SSD HDD shortages due to crypto mining

arnemetis

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I've been mining burstcoin since 2017, we didn't see a shortage back during the 2018 spike. I don't think chia will be anything like the eth mining and resulting in shortages. It's all about space anyway so ssds will be fine, large capacity drives might have a slight problem.
 

arnemetis

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Wait...

Is it SSD or HDD? I'm confused.
It would be insanely expensive and wasteful to mine with ssds. It's all about massive space, ssds are only used to speed up the plotting process which is done one time then the plots are just read thereafter. I don't see big miners buying up ssds just to burn during the plotting step.
 

vegeta535

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How much do people actually make off this? Last I check it wasnt worth doing.
 

arnemetis

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How much do people actually make off this? Last I check it wasnt worth doing.
The idea is that chia is about to make moves and may explode in popularity and thus it's actually profitable. I've got over 50k burstcoins, worth maybe $700 if I were to sell. I did it because I had extra space so why not use the empty space. The server was on anyway so it didn't really cost me anything. I like the idea because it uses far less electricity than gpu based mining.
 

Kardonxt

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How much do people actually make off this? Last I check it wasnt worth doing.
I suspect this is a paid article to try to build chia hype. I don't think it's even possible to trade yet so no one knows the value.

Their website pulls a $20 value out of nothing and bases their calculator on that. If it ends up being accurate their calculator estimates ~$13 per month, per TB of storage (unless I am using it wrong, I don't know much about chia.).
 
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sk3tch

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Likely has to do with Filecoin, too. China is a heavyweight in it.
 
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undertaker2k8

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Who knew my HW hoarding habit would turn into a money maker o_O, I have more storage in my primary system than I need (all those years of SSD deals)....
 

Zarathustra[H]

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This makes no sense to me.

The cryptography aspect of cryptocurrencies requires computational powers. I don't see how toy replace that with storage space.

Even so, can all these goddamn cryptocurriencies just go away please? They are really starting to get annoying, and the world is a better place without every last one of them.
 

sover

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This makes no sense to me.

The cryptography aspect of cryptocurrencies requires computational powers. I don't see how toy replace that with storage space.

Even so, can all these goddamn cryptocurriencies just go away please? They are really starting to get annoying, and the world is a better place without every last one of them.
It's not the space, it's the controllers on the SSDs. Seems rather ridiculous, but that's what they're talking about.
 

cdabc123

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It's not the space, it's the controllers on the SSDs. Seems rather ridiculous, but that's what they're talking about.
It is the space for many of these cryptos. Else someone would just emulate the algorithm on a fpga and destroy the network profitability.
 

Zarathustra[H]

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It's not the space, it's the controllers on the SSDs. Seems rather ridiculous, but that's what they're talking about.

Actually, that may make sense.

Many (most? all?) modern hard drives have hardware encryption accelerators on the controllers to encrypt all data written to them, that way instead of writing random data or zeroes for several days to secure erase them, you just issue the secure erase command, and it deletes the encryption key allowing for instant secure erase.

This kind of became a necessity in the multi TB drive era.

They must have found a way to somehow manipulate those hardware encryption portions of the controllers for alternate purposes. Maybe they flash a 3rd party firmware to them or something.
 
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Zarathustra[H]

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If it makes you feel any better this is just a clickbait article. And hdd mining will remain unprofitable.

Oh, I understand cryptocurrency just fine.

It's a huge speculative bubble that will never amount to anything, in the short term making those who are pushing it large quantities of money, but in the long term causing massive losses to those who invest in it. Much like a pyramid scheme

Bitcoin, ethereum, doge coin. None of them have any real future.

It's just a huge waste of electricity and massive inconveniences for anyone else who needs computer hardware, just so a few can profit from mining and pass it off before it all crashes.
 
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cdabc123

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Actually, that may make sense.

Many (most? all?) modern hard drives have hardware encryption accelerators on the controllers to encrypt all data written to them, that way instead of writing random data or zeroes for several days to secure erase them, you just issue the secure erase command, and it deletes the encryption key allowing for instance secure erase.

This kind of became a necessity in the multi TB drive era.

They must have found a way to somehow manipulate those hardware encryption portions of the controllers for alternate purposes. Maybe they flash a 3rd party firmware to them or something.
Decent insite on the workings of a hdd controller but you are extrapolating information from a incorrect post. If that was the case it could be done on a fpga with great success.

If anyone is genuinely interested the whitepapers are available for almost any crypto that isnt trash.
 

cdabc123

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Oh, I understand cryptocurrency just fine.

It's a huge speculative bubble that will never amount to anything, in the short term making those who are pushing it large quantities of money, but in the long term causing massive losses to those who invest in it.

Bitcoin, ethereum, doge coin. None of them have any real future.

It's just a huge waste of electricity and massive inconveniences for anyone else who needs computer hardware, just so a few can profit from mining and pass it off before it all crashes.
Your making assumptions on the economic impact of cryptocurrencies as a whole. I cant comment on that argument without diving into the management of fiats. Which is only a tad off topic compared to the (clickbait) article.

We shall see how crypto evolves in the coming years and I can tell you with certainty it will continue to hold some degree of value.

With that said if you are curious as to how these cryptos function there is decent documentation for many of them
 

Zarathustra[H]

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With that said if you are curious as to how these cryptos function there is decent documentation for many of them

Ah, my mistake, I misunderstood your post.

I have some limited understanding of the technical side of how they function. I am not well read there. Just at a layman's level.

The technical side of blockchain is interesting to me, but more so in how the concept can be applied to make other technologies more secure. Not so much for cryptocurrency purposes.

As far as crytptocurrencies themselves go, I find the discussion of their place in the market a lot more interesting, but in the end the ultimate effect is that it boils down to a way to scam older investors who don't understand what they are getting into, who buy out of FOMO, out of their money.
 

cdabc123

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Ah, my mistake, I misunderstood your post.

I have some limited understanding of the technical side of how they function. I am not well read there. Just at a layman's level.

The technical side of blockchain is interesting to me, but more so in how the concept can be applied to make other technologies more secure. Not so much for cryptocurrency purposes.

As far as crytptocurrencies themselves go, I find the discussion of their place in the market a lot more interesting, but in the end the ultimate effect is that it boils down to a way to scam older investors who don't understand what they are getting into, who buy out of FOMO, out of their money.
Regarding crypto as an investment, it would be difficault to strictly claim it to be a scam.

Btc and eth dont have a significant dev owned portion so you dont tend to see the devs manipulating them significantly to attempt to siphon money out (*cough* xrp *cough*).

There is however SIGNIFICANT portions owned and interest in the coins from governments. They arguably can do the same things. If you are trading any of these coins this should be known and plan for the manipulating parties to be able to drastically effect value on a moment's notice.

You also get significant manipulation on the reporting of cryptos at the markets are not regulated.

Compare this to stocks where despite regulation the manipulation still ocures. There are companies that can preform actions to allow this. And even market makers and brokers have participated. (Crypto exchanges have participated in manipulation many times in the past as well, in addition to up and disappearing with all the assets on numerous occasions.)

Take a look at gme. Still trading at 100+, has been HEAVILY manipulated and yet still holds significant value (far more then it "should") why does it have value? Because its nothing more then a ticker to trade on. Same with crypto for many individuals.

Crypto does however push abit beyond that. Payment processors for fiat have been historically terrible charging large fees, and holding payments to make money off the delay. Crypto is relatively clean, easy, abd cheap for moving money.

Its a market, you can trade it. As with every other market try to be well informed on what you are trading. If you would like to bet on its failure short positions are available with far lower fees then most stock brokers.

As for the demise of crypto. As we have seen in the past even after plunging large amounts it will eventually meet significant resistance. Crypto will never be worth nothing and the ones too lose on the market are the ones who took poor positions (like every market).

Theoretical quantum computers can defeat cryptocurrency so feel free to support the creation of such. I will do so besides you.

The mining scene this time around is nowhere near as diverse as it has been in the past. Mining profitability is supported almost exclusively by eth. If eth switches to a proof of stake algorithm then GPU mining will once again fall from profitability. I would have to say this is just about inevitable. My only hope is that hardware manufacturers (nvidia, amd, tsmc) are not left holding this bag (by overexpanding before this occurs). With that said all of the above have been expanding aggressively which could be vital for success in the future (unrelated to crypto)
 
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IndyColtsFan

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So, I purchased four 16 TB Seagate Exos drives in February for $325 each. On Amazon, they're now $500-$550 and on Newegg, $700-$900. :( Looks like the shortages are hitting, but SSD prices still seem OK.

EDIT: I saw an OoS Exos 16 TB for only $400. Still a pretty fast increase.
 
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DukenukemX

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Just like everything else in 2021, I won't be buying any computer hardware.
giphy.gif
 

ManofGod

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I have lots of SSD space already so I should be good. However, I am monitoring prices and will purchase another 2TB of space if the prices do go up.
 

MrGuvernment

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This makes no sense to me.

The cryptography aspect of cryptocurrencies requires computational powers. I don't see how toy replace that with storage space.

Even so, can all these goddamn cryptocurriencies just go away please? They are really starting to get annoying, and the world is a better place without every last one of them.
The world would be in the stone age with out blockchain and Crypto still, fact is Crypto is the financial future so accept it.

I do agree though, there are thousands of tokens that really are not needed and are just crappy rehashes of existing ones.
 

Zarathustra[H]

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The world would be in the stone age with out blockchain and Crypto still, fact is Crypto is the financial future so accept it.

I do agree though, there are thousands of tokens that really are not needed and are just crappy rehashes of existing ones.

The thing is no one actually uses crypto for transactions.

It has just become an investment asset. The only reason people are buying it is because of vague statements like "it is the future".

It all seems based on a house of cards and as soon as the "it is the future" hype dies down, it seems like the whole thing will crash, at least unless we see some real world transaction adoption.

The go was to do that with Bitcoin Cash and other efforts, but they seem to have gone nowhere. The only people who are actually buying things with cryptocurrencies are a handful of crypto enthusiasts.

If it is going to actually go anywhere you need more adoption than that.
 
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cdabc123

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The thing is no one actually uses crypto for transactions.

It had just become an investment asset. The only reason people are buying it is because of vague statements like "it is the future".

It all seems based on a house of cards and as soon as the "it is the future" hype dies down, it seems like the whole thing will crash, at least unless we see some real world transaction adoption.

The go was to do that with Bitcoin Cash and other efforts, but they seem to have gone nowhere. The only people who are actually buying things with cryptocurrencies are a handful of crypto enthusiasts.

If it is going to actually go anywhere you need more adoption than that.
More commerce then you are aware of occurs with crypto. Particularly in areas with a struggling fiat.

Could the usd become a struggling fiat?

Also when selling stuff I will take crypto 100% of the time over PayPal.
 

Zarathustra[H]

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More commerce then you are aware of occurs with crypto. Particularly in areas with a struggling fiat.

Could the usd become a struggling fiat?

Also when selling stuff I will take crypto 100% of the time over PayPal.

For most people crypto is way too volatile to be a useful currency. Believe it or not, there is something to be said for having strong central bank management.

You are an extreme outlier here. One of the crypto enthusiasts mentioned above. Once you get the general public to be interested in using crypto for regular transactions, it might go somewhere, but until then it is just a gambling instrument based on nothing, and open to collapse at any moment, as soon as peoples opinions on whether or not it has any value change.
 

Zarathustra[H]

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More commerce then you are aware of occurs with crypto. Particularly in areas with a struggling fiat.

Could the usd become a struggling fiat?

Also when selling stuff I will take crypto 100% of the time over PayPal.

Also, cryptocurrencies are very poorly suited to take over from FIAT currencies.

Their "limited quantity" winds up being more of a problem than an assets. Many people who are into crypto see the fact that governments "can't print money" as a good thing, but it is actually a liability.

You don't want to have excessive inflation, but having a low and stable rate of inflation is absolutely crucial for the economy to function. Usually a long term average of about 2% is considered ideal and what central banks all over the world target. If a currency has no inflation at all (or even worse, negative inflation) it would seriously hurt the economy.

Crypto as a transactional means of abstraction (buy crypto with a real currency, use it to buy something, seller redeems crypto for real currency) can work, but having crypto take over for real currencies would be an absolutely awful idea.

As an example, picture getting a mortgage in some cryptocurrency. The cryptocurrency is in limited supply by design and as such will likely appreciate. Now you owe more on your mortgage as time goes on. In some cases a lot more.

Almost the entire economy, consumer and business depends on being able to utilize debt in one way or another. Being able to Actively manage the money supply to keep a low steady inflation is key to keeping the economy working, and you just can't do this with crypto.
 
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Sycraft

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Also, cryptocurrencies are very poorly suited to take over from FIAT currencies.

Their "limited quantity" winds up being more of a problem than an assets. Many people who are into crypto see the fact that governments "can't print money" as a good thing, but it is actually a liability.

You don't want to have excessive inflation, but having a low and stable rate of inflation is absolutely crucial for the economy to function. Usually a long term average of about 2% is considered ideal and what central banks all over the world target. If a currency has no inflation at all (or even worse, negative inflation) it would seriously hurt the economy.
Well some economists would argue that you don't want any inflation ideally, it is just really hard to actually have 0% inflation... but what you REALLY don't want is deflation. A bit of inflation is fine, or even good (depending on the economist you ask) for an economy. A fair amount of it is not ideal, but is workable. However deflation? Even a little is not a good thing. It chokes off spending, brings things to a halt. That is one of the arguments for running a little inflation (there are other good ones too) is it makes sure there isn't deflation. Well guess what? If you have something with a fixed supply, like a crypto currency, and pair that with a growing economy that means necessarily there will be deflation.
 

cdabc123

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Also, cryptocurrencies are very poorly suited to take over from FIAT currencies.

Their "limited quantity" winds up being more of a problem than an assets. Many people who are into crypto see the fact that governments "can't print money" as a good thing, but it is actually a liability.

You don't want to have excessive inflation, but having a low and stable rate of inflation is absolutely crucial for the economy to function. Usually a long term average of about 2% is considered ideal and what central banks all over the world target. If a currency has no inflation at all (or even worse, negative inflation) it would seriously hurt the economy.

Crypto as a transactional means of abstraction (buy crypto with a real currency, use it to buy something, seller redeems crypto for real currency) can work, but having crypto take over for real currencies would be an absolutely awful idea.

As an example, picture getting a mortgage in some cryptocurrency. The cryptocurrency is in limited supply by design and as such will likely appreciate. Now you owe more on your mortgage as time goes on. In some cases a lot more.

Almost the entire economy, consumer and business depends on being able to utilize debt in one way or another. Being able to Actively manage the money supply to keep a low steady inflation is key to keeping the economy working, and you just can't do this with crypto.
Let me clarify my position. There is no way for crypto to replace a fiat in a country like the us. Our ability to methodically "generate" fiat coupled with being one of the leading currencies and economies in the world is a huge advantage. It is perhaps one of the sole reasons we can abuse the creation of value without nuking the economies the usd participates in. Limited supply means almost nothing for cryptos. Even the ones generating significant amounts of excess coin do not significantly harm the value of the coins as the value is largely arbitrary. People stress "limited supply" for crypto far more then it matters. The methodical manipulation of coins with large dev or private party shares is a much bigger factor.

Please understand our "controlled" interest rate is perhaps more arbitrary then the value of crypto.

The strength of a fiat is to deep of a topic to accurately dive into.

However, it is interesting to view the role crypto plays in economies with a failing fiat. I believe you underestimate the value of crypto. It is fantastic for transactions bridging multiple economies. It alows value to be maintained in crashing economies in addition to being a fairly interesting market to trade on.

This is not even diving into the functionality of blockchain based applications which may grow coming into the future.

Crypto wont crash just because people "lose interest" it will crash in methodic ways when large stakeholders cash in. It will be extremely volatile by nature but it will continue to exercise a healthy existance for the foreseeable future. It may even play a large role depending on management of prominent fiats.
 
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hajalie24

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With Ethereum Staking (the new model that eventually will replace the GPU based Proof of Work model) you need not just a lot of drive space, but it needs to be an SSD to keep up with the I/O of the network. It also uses a lot of bandwidth so your data cap can't be too low. The upside though is it's a lot less power usage.
 

cdabc123

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With Ethereum Staking (the new model that eventually will replace the GPU based Proof of Work model) you need not just a lot of drive space, but it needs to be an SSD to keep up with the I/O of the network. It also uses a lot of bandwidth so your data cap can't be too low. The upside though is it's a lot less power usage.
Ummm no thats not really correct. Ethereum stacking is assigning value to nodes that hold larger stakes of the network. This means the nodes can complete a much more simple method of verification for the network. Nodes build "trust" with the network for correct results and time actively supporting the network.

All it takes to successfully "mine" a proof of stake network is the stake of funds and having a reliable node up. For many people it would most likely be best to host the node on a cloud provider as they can ensure close to 100% uptime.
 

sk3tch

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Anti-crypto always ends up being extreme black and white views. It's all investment, it can't be used for transactions, it will never replace the dollar - all of those things can happen simultaneously and crypto will be successful.

- USD will be fine
- Store of value via BTC is OK
- "Paying for stuff" via crypto will and is happening

Most rational people are balanced in terms of investments. Crypto is no different. I wouldn't put 100% of my savings in USD or in stocks.
 

hajalie24

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Ummm no thats not really correct. Ethereum stacking is assigning value to nodes that hold larger stakes of the network. This means the nodes can complete a much more simple method of verification for the network. Nodes build "trust" with the network for correct results and time actively supporting the network.

All it takes to successfully "mine" a proof of stake network is the stake of funds and having a reliable node up. For many people it would most likely be best to host the node on a cloud provider as they can ensure close to 100% uptime.

Well take a look at the ethereum website and /r/Ethstaker if you don't believe me.

You need to run the Eth1 node running at the moment. This is where the majority of the HDD usage comes from I believe.
 

MrGuvernment

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Zarathustra[H] You do know not all crypto have "limited" supply? And Crypto is easily poised to take over large portions of FIAT. Credit Card companies are already on board such as Visa. FIAT as i noted is not going anywhere over night, but digital currencies are already being pushed through in first world countries which will just integrate even easier.

https://www.forbes.com/sites/michae...rtup-that-raised-271-million/?sh=1b6782294b1f

Integration into the current economic system is not difficult and has been going on for several years.
 

Sir Beregond

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As of today, the nvme SSD's I was looking at grabbing hiked up $100 and is now just about sold out at my local Micro Center.

Mining is apparently doing everything it possibly can to destroy this hobby.
 

cdabc123

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As of today, the nvme SSD's I was looking at grabbing hiked up $100 and is now just about sold out at my local Micro Center.

Mining is apparently doing everything it possibly can to destroy this hobby.
hdd, and ssd mining is not really a thing despite what the misleading article is trying to imply.

burst is most profitably mined (still not profitable) on the cheapest hdd spinners one can find.
 

flegg

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people smokin something in this thread. outside of the deep dark web and offshore gambling there's no real transactions being done in crypto. even in "countries with failing fiat" crypto transactions are minutia and ephemeral.

crypto will continue in this state until one of the altcoins that uses good tech with low transaction fees, high security, etc (and hopefully staking rather than GPU mining) establishes itself as the winner in the current altcoin wars.

I suspect when that happens BTC itself will crash+ fall away and whichever altcoin wins will become THEcoin.

Maybe eth 2.0 or bitcoin cash or nano... but at this rate could end up being the digital yuan tbh.

And my money is on crypto spiking (BTC to like 100k ish) and then crashing hard as miners dump all their inventory (cards and coins) in a nasty feedback loop by the end of the summer. it'll come back again but hopefully with an altcoin winner this time not bitcoin trash
 
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