Some Rebel XT questions

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n64man120

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After considering the purchase of an SLR for a while now, I had planned on using some money from my birthday and christmas this winter to fund the purchase of one. However, it seems I am being called to do otherwise...

I just came across an advertisement of a big show here in Boston this weekend, not sure if any locals are attending? http://huntsphotoandvideo.com/site/events.htm Anyways, on top of the huge rebates currently going on with Canon gear, the Rebel XT is being sold at the show by Canon reps at Wholesale Factory Direct Prices. Any speculation what this price may be, since the body is $899.99 retail? If it is a significant decrease in price, I feel it may be my civic duty to make a purchase on the spot.

Which bring me to my second question, if I decide to go with the purchase this weekend, lens'... Is the kit lens good for a starter or should I start straight off with the body and a different lens? Due to price and bulk, I don't think I'm interested in getting a telephoto lens right away. Aside from that, I don't have much of an idea what I should be looking for, despite my attempts at research. A nice all-around lens would be preferred, although I don't want to spent an exorbinant ammount for minimal increases in quality. I plan to shoot the city of Boston, both in day time and night, along with inside pictures of friends and such. Any suggestions for a good all-around lens?

I'm scrambling to learn as much as I can since this deal snuck up on me, any insight would be helpfull.
 
The 17-85 IS is a good all around lens but it's a little bit expensive at $600. A cheaper alternative is the 28-135IS, although it might not be wide enough to use indoors for friends. For indoors you'll want either a fast prime (50 f/1.8 or maybe 35 f/2) or a flash (420EX, 430EX)

Hm, I might check out the sale, but unless you can get a body + kit for ~600 you might be better off with waiting for a Dell sale and trying for a triple rebate. What's your budget for lenses and everything?
 
Any speculation what a direct from Canon price may be? I see I missed out on that deal earlier, but wasn't that an end-of-quarter deal so another one won't appear for a while? I haven't followed Dell deals with SLR's. Right now it's looking like $750 body, and $840 kit, is the best I can do retail online.

I'm having a hard time deciding what to do regarding lens. I don't have a budget per se, but I'm also a poor college student who doesn't want to spend more than he has to. Granted at the same time, it would be a waste to get a $800 body and toss a $75 lens on it. Also I'm not going to go out and buy a $600 L series lens, so I need something in the middle. I don't have a good feel for lens prices yet, to decide how much I'm willing to spend. Don't want to buy a crappy lens, but don't want to spend a ton at the same time, since accessories will be needed on top of all of this as well.
 
Man, I might have to go to a Hunt's store tomorrow (Harvard location) to check this out. See if I can get Nikon lenses for cheaper than over at BH and others (doubtful).

Anyways, I don't know what the XT would sell for at wholesale prices. I don't think the markup is very high from wholesale, so it might still pretty much be like $750 for the body, but I have no clue.

And there's nothing wrong with a cheap lens in the $80 range...you can get a 50 mm/1.8 for around that price (around $90). One of my favorite lenses. :D

It would also depend on what you'd like to shoot.

I like lowlight and night shots, so I find that I'm craving fast lenses, but price is a big factor, since dropping $800 - 1500 on a lens is pretty extreme for me, and I still have stuff to get like a tripod and head.
 
Sorry, when I said 600ish I meat after the triple rebate deal. I don't know how much the wholesale price will be.

Sigma makes some good lenses that are cheaper than Canon. Their 24-70 f/2.8 is supposed to be good, as is the 18-50 f/2.8. Those will both run around $500 a piece. For something cheaper, the Sigma 18-125 should give you a good range and it's less than $300. You'd want to pick up a flash if you wanted to use it indoors though.

Actually, my roommate might be selling his kit lens kinda cheap. I'll ask him... It's not a bad lens, but I sold him my 17-85 so he's ditching it. Depending on how much the kit and body alone cost (and how much he's selling his for) you might want to get them separate.
 
Doesnt the rebel have a pop-up flash? Or is it generally better to use another one sitting further off the body? I'm thinking $300-$400 AR would be the max I'd spend for a good lense. I like that Canon 28-135mm since it seems to have a large range, just questionable about close-up shots.

What are the differences between Sigma and Canon, just glass quality? Is there anything you lose with conflicts due to not having a Canon lens on a Canon body?

Also out of curiosity, I'd think that you would always want some small degree of zoom on a lens, although it seems alot of them are fixed at one size without zoom. Is that common? Just seems like it would be a bit inconvient to have no room to zoom in/out.

Edit: The tough part is this show is going to be a bit of a ride away, and I'm not available Sat/Sun so it's all or nothing on the price once I get there and find out. So i'm trying to gather as much info as I can now
 
The popup flash isn't bad, but a lot of times when you're inside you want to be bouncing the flash off the ceiling so the light source isn't as direct and you get some soft shadows. When I get home from work I can post some examples of the difference, it's pretty dramatic.

Canon usually has better quality control. With Sigma I've heard you won't always get a good copy. Same with Canon, but less frequent.

As for zoom vs. no zoom (prime lenses) the advantage to a prime is that for a low price you get a very large aperture (Usually f/2 or lower number) so you can get good low light shots without a flash. Also you get better at composition if you're stuck with one focal length. The down side is that it's less flexible and you can't do certain things well with certain focal lengths. For example, portraits with a 35mm would be tough, and indoor group shots with an 85mm would be equally tough. I only have zooms right now. It's more convenient, but fast (wide aperture) zooms are expensive.

Does the flier say that show prices apply at all the stores? If so, can you check out the Kenmore one?
 
Yeah, as the flier says at the bottom, prices apply at all 6 Hunt's locations, so it's not like you have to go out to Melrose (no way on earth I'm gonna drive up there just to look at prices).

The Kenmore or Harvard Square ones are much closer to you. The two girls that work at the Harvard location are also very cute. :p
 
What I'm thinking for now is that since I have a small point and shoot, I'll be more focused on a lens that will work well outside and not concern myself with situations involving small rooms. I can always get a wide-angle prime or flash in the future. Prime's dont seem like the right choice for me right now, since I'm looking for something universal and am not even completly sure what sort of subjects I'll end up primarily shooting.

The flier says sale prices are available at all hunt's locations. I'm going to either go to the Melrose store since that's where the show is, or hit up the Kenmore one since I can grab Taco Bell at the same time :p. The shows, and presumably deals, are 10-8 Fri/Sat and 10-6 Sun.

I'm going to look at some more lens since I'm attracted to the dexterity of the 28-135mm Canon you showed me, perhaps some Sigmas with similar specs. One thing that caught my attention, the 28mm end of that lens will be more wide angle than a 50mm prime, correct? I assume you said it would be an issue inside just because there isn't enough light available. I've got a weak understanding of f-stops, aperatures, etc... working on strengthing it.
 
Hahah, maybe I should go to the Harvard one after work tomorrow ;b
 
BillLeeLee said:
Yeah, as the flier says at the bottom, prices apply at all 6 Hunt's locations, so it's not like you have to go out to Melrose (no way on earth I'm gonna drive up there just to look at prices).

The Kenmore or Harvard Square ones are much closer to you. The two girls that work at the Harvard location are also very cute. :p
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Guess I'll head to one of them, I'm not too familiar with the city yet but I can figure things out. Kenmore is by the BU campus, correct? Not sure where Harvard Square is, but shouldn't be too hard to figure out.

Yea, umm, figured it out. Anyways, I wonder if there will be any other deals/vendors at the actual show that would be worth going to, or any other Hunts would work just as well. Harvard and Kenmore are both pretty close to me.
 
Are you on the E line of the Green Line? Catch it back in to Copley and then go out on one of the other ones to get to Kenmore. If you want to go to Harvard, take the Green in to Park Street and transfer to the outbound Red Line.
 
Yes, on a given camera, a 28 mm lens will provide a wider angle than a 50 mm. As you go up in focal length your angle of view decreases.

As for the 50 mm vs. the 28-135 IS canon. The typical 50 mm lenses from Canon are either 1.4 or 1.8. The 1.4 F stop version is also 3.5 times more expensive than the 1.8 version, and it's pretty much the fastest lens you can buy unless you somehow have the Canon F/1.0 lens (depth of field is incredibly limited with a 1.4 aperture though).

The 28 - 135 though, is a 3.5 - 4.5 aperture. The F/3.5 is on the lower end (28 mm), and that is slower than the primes with 1.8 or 2.8 apertures. This means the lens captures less light than the 'faster' lenses if other light settings like ISO were the same.

edit: ehhh, I guess I'll go to Harvard store tomorrow. Perhaps I can get a good deal on a set of tripod legs.
 
fugu said:
Are you on the E line of the Green Line? Catch it back in to Copley and then go out on one of the other ones to get to Kenmore. If you want to go to Harvard, take the Green in to Park Street and transfer to the outbound Red Line.
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Haha thanks, exactly what I was planning. So the F/3.5 isn't really ideal for low light, unless its held very still or on a tripod, of in-animate objects, correct? Not sure if I should just go for something like that for now, or try to get a lens that can do F/1.8 or F/2.8 now and not have to be fustrated by blurring photos at night. I guess I may be able to find something thats a 2.8 still got zoom, if not as much.

I shall be heading to Harvard, or Kenmore, as well :)
 
Here's my 2c

I'd start off with the kit lens, yes it's really cheap, but it will give you a good idea as to what you really need. After shooting for a little while you'll have a much better idea what lenses you need to shoot the stuff you like.

Here's a couple of lenses I use on my Canon Digital Rebel:

Canon EF 28-135 IS USM -- both IS and USM are very nice features, good alround lens

Tamron 28-200 XR -- A lens I picked up for $125 used from Ebay, very good for the money

Good luck with the camera!
 
Thanks for the suggestions, I'd totally agree with you if it weren't for these damn rebates. I could save an extra hundred dollars on the total purchase, if I bought a lens now rather than later. I guess it's going to come down to how much it's on sale for at the store.

How low do you see the body/kit go for from time to time, preferable in black? The best I see now is $840 from BuyDig, minus $75 rebate, so $765 currently. I need a number in my head when going to the store, since I'd like to hold off till Christmas, unless I could potentially save a hundred or two by buying now.
 
Yea I saw that dell has the body for 750, and kit for 840, before rebate. Still unsure which route to take there, but I'm not going to buy it now unless the body is sold for probably $650 or less during the sale, doubtfull?
 
At this point in time last year, the Digital Rebel (300d) cost a dealer $800 to get in stock. Then over the next 2-6 months after rebated ended the price dropped to around $600 or so as it was phased out.

My guess is that right now a Digital Rebel XT (350d) costs $750-$775 to get in stock, depending on the quantity a dealer orders. B&H sells the (black) 350d body for $790, and OneCall sells it for $830.


The "kit" lens sells for cheap since many people don't want to keep them around. You can buy the body only and place a WTB at FredMiranda B&S for the 18-55mm kit lens, and probably get it around $50 or so (~$60 shipped).
 
Pretty nice deal, I'd question the quality of that telephoto lens though? Is only having f/4.0-5.6 ok when its big outdoor shots, even if your shooting at night?
 
*confused*

What does the color matter when you're trying to shave every buck?

Buydig.com (where I bought my XT kit) has the silver body only for 746.00 - 75.00 rebate = 671 or the silver kit for 826-75 = 751 after rebate.

Be hard to beat that. Doubt any "show" could get much lower. FOr something like this,, shipping is probably cheaper than tax as an additional factor to think about.

BB
 
Yea I like the black look, but I'm not going to spend any extra money just to get it. I'm sure this BuyDig price should hold steady, so unless the "Direct From Factory" price is much cheaper, I might as well hold off for now.

Edit: My father has a SLR camera from back in the early 80's he still uses, a Canon A1 I believe? It's all metal and built like a rock, and he always says how good it's taken abuse over the years. Is there any concern of the plastic exterior of the Rebel making it weak and easily damaged?
 
n64man120 said:
Yea I like the black look, but I'm not going to spend any extra money just to get it. I'm sure this BuyDig price should hold steady, so unless the "Direct From Factory" price is much cheaper, I might as well hold off for now.

Edit: My father has a SLR camera from back in the early 80's he still uses, a Canon A1 I believe? It's all metal and built like a rock, and he always says how good it's taken abuse over the years. Is there any concern of the plastic exterior of the Rebel making it weak and easily damaged?
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The 10 and 20D models have a magnesium body but very similar components to the rebel series, but you'd naturally be paying a premium for a D camera. My rebel has stayed strong for the last 2 years but then again I don't throw it around either.
 
Well I called the Kenmore store this morning, to ask what the price was for the "3 Day Sale". I was told that they were selling it at retail price, with the $75 canon rebate, and another $50 rebate through Hunt's. Odd since that's not a 3 day sale price at all, even though I was told yesterday the body would be sold at wholesale price once Canon arrived and set how much it would be.

What do you guys think, someone's lying to me...

Edit: I called the show at Melrose, and they said they can't give me the pricing during the show, and I have to go and see for myself. I'm curious what the mark-down is there, since even though it says the sale prices should apply everywhere, Kenmore said it was being sold at retail price.

Edit2: Cambridge told me the 3 day sale price was the $50 off as well, and when I said "Oh that's it?", the lady went into a whole thing about how much of a steal that it. Blah blah blah, I wonder if the actual show has a price right from Canon thats a steal, or not.
 
For that price I might as well go BuyDig or Dell. The store said they'd pricematch, but then I have to pay tax on top of it.

Said 15% off Sigma lenses, and 15% off SanDisk cards, that may be looking into although I bet online still wins.
 
I'd get Sigma lenses from Sigma4Less.com - http://www.sigma4less.com

They'd likely try to sell you the 70-300 f/4.0-f/5.6 APO lenses at the show. But if they try to tell you they're better / worth more than Canon's lenses, they're BSing you. Some shops sell Sigma lenses with a huge markup over Canon lenses when the Sigma lenses really cost quite a bit less than the Canon ones. Still good lenses though.

Get a feel for online pricing of what you're likely to see there, and in the end decide if it is worth it or not. Enjoy the show...maybe a camera maker will have a booth there to play with their equipment...I gotta go...cheers.
 
Yea, I'm not sure if I'm going to the show now since the deal on the Reble isn't anythign special. I've been reading up on lenses alot however, so it may be handy going to try some of them out. Basicly trying to determine what sort of focal length I should get as a starter, along with how wide of an aperature I want. Then finally to go Canon, Sigma, Tamaron, etc
 
Well I've been doing some more research on lenses. I'm leaning towards getting a wide angle zoom for now, and then later on I'll pick up a telephoto once I get used to the camera.

Any suggestions for how wide I should go for general inside pictures of groups/friends, along with city scapes at night and day? I spoke with a 35mm photographer who suggested I get something as wide as 28mm, so that would be 18mm in digital. Any thoughts about this? I see alot of people praising the 50mm primes, it's just that I don't have any cameras with me to see what exactly these focal lengths look like.

I looked at something like the 28-130mm IS Canon lens, but it doesn't appear to be the sharpest out there, along with not being super wide. I would like some zoom however, especially since I'm not getting a telephoto right away. Any suggestions? Looking $200-$400 range.
 
I use the kit 18-55 for shooting inside of a house. It works great for general indoors shooting. For small rooms, 18mm can be invaluable for getting wide group shots. I've also done a lot of indoor shooting with my Tamron 28-200. It has worked quite well, but ocasionally a little wider would be nice.
If you want to shoot indoors without a flash, I'd look at canon's EF 28 f/1.8. Its a little spendy, but should work quite well for a lot of indoor stuff. The EF 50 f/1.8 is also very nice but is not wide enough for a lot of indoor group shots.
I own the Canon EF 28-135 IS USM, and although it is not as sharp as a "L" series lens or a prime, it is still a very good lens and produces very nice picutes. The IS makes taking pictures in low light without a flash easy. I've taken pictures at 1/13s that were very usable.
 
If you haven't purchased the camera yet (not sure if you have), I'd also suggest getting it with the 18-55 kit lens. It might not be the most amazing lens out there, but it's not bad, especially for around $100 - I have seen excellent shots with that lens. It's also probably the widest lens you'll have unless you pony up for the 17-40/4 from Canon or one of the super wide angles (Canon has that 10-22 mm lens), but those get pricey if you're just getting into SLRs and want some length from your first lens.

18mm is not bad, my Nikon 18-70 basically covers 28-105 for 35 mm cameras. A 28-135 lens might not be wide enough for you. At the widest end you only get the equivalent of 45mm FOV on 35mm film.

50mm is is definitely not really useful for wide angle shots, unless of course, you take some steps back. But you could do that with any lens. There are of course, situations where stepping back or forward isn't really an option :p

However, the 50mm has become my favorite lens to use (though I really love the 80-200/2.8 lenses too, when I was demoing them they were so nice!). Super fast lens, and at $100 it's probably optically the best lens you can buy at that price point. I usually just leave that on my camera and rarely use my 18-70 unless I'm in a situtation where I really need wider or closer shots. I'll probably be picking an 80-200 in the next couple weeks, but at 2 lbs, probably not gonna be my walk around lens. :p
 
Hmm, no I haven't purchased it yet. My main desire out of the camera is for city and nature shots, so a vibrant and sharp lens would be nice. I'm just concerned of getting something like a 28-135 and then not being as crisp as some other options, or wanting to use it inside for something and having to deal with it not being wide enough.
 
n64man120 said:
Is there any concern of the plastic exterior of the Rebel making it weak and easily damaged?
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Think about all of the "safety" and impact-resistant stuff that is made in this modern age with plastics... plastic is exceptionally resilient to bumps, etc. While it may creak a bit and deteriorate over extremes (time, temps, chemicals, etc) it is pretty freaking awesome for it's weight and price.
 
I'm starting to finalize my selections for my new SLR setup, however I've got a few things still unsettled I'd like to ask. I need everything from the ground up to get started. Here's my current plan...
Rebel XT -> B&H with rebate
Canon 17-85mm IS Lens -> B&H
Mack Warranties on Camera/Lens -> Compuplus.com
Lens hood -> B&H
Micro-fiber cloth -> B&H
2GB Kingston Elite CF -> Newegg
Tiffen UV Protector Glass -> B&H
Small Lowepro Bag -> B&H

Questions:

1) Any suggestions on getting just a cloth, or cleaning solution as well? Any reccomendations or will any of the options on B&H do just fine?

2) Suggestions on the CF card? I'm looking at a 2GB solution

3) The UV filter is only $15 compared to some others that are significantly more. Is the difference in this Tiffen filter, compared to others, going to noticeably degrade my picture?

4) Suggestions on which bag to get? I can't tell how deep of one I need once you have the camera/lens/filter/hood all attached. Especially since I can't find any dimensions on the lens hood.

5) Any money saving suggestions? The lens/camera on BuyDig is only $10 cheaper, that's the only other reliable place I've heard of with good deals. That and waiting for holidays for either a black friday deal, or some Dell deal. Perhaps some of the smaller items could be had elsewhere for less?

6) Anything I'm missing, as a starting photographer, that would be helpfull to get so I can go right out and start shooting?
 
I use Sandisk Ultra II cards.

I use B+W MRC pro filters. The 67mm one is about $50 from B&H.

Can you wait for a Dell deal?

Which bag? Once you start getting more equipment it becomes a factor. Top loading shoulder bags are easy to use, backpacks are easy to carry.

A CF card reader is nice to have. It's a lot easier than plugging the camera into the computer.
 
Do you think it's worth it to get the B+W MRC over a basic Tiffen lens, just for protection's sake? I can hold off for now, I'm having some help funding it as Christmas presents, so I have until then to get it. I'm thinking a top-loading bag for now, I'd like to get something quality and as small as possible. One I get a telephoto and other extras in the future, a new bag isn't a huge upgrade. And yes, I already have a CF card reader to use.

Thanks for the suggestions
 
It's always a compromise because you're spending $600 on a lens so you want to protect it, but at the same time you don't want to put a $5 piece of glass in front of it. Some guys don't use filters at all because it degrades the image quality and introduces more flare. I like having one for protection, but I figured I should probably get something decent so I'm not compromising the image that much. The multicoating helps to reduce flare compared to a plain UV one.
 
Oh, and I bought my 20D from buydig, no problems with them at all
 
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