Stuff Apple Fanatics Say

Globox said:
only because they had a really huge markup on really mediocre products
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Wow. Insightful AND totally logical.

I'd like to see you create mediocre products with a huge markup and turn it into a 640 billion dollar company. Please.
 
Globox said:
Yes they're patenting the designs they had nothing to do with in the (i.e didn't create)

Because? you could just email Samsung and ask them.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CW0DUg63lqU
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Uh, what?

Patenting their own Mag Safe design is completely valid. If I have to engineer it, I don't want my competitors to be copying it.

Patenting a computer design is an brand recognition tool.

Creating your own designs is not necessarily "inventing" anything, nor did anyone bring up "inventing" - well actually, you did.

Writing your own book, painting a work of art, etc... You didn't "invent" any of that. The English language and the oil paint is not something you're inventing, but you're using it anyway and you're calling it your own.
 
MJZ said:
Uh, what?

Patenting their own Mag Safe design is completely valid. If I have to engineer it, I don't want my competitors to be copying it.

Patenting a computer design is an brand recognition tool.

Creating your own designs is not necessarily "inventing" anything, nor did anyone bring up "inventing" - well actually, you did.

Writing your own book, painting a work of art, etc... You didn't "invent" any of that. The English language and the oil paint is not something you're inventing, but you're using it anyway and you're calling it your own.
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it was a modified mag safe design from a chinese cooking company

the brand recognition tool is bordering on abuse

oh brother...

yes which is also called the remix culture (every patent law is against this)
 
Globox said:
it was a modified mag safe design from a chinese cooking company

the brand recognition tool is bordering on abuse

oh brother...

yes which is also called the remix culture (every patent law is against this)
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Then what you clearly have is something against the Patent system.

While some patents are on its face - inane, a patent like the Magsafe, by any reasonable impartial bystander, is a valid patent.

Are you going to harken back to the original inventor of the wheel and deny the radial tire design patent?

Grow up and put on some pants, this is the real the world.
 
MJZ said:
Then what you clearly have is something against the Patent system.

While some patents are on its face - inane, a patent like the Magsafe, by any reasonable impartial bystander, is a valid patent.

Are you going to harken back to the original inventor of the wheel and deny the radial tire design patent?

Grow up and put on some pants, this is the real the world.
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When the patent system is as corrupt as it is now, yes then by all means i have a lot against it. Considering its doing the exact opposite of what it was intended to do.

Apple would

Is there really a need for the insults? this isn't highschool
 
They created a company. They created many products with tight integration between software and hardware. As a whole, the entire enchilada with all hardware and software, is unique. The total package and ecosystem is unique. This is what people buy. This is what has made them billions and will continue to do so. This ecosystem they have created is what now has every single tech company out there trying to copy it.

It's amazing to me how difficult this it to understand for some people.
 
Globox said:
When the patent system is as corrupt as it is now, yes then by all means i have a lot against it. Considering its doing the exact opposite of what it was intended to do.

Apple would

Is there really a need for the insults? this isn't highschool
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Actually, this was highly called for. YOU'RE against the patent system - fine. But that doesn't mean ALL patents are invalid, especially ALL of Apple's patents.

Are you following along yet? Or are you still in High School?
 
MJZ said:
Actually, this was highly called for. YOU'RE against the patent system - fine. But that doesn't mean ALL patents are invalid, especially ALL of Apple's patents.

Are you following along yet? Or are you still in High School?
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Sigh, when you stop using insults I'll take you seriously
0/10
 
I lean towards Globox's view. Apple isn't patenting new information or even usability, they're patenting esthetics. Sorry, that's not what the patent office is for.
 
vertices said:
They created a company. They created many products with tight integration between software and hardware. As a whole, the entire enchilada with all hardware and software, is unique. The total package and ecosystem is unique. This is what people buy. This is what has made them billions and will continue to do so. This ecosystem they have created is what now has every single tech company out there trying to copy it.

It's amazing to me how difficult this it to understand for some people.
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When people try to compare PC/Android/WinPhone vs. Mac/iOS suddenly it gets watered down into hardware and only hardware. It's like getting into a price argument between two cars with identical HP/0-60/Nurburgring lap times and throwing every other factor out or not being able to figure out why the exact same house costs $1 million+ in the Chicago suburbs vs. $300k in like Minnesota.
 
Nicterys said:
When people try to compare PC/Android/WinPhone vs. Mac/iOS suddenly it gets watered down into hardware and only hardware. It's like getting into a price argument between two cars with identical HP/0-60/Nurburgring lap times and throwing every other factor out or not being able to figure out why the exact same house costs $1 million+ in the Chicago suburbs vs. $300k in like Minnesota.
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Exactly. If all you care about is a computer's CPU speed and hard drive size, then you need to thank Intel and Western Digital, because HP didn't have anything to do with that shit.

Apple is one company that actually builds a computer, making it more than just the sum of its parts. If you don't care about design and usability, don't buy Apple, and I'm sure they'll cry all the way to the bank.
 
ScottSwing said:
Exactly. If all you care about is a computer's CPU speed and hard drive size, then you need to thank Intel and Western Digital, because HP didn't have anything to do with that shit.

Apple is one company that actually builds a computer, making it more than just the sum of its parts. If you don't care about design and usability, don't buy Apple, and I'm sure they'll cry all the way to the bank.
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well said, modifying the aftermarket parts makes for a good time too
 
Nicterys said:
When people try to compare PC/Android/WinPhone vs. Mac/iOS suddenly it gets watered down into hardware and only hardware. It's like getting into a price argument between two cars with identical HP/0-60/Nurburgring lap times and throwing every other factor out or not being able to figure out why the exact same house costs $1 million+ in the Chicago suburbs vs. $300k in like Minnesota.
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Well, we are kind of on a hardware enthusiasts site. It should be expected. If you want to talk about how happy your Mac makes you feel, then Macrumors is only a click away.
 
FoxhoundOp said:
Well, we are kind of on a hardware enthusiasts site. It should be expected. If you want to talk about how happy your Mac makes you feel, then Macrumors is only a click away.
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Looks at both hardware in the signature, he has an enthusiast setup, I don't see why he doesn't have the right to talk about Mac here as well?
 
refraxion said:
Looks at both hardware in the signature, he has an enthusiast setup, I don't see why he doesn't have the right to talk about Mac here as well?
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I never said he doesn't have the right to talk about Mac here. It just seems silly to come to a hardware enthusiast site and not understand why people are critical of Mac hardware, or why all discussions boil down to that. Hardware is quantifiable. "User experience" and design in this case isn't.
 
I expect people to be critical of Apple here. But they really need to open their eyes and learn that hardware is becoming a simple commodity. It's not nearly as important as it once was. It's now all about software. Software reigns supreme, and the tighter integration you have between your hardware and your software the better. This is the reality. Look at mobilization, virtualization, cloud tech, etc. hardware is becoming less and less a factor. Outside of gaming, your average hardware spec today is more than fast enough to do almost anything that most people do.

http://online.wsj.com/article/SB10001424053111903480904576512250915629460.html
 
vertices said:
I expect people to be critical of Apple here. But they really need to open their eyes and learn that hardware is becoming a simple commodity. It's not nearly as important as it once was. It's now all about software. Software reigns supreme, and the tighter integration you have between your hardware and your software the better. This is the reality. Look at mobilization, virtualization, cloud tech, etc. hardware is becoming less and less a factor. Outside of gaming, your average hardware spec today is more than fast enough to do almost anything that most people do.

http://online.wsj.com/article/SB10001424053111903480904576512250915629460.html
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http://rixstep.com/2/2/20120711,00.shtml
 
Oh oh oh....</oh face>
42358752109383125340815.jpg
 
Magnus said:
I lean towards Globox's view. Apple isn't patenting new information or even usability, they're patenting esthetics. Sorry, that's not what the patent office is for.
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Aesthetic. And these type of lawsuits go on all the time in the fashion industry. the Apple/Samsung lawsuit reaching mainstream media because it was over billions of dollars. I know, there's a lot of blogs with former lawyers on staff, but that does not mean their opinions are always solid when it comes to law.
 
MJZ said:
Actually, this was highly called for. YOU'RE against the patent system - fine. But that doesn't mean ALL patents are invalid, especially ALL of Apple's patents.

Are you following along yet? Or are you still in High School?
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From a moral standpoint, ALL patents are invalid because they are a product of the collusion between crony capitalists and the state. Patents are little more than economic rent seeking that anti-competitive companies, such as Apple, use to stifle competition.

You can no more own a design or an idea than you can own the blueness in the sky or the chairness of a chair.
 
vertices said:
You couldn't be more wrong. Roll back the clock to 5-10 years ago and you'd have a case. Not so anymore. This whole idea of "cracking the case" and building it yourself is dying a slow death that will soon speed up. Yes it started with mobile devices, and has now moved on to laptops. Look I'm an enthusiast too. I grew up doing this shit, but the entire idea of having a box sitting by your desk with fully interchangeable parts that you can go down to your local computer store and pick up may be "alive and well" now but not for a whole lot longer.

Even in terms of automobiles, you used to be able to easily work on them yourself 25 years ago. Now on modern vehicles it's so difficult to do anything with them as they are packed so tightly. Even minor repairs can end being costly due to design. Open the hood on my 2011 F-250 Turbo Diesel and tell me what you are going to do to work on that. Same thing with Macs, you can upgrade the SSD in MBA, but yes it's a bit more difficult, requires a proprietary SSD, etc.

Times are changing. You don't have to accept it, but in 5 years or so you will understand what I am saying. You can sit back and believe that no one wants the vertical model back , but look at the current market caps of related companies.

Below is in Billions
Dell 18
HP 34
Amazon 117
Intel 121
Google 231
Microsoft 259
Apple 638


Apple and it's vertical market that “no one wants” has grown to be not only larger, but 50% larger than Dell, HP, Intel, and Microsoft combined with absolute no end in sight to its growth. This is at a time when all the big players of your horizontal markets are struggling. If this doesn’t spell it out for you not sure what will. Apple will be a trillion dollar company within 3 years.
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The iTunes store created most of Apple's market cap. Music, movies, TV shows and then mobile apps. Then the next biggest chunk is mobile devices.

The mobile market is subsidized, making affordable sales and locking in people for years.

The Desktop/Laptop market is not where Apple made the money to turn themselves into the new 800 pound Gorilla.

Joe sixpack cannot afford $999 - $2800 for a laptop and they can't get one for signing a contract to Verizon for 3 years and paying $75.

So in the end, I believe using Apple's market cap and top sellers from Amazon for laptops in predicting the future of Windows PCs is flawed logic.
 
VIC-20 said:
The iTunes store created most of Apple's market cap. Music, movies, TV shows and then mobile apps. Then the next biggest chunk is mobile devices.

The mobile market is subsidized, making affordable sales and locking in people for years.

The Desktop/Laptop market is not where Apple made the money to turn themselves into the new 800 pound Gorilla.

Joe sixpack cannot afford $999 - $2800 for a laptop and they can't get one for signing a contract to Verizon for 3 years and paying $75.

So in the end, I believe using Apple's market cap and top sellers from Amazon for laptops in predicting the future of Windows PCs is flawed logic.
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Your flawed logic is in failing to see the larger picture. Moving forward it is going to be about software, services, and ecosystems. The next 20 years will not be at all like the last 20.
 
vertices said:
Your flawed logic is in failing to see the larger picture. Moving forward it is going to be about software, services, and ecosystems. The next 20 years will not be at all like the last 20.
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I am referring to your inference PC form factor will change do to Apple's financial success. I am not failing to do anything except changing the subject.
 
Another thing that I find hilarious about Apple fan bois (as I post from my iPad) is when they actually put the apple sticker on their car.

Usually it's a Prius or a BMW 328.
 
damicatz said:

From a moral standpoint, ALL patents are invalid because they are a product of the collusion between crony capitalists and the state. Patents are little more than economic rent seeking that anti-competitive companies, such as Apple, use to stifle competition.

You can no more own a design or an idea than you can own the blueness in the sky or the chairness of a chair.
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Moral standpoint? :rolleyes:

Something that could be argued to the end of the Earth and beyond...
 
VIC-20 said:
I am referring to your inference PC form factor will change do to Apple's financial success. I am not failing to do anything except changing the subject.
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I stand by my original statement. I disagree that they are separate.
 
vertices said:
I expect people to be critical of Apple here. But they really need to open their eyes and learn that hardware is becoming a simple commodity. It's not nearly as important as it once was. It's now all about software. Software reigns supreme, and the tighter integration you have between your hardware and your software the better. This is the reality. Look at mobilization, virtualization, cloud tech, etc. hardware is becoming less and less a factor. Outside of gaming, your average hardware spec today is more than fast enough to do almost anything that most people do.

http://online.wsj.com/article/SB10001424053111903480904576512250915629460.html
Click to expand...

I agree, software really is our limitation at this point.
We have more than enough processing power to do just about anything we want, but it's up to us to make software/programs/apps that will be ultra-efficient at what we want it to.
 
vertices said:
Your flawed logic is in failing to see the larger picture. Moving forward it is going to be about software, services, and ecosystems. The next 20 years will not be at all like the last 20.
Click to expand...
You say this like it's a good thing. I fail to see how this benefits the informed, tech-savvy consumer in any way. The trend toward a "vertical" product strategy concerns me greatly. Apple, Google, M$, et al. all duplicating one another's efforts in so many spheres -- be it streaming media, hardware, software, mobile phones -- and force the consumer to use their version of all of the above, all in the name of "integration."

I feel we, the consumers, benefited much more when each one of those product categories was its own niche with a different company (or set of 2-3) dominating the field. This is one of the reasons I have never spent a dime on an Apple product -- because they were among the first to push this "integrated" model which I distrust so much. I have a self-built desktop with M$ OS, Dell laptop, HTC phone with Google OS, use third-party browsers, own an off-brand TV... and would like to keep things that way. The day I have to entrust one single mega-corporation with all of the above in order to have a decent user experience will be a sad one. And it's certainly not efficient, either.
 
brettjrob said:
You say this like it's a good thing. I fail to see how this benefits the informed, tech-savvy consumer in any way. The trend toward a "vertical" product strategy concerns me greatly. Apple, Google, M$, et al. all duplicating one another's efforts in so many spheres -- be it streaming media, hardware, software, mobile phones -- and force the consumer to use their version of all of the above, all in the name of "integration."

I feel we, the consumers, benefited much more when each one of those product categories was its own niche with a different company (or set of 2-3) dominating the field. This is one of the reasons I have never spent a dime on an Apple product -- because they were among the first to push this "integrated" model which I distrust so much. I have a self-built desktop with M$ OS, Dell laptop, HTC phone with Google OS, use third-party browsers, own an off-brand TV... and would like to keep things that way. The day I have to entrust one single mega-corporation with all of the above in order to have a decent user experience will be a sad one. And it's certainly not efficient, either.
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I don't like it either and I never have. This current end game of Apple/Amazon/MS/Google, to use software as a service (and ultimately subsciption model monthly payments) for a device to access a cloud of your media/apps/everything is a throw back to using a dummy terminal to access a mainframe. Almost feels like computing is heading full circle.

Sure there are benefits but lack of ownership is downright scary. Miss a few payments, cloud provider gets sold/bankrupt/hacked, the devs stop support, screw up the sync, et.c and you could lose everything.

For some small examples, I didn't realize you couldn't re-download purchases from iTunes like you can with Steam, so I lost all the music I bought because I didn't back it up. (this may have changed when iCloud came out, haven't bought any iTunes music for a long time) Also I have a bunch of digital pdf magazines I can no longer open because the website I bought them from no longer exists, so I can't reactivate them. I get phone calls at work all the time from people asking if we can recover data from iPhones or iPods, because they did an update and wiped their devices or iTunes Library.

The idea for a "Personal Computer" came about for a reason. It seems like the world is forgetting why.
 
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