Sometimes The Grass Really Is Greener On The Other Side - Six Major Things I Think iO

Discussion in 'Smart Phones and Devices' started by Zorachus, Jan 17, 2016.

  1. Zorachus

    Zorachus [H]ardForum Junkie

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    Great article on Android Police, regarding the true differences between vanilla Android vs. iOS

    I thought it might be interesting to use my extensive experience on the Google side of the fence and apply it objectively on the Apple side to see if I could find areas where I thought Android could be improved. Sure enough, I found several key areas where I think Google could stand to borrow a page from the iOS playbook.

    http://www.androidpolice.com/2016/0...-things-i-think-ios-does-better-than-android/
     
  2. T4rd

    T4rd [H]ard as it Gets

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    Bless your heart, Zorachus.. you actually think we can have a rational conversation about this here..?

    Inb4 Mi7chy makes bogus iOS claims, baiting every iOS user/supporter into arguing otherwise, and ultimately getting the thread locked. Seriously, that just happened.

    Even if he wasn't here to troll us, someone else would be. Just look at the comments section of that article. I don't see this thread being any more productive. I think it's best to just leave this topic alone. We all know what we like and this isn't going to change anything.
     
  3. mi7chy

    mi7chy 2[H]4U

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    Threads don't get locked because people disagree. They get locked because people behave like children. Either agree, disagree or keep hush.
     
  4. T4rd

    T4rd [H]ard as it Gets

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    The problem is when someone (you, in that thread's case) make bogus/exaggerated claims, making it hard for anyone to not disagree or "keep hush", sending the thread into a perpetual troll-fest because no one will back down or admit to knowing less than they think about the subject.
     
  5. Trimlock

    Trimlock [H]ardForum Junkie

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    It has essentially killed the sub forum.

    Android works well enough but it's hard to compete with an OS that is the competitors money maker. The good thing about Android is they can rely on OEMs to incorporate new technologies to compete, it's one of the reasons why no one does vanilla android ... It just doesn't compete. I really wanted to like Android more than iOS BUT it just had too many faults, mostly to do implementation and the lack of control.
     
  6. T4rd

    T4rd [H]ard as it Gets

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    Only when it comes to these topics, I think. We just have to ignore the times when someone tries to derail a thread into an iOS vs Android debate that no one can ever conclude on.


    As with everything, it depends on what you're trying to do/control. I don't like iOS because of its lack of control over the file system, what apps I can install/sideload, how I share files and other things to people, my whole interface/launcher, etc. Plus I don't care much for Apple's hardware offerings either on the phone or tab side. I know you can overcome most, if not all of the above by jailbreaking, but if most/all of it is available natively in Android, it just seems to be a more logical choice to me. But I can certainly appreciate why anyone else would choose iOS in cases where it excels in areas geared more towards their preference as well.
     
  7. JMccovery

    JMccovery 2[H]4U

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    For me, if I wasn't all "geeky", an iOS device would be fine, as they do " just work"; but alas, a tech-head I be...

    As to the cross-device calling/messaging; the hilarious part is that Hangouts was supposed to remedy this, but the standard Android messaging app is still used, and I think hardware makers don't want to use Hangouts. Also, unless I'm just slow and haven't noticed any different, Hangouts Dialer only supports dialing from Google Voice/Fi numbers.

    As for OTA updates, if the carriers would just get the hell out of the way, things could improve.

    I do wonder where Android would be if Google was either the sole provider, or locked makers out of modifying it.
     
  8. Trimlock

    Trimlock [H]ardForum Junkie

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    I would like to reply to this in full but I'm currently mobile. I think this reply says all about people's current (and non changing) view of the landscape.

    Either way I'll respond in full in a bit.
     
  9. Trimlock

    Trimlock [H]ardForum Junkie

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    Ultimately this is what it still boils down to between the two major mobile OS's.

    One offers a stream line experience with ease of use and guaranteed freedom from OEM/Carrier specific bloatware. The big downside is being locked into an ecosystem that is controlled by one entity and not having varying options: Big screen or Small screen.

    The other offers two type of experiences:

    OEM: Not a lot of freedom, still more than non-jailbroken iOS but riddled with software you can no longer control. You are also stuck without much of getting any type of substantial software releases. You do often get cool additions such as super high rez screens, neat gimmicks like early voice control and integrated google maps.

    Vanilla: Lots of freedom, but it comes with some stigma's which aren't always true: Poor hardware and shitty battery life. Where you also get every software release you still have to wait on the carriers to release it, you could always flash it but that's an extra step that I think most users don't want to learn or bother with. A big pro to Vanilla is getting first access to all the updated Google Apps (although iOS typically get these around the same time, if not earlier).

    Vanilla Android is probably the easiest to use of the competition.
     
  10. Aurelius

    Aurelius 2[H]4U

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    The article is largely bang-on. Android is certainly more flexible than iOS, but there are things iOS users take for granted that Android users still don't get. Wait, you mean you have to wait months to download an Android system update, and your OEM purposefully abandoned you after a year because you didn't buy the more expensive model?

    Yes, Apple can do that partly because it has a much narrower range of hardware, but it'd be really nice if there was a way to streamline Android updates... at the least, save people the extra weeks of waiting for carrier approval.
     
  11. mi7chy

    mi7chy 2[H]4U

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    To be fair there are things Android take for granted such as stability and the reason why it has an uptime counter like unix vs iOS that can't get petty things like battery meter, alarm, etc. working correctly requiring constant updates to attempt to fix. So, frequent updates isn't automatically a positive point. Anyone who works with Juniper and Cisco gear can easily relate. We just want it to work the first time and run for years straight without having to update, reboot and disrupt service. And, Touchwiz Android has had features since 2012 if not earlier that Apple reintroduced as split view multitasking in 2015 so even if it wasn't updated in three years it's still more modern.

    http://www.macrumors.com/2016/01/16/iphone-6s-battery-percentage/

    Google Voice/Hangouts has had cross device calling, SMS and voicemail for years so I don't see what the big deal is. As a bonus it's carrier and phone brand independent and allows for free calling and SMS within North America. Clearly better than the limited lock-in that Apple provides.

    I can handicap Android to mimic iOS to extend battery life by playing around with "do not keep activities" and "limit background processes" in developer options but that would make my phone useless for the tools I need to run.

    Two different OS' that cater to different people. Android for up to power users while iOS is for the average Joe off the street.
     
    Last edited: Jan 19, 2016
  12. CHANG3D

    CHANG3D [H]ardness Supreme

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    I wouldn't say no one is making money from vanilla android. Motorola's resurgence is largely due to going vanilla. Right now Huawei is getting an international boost from Nexus 6P, but that may have to do with the hardware and price more over vanilla, don't know. But, honestly, just about anything is better than TouchWiz with few exceptions.
     
  13. Aurelius

    Aurelius 2[H]4U

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    Google Voice requires either creating a new phone number or porting it over (the latter costs $20), and it only works in the US. Google's number is free, but it costs $10 to switch numbers. Apple's system is completely free, functions worldwide and doesn't require doing anything special with your phone number -- as long as it's a valid cellphone number, it'll work.

    That doesn't make either approach better, just different. Google's is more flexible, but it's inherently chained to a specific number, country and online services; Apple's is specific to its products, but it's independent of your number and (if you're talking about Continuity-based calls and messages) internet connection.
     
  14. mi7chy

    mi7chy 2[H]4U

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    Continuum is useless for most people since it requires Apple hardware lock-in whereas Hangouts/Google Voice is cross platform.

    Randomly assigned Google Voice # is free and it does work internationally. I ended up paying $10 for a custom GV # since it's easier for people to remember and another benefit is it can be in a different area code than where I'm physically located so local free call for clientele in a different area. Also, Hangouts/GV has perks that's not obvious on the surface such as global spam call and SMS blocking, voicemail to text transcription that carriers normally charge for, etc. It's like spam filtering for email but for calls and SMS. Don't miss carrier # one bit as I always got interrupted or woken up by spam calls and SMS but rarely with Hangouts/GV. That's a service worth paying for but it's free and I save $$$ from dropping useless carrier SMS plan. Now if I can drop carrier voice plan since it's useless anyway and only keep unlimited data it'll drop my monthly bill in half.
     
    Last edited: Jan 20, 2016
  15. MrCrispy

    MrCrispy 2[H]4U

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    I'm a GV user for a long time and am now on Fi. Its just not as seamless as Apple's offerings and never will be. Google can't even make up their mind about a unified messaging platform, there's zero reason why Messenger exists, and no reason why Hangouts still has so many limitations.

    Google services are in general more feature rich and usable than MS/Apple but they simply don't care about consolidating the user experience on multiple platforms - their own apps on iOS/Android are inconsistent, they don't care about updates on Android, don't care about WP at all etc etc.
     
  16. Domingo

    Domingo [H]ard as it Gets

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    I don't disagree with anything in there. I owned 3 iPhones and am on my 2nd Android.
    There are most definitely things I miss about the iOS platform. He covers some of it, but there is still a layer of polish to iOS that I'm not 100% sure Google will ever recreate. Too often it just feels like Android apps follow the usual Google mantra of "get it to market, we'll fix it later." Yet too often they never get around to it. Either that or they never make the UI any better. Add-on laden launchers like TouchWiz make that even worse.

    I still can't stand how disconnected the different text apps are. Rather than having 3 Google-based text apps, how about making one really good unified one? I still can't get MMS pictures to send on Hangouts to normal SMS/MMS users. As soon as they fix it, the next update breaks it again. This is all the while they still have Google Messenger and Android Messaging updates, too.

    I love the flexibility (and drag and drop file functions) of Android, but iOS still has a lot of things going for it. If someone were to make something better I'd have no problem if either one crashed and burned.
     
  17. Climber

    Climber [H]ardness Supreme

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    This. I just stopped using GV and hangouts. Both are inferior to other options out there.
     
  18. mi7chy

    mi7chy 2[H]4U

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    It's not rocket science. Google Messenger is a carrier SMS app replacement whereas Hangouts is for merging Hangouts, Google Voice 10-digit calling + SMS + voicemail + transcription and carrier SMS. Was using Hangouts for everything but have since dropped carrier SMS since it's redundant and wasted money. Beyond mobile phone, Google Voice 10-digit calling is widely used with devices like Obihai as free landline replacement or as a business phone without having to run a local PBX. Hangouts is like Linux. Some get it and tap its usefulness. Others that can't wrap their head around it use something inferior.
     
    Last edited: Jan 27, 2016
  19. Climber

    Climber [H]ardness Supreme

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    Nice retort. You don't like what I like so you're stupid. What are we back in kindergarten?
     
  20. mi7chy

    mi7chy 2[H]4U

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    Some people actually want sensible solutions and not circle jerk nonsense.
     
  21. OEM

    OEM [H]ard as it Gets

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    lol...just lol
     
  22. Domingo

    Domingo [H]ard as it Gets

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    I want a 1- stop solution, which Apple has had for a while and which Hangouts (temporarily) is. I don't want to have a dozen instant messenger apps that do 95% the same thing. They already have the bundled Android app (and skinned launcher variants) in addition to Hangouts and Messenger.
    Google has more or less said that they plan to have yet another messaging app in Android 7, too.
    At this rate people are just going use Facebook messenger and/or whatever FB does with WhatsApp.
     
  23. mi7chy

    mi7chy 2[H]4U

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    iMessage and continuity reinvented a small subset of what Google Voice (now Hangouts) did in 2009 so it's not a 1-stop solution and 2014 is not something Apple had for a while. It lacks the following compared to Hangouts:

    - no free unlimited calls and SMS to North America without mobile plan
    - can't call or SMS on WIFI only without mobile plan
    - voicemail
    - voicemail to text transcription
    - doesn't have multi-line capability
    - global spam telemarketing call and SMS blocking
    - cross platform support for hardware and OS
    - carrier independence
    - can't use on a business or residential desk phone which is much more reliable than on a computer
     
  24. -Strelok-

    -Strelok- [H]ardForum Junkie

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    - My carrier has unlimited calls and SMS in NA, as does every other carrier so who cares about this
    - See above
    - Voicemail? iPhones were one of the first to have visual voicemail that you didn't have to pay extra for, so not sure what you mean by this
    - I don't care about this, but if they don't have it then I guess that sucks
    - Huh?
    - Never had issues with this since you can just add them to a block list
    - This doesn't even matter for most iOS users, but I can see why you have issues with it
    - I can use iMessage on any carrier I want. I used it on a prepaid carrier in Europe and it worked just fine
    - For the 5 people who need this, Google Voice/Hangouts will always be there for them

    Most of this is completely irrelevant to 99% of users. If it doesn't fit your usage, don't use it and be glad that Google is there to make 20 different versions of the same thing just for you.
     
  25. OEM

    OEM [H]ard as it Gets

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    Wait, you're serious when you say Android has an uptime counter because its more stable then iOS, aren't you?


    LO freaking L.
     
  26. mi7chy

    mi7chy 2[H]4U

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  27. -Strelok-

    -Strelok- [H]ardForum Junkie

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    This is even better. That website freezes my S6 for a bit, it's specifically made to crash a device. But keep trying to come up with arguments why Android is so much better than iOS. All you're doing is making a fool of yourself.
     
  28. Climber

    Climber [H]ardness Supreme

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    He's done that a while back. Although he edited his post so it doesn't make him as much of a douche but the tone and attitude of his post is enough. If we keep responding to his nonsense it's just going to end with yet another locked post.
     
  29. mi7chy

    mi7chy 2[H]4U

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    You really need someone to explain to you the difference between being able to close the browser vs it crashing the OS?
     
  30. -Strelok-

    -Strelok- [H]ardForum Junkie

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    The website is called crashsafari.com , are you being serious right now? It's specifically made to crash it. This is the dumbest "argument" I've heard yet on why android is better.
     
  31. mi7chy

    mi7chy 2[H]4U

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    Stop wasting your time with circle jerks and educate yourself with what a sandbox does.
     
  32. FrgMstr

    FrgMstr Just Plain Mean Staff Member

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    OK children. I am tired of this bullshit. Some folks have already been banned. When I see the REPORT POST feature used in this forum, I am coming in with a heavy hand, because you guys are wasting my time. If I wanted to be around juveniles, I would hang out at Major's house after school.
     
  33. CHANG3D

    CHANG3D [H]ardness Supreme

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    I'm an android guy who refused to move to Apple because, well, Apple. I got an iPhone 6 when TMo was having their locked-in deals last September. And there are a lot of things I want on Android in the iOS. But what I don't want is instability and frequent crashing that comes with Android. iOS is far more stable. I've experimented with jailbreaking, and bought $20 worth of jailbreaks, and I restored the phone back.

    I still just want Google Maps as my default map app, better home screen management and/or app drawer, continuity with other PCs, and would recommend that Apple give us bigger batteries instead of making the phones thinner. It's thin enough!

    As for what I want in android, a Nexus like experience is not bad. Timely security updates. Good camera. Good battery left. And smooth performance. Sense UI is like the only OEM skin that I could accept, otherwise as close to pure Google the better. I like what Motorola has been doing, and I hope more OEM follows.
     
    Last edited: Jan 30, 2016
  34. Trimlock

    Trimlock [H]ardForum Junkie

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    Yes to google maps, or at least a choice to use it as default. I love iMaps, it works very well but it is no where as accurate as the goog.
     
  35. -Strelok-

    -Strelok- [H]ardForum Junkie

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    I must have gotten really lucky or something, but I've never had any issues with Apple Maps. Google maps is good too though, it works pretty well on my S6.
     
  36. Trimlock

    Trimlock [H]ardForum Junkie

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    Apple maps isn't the abomination it once was, it's pretty good but it is quite out paced by Google in accuracy and updated info.
     
  37. CHANG3D

    CHANG3D [H]ardness Supreme

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    Apple Map's traffic report isn't as "live" as Google's. Also, you can't really move the map ahead to see what is farther in front of you. Sure, accuracy of the map without traffic is fine. But that quick traffic information is really important.

    Hell, I'll be fine with just the options in iMessage, contacts, and Safari to open maps with Google maps, without a system wide setting. I would be using Chrome if it had add-ons (y'all know the type I'm taking about.)

    P.S. Maybe we can now have an Apple thread that wouldn't be locked if not also removed. iPhone 7 is coming up...
     
    Last edited: Jan 30, 2016
  38. Aurelius

    Aurelius 2[H]4U

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    Pretty much. Apple's big problem was that it needed to ditch Google Maps to get features it wanted (Google wouldn't allow turn-by-turn unless Apple agreed to certain user tracking features), but underestimated how much effort it needed to produce a good-enough alternative. It was pitting a new, relatively small team with mostly off-the-shelf data against a company that had years of experience and thousands of staffers who could implement and verify information.
     
  39. Domingo

    Domingo [H]ard as it Gets

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    I've been off of the Apple platform for 2 years, but I actually never had any issues with Apple Maps. No more than Google at least. Both are hit or miss in non-grid cities (like Brussels and Boston) and pretty spot-on accurate in those that are.
    For me the main difference was just Google Maps tying to your Google account, which is nice for looking up older locations.
    I still think there are pluses and minuses to both platforms and would love if there was a valid 3rd option to push both of them.
     
  40. MrCrispy

    MrCrispy 2[H]4U

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    For me the main difference is that Google's platform and services are invaluable. MS is 2nd and Apple's offerings are a distant 3rd. Apple doesn't even compete in major areas, e.g. email, search, and there is no guarantee they will be around as the revenue is from the hw profit margins, not software or services.

    This is why everyone uses Google services when they can, there's no platform lock in and they are simply better (except for the voice/sms integration thing). So I'd rather use a phone designed for them, and it does make a difference.