should he worry? Notice of Action under the Digital Millennium Copyright Act

[dwilson041781]

my buddy has a wireless setup and left his router pw and login default and thinks thats what lead to someone downloading a movie through a torrent, and its been almost a month now and he hasnt heard from Cable Company by either email or postal mail or phone call. he just games and no one else in his house (parents) know how to bit-torrent, which led to me helping him setup his login and pw to router, so there is no hi-jacking his access.

I told him to setup his login and pw, and use firewall other than that, now just wait for some sort of paper work for fine or something along those lines.heres what he got in email.


Dear Comcast High-Speed Internet Subscriber:

Comcast has received a notification by a copyright owner, or its authorized
agent, reporting an alleged infringement of one or more copyrighted works made
on or over Comcast's High-Speed Internet service (the 'Service'). The copyright
owner has identified the Internet Protocol ('IP') address associated with your
Service account at the time as the source of the infringing works. The works
identified by the copyright owner in its notification are listed below. Comcast
reminds you that use of the Service (or any part of the Service) in any manner
that constitutes an infringement of any copyrighted work is a violation of
Comcast's Acceptable Use Policy and may result in the suspension or termination
of your Service account.

For more information regarding Comcast's copyright infringement policy,
procedures, and contact information, please read our Acceptable Use Policy by
clicking on the Terms of Service link at http://www.comcast.net.

Sincerely,
Comcast Legal Response Center

Copyright work(s) identified in the notification of claimed infringement:

Infringing Work: Superman Returns

Filepath: Superman returns[2006]DvDrip[Eng]-aXXo.avi.torrent
Filename: Superman returns[2006]DvDrip[Eng]-aXXo.avi
First Found: 29 Sep 2006 01:59:47 EDT (GMT -0400)
Last Found: 29 Sep 2006 01:59:47 EDT (GMT -0400)
Filesize: 718,400k
IP Address: xx.xx.xxx.xx(they gave his IP which matches his machine on IPchicken.com)
IP Port: 49153
Network: BTPeers
Protocol: BitTorrent

 

[MorfiusX]

I heard of someone around here getting a similar message from Comcast. I think it was them be preemptive of the RIAA or MPAA. But, I'm no lawyer and it sounds like it's time to get one.

 

[mobiux]

A woman i work with got one of those from her cable company over a year ago.
I told her to have a talk with her son, make sure he gets everything off the computer and wait to see if anything further comes along.

She hasn't heard anything yet.

I would wait before spending money on a lawyer, but make sure he keeps his shit straight on that connection.

 

[nst6563]

yuppers...I agree with the other posters...make sure he's got his shit straight on every pc in his house, and change the login/pw and security on his wireless connection. Even if it was changed recently, I'd change it yet again. Use WPA or radius if possible. Hell, you could set him up with a smoothwall or Endian box that the wireless router has to go through to get TO the internet in the first place, then with the firewall box you could restrict the access even further by the content manager and outgoing firewall.

Personally...I think it's BS that they try to nail people just by the IP address. I think that if they're going to make it stand up in court, they need the MAC address of the machine that was recieving the torrent file in question. Kind of like the DNA evidence or fingerprints on the gun

besides...I don't see why people even bother with d/l movies ...hell, get netflix and for $17-$20 a month you can have a shit-ton of movies sent to your door to watch ...and that's a HELL of a lot cheaper than taking a chance against the media giants.

 

[IanG]

A woman i work with got one of those from her cable company over a year ago.
I told her to have a talk with her son, make sure he gets everything off the computer and wait to see if anything further comes along.

That's technically destruction of evidence, which isn't generally a smart thing to do.

Back to the OP - I don't think he needs to sweat it too much. Keep a record of the date that you helped him set up security on it, and if there is any problems later on you can always do an affidavit which hopefully should clear the situation up.

Going OT again: I didn't know that there was a dvdrip of superman returns yet.

 

[walwalka]

it is a fake message from the person who is dling that torrent off him i have got 42 of those meesages at mt bros house nothing happends and if is was real it would say the president of comcast name

 

[xphil3]

That's technically destruction of evidence, which isn't generally a smart thing to do.

Back to the OP - I don't think he needs to sweat it too much. Keep a record of the date that you helped him set up security on it, and if there is any problems later on you can always do an affidavit which hopefully should clear the situation up.

Going OT again: I didn't know that there was a dvdrip of superman returns yet.

so you're telling me that you would keep the 10,000 mp3's on your computer if you were subpoena'd. riiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiight

I can't believe the crap people in the post are spewing out of their mouths. PEOPLE, its a warning letter. Plain and simple. I quote "Comcast's Acceptable Use Policy and may result in the suspension or termination of your Service account."

Its in black and white, they will terminate his account if they are notified one more time about illegal activity originating from his source IP address.

to the op: Tell you buddy not to worry, this is just a warning. He doesn't need to get a lawyer, but if he has any friends in the field he can colsult them about it. Also, tell him to call the cable company and verify that they have this exact document in their records(they will if it came from them). I have a few friends that have recieved these warnings for the local provider over 3 years ago, all they did was run a informant filterting application and everythign was peaches and cream

to nst6563:
Its your responsibility to secure your network, if you don't, anything that happens on it is your problem with a few exceptions(any public service with proper banners, IE. public FTP banners stating that nothing is logged).

 

[nst6563]

to nst6563:
Its your responsibility to secure your network, if you don't, anything that happens on it is your problem with a few exceptions(any public service with proper banners, IE. public FTP banners stating that nothing is logged).

umm...yeah...DUH!

However this is yet another reason the US legal system is a bunch of BS most of the time. They have no HARD EVIDENCE that said person d/l the material. Just an IP address...which mind you can be spoofed by any 12year old and a FAQ on said subject. I'm not a networking expert, but having the MAC would at least tie the IP stream to the physical connection/computer (unless it was spoofed as well, which from my understanding can be done just not as easily).

 

[mobiux]

That's technically destruction of evidence, which isn't generally a smart thing to do.

Technically this isn't a subpoena, it's just to let him know that they know something went on and it came from his IP.
This is his chance to get everything fixed or stop doing whatever they found.

 

[Asgorath]

Also, MAC addresses aren't like fingerprints. They can be cloned very easily. IP address is a bit more solid, but again, can be spoofed. It all sucks, but its the law, and the price we pay for living in the USA.

God bless america.

 

[Rakinos]

I've gotten two very similar letter from charter spaced a year or so apart. Nothing ever came of it, no phone call, no follow ups, nothing.

 

[xphil3]

Also, MAC addresses aren't like fingerprints. They can be cloned very easily. IP address is a bit more solid, but again, can be spoofed. It all sucks, but its the law, and the price we pay for living in the USA.

God bless america.

took the words right out of my mouth to nst's comment.

nst: this is whats' called a grey area, therefore if you're network is not properly secured and illegal activity is traced back to it, its your fault and the blame will come down on you. Period

and you talk about hard evidence, sure they have hard evidence. Logs are hard evidence my friend and don't forgetit. All they need is a public IP address and someones name. Also, rememeber that the ISPs know that there is no real way to prove who did said illegal activity since the advent of routers with NAT so they send out these warnings.

I get these warnings constantly from the MDU locations that I support at the NOC. Ive spoken to the legal teams from FDN global,XO communications, L3, New Edge network, Conversant, Covad.. they all say the same stuff im preaching to you. No security on your network, your problem.

 

[shade91]

to nst6563:
Its your responsibility to secure your network, if you don't, anything that happens on it is your problem with a few exceptions(any public service with proper banners, IE. public FTP banners stating that nothing is logged).

I would certainly like to see case law on that Mr eLawyer .

Shred the notice. It's a total waste of time. Besides, any half decent lawyer could have a case like this dismissed in no time at all. You hear about the idiots who fessed up and paid the RIAA. You certainly won't hear about those that fought back and made the RIAA look like schmucks in court with their weak evidence.

 

[dwilson041781]

again thanx for the info guys.(i told him to call johnnie cochran, LOL, but sadly hes no longer with us.)
ive relayed the info to him, and told him same thing if he's lied to me, cut the torrenting out and get netflix and no worries, and as far as more security he's gonna look into, i told him about the good people here on the forum and hope he joins and enjoys himself.

 

[d3fc0n5]

I have gotten one from warnerbros before in the same format.
I think its more so of a warning. trying to scare you out of P2P. I personaly just stay away from downloading movies from P2P apps and stick to FTP/http downloads of movies.

 

[AMD_Gamer]

if you really had to go to court just say you have a wireless router and dont know anything about how it works, im pretty sure you would easily get off. also cant you just ditch your hdd and claim that you never downloaded it?

 

[xphil3]

I would certainly like to see case law on that Mr eLawyer .

Shred the notice. It's a total waste of time. Besides, any half decent lawyer could have a case like this dismissed in no time at all. You hear about the idiots who fessed up and paid the RIAA. You certainly won't hear about those that fought back and made the RIAA look like schmucks in court with their weak evidence.

Case law, HA! dude, use common sense. If you're running a public anon FTP server, you 100% are not required to check the data on the server or responsible for what’s on the server. If you were in fact taken to court, they would have to prove that it was your intent to keep the information on the server and redistribute it illegally which is a feat in itself.

If you want case law, I can't give you that, sorry. What I can give you is concrete examples, the pirate bay ring any bells, suprnova, any of the other countless sites that contain information pertaining to piracy that have eventually been let off because of the said law(which I can't find ) . its public, its out of their control therefore they are no longer responsible. Im sure that you could scour SANS looking for concrete information but I don't have that much time on my hands and it’s pretty late as it is

and btw, login banners are the most important thing to publicly accessible data. If you don't clearly state that all transmissions will be recorded anyone can claim their 4th amendment right to privacy and your court case against any potential attacker just went down the drain.

http://www.informit.com/guides/content.asp?g=security&seqNum=118&rl=1
^ Something I could find.....

 

[nst6563]

Also, MAC addresses aren't like fingerprints. They can be cloned very easily. IP address is a bit more solid, but again, can be spoofed. It all sucks, but its the law, and the price we pay for living in the USA.

God bless america.

I thought it was the other way around (MAC's were more solid than IP's). I'm corrected

still...anyone d/l movies deserves it. Netflix or Blockbuster is still cheaper IMO.

 

[Sharaz Jek]

"we have your mac address, and were on our way to arrest you. we know exactly what computer were looking for because we know the mac address. thank you, and be patient while we are en route to your house".

when they get there, what do they find? a hammer, a pile of dust (that used to be an ethernet card), and a network card in my computer that is not a match of the mac address they were looking for.

good thing i had 12 bucks for a new card, and a hammer!

 

[cleric_retribution]

Case law, HA! dude, use common sense. If you're running a public anon FTP server, you 100% are not required to check the data on the server or responsible for what’s on the server. If you were in fact taken to court, they would have to prove that it was your intent to keep the information on the server and redistribute it illegally which is a feat in itself.

If you want case law, I can't give you that, sorry. What I can give you is concrete examples, the pirate bay ring any bells, suprnova, any of the other countless sites that contain information pertaining to piracy that have eventually been let off because of the said law(which I can't find ) . its public, its out of their control therefore they are no longer responsible. Im sure that you could scour SANS looking for concrete information but I don't have that much time on my hands and it’s pretty late as it is

and btw, login banners are the most important thing to publicly accessible data. If you don't clearly state that all transmissions will be recorded anyone can claim their 4th amendment right to privacy and your court case against any potential attacker just went down the drain.

If you run the server, you are responsible for the content on the server. This is not a matter of law or policy, but of good practice -- why make yourself liable for a bunch of armenian d00ds who upload kiddie porn to your server and the FBI catches on? They will never get in trouble, but you will!

People were arrested at my college for running anonymous FTP servers that had copyrighted movies and music on them. They were booted out of college, and they settled out of court for tens of thousands of dollars (between $50k and $60k) with the RIAA / MPAA.

Also, there needs to be a large distinction made between hosting an FTP server, and sites like piratebay or suprnova: The FTP serveactually has the files on it. Torrent sites DO NOT have the files on them, nor do they usually condone, in any way, the downloading of copyrighted works (they tell you that you should not! download actually) -- That is how they can escape some liability in US courts. The other, better way is to not be located in or have servers in the US. If people in the US are downloading torrents from your trackers, they will get in trouble, not the tracker site.

 

[movax]

I posted a letter from Comcast that my friend got for d/ling movies. It's been about six months now I think (search this forum for "Comcast + DMCA"), and no follow-ups to it. Pretty sure the noob's still downloading movies too. (I learned long ago that Blockbuster Online > d/ling movies, and the feel of boxsets > TV rips).

 

[xphil3]

If you run the server, you are responsible for the content on the server. This is not a matter of law or policy, but of good practice -- why make yourself liable for a bunch of armenian d00ds who upload kiddie porn to your server and the FBI catches on? They will never get in trouble, but you will!

People were arrested at my college for running anonymous FTP servers that had copyrighted movies and music on them. They were booted out of college, and they settled out of court for tens of thousands of dollars (between $50k and $60k) with the RIAA / MPAA.

Also, there needs to be a large distinction made between hosting an FTP server, and sites like piratebay or suprnova: The FTP serveactually has the files on it. Torrent sites DO NOT have the files on them, nor do they usually condone, in any way, the downloading of copyrighted works (they tell you that you should not! download actually) -- That is how they can escape some liability in US courts. The other, better way is to not be located in or have servers in the US. If people in the US are downloading torrents from your trackers, they will get in trouble, not the tracker site.

You are largly misinformed my friend, there reason these sites get off in court is for one reason, and one reason only. The same goes for people running anon FTP server,webspaces,IRC servers, ETC.

http://www.chillingeffects.org/dmca512/ - read it. Like I said, if its public you can play the "see no evil" card and protect yourself under the safe harbor provisions act. If you don't comply by removing the materials then you are:

1. a complete idiot
2. and intend to redistrubite it illegally like I originally stated.

and all the "people that were arrested" had to do was claim the safe harbor provision and they would be in the clear(unless they were notified first and didn't listen ).

I used to be very involved with people in the so called "scene" that ran numerous top sites, so I know the laws and loopholes.