Seiki SE50UY04 3840x2160 50" TV ($1300)

geok1ng

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it is great to have news.

i believe you are going down the right market path : there is a single strobing backlight display above 2560x1440 , at a meager 75Hz. a programable driver board would be the perfect partner for a 4k 120Hz board.
among other things, you are once again pursuing a product not available elsewhere for 4k displays.
i feel sorry for AMD if Freesync is off the spec sheet of your 4k 120hz board.
no more waiting for VEGA if that is the case, please confirm this so we can jump into (SLI) 1080Ti.
 

Zyklon808

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Sorry for asking this, but this board will be a drop in replacement for the original Seiki 39? No need to buy a new panel or anything right?
 

cirthix

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Sorry for asking this, but this board will be a drop in replacement for the original Seiki 39? No need to buy a new panel or anything right?

It only uses the panel. Nothing else. You can use the existing ac/dc power supply or an external 12v power brick.

The kit now also replaces the led driver, for pwm-free operation.

The mounting plate bolts to the 200x200mm holes of the panel and provides a 100x100mm pattern for standard vesa mounts.

My recommendation for a stand is this: https://www.monoprice.com/product?p_id=5400







IMG_1809.JPG

IMG_1814.JPG



IMG_1821.JPG
 

Zyklon808

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Thanks for the fast reply. This is exactly what I wanted to know. How much physical mods need to be done to support the board.

Sorta screwed as I have a glass desk. lol

One last question and I'm sure this has been asked before: Do we have a price range or will it be determined by how many units are ordered?
 

cirthix

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Thanks for the fast reply. This is exactly what I wanted to know. How much physical mods need to be done to support the board.

Sorta screwed as I have a glass desk. lol

One last question and I'm sure this has been asked before: Do we have a price range or will it be determined by how many units are ordered?


You can use a regular 100mm vesa mount then. It doesnt have to be the monoprice deskmount. I just like the linked monoprice ones because they are sturdy and free up some precious desk space.
 

geok1ng

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The kit now also replaces the led driver, for pwm-free operation.

Now this is a curved ball i did not saw coming: there are very few PWM complains on the Seiki, which does not mean that PWM-free driver is not desirable.
it is just that going the extra mile for 120Hz strobing would make more sense: if i am going to replace the led driver, why not make it strobe?
 

cirthix

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Now this is a curved ball i did not saw coming: there are very few PWM complains on the Seiki, which does not mean that PWM-free driver is not desirable.
it is just that going the extra mile for 120Hz strobing would make more sense: if i am going to replace the led driver, why not make it strobe?

The backlight driver supports it, but the pixel response of the mva panels are too high to take advantage of it.

The 28" TN is a different story though ;).


Really though? The original backlight driver is like 180Hz or something frustratingly low.
 

Zangmonkey

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So excited to see the progress!

Any idea of cost at this stage?
What would a potential Kickstarter look like?
 

cirthix

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So excited to see the progress!

Any idea of cost at this stage?
What would a potential Kickstarter look like?

I don't know. Is kickstarter the right thing for a product that is already designed? I'd like to do something like a group buy, but don't know what is best. Open to input.

I can front the money for production, that isn't the issue. I just don't know how many to expect to sell.
 

Zangmonkey

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I don't know. Is kickstarter the right thing for a product that is already designed? I'd like to do something like a group buy, but don't know what is best. Open to input.

I can front the money for production, that isn't the issue. I just don't know how many to expect to sell.

I strongly suggest you crowdsource. There are people here with experience using it for similar projects.

Production runs are expensive and it will be difficult to guess the demand.

Try reaching out to Necere on this forum. He and a partner ran a highly successful campaign for a custom designed ITX case.

You probably should try to have something before blurbusters posts the review, and reach out to them to see if they're ok with linking it. It would be good for readers to have an outlet if they decide they want one other than to email you.
 
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cirthix

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I strongly suggest you crowdsource. There are people here with experience using it for similar projects.

Production runs are expensive and it will be difficult to guess the demand.

Try reaching out to Necere on this forum. He and a partner ran a highly successful campaign for a custom designed ITX case.

You probably should try to have something before blurbusters posts the review, and reach out to them to see if there ok with linking it. It would be good for readers to have an outlet if they decide they want one other than to email you.

Yeah, it would be in the 5-digits for a small run of kits. I can swing it, but guessing the demand is the hard part.

Thanks for the tip, will try to talk with them. I really dislike websites and businesses that say "contact us for ordering/quotes" and yet I do the same. Totally agree on that point.

The order page should be up before the reviews. Now that it is in the mail, I've got work to do on the documentation and web side of things.
 

aeliusg

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Is there a list of panels this is going to be compatible with? Still have the 50" in the house somewhere.
 

geok1ng

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The backlight driver supports it, but the pixel response of the mva panels are too high to take advantage of it.

The 28" TN is a different story though ;)


I totally missed you there:(: people who will put the new board on a 39" panel will do it because:
- they like their seiki at 1080 120Hz
- they want it to do 4k 120hz
- your board will drive it at 4k 120hz anyway, strobing will ( vastly) reduce motion blur without introducing more overdrive ghosting than it already has at 1080/4k 120Hz without strobe. quite the opposite, i expect less perceived artifacts from those 39" panels at 120hz with a strobing backlight.

just check the pursuit cameras test of the FG70 monitors from Samsung to get a glimpse of what LMB can do for a VA panel:

C24FG70-blur.png


The reference is a Dell S2716DG, a gaming TN. LMB is active at the " fastest response time setting". I expect the 39" with a strobing backlight to behave similarly: a bit of dark overdrive trail at higher refresh rates, but much better motion clarity.

anyway it is great news for the 28" panel , which is still on sale in north america, panel availability will certainly drive up demand .

i wonder how much the market is willing to pay for a 28" 4k 120Hz lmb monitor with zero lag.:cool:
 

Zyklon808

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Let's just hope the board does not cost more than the the monitor does. I'll know I'll buy one. Just need to start saving!
 

geok1ng

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Let's just hope the board does not cost more than the the monitor does. I'll know I'll buy one. Just need to start saving!

The board is targeted towards low cost 4k panels, and uses state of art hardware, not found in any other product on the market. the panels it was targeted for are among the lowest cost panels made way back in 2013.
 

l88bastard

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I am in for two units on the group buy....saw a demo of Cirthix's 39 in action and it looks awesome!
 
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JRUHg

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think of P65-C1 and M65-D0 would work. full array backlight. scanning blacklight mb :woot:
 

Jinxtedium

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Any news? I'm in for one board. Any particular GPU recommendation that can handle the 4k@120Hz? I'm currently building a PC and it would be great to know any particular requirements for smooth operation with cirthix's board.
 
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The board is targeted towards low cost 4k panels, and uses state of art hardware, not found in any other product on the market. the panels it was targeted for are among the lowest cost panels made way back in 2013.

Ok, so you are saying the board will cost more than the monitor.
The question is, how much?
 

Zyklon808

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Holy crap 480hz @ 1080p? Crazy!

Now I wonder whats going to happen first, this kit release or the next season of Game of Thrones. ;)

Making good headway though if Blurbusters is wet for it.
 

cirthix

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4k@120Hz
1080p@240Hz
720p@300Hz
540p@480Hz
fast pwm, pwm-free, scanning, and strobing modes
28" and 39" behave identically

LTT review will be posted on the 17th. Blurbusters is ramping up testing, will have some content up before the 17th and some after. I'll be running the preorder from the 17th to the 7th, with 5 weeks of manufacturing afterwards, 2 weeks of flashing, assembly and testing, depending on order numbers, should be appearing in customers hands at the end of October. Both reviews will have preorder links.

Latest FW brings 10bit support and eliminates scanlines completely (LTT mentions lines, but their fw is a bit older).
 

Enhanced Interrogator

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Linus is gonna lose his mind over this thing.

And cirthix, I hope stand to make some real money off of the work you've put in. You're single handedly bringing new capabilities to the display market ahead of the big TV/monitor companies.
 

geok1ng

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scanning, and strobing modes
28" and 39" behave identically

You added as much value as possible to the kit. :cool:

Funny thing is in the end AMD's Vega will be launched on same day the kit will accept pre-orders.

Any particular reason to get a Vega over a 1080ti for this kit?
is a FW with Freesync still a possibility?
 
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EniGmA1987

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4k@120Hz
1080p@240Hz
720p@300Hz
540p@480Hz
fast pwm, pwm-free, scanning, and strobing modes
28" and 39" behave identically

LTT review will be posted on the 17th. Blurbusters is ramping up testing, will have some content up before the 17th and some after. I'll be running the preorder from the 17th to the 7th, with 5 weeks of manufacturing afterwards, 2 weeks of flashing, assembly and testing, depending on order numbers, should be appearing in customers hands at the end of October. Both reviews will have preorder links.

Latest FW brings 10bit support and eliminates scanlines completely (LTT mentions lines, but their fw is a bit older).


Im pretty late to the party here as I dont visit this forum much. It looks like you are producing a kit which basically replaces the scaler units in some monitors and allows for these modes you posted right?
Which specific 28" and 39" monitors is this compatible with? And will we need to purchase the monitors ourselves or are you selling the monitor with the custom board as a complete unit?

Thanks for doing this. I am EXTREMELY interested in it. Possibly buying both the 28 and the 39. lol






I am wondering something, since the circuit board is completely custom and you are adding all these different modes and high Hz support, would a possibility in the future be where you could add a DRAM chip or two and have a buffer on the board like the GSync module does, and allow for modes like 4k at 240 and maybe even 4k at 480Hz refresh? I dont mean where the "true refresh" is those speeds as I know the display cables dont support that kind of bandwidth right now let alone the GPUs pushing that kind of framerate. But if the panel's pixels can refresh at 480Hz, could you simply run a 4k frame on the panel, and refresh the pixels with the same buffered frame 2 or 4 times (depending on 240 or 480hz). So the real framerate will still be a maximum of 120fps and it would look like a 120Hz monitor to the PC, but the panel just refreshes 2-4x faster than the framerate. This could let the pixels be driven a bit better and give a bit smoother motion response. Or, perhaps you could run the 480Hz mode and display the real frame for the first refresh, and then insert a blank frame for other 1-3 extra in the refreshes between real frames. Much like how the Eizo Foris FG2421 gaming monitor works or older CRTs. I realize that is way too late for this production run and would be a lot of work. But thought it would be an interesting idea for maybe down the road sometime.
 
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Marm0t2

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Aug 15, 2017
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I assume the 39 is for the seiki 39 inch panel, any idea on whether or not it will work with the 50 inch SE50UY04?

If so, i'm so in. I've been using this thing at 1080p as my main for years.
 

geok1ng

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add a DRAM chip or two and have a buffer on the board like the GSync module does

sounds laggy. one idea behind Cirthix work is ZERO LAG

modes like 4k at 240 and maybe even 4k at 480Hz refresh

by the time GPUs can drive 4k at these refresh rates, we will be running holodecks using visual cortex brain chips

panel's pixels can refresh at 480Hz

they can't. even 240Hz is something that the Tn panel requires overdrive to achieve

bit smoother motion response

please note that the kit now accepts both scanning and strobing modes

insert a blank frame for other 1-3 extra in the refreshes between real frames

agaiin, the kit has 2 LMB modes: scanning and strobing.
 

geok1ng

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LTT called the monitor jank. urban dictionary tells me that LTT will be eating crow on twitter pretty soon.
 
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