So maybe I don't want Windows 10

polonyc2 said:
I'm perfectly happy with Windows 7 64-bit...only reason to 'upgrade' to Windows 10 is for DX12...I'll wait until the first DX12 title is released before upgrading...hopefully by then MS will have reversed course and made DX12 available to Windows 7 users
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There will be no new features in Windows 7, just security and bug fixes from here on out until 2020. They have already made that clear and no, it is not like Windows XP. Oh, and XP did not get DirectX 10. However, enjoy what you are using, that is fine. Me, I like to use all the OS's, old and new. :)
 
B00nie said:
Stop lying. Anyone can see that doing regular service tasks has increased clicks ever since XP. Simple functions are now hidden behind layers of needless abstraction and things have been moved to places where they didn't use to be. Extremely annoying and needless.
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I do not lie, I use personal, direct experience of an OS or item to base my observation on. You seem to use things, if you do, in ways that intentional complicate things, not the way the are at all.

Strange, I just right clicked the network icon that is on my Windows 10 desktop. So, lets see, right click, choose properties, network and sharing center opens up. Sorry but nope, you are dead wrong whether you deny it or not. I have said it before and I will say it again, I love what I do for work, love helping others and not trying to BS them into believing my inaccurate point of view.
 
I downloaded the preview last night. After install, and using it for several hours now I hate it. I will be removing the update from the 2 computers I was going to allow to update. I will continue to use the preview until it expires to see if I can learn to get use to it. If not I will run my windows 7 until it's not supported anymore. I will then be going completely Linux.
 
sam600sx said:
I downloaded the preview last night. After install, and using it for several hours now I hate it. I will be removing the update from the 2 computers I was going to allow to update. I will continue to use the preview until it expires to see if I can learn to get use to it. If not I will run my windows 7 until it's not supported anymore. I will then be going completely Linux.
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You hate it why? Sorry but, I am not really sure what you hate about it. Personally, I love it and it's monitor scaling works fantastic. Let me guess, it is not Windows 7?
 
ManofGod said:
You hate it why? Sorry but, I am not really sure what you hate about it. Personally, I love it and it's monitor scaling works fantastic. Let me guess, it is not Windows 7?
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I've actually not used 10 heavily until the builds that came out last week which made it much better for me on my Surface Pro 3 which I'm still dual booting with Windows 8.1 though I've not used Windows 8.1 much on it since last week.

Performance and stability seem pretty solid though battery life isn't up to snuff yet. The Edge browser in particular seems to something of a battery hog when compared to IE 11 modern though it does feel overall a faster and smother browser.

The new Start Menu solves most of the issues for desktop users related to confusion cause by the full screen Start Screen. However it does fell a bit bare bones. No ability to pin items on the left and no ability to sort All Programs like 8.1 had. There are just a number of little things that could be added like that and in other places. Assuming that Microsoft is serious about constant updates and improvements, it would be nice to see these little things added in over time.
 
heatlesssun said:
I've actually not used 10 heavily until the builds that came out last week which made it much better for me on my Surface Pro 3 which I'm still dual booting with Windows 8.1 though I've not used Windows 8.1 much on it since last week.

Performance and stability seem pretty solid though battery life isn't up to snuff yet. The Edge browser in particular seems to something of a battery hog when compared to IE 11 modern though it does feel overall a faster and smother browser.

The new Start Menu solves most of the issues for desktop users related to confusion cause by the full screen Start Screen. However it does fell a bit bare bones. No ability to pin items on the left and no ability to sort All Programs like 8.1 had. There are just a number of little things that could be added like that and in other places. Assuming that Microsoft is serious about constant updates and improvements, it would be nice to see these little things added in over time.
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Guess I had not noticed those things since I rarely used them anyways. I figure right now, stability is the most important function and those features will be added at a later date. For instance, I would prefer to have the full screen start menu open by default on start up but, at least for now, there is no option for that to occur.
 
magoo said:
Look, it's free. Won't cost you anything.
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But down the road it will. You only get support for life of the device, which is determined by Microsoft, 2 - 4 years max. I have a lot longer support path on Win8.1 so will be staying with 8.1.
 
Saturn_V said:
They're trying to side-step what happened when WInXP went out-of-support in 2014; and Win 7 goes off life support in 2020. MSFT took a lot of heat and negative press last year for pulling the plug on a 13-year old OS. :rolleyes:
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But they didn't really pull the plug, they still provide security updates to XP for the military so the real reason they pulled the plug was forced upgrade.
 
rezerekted said:
But they didn't really pull the plug, they still provide security updates to XP for the military so the real reason they pulled the plug was forced upgrade.
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Stick to your artwork, and leave the OS licensing reasons to the big boys.
 
ManofGod said:
I do not lie, I use personal, direct experience of an OS or item to base my observation on. You seem to use things, if you do, in ways that intentional complicate things, not the way the are at all.

Strange, I just right clicked the network icon that is on my Windows 10 desktop. So, lets see, right click, choose properties, network and sharing center opens up. Sorry but nope, you are dead wrong whether you deny it or not. I have said it before and I will say it again, I love what I do for work, love helping others and not trying to BS them into believing my inaccurate point of view.
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I never said this wasn't possible in Win10. I was referring to the new "improved" modern UI way of doing things. Modern ui puts layers of abstraction and extra clicks to everything. It sucks. You also completely disregarded the fact that post Vista UI has been a degradation instead of improvement as far as work efficiency goes. Especially if you consider that most OS users will never discover the start button right click functionality for example which somewhat fixes the flaws of the basic interface.
 
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Okay on day 2 of using Win 10. As I investigate trying to figure out how to do everything I want to do. I'm starting to feel a little better about it. A few things I still don't like: All MS apps already installed, Being tied to having an MSN Live account, MS's ability to collect data. Bouncing between Settings and Control panel. Yes I understand MS will be doing away with the Control Panel. I just don't feel it is as straight forward as Win 7. Don't even get me started on the appearance of it. It's like they let a 5 yr. old did the artwork. That being said I have discovered somethings I do like. Will continue to explore and hopefully learn.
 
I read a post on another forum where someone mentioned that according to a Microsoft blog that all drivers starting with Windows 10 have to be WHQL certified by Microsoft...is this true?...meaning no more non-WHQL drivers can be installed?
 
polonyc2 said:
I read a post on another forum where someone mentioned that according to a Microsoft blog that
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...my BFF Jill's sister heard that Tommy told his girlfriend that Billy's turtle fell into the...

:D

You're pulling our leg, right? I can't find that blog anywhere.
 
My very limited understanding is that WHQL means that the driver can be distributed through Microsoft Update, and this blog isn't talking about just WHQL drivers but other drivers too, and then I get completely out of my depth.
 
Holy mothballs Batman! All these complaints about control panel and things being tweaked and moved - I haven't laughed this hard in years. I do feel your pain though, simply because I used to be one of you. :p

Let’s have a look at the history of Windows through these eyes shall we?
*tongue-firmly-in-cheek*

DOS 5: "Oh yeah baby, this is the peak of technological power!"

DOS 6.22: "Bah, just another excuse to make a perfectly good system obsolete. Windows 3.11? - that just came bundled and I only use it to show off my new colour monitor. WordPerfect 5 and XTree Gold is all I ever need".

Win9x: "Argh, what the hell happened to DOS? It's hidden away and it isn't even true DOS. Who the hell uses a mouse anyway?"

Win2K: "Yeah it's very stable but it really won't run DOS anymore and some games and older software won't work".

WinXP: "Only 5 region changes allowed on DVD drive? Product Activation? and what do you mean my Win95 scanner drivers won't work? I will never use XP!"

Those comments above were actually my (or my friends) complaints at the time. It was about the release of Win2k that I actually got a job in the industry and around the release of XP I learnt that things will always change in this industry and either I learn to adapt and find new (often better) ways to do things or I will become a permanently miserable bugger.

Let’s continue shall we – not mine this time but I heard them (paraphrased) from customers over the years:

Vista: "More changes to the driver model? and application/security changes too? The developer of my favourite (unregistered) shareware died 12 years ago - what am I supposed to do now? No modern OS should need more than 512MB of RAM!"

Win7: "Um, yeah it has no more hardware requirements than Vista but I don't like that I have to have a big graphics card just for the desktop. I'm sticking with XP... plus I think MS are tied up with the RIAA/MPAA and might report me for my… um, legit music collection"

Win8: "Argh, the start menu's changed, modern apps are crap and I'm sure I'll have to use them and, and... Win7 forever! No, if I don't like it after 30 minutes, it's just not a good OS"

Win8.1: "Yeah, I read that they kinda fixed some things but the modern apps are still there and so is the start screen therefore it still sucks"

Win10: "I tried it for a couple of hours but things weren't where I left then in Win7. They said things would be different this time but I didn't think they meant - you know - actually different. The extra three clicks wore out my mouse and gave me heart palpitations from all the effort so I gave up and cried in the corner – although that could have been because I hadn’t found the new/best way to get what I wanted yet – no, that can’t be it... Also, I still hate the new apps and won’t use them but MS forces me to use a throw-away MS account if I want to use them – it’s not fair. I’m sure those other guys are lying to me when they say I don’t need an MS account if I’m using normal desktop apps because my cousin Pete told me that they are forcing me to use that so they can spy on me!”

Ah… good times. Great taste. :rolleyes:
 
polonyc2 said:
sounds bs to me as well...closest I came to finding anything close to what I saw posted was this...

http://blogs.msdn.com/b/windows_har.../01/driver-signing-changes-in-windows-10.aspx
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As someone who understands this process pretty clearly, that's exactly what that post is describing in some pretty excruciating detail. They have basically killed non-profit hardware developers. I hope that it doesn't negatively affect folks like Arduino.

Since I have Win10 on real hardware, I looked at the feature that allowed you to suspend driver signing for installing a driver. It's pretty straightforward to disable the signing to disable the driver but when you reboot in regular mode, it refuses to load the driver without a signature. The only way to permanently disable the driver signing verification is to put the entire OS into a debug/evaluation mode and you end up with a watermark on the desktop and Windows Update appears to stop checking/installing security updates.

All of that said, the blog post was from 1 APRIL so I hope there's something I'm missing but everything they describe in that post appears to be real as of build 10166.
 
Meathorse said:
<SNIP FOR CLARITY?

Win10: "I tried it for a couple of hours but things weren't where I left then in Win7. They said things would be different this time but I didn't think they meant - you know - actually different.
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like those before you, you are getting confused between different and better. :rolleyes: change for change's sake is not better. describe for me how it's better and you might convince me. how do these changes make my experience or a normal desktop user's experience better and more productive.
 
Windows 10 gave me bad eyestrain I don't think the drivers are optimized fore displaying the OS.
 
I can agree with you on the eye strain. you seem to be able to adjust the font size for everything, but what's displayed on the web page. yes I know you have the handy dandy zoom function. Problem is it leaves some pages okay while other are either huge. I tried the option I used in Win7 of ignoring fonts in accessibility which seems to do nothing now. I suppose I could actually put my glasses on HA!
 
If those screenshots I saw are legit, I don't want Win10. It's like Win3 but way worse.
 
Not a fan of it myself. The Win7 GUI is nice, the Win10 GUI looks like a mobile app and lots of websites are following that same design theme which is annoying to me.

However, it seems like they're trying to force peoples' hands by ending support for Win7 along with DX12 for Win10 only and other things.

Will have to jump eventually but will be sticking with Win7 indefinitely unless I try Win10 and they've actually done a good job.
 
Comixbooks said:
Windows 10 gave me bad eyestrain I don't think the drivers are optimized fore displaying the OS.
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Really? You must have an NVidia card then because I am having zero issues with my AMD based cards. Oh, and Intel on my Surface Pro. :) 4k monitor at home and it looks great, 2 x 1080p at work and also looks really good. (4K looks even better though. :D ) Or perhaps you are just really reaching?
 
Yah I do have a NVidia in that machine. It's one of my Linux machines. I slapped. another hard drive in it and unplugged the other drive to install Win10 on. So your saying their is a problem with NVidia drivers?
 
svet-am said:
As someone who understands this process pretty clearly, that's exactly what that post is describing in some pretty excruciating detail. They have basically killed non-profit hardware developers. I hope that it doesn't negatively affect folks like Arduino.

Since I have Win10 on real hardware, I looked at the feature that allowed you to suspend driver signing for installing a driver. It's pretty straightforward to disable the signing to disable the driver but when you reboot in regular mode, it refuses to load the driver without a signature. The only way to permanently disable the driver signing verification is to put the entire OS into a debug/evaluation mode and you end up with a watermark on the desktop and Windows Update appears to stop checking/installing security updates.

All of that said, the blog post was from 1 APRIL so I hope there's something I'm missing but everything they describe in that post appears to be real as of build 10166.
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This is a dealbreaker. I run several unsigned drivers on several Windows 8.0 as well as Server 2012 R2 boxes, one being pretty critical as it is a modded LSI driver that unlocks extra functionality not present in the vanilla driver - one of then being drive spindown.

In Windows 8 you could just temporarily disable driver signing, install the driver, and when you rebooted it would load the unsigned driver fine. Windows 10 appears that it won't even load the driver.

Things like low level disk tools, VPN software, image file mounting tools, ramdisk software - a whole slew of software will get screwed on this.
 
sam600sx said:
Yah I do have a NVidia in that machine. It's one of my Linux machines. I slapped. another hard drive in it and unplugged the other drive to install Win10 on. So your saying their is a problem with NVidia drivers?
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Possibly. So far, I have not had any eye straining experiences but, I have only used AMD so far and do not have any machine with a good Nvidia card to directly compare it too.
 
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