"Star Trek: Discovery" Renewed for Season 3

nilepez said:
IT's a fucking review of show. Jesus. Nobody is talking about politics.
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Why are you getting angry? You're acting like this is something new. Almost all professional reviewers judge shows by how woke the material is and not on the actual plot and characters merits.
That's half the reason why review aggregate sites are meaningless. The another half being the oneangrygamer type bunch who automatically votes 1/10 if a show has a female protagonist or gay character.
That's why I don't trust RT, or any aggregate score site.
 
M76 said:
Why are you getting angry? You're acting like this is something new. Almost all professional reviewers judge shows by how woke the material is and not on the actual plot and characters merits.
That's half the reason why review aggregate sites are meaningless. The another half being the oneangrygamer type bunch who automatically votes 1/10 if a show has a female protagonist or gay character.
That's why I don't trust RT, or any aggregate score site.
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I agree. I honestly put a ton more merit into reading opinions here on a show or movie, or facebook posts more than any professional reviewer or review sites. After watching things like steam review bombing, i cant imagine a similar thing doesnt happen for movies/shows.
 
Darunion said:
I agree. I honestly put a ton more merit into reading opinions here on a show or movie, or facebook posts more than any professional reviewer or review sites. After watching things like steam review bombing, i cant imagine a similar thing doesnt happen for movies/shows.
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Of course it happens, and it goes both ways. Or actually goes four ways if you know what I mean.
 
M76 said:
That's why I don't trust RT, or any aggregate score site.
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It seems like you used to be able to trust the audience average on RT until they started hiding 1/2 star (or was it 1-star?) ratings.
 
1_rick said:
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Gosh, how did they lose money on them and investors bailed on the fourth one? They just did so great with general audience once they left those stuck in the past boomer fans. It's a mistery.
 
Derangel said:
I’ve listed multiple. It’s already renewed, they’ve already started casting for S2, general audience response is positive. This is all after one episode. You can’t call a show a “flop” after a single episode because it takes longer to see what the over-all trend is.

Despite being terrible, STD is headed into its third season. Not really sure that can count as a flop either. Unless they’re just sinking money into it hoping it boosts All Access subs.
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You're right, I can't say Picard flopped, I predict it will soon enough. And if it doesn't by some miracle, it will still remain a terrible (anti-)ST show, whether you care about that or not.

As for the STD, how is it even debatable? You really think Netflix would bail the first chance they got if the show was profitable? Or that CBS would hide the numbers? And that each new season takes more time to get renewed...
Just because they keep filming something doesn't mean they don't lose money on it or gain very small ROI, both of which are considered flopping for such large brands and investments.
 
nutzo said:
This.

Combined with their exclusive streaming is enough for me to never watch it.

It's not even worth the effort to pirate it.
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We have it in the UK both on Netflix and broadcast television (channel 5?). I really did try to get through the first season, but found it's not even worth a hate watch. There's just so much wrong with it. You can only turn it up to 11 for so long, and have so many weak plots... it's ultimately a massive bore.

Watch The Expanse, watch Picard (despite its flaws). Discovery is just episodic trash.
 
1_rick said:
It seems like you used to be able to trust the audience average on RT until they started hiding 1/2 star (or was it 1-star?) ratings.
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I never relied on RT, or Metacritic. The only rating I trust is a review, where I can judge the actual arguments pro / contra for the movie.
Would you refer to random strangers on the street to decide what you should watch ? Because if you trust RT you're doing that.

They should hide 10/10 scores and 1/10 scores both, because in 99.999% of the cases both are unrealistic.
 
M76 said:
Would you refer to random strangers on the street to decide what you should watch ? Because if you trust RT you're doing that.
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All I can tell you is that I found the viewer aggregate rating more useful to me than the critic score as a proxy for whether or not I'm likely to like a movie, or at least I felt like I could until they started suppressing bad scores.
 
nilepez said:
So if you, as a user reviewer are useless, and Pros are useless, then what's the point of this entire conversation?
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I didn't say user reviews were worthless. I said professional reviewers generally are because they are so far out of line with regular audiences that they can't be trusted. In fact, their opinions are almost always inverse of the general populace.
 
Meeho said:
You're right, I can't say Picard flopped, I predict it will soon enough. And if it doesn't by some miracle, it will still remain a terrible (anti-)ST show, whether you care about that or not.

As for the STD, how is it even debatable? You really think Netflix would bail the first chance they got if the show was profitable? Or that CBS would hide the numbers? And that each new season takes more time to get renewed...
Just because they keep filming something doesn't mean they don't lose money on it or gain very small ROI, both of which are considered flopping for such large brands and investments.
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I’m not ready to make a call on Picard’s quality either way, yet. Voyager is basically my barometer here. As long as it’s better than the average Voyager episode I’ll stick with it.

Did you intentionally ignore my last sentence? If you’re going to argue at least make sure to read the entire post.
 
Episode 2 of Picard was fucking great, I was hooked the entire time and it went by so fast! The quality of it felt as good as a movie and as much as I love Picard, I always found him a little too sanctimonious over the years and to hear the admiral say to him, "the sheer fucking hubris" oh man I lost it, that was some fantastic writing. I'm glad they gave some more backstory to what happened on Mars too, that F8 or whatever android creeped me the fuck out so the actor did a really good job w/that. Definitely blows Discovery away and is shaping up to be a great show IMO despite some flaws (no show is ever perfect). As long as they stick to good strong writing like this and don't bludgeon us with politics (left/right/identity), it'll be a fun ride. Too bad some of the rusty old boomers who are fixated on hating anything new are missing out.

I think given Picards diagnosis, the show will end up with him dying a hero of the federation which would be fitting for his character. I also think what happened on Mars was the work of the Romulan Jaat Vash or whatever.
 
5150Joker said:
Episode 2 of Picard was fucking great, I was hooked the entire time and it went by so fast! The quality of it felt as good as a movie and as much as I love Picard, I always found him a little too sanctimonious over the years and to hear the admiral say to him, "the sheer fucking hubris" oh man I lost it, that was some fantastic writing. I'm glad they gave some more backstory to what happened on Mars too, that F8 or whatever android creeped me the fuck out so the actor did a really good job w/that. Definitely blows Discovery away and is shaping up to be a great show IMO despite some flaws (no show is ever perfect). As long as they stick to good strong writing like this and don't bludgeon us with politics (left/right/identity), it'll be a fun ride. Too bad some of the rusty old boomers who are fixated on hating anything new are missing out.

I think given Picards diagnosis, the show will end up with him dying a hero of the federation which would be fitting for his character. I also think what happened on Mars was the work of the Romulan Jaat Vash or whatever.
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I'm going to have to disagree with you here. I found the writing in the second episode to be atrocious. The story makes even less sense than it did after episode 1.
 
First Discovery is some junk serie. You've got every politically correctness you could hope for and more, and some basic improbable altogether mix of Star Trek old situations. Discovery is a joke ! Looks like some japanese cartoon from the 70s made serie.
After what I understood, Picard is oriented to provide some socialist agenda, only reason Patrick Stewart would have accepted. So this is far beyond political correctness, but I believe it will be so far that it would be weird and watchable, especially for Sci-fi, maybe even better if Patrick Stewart wasn't so old and kind of looks crippled and tired.
 
Need to watch episode 2 of Picard though. Missed it (Amazon Prime). Some people seem to say it's finally great...
 
Jandor said:
Need to watch episode 2 of Picard though. Missed it (Amazon Prime). Some people seem to say it's finally great...
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One thing that I have liked in both of the first two episodes is that Picard appears to get younger as each episode progresses. The earliest scenes of the first episode show him waiting to die, as he expresses near the end of the episode, but once he meets Dahj he starts to liven up (as much as an almost-octogenarian can).

The parts I had the biggest problems with were the dialog between the Commodore and her subordinate, which seemed like it was written by an angsty teenager, and carried over into the conversation between the Romulan covert operatives, and the entire scene on Utopia Planitia. The concept for the scene was fine, we've seen Starfleet taking advantage of synthetic labor before, most notably on Voyager in the episode Author, Author; however, the swearing on the part of the human workers combined with the way they filmed the violence felt to me like they were trying too hard to be edgy.

The Admiral's interaction with Picard kind of makes sense, so given the context I'll let the F-bomb dropping go, but the terrible writing about a handful of species wanting to back out of the Federation (which is a separate body from Starfleet) causing them to abandon their humanitarian efforts, while leaving it up to speculative viewers to piece together that maybe the Dominion War was harder on the Federation than anyone has admitted to in the new series so far, even though it wasn't that big of a deal when Voyager returned home or even given more than lip-service in Nemesis, bothers me.
 
Yep. It's getting better and builds on the story.
Actually Stewart is only 80. So he can manage to look older or younger. Knowing people doing their morning 4/5km run at 80.
 
5150Joker said:
Episode 2 of Picard was fucking great, I was hooked the entire time and it went by so fast! The quality of it felt as good as a movie and as much as I love Picard, I always found him a little too sanctimonious over the years and to hear the admiral say to him, "the sheer fucking hubris" oh man I lost it, that was some fantastic writing. I'm glad they gave some more backstory to what happened on Mars too, that F8 or whatever android creeped me the fuck out so the actor did a really good job w/that. Definitely blows Discovery away and is shaping up to be a great show IMO despite some flaws (no show is ever perfect). As long as they stick to good strong writing like this and don't bludgeon us with politics (left/right/identity), it'll be a fun ride. Too bad some of the rusty old boomers who are fixated on hating anything new are missing out.

I think given Picards diagnosis, the show will end up with him dying a hero of the federation which would be fitting for his character. I also think what happened on Mars was the work of the Romulan Jaat Vash or whatever.
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It was better than Discovery, but not great.
 
MrCaffeineX said:
One thing that I have liked in both of the first two episodes is that Picard appears to get younger as each episode progresses. The earliest scenes of the first episode show him waiting to die, as he expresses near the end of the episode, but once he meets Dahj he starts to liven up (as much as an almost-octogenarian can).

The parts I had the biggest problems with were the dialog between the Commodore and her subordinate, which seemed like it was written by an angsty teenager, and carried over into the conversation between the Romulan covert operatives, and the entire scene on Utopia Planitia. The concept for the scene was fine, we've seen Starfleet taking advantage of synthetic labor before, most notably on Voyager in the episode Author, Author; however, the swearing on the part of the human workers combined with the way they filmed the violence felt to me like they were trying too hard to be edgy.

The Admiral's interaction with Picard kind of makes sense, so given the context I'll let the F-bomb dropping go, but the terrible writing about a handful of species wanting to back out of the Federation (which is a separate body from Starfleet) causing them to abandon their humanitarian efforts, while leaving it up to speculative viewers to piece together that maybe the Dominion War was harder on the Federation than anyone has admitted to in the new series so far, even though it wasn't that big of a deal when Voyager returned home or even given more than lip-service in Nemesis, bothers me.
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I think if you go back and watch the TNG movies, the one with those aliens constantly rejuvenating themselves with their plastic surgery machines (can't remember the title because it was such a shit movie), the lead villain tells Picard the federation is dying because of the borg and dominion attacks and it's obvious things aren't so rosey. So some species threatening to pull out when the feds stretch their resources to the limit makes sense here given the fact that the federation is like a gigantic communist like regime that controls all the member states resources and how they're allocated.

Infact I wish they would deep diver into the subject of how truly bullshit an organization the federation really is with only the humans, Vulkans and Andorians being the masters while everyone else gets the illusion of equality but aren't. As a result i wouldn't mind seeing a civil war play out. I wish Picard would go this direction with him exposing all this and a short season long civil war breaking out but that sadly won't happen.
 
M76 said:
Making something worse than discovery would be quite the feat.
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Ok, yeah. Not much can sink to that level. Have you seen "Another Life" with Katee Sackhoff. It's a challenger for the bottom, and I think it's getting a season 2 as well.
 
I really wanted to like this show. Watched the first season and a couple of season 2. I think I missed the slight comedy portion of the original or the next generation. There was always a funny moment that broke up the tension. I feel like this went in a totally different direction.
 
5150Joker said:
I think if you go back and watch the TNG movies, the one with those aliens constantly rejuvenating themselves with their plastic surgery machines (can't remember the title because it was such a shit movie), the lead villain tells Picard the federation is dying because of the borg and dominion attacks and it's obvious things aren't so rosey. So some species threatening to pull out when the feds stretch their resources to the limit makes sense here given the fact that the federation is like a gigantic communist like regime that controls all the member states resources and how they're allocated.

Infact I wish they would deep diver into the subject of how truly bullshit an organization the federation really is with only the humans, Vulkans and Andorians being the masters while everyone else gets the illusion of equality but aren't. As a result i wouldn't mind seeing a civil war play out. I wish Picard would go this direction with him exposing all this and a short season long civil war breaking out but that sadly won't happen.
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So Mass Effect 1 but with Picard as Shepard? I approve.
 
Snowdog said:
Ok, yeah. Not much can sink to that level. Have you seen "Another Life" with Katee Sackhoff. It's a challenger for the bottom, and I think it's getting a season 2 as well.
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Another life would have been great if they didn't bring in all the bickering and shitty casting. The premise of the story is good but they screwed it up bad.


CptCabbit said:
So Mass Effect 1 but with Picard as Shepard? I approve.
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LOL I hadn't thought of that but yeah.
 
pendragon1 said:
lol @ citing rt critics reviews
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Dude, you've got people saying the people are wrong (except, of course the post himself, who is obviously trustworthy and an authority) and then saying, "Oh well you can't trust pros either." So basically we've got a bunch of guys saying, these shows suck, and you know it's true, because I said it.
 
Meeho said:
You're right, I can't say Picard flopped, I predict it will soon enough. And if it doesn't by some miracle, it will still remain a terrible (anti-)ST show, whether you care about that or not.

As for the STD, how is it even debatable? You really think Netflix would bail the first chance they got if the show was profitable? Or that CBS would hide the numbers? And that each new season takes more time to get renewed...
Just because they keep filming something doesn't mean they don't lose money on it or gain very small ROI, both of which are considered flopping for such large brands and investments.
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Link to announcement that they're dropping Discovery, because AFAICT, it's still gonna be on Netflix this year and given that S4 is already green lit, it's likely to be on there next year too.
 
Dan_D said:
I didn't say user reviews were worthless. I said professional reviewers generally are because they are so far out of line with regular audiences that they can't be trusted. In fact, their opinions are almost always inverse of the general populace.
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you're saying that, others are saying Users are useless (some both). Conclusion: no opinion is useful. I personally trust pros more than users. Prose said the last Maleficient was awful. Users said it was almost perfect. It was 2 hours of my life I'll never get back. Nobody (nor any aggregate site's score) is always right, but IME unless it's some genre flick that you love, user scores are less reliable.
 
nilepez said:
you're saying that, others are saying Users are useless (some both). Conclusion: no opinion is useful. I personally trust pros more than users. Prose said the last Maleficient was awful. Users said it was almost perfect. It was 2 hours of my life I'll never get back. Nobody (nor any aggregate site's score) is always right, but IME unless it's some genre flick that you love, user scores are less reliable.
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Or you just happen to be the exact opposite of almost all the rest of humanity the way professional critics are.
 
nilepez said:
Link to announcement that they're dropping Discovery, because AFAICT, it's still gonna be on Netflix this year and given that S4 is already green lit, it's likely to be on there next year too.
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Dropped Picard and pulled most of the funding for STD.

 
Meeho said:
Semantics. They didn't want to touch it after experiencing a nasty STD.
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Supposedly STD does get good views on Netflix (via their old view reporting method), but funding it over their own original series and splitting revenue with CBS just does not seem like the best of investments for them.
 
Derangel said:
Supposedly STD does get good views on Netflix (via their old view reporting method), but funding it over their own original series and splitting revenue with CBS just does not seem like the best of investments for them.
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It seemed like a good idea in the beginning, rightfully so as Star Trek was such a grand brand, but it didn't turn out that way, unfortunately. Star Trek and Star Wars should be money factories of which everyone wants a piece. Now they are both tainted. Star Trek 4 can't get investors, series are in constant production troubles, merchandise based on Prime and Kelvin universe doesn't sell...
 
I just hope Number One is in S3. Hoootttt

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