advice or personal experience would be appreciated. Thanks!
Click to expand...

I just switched from an intel X99 to an AM5 (CPU, mobo, RAM) without re-installing the OS. I believe it was an upgrade from a win7 too.
No, you don't need to reinstall.

Also that CPU change seems silly (to me).
 
I have heard a few times that the 5800x3D is a big upgrade for VR, compared to 5800x/5900x/5950x
 
Have you considered over clocking the 5950x at all? to get a higher core frequency on more cores vs the boost on 1 or 2?
 
If you’re focused on Flight sim and gaming, no productively requirement, then yes I’d do it.

I would also be eyeing gpu releases bc you can always eat more resources in that genre.
 
I did the same. Big jump in games that aren't GPU limited, drop off in productivity, as expected. I do a lot of VR with games that hammer the cpu, like msfs and iRacing. I also do photogrammetry, which can use all the cores it can get, so it was a trade off but I haven't swapped back. I had my 5950 PBO+c/o and it was drawing 205W, vs around 110W for the 5800x3d. My system is a lot less noisy when under full load as the AIO isn't spinning up as I have it tied to coolant temp. They rarely go over 65% speed (start to become audible at 50%) where with the 5950X cranked up they'd be 80% in games and 100% when using all the cores.
 
My son doesn't play those games but he loves all the rollercoaster-related simulators - similar use case. Went from 5950X to 5800X3D and it has been great. I look at the 5800X3D as peak gaming for that platform - so worth it to make the move. The added bonus is the 5950X will net you about $100 for the swap!
 
I made the same switch last week and even at 4K it has been worth it for the poorly optimized or CPU bound games like WOW, Civ, Stellaris, etc. It seemed silly at first but I can't argue with the results. Pegged at 4K120 or showing GPU utilization at 100% if less than that. I agree with the peak gaming for AM4 comment. My brother is now enjoying my 5950x.

I look forward to the next gen X3D parts.
 
My coworker switched from a 3900x to a 5800x3d and his fps skyrocketed in flight sim but that is quite a bit slower of a cpu than you have. If you're just doing gaming I feel like if you're not going to upgrade platform anytime soon you should go for it. IME in FF14 it gives basically same fps with my 3090 as my 12900k and 7950x do at my weird 3200x1600 resolution I run it at which is a lot better than my 5950x did.
 
No need to reinstall Windows after upgrading CPU. The only thing which might happen is if you have OEM Windows key then it might loose its product activation and you might need to reactivate it (which is of course free of charge).

As for 5800X3D "upgrade" since its actually slower CPU I would aim at sourcing the CPU from where you can easily return it if it doesn't move performance in right direction and wait with selling 5950X
 
XoR_ said:
No need to reinstall Windows after upgrading CPU. The only thing which might happen is if you have OEM Windows key then it might loose its product activation and you might need to reactivate it (which is of course free of charge).
Click to expand...

Activation is based on the motherboard, not the CPU. Really the only issue that would require a re-install would be if you were using something like Bitlocker that was bound to the TPM on the CPU and forgot to disable it first.

XoR_ said:
As for 5800X3D "upgrade" since its actually slower CPU I would aim at sourcing the CPU from where you can easily return it if it doesn't move performance in right direction and wait with selling 5950X
Click to expand...

The situations where the 5800X3D is "slower" than any other Zen 3 are few and far between. You're basically talking exclusively about content creation / productivity apps; and not all of them, just the tiny subset of those apps that can actually use more than 8 cores. People spend too much time salivating over their Cinebench scores and other artificial benchmarks, that they have forgot what most people actually use their computers for. It wasn't that long ago when 4-cores was still considered high-end, and you had to go with an elaborate HEDT setup just to get 6 cores. The 8 cores on the 5800X3D is plenty for 99% of computer users.
 
GotNoRice said:
The situations where the 5800X3D is "slower" than any other Zen 3 are few and far between. You're basically talking exclusively about content creation / productivity apps; and not all of them, just the tiny subset of those apps that can actually use more than 8 cores. People spend too much time salivating over their Cinebench scores and other artificial benchmarks, that they have forgot what most people actually use their computers for. It wasn't that long ago when 4-cores was still considered high-end, and you had to go with an elaborate HEDT setup just to get 6 cores. The 8 cores on the 5800X3D is plenty for 99% of computer users.
Click to expand...
The reason 5950X is at times faster in games than 5800X3D is not so much because of more cores but because 5950X has higher clocks.
It is not big difference hence these cases when larger caches does nothing and faster cores are more important are not very visible. Also because clock difference is small in these cases performance difference is also small.
If AMD designed 5800X3D with higher clocks (presumably limited by used cache speed) the same as 5950X there would be no game (except maybe some turn based strategy which can use lots of cores) which would run faster on 5950X

That said I do not dismiss 5800X3D gaming performance advantage. There needs to be valid reason to bother replacing CPU over.
I just say that maybe its not worth the hassle...


https://www.eurogamer.net/digitalfoundry-2022-intel-core-i9-13900k-core-i5-13600k-review?page=2
Performance on 5800X3D in MSFS 2020 is better than 5950X for sure. It is also FPS regime where few additional FPS can make a difference... well, at least if it was fast paced shooter it would make a difference 🙃

Anyways, when not sure which CPU will get you best gaming experience... always go latest Intel 🤪
 
XoR_ said:
The reason 5950X is at times faster in games than 5800X3D is not so much because of more cores but because 5950X has higher clocks.
It is not big difference hence these cases when larger caches does nothing and faster cores are more important are not very visible. Also because clock difference is small in these cases performance difference is also small.
If AMD designed 5800X3D with higher clocks (presumably limited by used cache speed) the same as 5950X there would be no game (except maybe some turn based strategy which can use lots of cores) which would run faster on 5950X

That said I do not dismiss 5800X3D gaming performance advantage. There needs to be valid reason to bother replacing CPU over.
I just say that maybe its not worth the hassle...


https://www.eurogamer.net/digitalfoundry-2022-intel-core-i9-13900k-core-i5-13600k-review?page=2
Performance on 5800X3D in MSFS 2020 is better than 5950X for sure. It is also FPS regime where few additional FPS can make a difference... well, at least if it was fast paced shooter it would make a difference 🙃

Anyways, when not sure which CPU will get you best gaming experience... always go latest Intel 🤪
Click to expand...

Your link proves why the 5800X3D beats the 5950X in gaming. Look at the 1% numbers. Outside of that one game, the 5800X3D also beats the 5950X.

The 5950X wasn’t even the fastest gaming AMD CPU before the 5800X3D came out.
 
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GotNoRice said:
The situations where the 5800X3D is "slower" than any other Zen 3 are few and far between. You're basically talking exclusively about content creation / productivity apps; and not all of them, just the tiny subset of those apps that can actually use more than 8 cores. People spend too much time salivating over their Cinebench scores and other artificial benchmarks, that they have forgot what most people actually use their computers for. It wasn't that long ago when 4-cores was still considered high-end, and you had to go with an elaborate HEDT setup just to get 6 cores. The 8 cores on the 5800X3D is plenty for 99% of computer users.
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1670909548944.png

Glad to be part of that 1%
My computer hits all 32 threads at 100% pretty damn often.
I'm more than happy with my 5950X.
 
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TheSlySyl said:
View attachment 533911
Glad to be part of that 1%
My computer hits all 32 threads at 100% pretty damn often.
I'm more than happy with my 5950X.
Click to expand...

It's one thing to post a screenshot of your CPU at 100% usage, absent of any context. The real question is, what program are you running that is creating that utilization, and what percentage of your computing does that represent compared to gaming?
 
GotNoRice said:
It's one thing to post a screenshot of your CPU at 100% usage, absent of any context. The real question is, what program are you running that is creating that utilization, and what percentage of your computing does that represent compared to gaming?
Click to expand...
I'm not sure how you have your computer setup, but for me a whole desktop "screenshot." Involves 2x 4k monitors and 1x 1440p, one of the 4k monitors (the one that this cropped screen is taken from) is vertical, and I happened to be doing rendering (for Minecraft, of all things) when I took this screenshot.
You're not welcome to my entire desktop so I just posted the relevant info.

I do real time streaming (with transcoding), I do an absolute ton of video editing, audio editing, non-realtime transcoding etc. Some minor rendering, mostly related to my minecraft server and lately I've been doing an absolute ton of AI artwork generation and learning.

I have games that use 60-70% of all 32 threads without any background rendering or transcoding, such as Planet Coaster/Zoo, the Jurassic World Evolution games or various other management titles.

Lately I've been spending more time on computing than gaming on my computer, but that's mostly because I've been busy as fuck and most of my gaming has actually been on my Switch lately.

If you ever try to capture raw 4k60 video, while simultaneously playing a demanding game - such as cyberpunk 2077 - you want as many threads as you possibly can have.
 
TheSlySyl said:
I'm not sure how you have your computer setup, but for me a whole desktop "screenshot." Involves 2x 4k monitors and 1x 1440p, one of the 4k monitors (the one that this cropped screen is taken from) is vertical, and I happened to be doing rendering (for Minecraft, of all things) when I took this screenshot.
You're not welcome to my entire desktop so I just posted the relevant info.

I do real time streaming (with transcoding), I do an absolute ton of video editing, audio editing, non-realtime transcoding etc. Some minor rendering, mostly related to my minecraft server and lately I've been doing an absolute ton of AI artwork generation and learning.

I have games that use 60-70% of all 32 threads without any background rendering or transcoding, such as Planet Coaster/Zoo, the Jurassic World Evolution games or various other management titles.

Lately I've been spending more time on computing than gaming on my computer, but that's mostly because I've been busy as fuck and most of my gaming has actually been on my Switch lately.

If you ever try to capture raw 4k60 video, while simultaneously playing a demanding game - such as cyberpunk 2077 - you want as many threads as you possibly can have.
Click to expand...
There’s a 7950X now - you should upgrade based on your use case.
 
Nah. Don't have the money to waste on an entirely new motherboard, RAM and processor. Also likely a new power supply. At the moment.

The 5950X was a wonderful drop in upgrade from my 3900X which was holding me back a bit.

I'll consider AM5 when the 9950X or whatever they call it comes out. I was an early adopter of AM4 and have no interest in dealing with those growing pains again. Especially because my next system is looking at 128GB of ram and hopefully more than 32 threads. Also I want damn PCIE-5 NVME drives to come out, GIMME DAT BANDWIDTH.

I also want higher framerates though. So a 16core X3D model would be very tempting.
 
TheSlySyl said:
Nah. Don't have the money to waste on an entirely new motherboard, RAM and processor. Also likely a new power supply. At the moment.

The 5950X was a wonderful drop in upgrade from my 3900X which was holding me back a bit.

I'll consider AM5 when the 9950X or whatever they call it comes out. I was an early adopter of AM4 and have no interest in dealing with those growing pains again. Especially because my next system is looking at 128GB of ram and hopefully more than 32 threads. Also I want damn PCIE-5 NVME drives to come out, GIMME DAT BANDWIDTH.

I also want higher framerates though. So a 16core X3D model would be very tempting.
Click to expand...
There it is - looking for 3D V-cache after all. :)
 
TheSlySyl said:
Only when they offer it with more than 8 cores. 8 cores even with Vcache would be a downgrade for me. *shrugs*
Click to expand...
I guess. I dumped my 5950X for a 5800X3D and haven’t been happier. When I seek high performance I want the best. My main rig has a 7950X.
 
TheSlySyl said:
If you ever try to capture raw 4k60 video, while simultaneously playing a demanding game - such as cyberpunk 2077 - you want as many threads as you possibly can have.
Click to expand...

I do this all the time via Nvidia Shadowplay using the hardware encoder on the videocard with basically zero extra CPU usage.
 
I made this switch over the weekend after receiving an impromptu giftcard and using the Microcenter new customer coupon. So far the experience has been good.

On my main gaming PC, I play FPS games at 1080p @ 240hz and 1440p @ 120hz for everything non-FPS. I've noticed higher minimum/average frames in MW2 so far and a few other games. Nothing scientific, but no complaints or any noticeable adverse effects.

This was an easy "upgrade" as the 5950x is being dropped in my ESXi server to replace a 3900XT, which I'll likely repurpose to my Plex server.
 
Honestly if you are not doing any Workstation tasks or are mostly gaming, the 5800x3D is the cpu to have on the AM4. AMD gifted us stragglers with one last fantastic cpu. Only 3 chips matter on the AM4 platform. 5600 or 5600x Budget chip, 5950 for workstation work, and 5800x3d for Dedicated Gaming rig and little production work
 
So I'm digging up an old thread with a thought thread...

The differences between the 5950x and the 5800X3D are cores, clock speeds and L3 cache.

In the ryzen lineup, the most cache are the X3Ds with 96MB but second is the 5950x with 64MB. What if you disabled one of the CCXs on the 5950x? Then it would essentially be a 5800x with just eight cores...but instead of the 32MB of cache the 5800x has, it would be sporting 64MB. Or is the L3 cache not shared between CCXs?
 
applegrcoug said:
So I'm digging up an old thread with a thought thread...

The differences between the 5950x and the 5800X3D are cores, clock speeds and L3 cache.

In the ryzen lineup, the most cache are the X3Ds with 96MB but second is the 5950x with 64MB. What if you disabled one of the CCXs on the 5950x? Then it would essentially be a 5800x with just eight cores...but instead of the 32MB of cache the 5800x has, it would be sporting 64MB. Or is the L3 cache not shared between CCXs?
Click to expand...
I have a 5950X but too lazy to reboot my system to confirm but according to this

The Ryzen 9 5950X features 2 CCDs (again, 8 cores each), so simply by disabling a single CCD, we’re left with the same basic configuration as we would see in a Ryzen 7 5800X (including the same amount of L3 cache too, since the chip’s cache is held on each chiplet).

An alternative take on getting the most out of a 5950X for specific titles might be using Process Lasso (or just plain old task manager???) and adjusting some settings there. I think the 5800X3D would still perform better in some/most titles but this might be able to give a boost. By making modifications to the Windows scheduler, I think the cache will still be present (unlike disabling a CCD) but you can limit it to your non SMT cores. I've never actually tried this but saw a YouTube video that claims it can be a big uplift on certain titles.
 
Just want to throw it out there that at 4K 5800X3D even keeps pace with 7800X3D that I swapped out with in most games. The experience you will get in MSFS would be one of the best AMD has to offer in that game on an AMD cpu using a 5800X3D.
 
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