SENTRY 2.0: Evolution of console-sized gaming PC case

Discussion in 'Small Form Factor Systems' started by ZombiPL, Apr 1, 2018.

  1. ZombiPL

    ZombiPL Limp Gawd

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    iWoqytd.gif r68Tqxl.gif


    Hello again guys. It's been over a year since the end of our indiegogo campaign and over 2 months since our last pre-order sale. Many of you are wondering why we still did not start retail sale of Sentry. Now is the time for explanation. You probably remember, that DR ZĄBER is a company established a long time before we even thought about this hobby project and its main business is far away from computer cases industry (we do not make Sentry cases for a living). Because of that we could take a different approach than other pc hardware companies, take our time, gather all the feedback you were giving us for the last year, talk about possible improvements and make better pc case.

    After encountering issues with production and deliveries we have decided to take a step back and figure out how to resolve them before continuing with the production. We have launched a limited pre-order sale at the end of January to test out few improvements including fast worldwide courier shipments by DHL and few small organisational improvements in the manufacturing/assembling process. While DHL shipping seems like a correct solution for the shipping issues, we still are not happy with the production process to the point where we believe that design updates are necessary. With that said, if we are to update the designs and go over those updates with our subcontractor, we might as well improve the functionality of the case where we can. Thus we think now is the time to start designing SENTRY 2.0.

    Like you all know (we are repeating this over and over again) this is a community project. We designed Sentry basing on community feedback and without it we would not succeeded. Because of that we don't see any reason why we should change this approach. Next version of Sentry will be also designed basing on the feedback we did/will receive from you.


    PLANNED CHANGES:

    We will increase the ventilation area up to 65% bigger surface than in rev 1.1 to allow native support of more power hungry graphics cards.
    We will try to reduce the number of screws needed to screw the top cover from 8 to 4, just like in most of mainstream pc cases.
    We will reduce the number of types/sizes of screws used in Sentry from 6 to 3.
    If we will be able to find a supplier for black m3x6 screws with torx socket, we will switch currently used hex screws with them. Some people reported that with bigger force they were able to damage the socket and they had problems with unscrewing the screw. Torx socket allows to use a bigger force/torque to screw/unscrew the screw. If we will have the possibility to get those screws, we will.
    As you know, Sentry has its own, unique method of riser installation. We were very satisfied with it when we ordered a first batch of 25 prototypes (rev.1.0-1.1), but when we manufactured over 1000 units it turned out this element has some problems with repeatability and with some units our backers had to use a little bit of force to insert riser properly. The installation procedure was also not clear for quite a lot of users. In revision 2.0 we want to solve this problem and use separate element to mount the riser, so the installation will be more straightforward and also improved design will allow us to eliminate one type of screw
    We received some photos from our supporters that the current design of top hdd bracket sometimes collides with USB 3.0 cable or even reduces the maximum height of some types of RAM modules. To solve this problem in new version we want to remove two problematic bendings and move the whole element a little bit towards the back of the case, away from the RAM/USB socket area.
    If you have a PC case so small that it can be transported in a laptop bag, then we think that having this theft-prevention feature will be a good idea.
    In the past we added those WIFI antennas holes because it was commonly requested feature in various case design threads. After using those for some time we have realised that you need to tighten the antenna connectors really hard from both sides if you don’t want them to get loose when re-attaching antennas multiple times. This means using two wrenches, one of which is in especially cumbersome position on the inside of the case. Because of that we decided we need to improve the shape of those holes to lock connector rotation.
    During assembling process of vertical stand we were using strong industrial glue to attach rubber feet. However we received a feedback from our backers that in some hot environments this glue doesn’t do its job and they had to glue those feet again. Firstly we thought about just switching the glue to some other one, but then we received many questions about possibility of fully detaching those rubber feet to clean them or install some others, for example with different colour. Because of that we decided we need to design them and the stand in the way which will allow an installation without glue.
    It’s a simple improvement to make life easier.
    We analysed the feedback from our backers and it turns out that only small fraction of them used 2.5’’ hdd mounting points inside GPU compartment, but also most owners of ITX GPUs would like to install 3.5’’ drive there, if it was possible. Because of that and because we already have a support for two 2.5’’ drives, as well as the fact that M.2 became a standard in itx boards, we decided to drop support of 2.5’’ HDDs inside GPU section, and instead we will allow installation of 3.5’’ drives.
    Another request from ITX GPU users. We understand we raised such expectations after showing photos of our rev 1.1 prototype packed with a R9-Nano and CPU AIO watercooler. After that we received many questions if we will make a native support for that. Yes. We will try to do that, and Yes, we will allow 120mm coolers!
    Sentry was designed to be futureproof. It means not only the case should be durable but also peripherals should be easily accessible. When we decided that we will add a native support for 120mm AIO, then we needed to do something with the vandal power switch, because it would collide with it. We do not want to design a non-standard switch, because it would disrupt “future-proof” philosophy, so we moved the current switch to the exact center of the case’s front which solved the problem with AIO, but also made another problem with the cables of SFX-L power supply. We needed to make a decision. After the market analysis we decided we can drop the support of SFX-L PSUs, because there are many standard SFX power supplies which can handle almost everything what you can install into Sentry (there are many 500W+ PSUs with even 650W options). For a price of leaving bigger power supplies we are getting a support for 120mm water cooling. We think this is a good deal in such small volume.
    We wanted the case itself to be lighter for both personal-transportation purposes and because of the cost of shipment to clients. To do that we want to reduce the number of some internal structure elements and with others we want to change their shape to make them lighter while keeping their stiffness. Also the denser ventilation will help us in that matter. We expect to get up to 0.5 kg of mass reduction which we think would be a great result (at this point we can’t say exactly how much lighter the Sentry 2.0 will be, because we are just at the beginning of designing stage and a lot of things are still changing.
    We designed the whole new packaging to lower the cost of the transport. Since we picked a DHL as our main transport company, the quality of service and its speed increased, but so the prices did. With the new packaging we predict we should get a 10-15% of shipping cost reduction.
    After the campaign we were many times asked to add such mounting points to improve the cable management. We will try to do it where it will be possible.
    Some of our backers informed us that they had problems with installation of motherboard’s aluminium backplate and they needed to use more force than usually to attach it. Since Sentry was made without forms or automatic assembling machines, but with human hands assist, there might be some small misalignments in some of the units. We want to make sure that does not happen anymore.
    Some of the power supplies released after we were designing this PSU mount had their IEC socket installed in a place which did not allow proper installation in Sentry (Users had to shave off a little bit material in front of PSU or the external part of plastic IEC connector). We will improve the PSU mounting bracket by shaving off some unnecessary material to the point where such situations shouldn’t occur anymore.
    We noticed that many users when they have a problem with assembly they do not check the online manual (which is the most up-to-date document), but they prefer to either use bigger force to solve the problem or to modify some elements. We added a simplified quick-start paper manual to help our clients with assembly, but it turns out it made even more problems. Many people asked for help in solving the issues with installation procedures that were already thoroughly explained in the updated online manual. They didn’t know that there is a full, more detailed version of the manual available online, regardless of the link provided in two forms on top of the quick-start manual page. We want to make sure users will know about and read full and most recent version of the manual online. Right now we are thinking about giving our clients only online manual, forcing them to read the newest version of manual on our site, to help them get their answers faster. This is still a thing to debate about.
    White colour paint is one of the most difficult to get the equal results from the paints we were working with. It would be easier if it would be applied with automatic machines, but with small scale production it is very hard to find a company who would do that for a reasonable price. Our current steel-elements manufacturer (who is also painting Sentry) still does not have robotic painting arms which would guarantee the quality and repeatability of achieving a white colour surface. Because of that during the indiegogo campaign we used separate paintshop which did a good job, but also we had to reserve a special time for us even before we knew how big the order will be, and even then we had to wait in the line to get our cases painted there. It took us a lot of time and nerves, so we decided we will not be making white Sentry cases until our metal parts manufacturer will get a better painting method for this colour than he has now.
    From the feedback we received and many, many photos of your cases we noticed that less than 1% of backers used those brackets. Most of Sentry users did not even try to install anything different than GPU in the GPU section. Because we are trying to reduce the weight of the case everywhere we can for the purpose of reducing the shipping price, we decided this is a good thing to stop adding those elements to the package. Another reason (than the weight) was leaving the native support for 2.5’’ HDDs in the GPU compartment to support there only 3.5 drives and AIO coolers.
    Most of Sentry users simply do not use those elements and when the shipping price is very high (partly because of the weight), then not adding such redundant elements is an opportunity to reduce it.
    As you know, we did a special test-batch of cases to check how good will be our new shipping company. Cost of the shipping with the economical courier was almost 60% lower than express DHL shipment, but at the same time the time of delivery was significantly shorter. For example, economical packages from EU to USA were delivered in around 2 months while some of those more expensive express packages were delivered even on the next day, and the rest our backers received them within 7 days. This convinced us that is a right way.
    Since we are aiming to support 120mm AIO inside the GPU compartment, we also have to figure out how to make a balanced build with a reasonably powerful MINI/ITX-sized GPU fitting in the remaining space. In revision 1.1 we could only fit standard ITX-sized GPUs, and within current generation of cards anything above GTX 1060 would not fit. We want to fit at least GTX 1070 or 1080 class MINI/ITX card inside and for that we plan to slightly increase the supported GPU oversize, just by around 2mm. We plan to support Gigabyte Mini ITX and MSI Aero ITX series this way. AIO-induced airflow should also benefit the GPU thermals.
    While allowing more powerful graphic cards we need to reduce the free space above the back side of GPU where the hot air could gather in horizontal position.


    IDEAS REJECTED:

    After many conversations with you guys, we decided it would be good to have this option. Many of our backers had several coolers they wanted to test in Sentry and having a possibility to access to the back of the motherboard without unscrewing it would really help them. We will check the possibility of this feature in the next prototype (we’re still not sure if we have a right solution for this problem).

    UPDATE - Feature rejected after poll:
    Internal dust filters need additional space and some advanced tooling. We decided we do not want to increase the volume and price of Sentry for the sake of mounting such filters.
    Sentry is designed to use industry standard components. There is no standardised type-C front panel yet, only custom PCB based solutions. We will revise this issue when there is a “baffle” type cable that includes both type A and C connectors, similar to the one we are using now.
    Audio connectors on the PC cases are most frequently criticised about their low quality audio output. Routing cables to such connectors on the front panel of Sentry without signal being affected, and without front aesthetics being spoiled by the connector location, would be really hard to implement and expensive. Especially when considering our design principle of using standardised components. On top of that, at the current price point and market for such cases, most users in our niche tend to have wireless headsets, use dedicated external audio DAC or have USB-connected headsets.
    We received some questions about the possibility to replace our current Stand Locking System (SLS) with standard screws or to add an option to screw the stand permanently to the side of the case to make this connection even more sturdy. We think our current tool-less design is more than enough to keep Sentry stable in vertical position. We prefer to use and refine one properly working system than to add another option for the same purpose, which will increase the cost and time of manufacturing, while also not being used by most of people.
    There are enough graphic card models on the market to fit inside Sentry and there are already many bigger cases that fit bigger graphic cards. We do not want to increase the case size when that is not a necessity.
    Adding a handle for mobility when the case itself is compact enough to fit inside a backpack or many laptop bags isn’t really necessary.
    There is no place where we could install a proper window without losing venting capabilities and thermal efficiency.

    FEATURE GALLERY:

    MkHJe0pl.jpg acdfFZPl.jpg
    fFZLXSQl.jpg FFc6qcYl.jpg

    RENDERS:

    9ZeidhKl.jpg q5SJvLEl.jpg
    n5uGfail.jpg 46x5hcsl.jpg

    As you see there will be more than just few changes. Please let us know what you think about all of this. Maybe we forgot about something which you think it is important to have? We will appreciate your help. Thanks!
     
    Last edited: Apr 22, 2018
  2. ZombiPL

    ZombiPL Limp Gawd

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    ACTIVE POLLS ON NEW FEATURES

    POLL 1: Motherboard backside access panel https://www.strawpoll.me/15507008


    View attachment 66954

    Improvement 7. Motherboard backside access panel
    View attachment 66950 View attachment 66951
     
    Last edited: Apr 15, 2018
  3. dondan

    dondan [H]ard|Gawd

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    Hi Zombi great changes hear a small tip:

    This is not allowed for products selling in the EU. If you want to add a CE you have to include a manual.

    A idea for a other feature is HDPlex 400W support. If you can mount it near the GPU your customer can use a 120mm AIO on SFX psu location.
     
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  4. octagoncow

    octagoncow [H]Lite

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    These changes look great. I agree with cutting out the quad drive mounts and pci covers; it's just wasted material and weight for most people. Are the dimensions the same as V1.0? Are any of the 2.0 pieces going to be backwards compatible?

    Also this was posted on April Fools day for the United States so I didn't realize this was a serious post until I read it.
     
  5. greyhound

    greyhound [H]Lite

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    Have you considered a more premium build with thick alu pannels?

    Moving from steel to alu would balance the weight increase from the thicker pannels.

    The last gen of sff cases (Louqe and Mjolrin) is using this approach.
     
  6. ZombiPL

    ZombiPL Limp Gawd

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    Hey Daniel. Thx for the tip, but it is only partially true. For example you can sell a "screw" and give a CE mark for it. Will you sell it with a manual? When was the last time when you bought a HDD or RAM module and you received it with a paper manual? For sure there was a CE mark on them. In our situation computer case is only a component of future device. It is not a device itself. AFAIK if you would be selling a fully assembled PC then you must provide a paper manual. In our situation it is just like with this screw: we can easily mark it with CE mark, because it is compliant with WE directives and it is safe for usage, but as a single component we do not have to give a manual since this is not a complete device. In the past we were thinking in the same way that the paper manual is a must-have for a CE mark, but it looks like it is not for every product. We will look for proper documentation confirming this information and we will send you the link.
     
  7. SaperPL

    SaperPL [H]ard|Gawd

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    Well, HDPlex is a neat toy, but we don't want to increase the complexity for the sake of such niche, non standardised component. You see to attach an AIO in place of PSU we'd have to perforate the surface below the PSU for the mounting or add some structure so it hangs there pulling air through the cover but not being attached to it(we don't want a situation where you mount the AIO on the cover, really. Add finding a place for HD-Plex in already cramped space to that.

    Dimensions will be roughly the same as V1.0. Backward compatibility will be kind of tricky with this amount of changes. Vertical stand and cables should be backward compatible, we are not planning on changing those, case cover may be interchange'able.

    Yeah, we get that its April Fools day (we have it also here), we're dead serious though :)

    We're using quite a lot of welding in our construction to avoid degrading the aesthetics of the case by rivets and this makes using aluminium really hard for us. Aluminium version of Sentry would be a design from scratch honestly, it would probably be a frame based chassis imitating what we've done with Sentry.

    Louqe and Mjolrin are basing their design on quite a lot of extruded elements and CNC and we might not have the capabilities to do a full production based on that.
     
  8. dondan

    dondan [H]ard|Gawd

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    I looked in my version of the EN 60950-1:

    "1.7.2 Safety instructions and marking" they write:

    The operating instructions, and the installation instructions for PLUGGABLE EQUIPMENT intended
    for USER installation, shall be made available to the USER.

    So maybe you are right because they don't write it has to be printed.
     
    Last edited: Apr 1, 2018
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  9. ZombiPL

    ZombiPL Limp Gawd

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    This is all true, but the information in this link doesn't determine if parts of future device (like pc cases) also need separate users manual. This is a very specific situation.

    Some different question: If you think you must have a paper user's manual for A4 case to give a CE mark, did you make this manual in all languages of the countries where you exported your product? According to WE (EU) directives if you provide a user's manual, it must be in unified language (like LEGO sign instructions... we did something like that with Sentry 1.1), or you must translate it into the official language of the country where you are exporting it. I saw somewhere (probably in KS comments section) some guys from Croatia who were talking that they bought A4, but i didn't see any A4 manual in Croatian. Did you provide a manual in all of those EU languages where you exported your case? In my opinion you did not have to, because your product is not a final product, but just a part to make it, and if you have some sort of online manual, it should be enough.

    I think everything depends on the point of view. If you look at your/our pc case as a part of future device, then you do not need a paper manual, because it will be needed for a whole device (pc case is just a "spare" part).
    This week I just bought Hitachi hard drive and Crucial Balistics RAM module, and both of them have CE mark, but none of them had paper manual, because they are treated as part of a device, not a device itself. I do not think that companies which are such big are not providing paper manual because of "lack of knowledge". Same goes for WD and Seagate HDDs which I used to buy. Or maybe I'm wrong here?

    If we are right, almost none of pc-cases need a separate paper manual (probably updated online user's manual is enough). If you are right, we all need to keep making "sign language" manuals, or start making translations of our papers to all of the EU languages where we are/will be selling our pc case. I think this is a time to solve this problem once and for all, and I hope you can help us with that.
     
    Last edited: Apr 1, 2018
  10. ZombiPL

    ZombiPL Limp Gawd

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    In other version of probably the same directive I read that, the manual should be provided "when asked". It means that online, always up-to-date document (instead of paper manual) does not necessarily need to be a problem when you would want to mark your case with CE mark. It needs a deeper investigation.
     
  11. kingtron

    kingtron Limp Gawd

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    I have requested to increase the vent holes long time ago, thanks for considering that in v2.0 :)

     
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  12. ZombiPL

    ZombiPL Limp Gawd

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    Yes mate. We wrote that down :)
     
  13. prava

    prava [H]ard|Gawd

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    A case isnt a pluggable item.
     
  14. ZombiPL

    ZombiPL Limp Gawd

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    Wow. For all that time I was wondering where did you go :)
     
  15. 7x1x

    7x1x [H]Lite

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    Since you're adding support for a 120 AIO, would it be possible to fit a 240mm AIO with no GPU?
     
  16. prava

    prava [H]ard|Gawd

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    Very busy with life, but watching from the shadows. :ROFLMAO:

    Any chance you have an estimation as to when the V2.0 might come out? Maybe this year? Next one? I don't mean to rush anything... but I'm tired of my actual gigantic ATX case and I'm still in love with the steambox form factor (that is: tall and thin).
     
  17. SaperPL

    SaperPL [H]ard|Gawd

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    Well, not really. For 120 mm AIO the hose connectors are on the other side of central wall and they are not obstructed by the air pocket above GPU. We cannot do that with 240 mm rad since it has to be oriented differently and therefore you could not bend hoses for it properly. And we do not plan to make the air pocket detachable.

    I know it is a neat concept of making an APU build with 240 mm AIO, but it's pretty hard combining those features already with what we want to do.
     
  18. kingtron

    kingtron Limp Gawd

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    There will be a room for a ZOTAC 1080 Ti Mini and 120mm AIO ?? or it is too large ?
     
  19. ZombiPL

    ZombiPL Limp Gawd

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    The size of Sentry probably won't change, so also GPU compartment's length will stay the same. Check the length of Zotac card and add a dimension of 120mm AIO and you will get your answer :)
     
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  20. kingtron

    kingtron Limp Gawd

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    How about supporting a 40mm Fans next to the GPU and the CPU side as well.
    79840_DSC_0758.jpg 79836_DSC_0759.jpg
     
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  21. FredomFM

    FredomFM n00b

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    Is it possible to rearrange the gpu and the powerplug to allow for a taller gpu?
    It would allow for the pcie power connectors to be plugged in on oversized cards.
    Edit: I mean putting the powerplug on top and the gpu above the motherboard.
     
  22. SaperPL

    SaperPL [H]ard|Gawd

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    Well, this is a tricky one - In theory there's space to mount 50mm fans on the GPU compartment bracket, but there's one problem - case cover is directly laying on this bracket and if we were to mount the fans to the bracket we would need some space for the screw heads, and you guys know those big fan screws. To add that distance we would have to weld some spacers or a single piece of metal and move the side of the bracket slightly to the inside to make a 1 mm distance for those screw heads. We don't want to do that, because we are already fighting for each millimetre to accommodate those oversized ITX GPUs. We also don't want to add more welds than we absolutely require.

    I will think about a way to design some additional piece that would be used to mount those fans, but you'd have to download the DXF file and order it locally probably.

    We don't want to make such revolutionary changes for our design at this point. Note that we don't want to support those big cards not only because of their size but also because of their power consumption. You would be overpaying for the card that may not perform as advertised in Sentry with those big oversized GPUs.
     
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  23. kingtron

    kingtron Limp Gawd

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    No problem at all, thanks
     
  24. SaperPL

    SaperPL [H]ard|Gawd

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    kingtron This is what I mean (fast draw though):
    i0cMk3U.jpg
    sSdIDzC.jpg
    Ke7WQT3.jpg

    It is slightly asymmetric to fit both old and new design, I will have to refine that after finalising the 2.0 designs if we are to release such DXF file for you guys.

    One caveat is that to make it really simple in production it needs to be a single sheet of metal without any bends. Bends are bad if we don't know who will be making those for you. This means you'll have to glue this to your bracket and glue is not a neat solution.

    We definitely won't be making such pieces as a part of the package, but we might investigate interesting mods during prototyping stage.
     
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  25. St1X

    St1X [H]Lite

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    MoBo back access hatch looks ugly :(
    It ruing aesthetics of a back panel.
    Will there be an option to get a panel without it?
     
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  26. SaperPL

    SaperPL [H]ard|Gawd

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    We are not planning to make options, but if most of the people don't want the panel because of the looks, we will consider not doing it.

    Can you try to narrow down what you don't like about the look of the panel?

    We could change the shape in some way to better fit the style of the case. For example octagon-like cut corners or maybe some more advanced shape?
     
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  27. Ark :o

    Ark :o Limp Gawd

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    I hope this comes to fruition, any form of fan ventilation would increase my interest in this case by a factor of 10.
     
  28. Smitty2k1

    Smitty2k1 Gawd

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    Good stuff, looking forward to watching this progress.
     
  29. St1X

    St1X [H]Lite

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    I cannot describe, why I dislike it so much, it just feel, that it's ugly. And it is quite redundant, frankly speaking. For the sake of CPU heatsink testing that will be done by a handful of people during a couple of days you'll ruin aesthetics of the case for every one, permanently.
    I am strongly against it
     
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  30. SaperPL

    SaperPL [H]ard|Gawd

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    Its not only for the sake of CPU cooler testing. There are few scenarios where you'd want to access backside of motherboard without tearing down whole build like:
    - adding/upgrading/replacing faulty m.2 ssd
    - adding/upgrading/replacing faulty wireless card if on the back of the board
    - upgrading/replacing faulty CPU if your cooler mount requires back access

    The question is, is this worth it or not. We'll see how it goes with the prototypes. We'd like to have such feature at least on them for the sake of testing coolers. Later on we'll see how people like this feature.
     
  31. kingtron

    kingtron Limp Gawd

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    When using a large CPU cooler ,,,, there will be no space for the HDD except the position in the photo (next to the PSU) , I hope you can adjust that in v2.0 and add this HDD position capability to it.

    95018_C9D5A13D-0253-43DB-8761-0206BD67F60A.jpeg
    95019_1A6B0F36-74BA-43F8-97C1-9E41D345DE5C.jpeg
     
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  32. SaperPL

    SaperPL [H]ard|Gawd

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    Do you mean to keep the position next to the PSU or that you'd want to have a possibility to mount the drive next to such big cooler?

    We are keeping the layout of two 2.5" drive mountings but I don't think we can fit the 2.5" next to such big cooler, especially since we are moving slightly closer with the central wall to it.
     
  33. kingtron

    kingtron Limp Gawd

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    in v1.0 I have modded the HDD bracket and flipped it to be able to mount the HDD next to the PSU, I was hoping to be able to do the same without modding in v2.0, but I think it will be difficult this time because you are moving the PSU closer to the central wall.
    I think this time I need to use an AIO instead of such a big cooler, or simply use an M.2 instead of 2.5"
     
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  34. SaperPL

    SaperPL [H]ard|Gawd

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    Ok, now I get it. The drive will still fit, but flipping the bracket will probably not be possible like that anymore as it's going to look a bit different because of some structural changes and support for AIO. I'll think about it though.
     
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  35. waspodov

    waspodov n00b

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    what hsf/cooler that you use? thanks
     
  36. kingtron

    kingtron Limp Gawd

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    A modded Cooljag falcon 2 with Noctua NF-A12x15 PWM fan attached below the heat sink.
    You have to use it with a very low profile memory , like the innodisk DDR4 VLP.
     
  37. St1X

    St1X [H]Lite

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    My point is - it's not worth it. Sentry should a be a sexy as hell computer case, that would please everyone's eye, but this hatch will totally ruin the looks. Any designer here to explain this? :)
    I am totally OK to disassemble my PC every time I need to replace something. For most of the people it happens so rarely, that I assume majority will support me on this
     
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  38. SaperPL

    SaperPL [H]ard|Gawd

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    I get it. I agree that adding another asymmetric element like this breaks the otherwise clean look. The question is, whether it can be designed in a way it doesn't affect that clean look.

    We'll probably decide upon this based on some polls. First we need to design the internal locking mechanism to know what we can do with the shape of this access panel. After that we can draw some concepts for the shape of it, make renders and poll which one looks the best, and finally after that make some decision with another poll about whether its worth it or not.

    At this point, we will be designing this feature anyway for the sake of our internal performance testing, but this could end up as a review unit (we'd have to thread lightly there though to make sure people don't get confused about this feature being in the final product or not).
     
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  39. LegoFab

    LegoFab [H]Lite

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    Feb 12, 2018
    How about idea top side motherboard access plate - same with bottom side. I saw many people they cut top plate to install higher cooler.
     
  40. ZombiPL

    ZombiPL Limp Gawd

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    This would reduce the maximum allowed height for some coolers. Under mobo we have some space to hide this panel. Over it some coolers would not fit if we will stay with the same case external dimensions.
     
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