Star Citizen Selling A $900 Ship

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I love it. I backed it. Probably backed it a hell of a lot more than the vast majority of [H] users (though, undoubtedly, not as much as the biggest proponents of it). Privateer 2 is one of my top 10 GOAT, probably. I played every WC and have multiple WC CDs sitting about 4' away from me as I type.

I just don't like the direction things have gone. And regardless of the direction things have gone, I think it is likely that CR has seriously fucked up. Has mismanaged funds. Has promised things that are simply not possible to deliver without a significantly larger budget. Possibly done things of questionable integrity.

Yeah, I thought the idea when it was originally proposed was awesome. Saw how quick it got funded and figured I'd wait till it launched to buy in.

Now... it looks like a mess.

Chris Roberts might be a great game designer, doesn't mean he knows how to run a dev studio, or even a business in general. I want an awesome massively multiplayer space shooter with an economy and such... I don't want what appears to be a mismanaged mess that demands I buy more crap for a game that isn't even out yet. I don't mind rewards for backers in a game, so long as it's not pay2win(which unfortunately seems to be the case here).

Of course when I see discussion about the game, or people simply asking questions, there's always someone just making up crap about how game mechanics work, or percentages of NPCs, ships, maps sizes, and so on. It's not like they're guessing how things will work out based on established mechanics(nothing wrong with speculating), but they just pull it out of thin air and complain that anyone who questions it is a "hater". Yeah, that bolsters my confidence in the community for the game(not).
 
Ug, the amount of disinformation and/or dishonesty in this thread is amazing.

1. This isn't DLC. You can't earn non-free DLC for free in a game that is also sub free. Calling it "DLC" is completely dishonest.

2. There is no need to make this purchase. It is not mandatory, you can ... as stated above, earn it in game and only are required to purchase a package to play subscription free. These packages start at $45.00. Saying people are being asked to pay $900 to play a game is also completely dishonest.

3. The ship in question is not even close to $900. It's not cheap, I will give you that, but the ship is actually $400.00. The $900.00 package actually contains the equivalent of three completely different ships.

4. Not that you are buying a ship in the first place, but are donating towards game development and receiving a thank you gift in the form of a ship. For the last freaking time, you can spend $45.00 and play sub free and earn this ship in game FOR FREE.

5. Star Citizen is the most open game development in history. They have numerous update posts a week, every week. Any other game and its completely held to the chest and locked under NDA until the very release day.

Just because you can't understand why someone would want to donate this much money doesn't mean the game is some sort of scam. No one is being asked for anything and are constantly told that its not necessary, but they do it anyway. This doesn't make them mentally challenged, merely generous.

Seriously, with all these morons out there today saying that people aren't paying their fair share ... the fact that we have people willing to help out shouldn't even be a concern.
 
1. You're right, it's more of a pay2win micro transaction.
2. No one is saying it costs $900 to play the game, but instead of earning it in-game you can just buy it.
3. It's still $900.
4. Explain. Other people have been asked how the earning of ships in relation to time spent in-game happens, no one can explain. Obviously it would be ridiculous to be able to quickly earn such a ship as it would crap on the $900 that people spent. No one can explain it.
5. LOL. Bullshit. Any other game locked under NDA till release day? Read the damned thread, another crowd funded multi-million dollar game was already brought up, that isn't locked under NDA till release day. I've other independently developed games that have actually been finished, have developers giving updates. Chris Roberts is not the damned messiah of PC gaming, quit pretending he is.

See what I mean? These guys just make crap up. He could have just stuck with points 1-4, but no he just had to post a 5th that is complete BS.
 
I think CR saying - know what, not even going to justify this stuff with a response - instead, here is some internal, never before seen development stuff showing just a small part of what we are up to. More to come. That would have been terrific.
 
Ug, the amount of disinformation and/or dishonesty in this thread is amazing.

1. This isn't DLC. You can't earn non-free DLC for free in a game that is also sub free. Calling it "DLC" is completely dishonest.

2. There is no need to make this purchase. It is not mandatory, you can ... as stated above, earn it in game and only are required to purchase a package to play subscription free. These packages start at $45.00. Saying people are being asked to pay $900 to play a game is also completely dishonest.

3. The ship in question is not even close to $900. It's not cheap, I will give you that, but the ship is actually $400.00. The $900.00 package actually contains the equivalent of three completely different ships.

4. Not that you are buying a ship in the first place, but are donating towards game development and receiving a thank you gift in the form of a ship. For the last freaking time, you can spend $45.00 and play sub free and earn this ship in game FOR FREE.

5. Star Citizen is the most open game development in history. They have numerous update posts a week, every week. Any other game and its completely held to the chest and locked under NDA until the very release day.

Just because you can't understand why someone would want to donate this much money doesn't mean the game is some sort of scam. No one is being asked for anything and are constantly told that its not necessary, but they do it anyway. This doesn't make them mentally challenged, merely generous.

Seriously, with all these morons out there today saying that people aren't paying their fair share ... the fact that we have people willing to help out shouldn't even be a concern.

You are frankly just straw manning here, either that or you don't really understand the overall criticism. Of course no one is forcing anyone's hand to front the money for all the stupid little packages. No one is forcing anyone into the doors of Vegas casinos either, doesn't mean there aren't fucking plenty of laws concerning gambling or instances where gambling has ruined familes and what not. Some cultures completely disallow gambling altogether. Just because something doesn't physically force you to do something doesnt' mean it's automatically not potentially malicious.

Pretty easy example really so I don't know why you would come off saying something as asinine as that.

And while SC isn't entirely gambling, it's a lot like it, and they are clearly trying to continue milking the shit out of their whales here, interestingly enough these new high-dollar packages coincide with rumors CIG is about out of money. Go figure.
 
4. Not that you are buying a ship in the first place, but are donating towards game development and receiving a thank you gift in the form of a ship. For the last freaking time, you can spend $45.00 and play sub free and earn this ship in game FOR FREE.

Again the whole point of the criticism is that CR doesn't even have the makings of a true game here. The whole point is that this game may not ever come out, or if it does, will be in a form that does not reflect the promises CR sold people on. Nothing you posted shows that you even remotely understand the point being raised with all the criticism.
 
I think CR saying - know what, not even going to justify this stuff with a response - instead, here is some internal, never before seen development stuff showing just a small part of what we are up to. More to come. That would have been terrific.

OK...? If he actually had something to show that would disprove the critics right then and there he would have shown it, but he didn't, because he doesn't. I can't believe you just said that.

Instead he just wrote a fucking novel as to why all the critics are wrong and also bad.

Rest assured I think CIG is going to HAVE to release some kind of information or media regarding the status of the game pretty soon if the bad press gets any worse, and it will probably be a joke.
 
I think CR saying - know what, not even going to justify this stuff with a response

Pretty sure the haters would just go "OH LOOK, HE REFUSES TO COMMENT SO IT MUST ALL BE TRUE!!!!11". I don't think he can win at this point other than keeping steady progress on the game.
 
Pretty sure the haters would just go "OH LOOK, HE REFUSES TO COMMENT SO IT MUST ALL BE TRUE!!!!11". I don't think he can win at this point other than keeping steady progress on the game.

From the "haters" point of view they see that a fantastic opportunity to make a great game is on the path to being completely squandered. And that is not without sound evidence pointing to that view.

You on the other hand continue to hold blind faith for the game - whether through love of Roberts or just because you're sunk so much cash into the game it makes you sick to your stomach that you might have been strung along in a fantastic con.

A con that would enable CR continue paying for his fancy cars and mansions and sit on a throne with his VP wife, barking orders at his underlings to spend $8 million on shit like motion capture and making alien languages when the foundations of the game itself have yet to exist.
 
Pretty sure the haters would just go "OH LOOK, HE REFUSES TO COMMENT SO IT MUST ALL BE TRUE!!!!11". I don't think he can win at this point other than keeping steady progress on the game.

Or actually hiring a PR/Marketing professional that knows WTF they're doing and and filtering/tempering responses through that, rather than, you know, putting his apparently mouthy, loose cannon of a wife in that position.
 
Pretty sure the haters would just go "OH LOOK, HE REFUSES TO COMMENT SO IT MUST ALL BE TRUE!!!!11". I don't think he can win at this point other than keeping steady progress on the game.

After reading his "rebuttal" he should of just kept quite and issued a generic PR statement.
Instead we have something a pestilent child would write not a Founder of a studio working on a 100m+ title.
 
I guess con is the wrong word to use here. I genuinely don't believe CR set out to actually commit fraud.

The real sentiment here is simply that CR is just incompetent and is on track to completely squandering $90 million and the game that we all wanted will never come to fruition. Naturally the people that have a lot of money tied into this game are going to side with CR on any criticism.
 
While I have not backed SC or really have any involvement in it I did go and read a couple of articals on this. What I read is damn disturbing and if true will be the end of CR and SC in one good swoop. Of all that I read this one statement stood out and yes it is disturbing to take the word of CR after all that has come out.

However, many of you seem content to discard these allegations as false simply because Roberts says they're false, which is more disturbing than any claims contained in this article

Source:
http://www.forbes.com/sites/jasonev...hris-roberts-insatiable-ambition-is-to-blame/

The person(s) of subject Chris Roberts says it's false then the army of fanbois attacks anyone who speaks out about CR and SC. Just because Chris Roberts says it's false does not mean it is. I do suspect that after this latest shitfest that something will blow big time. That time is coming really soon now that there is former and "current" employee's who are now speaking out.

When this shit blows everyone will hear it.
 
Ug, the amount of disinformation and/or dishonesty in this thread is amazing.

1. This isn't DLC. You can't earn non-free DLC for free in a game that is also sub free. Calling it "DLC" is completely dishonest.

Agreed. It isn't DLC. DLC has been used by hardly anyone in this thread. It isn't DLC, it's P2W to fund the game. Sub free might be not quite correct though. Sub optional would be more accurate. You can (and people have) subbed right now. Even though there's no game. You'd think as the champion against disinformation, you'd be a little more accurate, eh?

2. There is no need to make this purchase. It is not mandatory, you can ... as stated above, earn it in game and only are required to purchase a package to play subscription free. These packages start at $45.00. Saying people are being asked to pay $900 to play a game is also completely dishonest.

Did anyone anywhere ever say you HAD to pay $900 to play a game? Of course it isn't mandatory.

3. The ship in question is not even close to $900. It's not cheap, I will give you that, but the ship is actually $400.00. The $900.00 package actually contains the equivalent of three completely different ships.

Equivalent of three different ships? Not really sure that's super honest. Why not say it's the equivalent of 10 different ships (Auroras). Or, better yet, say it's one ship with all the different modules you could have (which is super honest, because it's the actual truth).

4. Not that you are buying a ship in the first place, but are donating towards game development and receiving a thank you gift in the form of a ship. For the last freaking time, you can spend $45.00 and play sub free and earn this ship in game FOR FREE.

Yeah, the "you're not buying a ship, you're donating towards game dev" has been the battle cry of the kool aid drinkers for two years. Doesn't mean it's true, or even rational or realistic.

5. Star Citizen is the most open game development in history. They have numerous update posts a week, every week. Any other game and its completely held to the chest and locked under NDA until the very release day.

Lol, okay. Any other game is locked down until the very release day? You're drunk. You think SC is the first crown funded game? Hell, even before or without crowdfunding. I felt more involved posting on PS:T's forums than SCs. They provide updates. After they were getting reamed too much for NOT providing enough updates. Doesn't mean their updates aren't full of shit. Which I'd say they are given how much arguing there is about VERY BASIC game mechanics on their own forums.
 
Agreed. It isn't DLC. DLC has been used by hardly anyone in this thread. It isn't DLC, it's P2W to fund the game. Sub free might be not quite correct though. Sub optional would be more accurate. You can (and people have) subbed right now. Even though there's no game. You'd think as the champion against disinformation, you'd be a little more accurate, eh?



Did anyone anywhere ever say you HAD to pay $900 to play a game? Of course it isn't mandatory.



Equivalent of three different ships? Not really sure that's super honest. Why not say it's the equivalent of 10 different ships (Auroras). Or, better yet, say it's one ship with all the different modules you could have (which is super honest, because it's the actual truth).



Yeah, the "you're not buying a ship, you're donating towards game dev" has been the battle cry of the kool aid drinkers for two years. Doesn't mean it's true, or even rational or realistic.



Lol, okay. Any other game is locked down until the very release day? You're drunk. You think SC is the first crown funded game? Hell, even before or without crowdfunding. I felt more involved posting on PS:T's forums than SCs. They provide updates. After they were getting reamed too much for NOT providing enough updates. Doesn't mean their updates aren't full of shit. Which I'd say they are given how much arguing there is about VERY BASIC game mechanics on their own forums.

The apologists are doing the equivalent of sticking their fingers in their ears and humming their personal anthem to Chris Roberts, while calling every dissenting opinion ignorant.
 
I like how much effort and time Chris Robert spent writing that open letter. It shows that he really does care about the project. Also I believe now that there is some truth to what people are saying about Derick Smart and his scorched earth campaign. Why attack Chris Roberts' family, that is going way over the line and just shows how crazy that fucker is.
 
The apologists are doing the equivalent of sticking their fingers in their ears and humming their personal anthem to Chris Roberts, while calling every dissenting opinion ignorant.

Well considering most if not all of it is just a rumor or hearsay, from either derek smart or an ex employee that could just as easily make up lies as derek because they have an ax to grind and are out of a job for one reason or another, yes it would be pretty ignorant of anyone to take anything they say seriously.

Anyone that accepts rumors as facts is a moron.
 
Still hoping this comes out within a relatively reasonable timeframe, and that the 900$ ships won't take a year to grind for.
 
That's an expensive .jpeg. Hope they have a good printer to mount in on their wall.
 
Army of fanbois will tow that CR line and just deny it all just because the person of interests says it's false. Sheep comes to mind here and to be frank they will be led to slaughter. At this stage I see SC going down in flames.
 
I think it's funny how many people pass judgement either for or against SC. Is it going to exceed all expectations? Only if you have none. There's clearly stuff being done, it's a big project, and given that the scope of modern games just keep getting bigger, it's not a surprise they've set a high bar. Achievable? Who knows. I'm more of a "wait and see" guy than either an "it's AMAZEBALLS" or "it BLOWS GOATS" guy.
 
A lot of CR/SC critics, including 90% of the posters in this thread*, just got wtfpwnd. Because the primary source for their criticism is proven to be complete bullshit.

(* percentage pulled out of my ass.)

Oh, the complainers got wtfpwned? so the game is out?

The main complaint is 'where the fuck is the game?'. Rest are all extra. It's defenders that love the drama and yell derek smart, while not many other bother to care as long as the game is there.
 
A lot of CR/SC critics, including 90% of the posters in this thread*, just got wtfpwnd. Because the primary source for their criticism is proven to be complete bullshit.



(* percentage pulled out of my ass.)

Except the bulk of the criticism isn't even anything from the escapist article. I think you just wtfpwnd yourself.
 

Oh that's funny. The butthurt fans throwing a fit at forbes even though the writer there correctly referred to it all as allegations and claims.
[UPDATE 2: An army of Star Citizen fans have predictably started attacking me for writing this article. Bear in mind that I'm simply reporting on a report, and liberally using words like "allegations" and "claims." However, many of you seem content to discard these allegations as false simply because Roberts says they're false, which is more disturbing than any claims contained in this article.]
 
Oh that's funny. The butthurt fans throwing a fit at forbes even though the writer there correctly referred to it all as allegations and claims.

Pretty entertaining. Some of the posts you can actually sense the tears streaming down their faces as they wrote it.

The level of kneejerk defensiveness kinda reminds me of when some woman remarries, the stepdad starts happyhanding the kids and she takes the stepdad's side and gets angry with the kids. Just all consuming denial.

Regardless, CIG has just 9 days to come up with something spectacular for Citizencon to quell the discontent. The level of defensiveness and tone in Chris Roberts somewhat frenzied and childish reply makes it apparent that maybe not all the accusations of a poorly run operation are true, but enough was accurate that it hit some nerves.
 
What I find funny is when people criticize this game, and they have a right to - which I am not defending by the way, but completely ignore the fact that people spend way more trying to obtain useless skins for Counter Strike and plethora of other games.

I mean come on, $2400 for an AK skin? How much will a person spend if they were to buy crates and open them one by one instead of spending $2400...still a metric shit ton for something so useless.

At least the ships are actual ships which you will get to enjoy once they launch. I bet you it will be really hard to get bigger ships in SC even though they mention you can obtain them. $900 is a lot for sure for something like that which I would never spend, but someone can afford it I am sure.
 
Pretty entertaining. Some of the posts you can actually sense the tears streaming down their faces as they wrote it.

The level of kneejerk defensiveness kinda reminds me of when some woman remarries, the stepdad starts happyhanding the kids and she takes the stepdad's side and gets angry with the kids. Just all consuming denial.

Regardless, CIG has just 9 days to come up with something spectacular for Citizencon to quell the discontent. The level of defensiveness and tone in Chris Roberts somewhat frenzied and childish reply makes it apparent that maybe not all the accusations of a poorly run operation are true, but enough was accurate that it hit some nerves.

Oh right, because D Smart and his shrills have never been known to hit someone's nerves before without a shred of truth. People like you just want to see the world burn.
 
You are frankly just straw manning here, either that or you don't really understand the overall criticism. Of course no one is forcing anyone's hand to front the money for all the stupid little packages. No one is forcing anyone into the doors of Vegas casinos either, doesn't mean there aren't fucking plenty of laws concerning gambling or instances where gambling has ruined familes and what not. Some cultures completely disallow gambling altogether. Just because something doesn't physically force you to do something doesnt' mean it's automatically not potentially malicious.

Pretty easy example really so I don't know why you would come off saying something as asinine as that.

And while SC isn't entirely gambling, it's a lot like it, and they are clearly trying to continue milking the shit out of their whales here, interestingly enough these new high-dollar packages coincide with rumors CIG is about out of money. Go figure.

My god, you sound just like Jack Thompson when he tried to ban video games. In fact, I think he used your entire argument before congress. And I am the one using "Strawman" arguments??
 
Again the whole point of the criticism is that CR doesn't even have the makings of a true game here. The whole point is that this game may not ever come out, or if it does, will be in a form that does not reflect the promises CR sold people on. Nothing you posted shows that you even remotely understand the point being raised with all the criticism.

Criticism based on what exactly? Un-named sources that are likely just DSmart himself? Have you forgotten that DSmart has been at war with Chris Roberts since Wing Commander? This isn't criticism, its unfounded allegations made by a raving mad man that you are swallowing hook line and sinker. Anyone that has spent 10 minutes looking through the assets of the alpha between patches knows he is full of shit. There is a ton of work there.
 
As I said before, it would take a lot more work and money to fake what they've shown us so far than to do it for real. I mean 261 people taking a paycheck to produce smoke and mirrors and only about 2 discredited anonymous probably-faked sources claiming otherwise? And you believe the fakers?

Occam's Razor says its more likely that they're actually making a game. Anyone actually following Star Citizen's development would know. Anyone who played different builds of Arena Commander would know. Or reading the individual programmer's work threads. You just can't fake something of this magnitude.

So what real criticism remains? The only one is that the game isn't out yet. But they never promised the full game by now. Never. They only promised Squadron 42 by late 2014, and they changed that date at least two years ago. They've been setting the proper expectations for the release of Squadron 42 for at least the past two years. If you're one of the first few people to back the game in the Kickstarter days or slightly after, maybe you have reason to be upset, but not anyone else. If you found out about Star Citizen in the past two years, you're a troll, not a critic.

There simply is no other legitimate criticism that can be made about the management or release schedule of Star Citizen. If you are, then you're basing your criticism on discredited and faked sources.
 
Anyone who played EvE can understand this. Just in EvE you earned your ship, not just bought it (legally anyway..)...
These days I wouldn't bother rocking an expensive ship if I got back into EvE. 10-20USD real world value is more than enough for a kickass ship. Incremental differences to a $200 ship is not worth it, if you're going to get ganked/popped it's usually going to happen regardless of your ship capabilities. Most do not engage if it's a 'fair fight'.

I'd presume the same thing applies in this game too.
 
I think it's funny how many people pass judgement either for or against SC. Is it going to exceed all expectations? Only if you have none. There's clearly stuff being done, it's a big project, and given that the scope of modern games just keep getting bigger, it's not a surprise they've set a high bar. Achievable? Who knows. I'm more of a "wait and see" guy than either an "it's AMAZEBALLS" or "it BLOWS GOATS" guy.

^Like this guy says. I really hope the game works out, but if it doesn't and I've lost a $125 investment, then oh well. I've blown more money on dumber things.
 
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