Should You Switch To Windows 10 Or A Mac?

[Deleted member 83233]

I used to rely on the phrase "Windows just works" because even with 8.1 it did just that... it worked. Day or night. Rain or shine. It just worked. Battery backup to keep brown outs at bay. External Hard drive for system images once a quarter only hooked up during the image. Cloud drive for documents.

The launch of Windows 10 tested that phrase to it limits because it stopped just working. I'll try 10 again here in a month or two after I file my taxes but not before.

I haven't had a single issue with Windows 10 at home or at work (we're piloting just on a few machines at work, but it's been solid so far). Just trying to get way out ahead of the support curve basically. I know that hasn't been the case for everyone though. There are a few things that annoy me about it, but I haven't had any failures yet.

 

[Darth Millennial]

I haven't had a single issue with Windows 10 at home or at work (we're piloting just on a few machines at work, but it's been solid so far). Just trying to get way out ahead of the support curve basically. I know that hasn't been the case for everyone though. There are a few things that annoy me about it, but I haven't had any failures yet.

It worked (and continues to) fine on the families laptops and tablets. The simple machines (Media PC, etc) but my gaming rig it cratered right to hell. I think it stayed up 10 days. Then one reboot later it never came back online. Went to reload using a base image. Video driver wouldn't make use of Eyefinity properly and since my monitors are in portrait that is an absolute necessity. I reloaded 4 times. I can't just turn that feature on I need to configure it properly. I got so mad I laid into my heavy bag for an hour. Finally I just pulled out my Windows 8.1 flash drive and loaded it instead. Everything has continued to be fine since.

 

[Exavior]

It worked (and continues to) fine on the families laptops and tablets. The simple machines (Media PC, etc) but my gaming rig it cratered right to hell. I think it stayed up 10 days. Then one reboot later it never came back online. Went to reload using a base image. Video driver wouldn't make use of Eyefinity properly and since my monitors are in portrait that is an absolute necessity. I reloaded 4 times. I can't just turn that feature on I need to configure it properly. I got so mad I laid into my heavy bag for an hour. Finally I just pulled out my Windows 8.1 flash drive and loaded it instead. Everything has continued to be fine since.

Your video card is Microsoft branded? I have never seen one of those before, where did you get it from?

 

[Deleted member 83233]

It worked (and continues to) fine on the families laptops and tablets. The simple machines (Media PC, etc) but my gaming rig it cratered right to hell. I think it stayed up 10 days. Then one reboot later it never came back online. Went to reload using a base image. Video driver wouldn't make use of Eyefinity properly and since my monitors are in portrait that is an absolute necessity. I reloaded 4 times. I can't just turn that feature on I need to configure it properly. I got so mad I laid into my heavy bag for an hour. Finally I just pulled out my Windows 8.1 flash drive and loaded it instead. Everything has continued to be fine since.

Yeah, that doesn't sound like fun. I've seen a few accounts of others having trouble like this, I just haven't seen it myself. Even on my gaming, media, GHTPC systems. Well, at least you got some bag time in. Mine's been hanging idle for a couple of weeks.

 

[ManofGod]

As they noted, the jump from Windows 7 to Windows 10 is not that significant if you are buying a new system. Going to a Mac makes sense in only one of their examples (in my opinion) and that is where you are already so heavily leveraged in the Apple ecosystem (iTunes, iPhone, iPad, etc) that you can leverage that integration. Otherwise Windows is still the most ubiquitous and flexible computing platform there is for the widest range of activities. (Full Disclosure: I just upgraded to a new computer this weekend and I did go with 64 bit Windows 10 for my Z170/6700K system)

How was the boot time with the M.2 drive? Was it a little slower than a regular Sata SSD like some have experienced?

 

[wtourist]

Windows 10 is usable. There are check lists for privacy settings.
I am on Sandy Bridge and AMD CPUs.
Edge looks like google. Have nor figured out hoe to pin web sites. Close"X" brings close all TABs.
Where is close one choice?
Want to play Netflix or Hulu, Microsoft says go to store for free "ap." Use left hand tiles play starts then windows gives error message "not supported" use desktop. Not sure what others.
Does this involve "java?"
Adobe Flash is included in W10, won't know till you try to install.

Control Panel can be a tile.

Microsoft Performance was not much but did show the effects of some changes. It is gone.

There a number of straightforward in 7 issues that 10 seems to hide, have not found a good cheat sheet. Odd. Microsoft or someone should make common settings changes easy to look up.

I do like 10 much better than 8 or 8.1.

 

[westrock2000]

Then it's time for a NAS or SAN perhaps. (provided the network infrastructure is in place) The most I typically do in a workstation is a mirrored set. I prefer bulk storage to be off of the local workstation.

Ahh, but now your off of Windows

Hence, my philosophy, use the OS that best fits the job...not need to have prejudice.

 

[kbrickley]

How was the boot time with the M.2 drive? Was it a little slower than a regular Sata SSD like some have experienced?

My M.2 is booting up in a matter of seconds ... if I hit the power button on my computer before turning on my monitor I am at the Windows 10 desktop by the time I power on my monitor ... if that is slow I can't even imagine how fast a regular SSD would be ... it seems to spend a couple of seconds on the Z170 motherboard logo and then goes straight into Windows ... 6-10 seconds max

 

[Aireoth]

I will agree with this in some ways. I still prefer to build my own for gaming and professional systems. However, if I was going to buy off the shelf, the Dell Precision workstations are pretty hard to beat. They're nicely built, have TONs of possible configurations. However, they are a little overpriced as far as per-component costs and upgrades above base-spec go. I'd still use one over a lot of what's out there though for simplicity's sake, and especially in a corporate environment. We have a ton of them for our engineers where I work, and have pretty close to zero problems with them. Plus, get 20 cores in there over 2 sockets, and that's a lot of power.

Cool? I am confused, you agree with the new Mac Pro being a joke in some ways, yet you go on to talk about the Dell Precision...

 

[Yakk]

Not Windows Free quite yet, still have a few games stuck on Windows. Switched to Mac & Linux for everything else.

Come on Vulkan!

 

[mi7chy]

Windows 10/8.1 is good for a desktop OS with the largest selection of professional software and gaming.

Linux is best as server OS and second best as desktop OS.

OS X is a niche like Windows Phone OS with the slimmest software selection.

 

[snowcrash]

The simple comment from me of "You're on your own with a MAC" answers the question in my circle of friends and families. It's unfortunate not a single person saw fit to be independent and go MAC instead of being sheeples with PC. Would make my life a lot simpler without the free tech support calls 24/7.

 

[nightfly]

It's a regression in functionality from both 7 (on the desktop) and 8 (on touch devices), it's unacceptably intrusive, and they still haven't fixed much of the UI stupidity left over from 3.1, 3.11, 95, 98, Me, NT, 2000, XP, 7, 8. .

FIFY.
Microsoft has always been about pointing out the shiny new things, and never bothered to get around to fixing the underlying problems. Sure, cheap memory and SSD's have hidden the flaws of the OS, but that doesn't mean they're gone. Programs still interfere with one another, freeze the whole damn thing, install files on top of other program's files so that the first one doesn't work right, not to mention windows rot. The impossibility of easily knowing what a program is doing when it installs itself is another; the registry was lunacy in the beginning, and still is. Lots of software installs stuff that runs all the time, and by default, seizes ownership of files used by other programs. Looking for something? Good luck. 'You do not have permission to access this' is a common warning box seen in Window, even though you're the only one who uses that computer. Why? Why do I have to jump through hoops to manage my own machine? When I got Win 7 it took me days to figure out how to remove all the crap out of windows that prevented me from setting it up the way I wanted to. I came to support forums, only to be told by the Microsoft faithful that 'Microsoft knows better than you do'. Uh, we all know that's pretty much a complete and utter lie; what Microsoft knows best is how to screw over it's customers to get more money out of them, and why should I want to be one of those? Programs hide information in the registry from the operators of the machine. Why would anyone think that's a good idea? Only benefits the corporations. Not the consumer.

I'll use windows only if there's no other option. Game machines are getting better and better, and if the software I need to use will run on linux, that's the way I'll go.
Apple is even worse than Microsoft, and more expensive. No thanks.

 

[steakman1971]

I use a Mac at work - no complaints at all. It's stable, has the software I need, etc. I love the trackpad - I think its much nicer than other laptop vendors I have used. For a productivity computer, Macs get the job done for me.
I have the new Macbook. Not a fan of the keyboard, but its light and easy to travel with. Miss the USB ports and can't use my Thunderbolt monitor with it. Not sure what Apple was thinking?

At home, I have servers running Ubuntu and my desktops run Windows 10. I love all the power and software available to Linux. I can ssh to my systems, use Xterms if I need to (which is rare).

Windows 10 works great for me as well. I mainly play games at home, but sometimes use office (if I forgot my Mac at work).

I really don't care when people tell me which OS is better. They all have their strengths and weaknesses. Shrugs.

 

[Disposed]

Now that I've gotten Playonlinux to behave, Mint is working well for me. No need to worry about Windows 10 anymore.

You'll be back... Once you realize that you only get 1 out of every 10 game releases on linux and you get half the performance of windows you'll be back. I like linux but for gaming its still pretty shit.

 

[heatlesssun]

FIFY.
Microsoft has always been about pointing out the shiny new things, and never bothered to get around to fixing the underlying problems. Sure, cheap memory and SSD's have hidden the flaws of the OS, but that doesn't mean they're gone. Programs still interfere with one another, freeze the whole damn thing, install files on top of other program's files so that the first one doesn't work right, not to mention windows rot. The impossibility of easily knowing what a program is doing when it installs itself is another; the registry was lunacy in the beginning, and still is. Lots of software installs stuff that runs all the time, and by default, seizes ownership of files used by other programs. Looking for something? Good luck. 'You do not have permission to access this' is a common warning box seen in Window, even though you're the only one who uses that computer. Why? Why do I have to jump through hoops to manage my own machine? When I got Win 7 it took me days to figure out how to remove all the crap out of windows that prevented me from setting it up the way I wanted to. I came to support forums, only to be told by the Microsoft faithful that 'Microsoft knows better than you do'. Uh, we all know that's pretty much a complete and utter lie; what Microsoft knows best is how to screw over it's customers to get more money out of them, and why should I want to be one of those? Programs hide information in the registry from the operators of the machine. Why would anyone think that's a good idea? Only benefits the corporations. Not the consumer.

I'll use windows only if there's no other option. Game machines are getting better and better, and if the software I need to use will run on linux, that's the way I'll go.
Apple is even worse than Microsoft, and more expensive. No thanks.

I think that 99% of what is called "Windows rot" is "crappy software". Virtually every messy Windows setup I've ever seen has a ton of browser toolbars, "Flash" players, supposed anti-malware or spyware tools, etc. When junk isn't installed on a Windows system they tend to run pretty well.

 

[kbrickley]

My M.2 is booting up in a matter of seconds ... if I hit the power button on my computer before turning on my monitor I am at the Windows 10 desktop by the time I power on my monitor ... if that is slow I can't even imagine how fast a regular SSD would be ... it seems to spend a couple of seconds on the Z170 motherboard logo and then goes straight into Windows ... 6-10 seconds max

Correction ... I just put a stop watch on it ... from a cold boot it was around 20 seconds

 

[Disposed]

I think that 99% of what is called "Windows rot" is "crappy software". Virtually every messy Windows setup I've ever seen has a ton of browser toolbars, "Flash" players, supposed anti-malware or spyware tools, etc. When junk isn't installed on a Windows system they tend to run pretty well.

I definitely remember windows rot with XP but have not seen it at all since vista.

 

[westrock2000]

Windows 10/8.1 is good for a desktop OS with the largest selection of professional software and gaming.

Linux is best as server OS and second best as desktop OS.

OS X is a niche like Windows Phone OS with the slimmest software selection.

I'm not going to say "everything" works, but anything I have ever needed to do on OSX that I was familiar with on Linux could be done. It is Unix after all.

However there are programs I use on OSX that cannot be used on Linux.

Heres a good example of some instructions...

Each version of iTunes can give you different results, but the general process is as follows:

1. Install WINE
2. Run the iTunes installer via WINE
3. Google and try to solve any problems you come across

That is not consumer friendly.....

 

[westrock2000]

I definitely remember windows rot with XP but have not seen it at all since vista.

I think you will see this on any operating system as the years go by and you add more stuff that you only need for a moment, but stays remnant forever.

It's not a fault of the OS, it's a fault of the user being a user of a multifunctional device.

 

[mdburkey]

I for one loathe Windows 10 -- but it is at least usable.

OS X I loathe even more -- and many of the applications I need to use and/or support simply either do not exist on the Mac or exist in totally dumbed down versions (e.g. Quickbooks).

Linux is a great server OS and is great for many things -- but as a full desktop OS, especially for someone like my parents, not a chance. I have various flavors of Kubuntu, Debian, etc running in VM's all the time on several machines -- one of my several "day jobs" is doing ARM kernel and device driver programming and porting (and occasional porting/modifications to the barebox boot loader). So, yes, I know Linux better than 99.9% of people do, all the way down to the kernel and bootloader levels, have done full LFS installs and full embedded setups from scratch, using PTXdist, Yocto, etc, and have been running, installing, and supporting it frequently ever since my first excited days installing Volkerding's first release of Slackware. That said, it still wouldn't be my first choice as a desktop OS, for device driver reasons if no other, and, under Linux, when I really NEED a device driver for something, I am one of the people who simply sits down and WRITES one -- but I prefer not to HAVE to do this on a daily basis (unless someone is paying me to! ).

Gripes with Windows 10:
1) It's fugly.
2) From a personal/home use standpoint, no Media Center -- which precludes it's use on any of my HTPC's (at least unless/until SiliconDust makes their DVR app usable with DRM'ed content).
3) The Control Panel/Settings screens are total confusion -- too many things are spread between the two different interfaces and finding stuff can be a royal pain. Control Panel still works much better IMHO and is far easier to use (especially in the "all items" view).
4) The new start menu is lackluster at best, but better than the Start Screen in 8 -- but I always load ClassicShell on everything anyway (and we have it deployed on every machine at work), so it doesn't matter an iota there.
5) The forced updates situation is untenable -- especially when the "updates" are like TH2 and actually UNINSTALL some of the software I had loaded, reset privacy options back to defaults, and basically change things without my permission. On the few Win10 boxes I currently have in use, I have just disabled the update service for now to keep this from happening again. Deferring updates is NOT good enough.
6) Privacy is a concern -- especially for many of the organizations I support who have to comply with HIPAA (and law offices, etc). Microsoft has finally, grudgingly given out an option to turn off all telemetry and feedback, but it requires upgrading to the Enterprise version (and they have thus far REFUSED to release HIPAA compliance guidelines for the Pro version) -- which effectively means that all the smaller practices I support now have to essentially purchase Windows twice (once in the form of the Pro copy that comes with the machine and then again in the form of the Enterprise copy through the VL channel -- which typically requires an initial purchase of 5 licenses, which is nuts for smaller medical practices that may only have one or two PC's total).
7) The so-called Tablet Mode in Windows 10 is a MAJOR step back from Windows 8.1 on an actual tablet -- and many Windows 8.1 tablet apps do NOT work/render perfectly on Windows 10 (even the Amazon Kindle "Metro" app isn't 100% on Windows 10). And, on a tablet, Edge is a major step back from the swipe version of IE on 8.1 (and wastes a ton more screen real estate too).
8) "Universal" apps aren't -- they should be called "Universally Useless". A good example would be the new SiliconDust HDHomeRun Windows 10 app version -- which totally sucks at playing back video from a HDHomeRun Prime because it can't access the MPEG2 scalar hardware for assisted decoding. It works fine in the actual PC version o View. It works fine in the Kodi plugin. But in the Windows 10 Universal App? Nope. With a full software decode, it basically takes a Core i3 to properly decode/display 1080p ATSC video -- which makes the app totally useless on any of my Dell Venue tablets, ECS Liva HTPC boxes, etc (all of which handle TV beautifully and smoothly with Media Center on 8.1).

For the typical home user, Windows 10 is probably ok; ugly, annoying, and with a lot of privacy concerns, but ok. But from a business standpoint (especially any involving PHI), Windows 10 is totally FUBAR.

So, in my mind, at least for now, the answer to the question is probably Windows 8.1 Pro+Media Center with ClassicShell loaded, rather than either of the two mentioned options.

 

[heatlesssun]

7) The so-called Tablet Mode in Windows 10 is a MAJOR step back from Windows 8.1 on an actual tablet -- and many Windows 8.1 tablet apps do NOT work/render perfectly on Windows 10 (even the Amazon Kindle "Metro" app isn't 100% on Windows 10). And, on a tablet, Edge is a major step back from the swipe version of IE on 8.1 (and wastes a ton more screen real estate too).

Not sure what issues you're seeing with the Kindle app in 10, works perfectly for me in 10 on tablets ranging from 8" 1280x800 up to the 13.5" 3000x2000 Surface Book. One thing that can cause an issue is using a scaling fast or other than the recommend one for a particular screen.

 

[ManofGod]

Correction ... I just put a stop watch on it ... from a cold boot it was around 20 seconds

Sounds like there are some firmware and initialization issues that need to be resolved. That is why, for the time being, I am going to stay away from the M.2 drives but, eventually, I will pick one up. Thanks.

 

[ManofGod]

I use a Mac at work - no complaints at all. It's stable, has the software I need, etc. I love the trackpad - I think its much nicer than other laptop vendors I have used. For a productivity computer, Macs get the job done for me.
I have the new Macbook. Not a fan of the keyboard, but its light and easy to travel with. Miss the USB ports and can't use my Thunderbolt monitor with it. Not sure what Apple was thinking?

At home, I have servers running Ubuntu and my desktops run Windows 10. I love all the power and software available to Linux. I can ssh to my systems, use Xterms if I need to (which is rare).

Windows 10 works great for me as well. I mainly play games at home, but sometimes use office (if I forgot my Mac at work).

I really don't care when people tell me which OS is better. They all have their strengths and weaknesses. Shrugs.

I love all of them as well. However, I cannot justify spending my own money on a Mac since I have already invested in a build at home, a build at work and a Surface Pro. I do run Ubuntu in a VMWare Player 12 virtual machine and it works well. I just do not like to dual boot anymore.

 

[Quix]

I think this comparison is ridiculous because it assumes that if you're going to buy a Mac you're ALSO going to run Windows on it too. What's the point of that? It's like admitting defeat right out of the gate.

 

[Trimlock]

It's awesome coming to the front page section and reading all the ignorant nerd rage

 

[kbrickley]

Sounds like there are some firmware and initialization issues that need to be resolved. That is why, for the time being, I am going to stay away from the M.2 drives but, eventually, I will pick one up. Thanks.

OK ... since my old system was E8400 based with no SSDs it took several minutes for that system to boot up ... I though 20 seconds was pretty quick ... how fast should it be, just out of curiosity

 

[Deleted member 245375]

The actual question is "Should You Switch To Windows 10 or OSX?" since a Mac is a computer capable of running many different operating systems even in spite of Apple preferring that you not do such things (and I can run OSX on my hardware if I happen to choose to do so, again to the detriment of Apple whether they like it or not.

As noted earlier and many times over the past year or so, Windows 7 has support till 2020 unless Microsoft pulls some dick move on us and drops it for some unspecified (at this time) reason or they continue to break support for newer hardware as recently announced with some Skylake and other future chipsets and architectures. I find their actions to be detrimental in the long run but that's just me, Microsoft user and supporter since the mid-1970s.

They're really starting to irritate the hell out of me with this bullshit related to Windows 10 and making some stuff retroactive for Windows 7 users (don't give a rat's ass about 8/8.1) but where there's a will there's a way (and a shitload of smart people who tear into this crap and dissect it and figure out which updates to make use of and which to avoid completely).

I still consider Windows 7 the best operating system Microsoft ever developed, from the first day I used it (first leaked beta way back in what, late 2008 or so) and still feel this way today and I've got no reason to alter my position. Windows 10 has no meaning or use for me, even in spite of being "free" of monetary cost.

OSX isn't going anywhere, of course, and neither is Apple but I'm not buying their overpriced lackluster hardware just to run their code when I can do that on hardware I already own.

As for Linux of most any kind (I do like Android which is of course based on Linux), while I've used it off and on since pre-Slackware 1.0 days so long ago I still find it pretty much unusable for my intents and purposes so I suppose that's a purely personal point of view - I'm sure it's fine for others, just not me.

 

[heatlesssun]

Oh, I agree, there are quite a few impressive Windows laptops coming out now. If I'm honest, I'm even quite impressed with the Pixel C purely from a hardware perspective. The new Surface Book is very cool too (though I'm a little skeptical of the hinge...) I'm not saying that there is nothing else out there in the same class as a MacBook. Just that people shouldn't rule them out because they don't like Apple. If you look at any large corporation you're going to see parallels to Apple. There's a stigma associated with Apple users too, and a lot of it is based in fact. However, they do make a good piece of hardware, and to hate it just to hate Apple is silly.

I think MacBooks are very good laptops but Apple over the last few years has been very slow to do much with the line, so much so that PC OEMs have easily caught up and even surpassed MacBooks in some areas. MacBooks were long heralded for their screens for instance, now they kind of average.

Got my Surface Book 97/16 GB/512 GB model on launch day. There's been much said about bugs and flaws in the screen detachment process and power control issues, and there certainly are some issues there that I've experienced though nothing to the point that has made the machine unusable for me as some bloggers have been promoting. But the design and build quality of the device are as good as anything ever made, even by Apple. I've found it interesting that so much has been made of the hinge. It is different and key element to the mechanics of the device's convertible design. Seems to work well. One interesting aspect to it besides the "gap" is that it can be picked up by the screen even with the keyboard attached. It's freaked some people out when I've done that.

 

[ManofGod]

OK ... since my old system was E8400 based with no SSDs it took several minutes for that system to boot up ... I though 20 seconds was pretty quick ... how fast should it be, just out of curiosity

I know that for my system, an I7-6700k, Gigabyte Z170X Gaming 7, Windows 10 Pro and 32GB of DDR4 ram, I can usually get 9 to 10 seconds or so. (This is with a 480GB AData SSD booting from hybrid shutdown mode.) On a previous AMD FX system, I could get it in about 6 seconds or so.

Honestly, I think that the Thunderbolt / USB 3.1 hardware causes some delays.

 

[Nolan7689]

People act like this OS is somehow fundamentally different than 7 or 8.1 was... it's not. It's still Windows. It still looks and works like Windows. Most of the control features are still there just like previous versions of Windows, plus a few new ones.

The largest actual change to the control panel is the requirement to initiate Windows Updates manually through the new Settings button rather than being able to do it in the control panel. But pretty much all other system tools are still accessible exactly the same.

Right clicking the start button also still brings up that awesome new context menu.

It's pretty much what people wanted out of Windows 8.1.

Would I be happy if the whole app thing just went away? Yep. Does it wreck my life or my ability to use my system? Nope.

But it has privacy issues and it takes further control away from the user in terms of updates.



Of course in all honesty the only reason my Desktop isn't running it is pure laziness. However my Surface Pro 3 will NEVER run Windows 10 again. I should not have to worry about a 2-3 hour battery life. Fuck even unused (screen off and sitting) Win10 would suck the battery dead in about 8 hours.

 

[kbrickley]

I know that for my system, an I7-6700k, Gigabyte Z170X Gaming 7, Windows 10 Pro and 32GB of DDR4 ram, I can usually get 9 to 10 seconds or so. (This is with a 480GB AData SSD booting from hybrid shutdown mode.) On a previous AMD FX system, I could get it in about 6 seconds or so.

Honestly, I think that the Thunderbolt / USB 3.1 hardware causes some delays.

Seems like there could be something wonky with the Fastboot ... turning the setting off seems to have cut the boot time by about 5 seconds ... I'll watch for bios updates and other enhancements over time ... still enjoying the new system though ... it is such a step up from my E8400 system

 

[MRAB54]

I've been on a mac for a year now for work. It's about as unstable as windows 98 - apps constantly hang or crash. They have 'force quit' as part of the main apple drop down because it is a feature that you will use plenty. Yet, none of the apple fan boys ever complain about it.

The 'finder' app is so terribly frustrating that I use the shell exclusively to get at files. The BSD-like OS is the biggest positive for me, however.

Also, good luck getting mac mail or calendar app to work correctly with an exchange server. Browsing samba shares takes about 15 times as long as on windows for some unknown reason.

I could go on and on. It is kind of ridiculous how they have become so popular.

 

[mdburkey]

I've been on a mac for a year now for work. It's about as unstable as windows 98 - apps constantly hang or crash. They have 'force quit' as part of the main apple drop down because it is a feature that you will use plenty. Yet, none of the apple fan boys ever complain about it.

The 'finder' app is so terribly frustrating that I use the shell exclusively to get at files. The BSD-like OS is the biggest positive for me, however.

Also, good luck getting mac mail or calendar app to work correctly with an exchange server. Browsing samba shares takes about 15 times as long as on windows for some unknown reason.

I could go on and on. It is kind of ridiculous how they have become so popular.

Ditto on this. My wife has a MacBook she has to use for work (school system). She was using it this weekend and it was crashing or hanging on her frequently -- just using Excel. And, even though it is a fast MacBook, it runs the schools database software noticably slower than the PC version does -- and something as simple as a macro based mail merge that works perfectly on the PC, doesn't work at all on the Mac. This is to say nothing of the fact that many of their student testing and scoring packages simply don't work on the Mac to begin with.

 

[mdburkey]

Not sure what issues you're seeing with the Kindle app in 10, works perfectly for me in 10 on tablets ranging from 8" 1280x800 up to the 13.5" 3000x2000 Surface Book. One thing that can cause an issue is using a scaling fast or other than the recommend one for a particular screen.

Are you using the tablet in TABLET MODE or in desktop mode?

On a Dell Venue 8, in desktop mode it basically works right (though if you actually enable full screen view from the new hamburger menu, it can be the devil to get back out of it), but in Tablet Mode, it behave rather weird -- especially on initial startup and there are many functions that you simply CANNOT get to to with the loss of Charms bar (unless you switch back to desktop mode). And, while, yes this is relatively easy to do from the Action Center toggle, having to switch in and out of tablet mode is a nuisance.

You also get into some really weird behaviors with the new pop-up keyboard handling when in Tablet Mode vs how it works in desktop mode (which disables the automatic on-screen pop-up, unless you set it to auto-activate on any text field, which causes even more weird issues).

Windows 8 apps that have not been rewritten for Windows 10 just haven't handled the transition all that well, especially with regards to the removal of the Charms bar, the new hamburger, and the odd differences in how they behave in Tablet vs Desktop modes.

 

[brettjrob]

To be honest, I think I liked 8.1 more for touchscreen use (on Surface Pro 2) than 10, and it's nearly a wash for desktop use. Overall, the tech community was too hard on 8.1. There are very few areas in which 10 is a demonstrable improvement, but it's still not bad, and I'd still prefer using either 8.1 or 10 over 7.

 

[brettjrob]

Are you using the tablet in TABLET MODE or in desktop mode?

On a Dell Venue 8, in desktop mode it basically works right (though if you actually enable full screen view from the new hamburger menu, it can be the devil to get back out of it), but in Tablet Mode, it behave rather weird -- especially on initial startup and there are many functions that you simply CANNOT get to to with the loss of Charms bar (unless you switch back to desktop mode). And, while, yes this is relatively easy to do from the Action Center toggle, having to switch in and out of tablet mode is a nuisance.

You also get into some really weird behaviors with the new pop-up keyboard handling when in Tablet Mode vs how it works in desktop mode (which disables the automatic on-screen pop-up, unless you set it to auto-activate on any text field, which causes even more weird issues).

Windows 8 apps that have not been rewritten for Windows 10 just haven't handled the transition all that well, especially with regards to the removal of the Charms bar, the new hamburger, and the odd differences in how they behave in Tablet vs Desktop modes.

I fully agree: "Tablet Mode" is a mess. I'll concede I haven't taken the time to RTFM on it, so I very well may be misunderstanding its purpose and functionality. But if that's the case, "Tablet Mode" is one of the most unintuitive software features I've ever encountered. I'm generally pretty savvy about figuring this stuff out on my own, and I flat-out gave up on this after 5 or 10 minutes back in July when I first upgraded on my SP2.

 

[nightfly]

When junk isn't installed on a Windows system they tend to run pretty well.

Thing is, I don't install junk. The only way Windows works well is if you don't install anything. Even Microsofts's own programs mess it up, as I mentioned. Stuff shouldn't be installed as 'running all the time' just that you can't necessarily see it unless you know where to look. Programs shouldn't be installing parts of themselves all over the place. Once upon a time, in a land a long time ago, every dll got dumped into one big directory. And god forbid, if another program had a different version with the same name, chaos would ensue. And once upon a time, a software company produced Dos 5, a rock solid OS that would give the company a reputation of good software, only to be destroyed a couple of years later with doublespace. But the faithful still truly believed, and do to this day. And so it would be, that the lands would be cursed, with misbehaving OS and software, forever and ever. Amen.

 

[heatlesssun]

On a Dell Venue 8, in desktop mode it basically works right (though if you actually enable full screen view from the new hamburger menu, it can be the devil to get back out of it), but in Tablet Mode, it behave rather weird -- especially on initial startup and there are many functions that you simply CANNOT get to to with the loss of Charms bar (unless you switch back to desktop mode). And, while, yes this is relatively easy to do from the Action Center toggle, having to switch in and out of tablet mode is a nuisance.

You also get into some really weird behaviors with the new pop-up keyboard handling when in Tablet Mode vs how it works in desktop mode (which disables the automatic on-screen pop-up, unless you set it to auto-activate on any text field, which causes even more weird issues).

I honestly have no idea what you're talking about here. I have an 8" Asus VivoTab Note, pretty much the same thing as the original Dell Venue 8 Pro except with a Wacom pen. The Kindle app works in both desktop and tablet mode. The hamburger menu isn't used to control windowing. The task bar can always be reached in in tablet mode with swiping up from the bottom, there's no need to go back to desktop mode unless you want to use the desktop.

Whatever issues you're having here, it's not Windows 10 per se.

 

[heatlesssun]

Thing is, I don't install junk. The only way Windows works well is if you don't install anything.

I have tons of desktop and store apps installed on most of my device, Office, Steam games, Adobe products, tons of editors, just lots and lots of stuff. To me the idea that dozens or hundreds of apps can't be installed on Windows and work consistently well isn't my normal experience.