Seiki SE50UY04 3840x2160 50" TV ($1300)

Alti

Weaksauce
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Jan 30, 2010
Messages
108
Hmm, it seems like your display is getting the full 24 bit color information or else you would see some sort of banding. My feeling is that some displays shipped with the 24 bit color enabled, and others with the limited video color mode. Hopefully the setting is in the service menu somewhere, though it's also a possibility that it is a user inaccessible setting or even a hardware jumper.

houkouonchi, can you try setting your display output format to YUV422 and see if you see the same type of banding? I think that would confirm whether what we're seeing is the limited bit depth or not.
I just switched to YUV422 mode after trying out the test pattern posted previously.

There's more detail in the blacks now and I definitely don't see the red issue with either mode. However I am talking about the 50 inch version so it might not apply to the 39 inch version.
 
Joined
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Hmm, it seems like your display is getting the full 24 bit color information or else you would see some sort of banding. My feeling is that some displays shipped with the 24 bit color enabled, and others with the limited video color mode. Hopefully the setting is in the service menu somewhere, though it's also a possibility that it is a user inaccessible setting or even a hardware jumper.

houkouonchi, can you try setting your display output format to YUV422 and see if you see the same type of banding? I think that would confirm whether what we're seeing is the limited bit depth or not.


YUV444 mode (no YUV422 listed on the linux drivers) made the whole display look purple-ish. It is running 24 bit color and looks good. I tried changing the color mode from full to limite and then I saw banding in the image which I did not previously see but its nothign like the issues shurcooL's display is showing:.

My options:
http://us.download.nvidia.com/XFree86/Linux-x86_64/331.38/README/xconfigoptions.html
 

asteroids

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Jan 1, 2014
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I too have the shading problem. Am running NVIDIA-Linux-x86_64-325.15 The latest drivers cause excessive crashes with Firefox.
 

asteroids

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Jan 1, 2014
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I too have the shading problem. Am running NVIDIA-Linux-x86_64-325.15 The latest drivers cause excessive crashes with Firefox.
 

asteroids

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I hooked up the VGA port and displayed the image without the crush of pallet. The problem is along the HDMI path. Graphics card/driver, cable, or monitor.
 

bzo

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May 22, 2007
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YUV444 mode (no YUV422 listed on the linux drivers) made the whole display look purple-ish. It is running 24 bit color and looks good. I tried changing the color mode from full to limite and then I saw banding in the image which I did not previously see but its nothign like the issues shurcooL's display is showing:.

Thanks for checking. Now that I check the options again, it is YUV444 and not YUV422.
 

cptcorn

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Dec 11, 2013
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BGR means the subpixel order is Blue, Green Red instead of the much more common Red, Green Blue.

Windows will play with the subpixels sometimes to try to apply anti-aliasing on text. This is called ClearType, and if windows is trying to anti-alias a RGB display but is really hooked up to a BGR display, things get funky.

In the registry you can go to something like >

HKEY_CURRENT_USER\SOFTWARE\Microsoft\Avalon.Graphics\My Display 1

(cleartype is applied individually per each display, so if you have a multi-display settup figure out which one the seiki is)

If you set "Pixel Structure" to 0, text wont be anti-aliased. This will look bad.

If you set "Pixel Structure" to 1, then you are set up for a RGB display. This should look better but odd.

If you set "Pixel Structure" to 2, things should be perfect.

I also recommend setting your gamma level to somewhere between 1900~2200 (decimal). I prefer 2200 but you can play around with it yourself.

Mine was already set to these values, still nasty text (most noticeable in red)
 
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Ok, so my dad has three 39 inch seiki's. The two he has at home are fine with almost the same setup except he has a 5800 series eyefinity 6 card at work and a 7800 series at home. Both using accel active dp 1.1 -> HDMI 1.4 adapters and running windows. His two at home are fine his display at work is definitely messed up but its not as bad as some of the other guys. Here is his picture:



The two at home are flashed with the 50 inch firmware where the one at work is not. I guess we will try flashing to see if it makes a difference but I doubt it will.
 

Logun

n00b
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Mar 5, 2012
Messages
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I just ordered my 39" today so I'm obviously interested to see if Seiki is updating their firmware at manufacturing or if it will still be necessary.

What cables should I be using? Is a regular HDMI 1.4 cable sufficient? Or is there a reason you're using DP -> HDMI? Just available ports on your card?
 

thomaslfessler

Limp Gawd
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Jul 26, 2005
Messages
143
Jumping between systems and video cards.('09 Mac Pro - 7950 & 680GTX || Win 8.1 Box with AMD 6870) The color issues are 100% reproducible by sending the display a YUV color format rather than a RGB color format.

From Windows:
6870 -> mDP -> Active DVI Adapter -> HDMI to Seiki, the issue does not reproduce and the image is always sent as RGB
6870 -> HDMI ->Seiki, Image initially sent as YUV. Changed to RGB and issue disappeared.

From OS X:
There does not seem to be a solution.
This should help, but it has no effect in OS X: http://www.ireckon.net/2013/03/forc...ix-the-picture-quality-of-an-external-monitor

Overall
Does NOT appear to be an issue with the monitor. Just the data it's sent.
 
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bzo

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May 22, 2007
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I have an nvidia card and it appears that there is a known issue of the windows nvidia drivers refusing to send full range rgb over hdmi, except for "PC" resolutions. When I switch to a resolution listed in the PC group (such as 1024x768), the banding isn't there. But with a custom resolution or built in one listed under HD/SD I get the banding.

There is a registry hack that is supposed to override this, but I haven't been able to get it to work as of yet. If I can't the hack to work, I may need to try an active DP to HDMI adapter, as this may get this TV to be seen as a monitor.
 

shurcooL

[H]ard|Gawd
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Oct 12, 2007
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thomaslfessler, that's a very interesting finding, thanks! I'll have to try it. Where in Windows can you control whether it's RGB or YUV?
 
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well the only other difference between my dad's machine at home and work is he is using myc ustom inf with the 120Hz mode in it. Also at 4k why would it be pushing a TV mode when its not really a what is considered a normal TV mode (no overscan bs like at 1080p).
 

elleana

2[H]4U
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Apr 15, 2006
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With the 39" on sale for $404, I just got a price match for my end of November purchase. Sweet!

Been meaning to pick up the 39" and am almost going to hit checkout now that its at $404, but I'm wondering if something new is around the corner. Granted, its probably not going to be anywhere near as cheap, but am kinda torn right now. Argh.
 
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Yeah.. honestly even if the 60Hz ASUS 39 inch comes out that was supposed to be using the same panel I have a lot of doubts it will allow for 120Hz @ 1080p. If I had to chose 60Hz at every resolution + MST or 30hz @ 4k with 120Hz @ 1080p then I think I would chose the 30hz 4k with 60 Hz 1080p.
 

shurcooL

[H]ard|Gawd
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Jumping between systems and video cards.('09 Mac Pro - 7950 & 680GTX || Win 8.1 Box with AMD 6870) The color issues are 100% reproducible by sending the display a YUV color format rather than a RGB color format.

From Windows:
6870 -> mDP -> Active DVI Adapter -> HDMI to Seiki, the issue does not reproduce and the image is always sent as RGB
6870 -> HDMI ->Seiki, Image initially sent as YUV. Changed to RGB and issue disappeared.

From OS X:
There does not seem to be a solution.
This should help, but it has no effect in OS X: http://www.ireckon.net/2013/03/forc...ix-the-picture-quality-of-an-external-monitor

Overall
Does NOT appear to be an issue with the monitor. Just the data it's sent.
Ok, you're definitely onto something with that.

I was able to get it to display the colors absolutely smoothly when I tried with resolutions of 1440x900 or lower in Windows.

However, I still can't get it to work properly at 3840x2160 at all.

I've tried the Accell active mDP->HDMI adapter, but it did not help in any way.

It might be because I'm using an old Windows 7 with old boot camp Nvidia drivers. Perhaps with Windows 8.1 + latest nvidia drivers I'd see different results.

Interestingly, I was able to get it to be smooth at 1920x1080 @ 60 Hz under OS X (but not Windows). But any higher resolution keeps giving the problems as before.
 
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Ok, you're definitely onto something with that.

I was able to get it to display the colors absolutely smoothly when I tried with resolutions of 1440x900 or lower in Windows.

However, I still can't get it to work properly at 3840x2160 at all.

I've tried the Accell active mDP->HDMI adapter, but it did not help in any way.

It might be because I'm using an old Windows 7 with old boot camp Nvidia drivers. Perhaps with Windows 8.1 + latest nvidia drivers I'd see different results.

Interestingly, I was able to get it to be smooth at 1920x1080 @ 60 Hz under OS X (but not Windows). But any higher resolution keeps giving the problems as before.

Have you tried my inf?

http://box.houkouonchi.jp/seiki_custom_edid_120_240hz.inf


That was the only difference between my dad's home machine and work as both were using the accel miniDP -> HDMI 1.4 adapter as well.
 

bzo

n00b
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May 22, 2007
Messages
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Have you tried my inf?

http://box.houkouonchi.jp/seiki_custom_edid_120_240hz.inf


That was the only difference between my dad's home machine and work as both were using the accel miniDP -> HDMI 1.4 adapter as well.

That might have fixed the color banding in 1080p on mine. I'm not positive though because I tried reverted the monitor driver back to the generic one and I still have no banding at 1080p - so it's possible the registry hacks I did earlier may be what changed this.

No banding at 1080p 120hz either. No luck at 4k though.
 

bzo

n00b
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May 22, 2007
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Just flashed to the 50 firmware. It got rid of the banding at 4k res, but I think it just has better color interpolation and is masking the problem with the limited/full hdmi rgb range.

On this page: http://www.lagom.nl/lcd-test/black.php
levels 1-15 are all black in rgb mode, while they are normal in YUV mode.
 

shurcooL

[H]ard|Gawd
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Oct 12, 2007
Messages
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Tried updating Nvidia drivers to the latest, and tried your inf. Still no luck with proper colors at 4k (this is with 39 firmware; I haven't tried the others today). >_< Lower resolutions are working.
 

thomaslfessler

Limp Gawd
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Jul 26, 2005
Messages
143
When I flash to the 50" firmware, besides the overdrive in red, there is a redraw/memory effect on the display that leaves distorted colors on black backgrounds when moving other images, such as a a window, over them.





Just flashed to the 50 firmware. It got rid of the banding at 4k res, but I think it just has better color interpolation and is masking the problem with the limited/full hdmi rgb range.

On this page: http://www.lagom.nl/lcd-test/black.php
levels 1-15 are all black in rgb mode, while they are normal in YUV mode.
 

geok1ng

2[H]4U
Joined
Oct 28, 2007
Messages
2,129
Just flashed to the 50 firmware. It got rid of the banding at 4k res, but I think it just has better color interpolation and is masking the problem with the limited/full hdmi rgb range.

On this page: http://www.lagom.nl/lcd-test/black.php
levels 1-15 are all black in rgb mode, while they are normal in YUV mode.

New firmware= new calibration!

NVIDIA control panel>Digital color format:
RGB= NO BANDING
YCbCr444= banding

So with the 50" frimware and a new NVIDIA card instead of the old 39" firmware and AMd card i move from the old 4::4:2 limited to RGB color space.

That also means that my old calibration settings FAIL MISERABLY at black and white levels tests on lagoon, now i must use:

Contrast 48
Brightness 61

The good news is that now in RGB i can have a perfect score on BOTH blacks AND whites! Gone is the "VA panel black crushing" that i was reporting before as i can see all black squares on the black level test without losing any white square on the white saturation tests. Unfortunately my gamma is around 1.8 now, so further tweaking in the color channels will be needed. I will post nw results as soon as i am finished recalibrating gamma.
 

asteroids

n00b
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Jan 1, 2014
Messages
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Loaded the 50" firmware on my 39". Reset my graphics card profile and settings and recalibrated. I took my time and set by black point and white point carefully.

Much much better, BUT... the problem with gradients is still there. Viewing http://www.lagom.nl/lcd-test/gradient.php clearly shows the problem. I see vertical areas of red and green in the grey scale suggesting a firmware problem with the monitor.

My aging SGI monitor (broadcast quality and hanging on the same nvidia card) shows flat fields with smooth transitions and no artifacts. It still might be and HDMI problem with the nvidia driver but I suspect not.
 

geok1ng

2[H]4U
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2,129
Loaded the 50" firmware on my 39". Reset my graphics card profile and settings and recalibrated. I took my time and set by black point and white point carefully.

Much much better, BUT... the problem with gradients is still there. Viewing http://www.lagom.nl/lcd-test/gradient.php clearly shows the problem. I see vertical areas of red and green in the grey scale suggesting a firmware problem with the monitor.

My aging SGI monitor (broadcast quality and hanging on the same nvidia card) shows flat fields with smooth transitions and no artifacts. It still might be and HDMI problem with the nvidia driver but I suspect not.

Using NVIDIA here with NO DP>hdmi adapter, simple and direct HDMI cable.
NO BANDING WITH RGB COLOR SPACE.
NO RED /GREEN STUFF on image test.

rough color tweak:

color mode warm
gain red 128
gain green 126
gain blue 136

offset red 350
offset green 450
offset blue 500

in nvidia control panel

gamma
all channels +0.50

this is netting me around 2.2 red, 2.1 green and 1.9 blue on gamma test at 48% luminance bars.
 

thomaslfessler

Limp Gawd
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Jul 26, 2005
Messages
143
+1 for the 50" firmware for OSX/AMD 7950. Using a huey&#8226;Pro, I'm finally able to match the color profile my a Dell 3007wfp-hc.
A single link active adapter is still required.

However.... I'm seeing dancing pixels in translucent drop shadows along the edges of some objects. And the display intermittently turns black...

Seiki needs to be poked for a firmware update....
 
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Logun

n00b
Joined
Mar 5, 2012
Messages
21
awesome thanks! it will arrive this week and I wanted to ensure I had all the necessary cables to play with it at different resolutions and refresh rates. Pixel clock is still something I'm learning about.
 

b7fLuid

n00b
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Dec 2, 2013
Messages
8
Have you tried my inf?

http://box.houkouonchi.jp/seiki_custom_edid_120_240hz.inf


That was the only difference between my dad's home machine and work as both were using the accel miniDP -> HDMI 1.4 adapter as well.

Hey Houkouonchi,

first just wanted to say thanks for all the work you've been putting into these Seiki threads. It's been close to a year's worth of work and it's definitely helpful!

Anywyays, I'm having issues with updating the drivers with your .inf file. I go to the device manager, display, adapter, AMD radeon HD 7800 series, properties, driver, update driver, browse my computer and then the folder with your .inf file, but I keep getting the message "the best driver software for your device is up to date".

Could it be that I'm using the CRU monitor resolution app?

I'm using Win8, i7 875K, AMD 7850 2gb, catalyst 13.9, HDMI connection with the Seiki 50" firmware update.

Any help would be greatly appreciated. Thanks!
 
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Hey Houkouonchi,

first just wanted to say thanks for all the work you've been putting into these Seiki threads. It's been close to a year's worth of work and it's definitely helpful!

Anywyays, I'm having issues with updating the drivers with your .inf file. I go to the device manager, display, adapter, AMD radeon HD 7800 series, properties, driver, update driver, browse my computer and then the folder with your .inf file, but I keep getting the message "the best driver software for your device is up to date".

Could it be that I'm using the CRU monitor resolution app?

I'm using Win8, i7 875K, AMD 7850 2gb, catalyst 13.9, HDMI connection with the Seiki 50" firmware update.

Any help would be greatly appreciated. Thanks!

Problem is the driver is for a monitor not the display adapter. So go to device manager (devmgmt.msc) and go to the monitors subsection (not display adapters) which is usually "Plug and Play monitor".
 

b7fLuid

n00b
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Dec 2, 2013
Messages
8
Hey thanks,

at first I did try updating the monitor as well, but got an error message. I restarted Win8 with driver enforcement turned off and it works now.

Still getting resizing of windows when the monitor turns off and on or wakes from sleep. I guess I can live with that.

Tried gaming at 720P. Works pretty well.

Thanks again!
 
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Hey thanks,

at first I did try updating the monitor as well, but got an error message. I restarted Win8 with driver enforcement turned off and it works now.

Still getting resizing of windows when the monitor turns off and on or wakes from sleep. I guess I can live with that.

Tried gaming at 720P. Works pretty well.

Thanks again!

The resizing of the windows thing can be fixed if you buy an HDMI detective (if its worth the cost to fix that issue).
 

geok1ng

2[H]4U
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Oct 28, 2007
Messages
2,129
The resizing of the windows thing can be fixed if you buy an HDMI detective (if its worth the cost to fix that issue).

Well using AMd i could force the OS window to detect the display when i changed inputs or teh TV went into sleep mode, but with NVIDIA it is impossible to resume the dispaly after standby/sleep, even with a power cycle on the TV or force detection on NVIDIA control panel/ windows control panel. I have disabled all power savings in windows as a workaround but it sucks big time
 

dt3k

Weaksauce
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Jan 31, 2006
Messages
83
Was about to pull the trigger on the 39" but the price just jumped on Amazon. Any chance it'll go back down again?
 

dt3k

Weaksauce
Joined
Jan 31, 2006
Messages
83
Oh wait, looks like Amazon has pulled the 39".

"Item Under Review
While this item is available from other marketplace sellers on this page, it is not currently offered by Amazon.com because customers have told us there may be something wrong with our inventory of the item, the way we are shipping it, or the way it's described here. (Thanks for the tip!)

We're working to fix the problem as quickly as possible."
 

thomaslfessler

Limp Gawd
Joined
Jul 26, 2005
Messages
143
Maybe some good news on the OS X front.. Apple is asking for more information about issues with OS X drivers on Apple Hardware. I've sent across details from my MacPro with a 7950.

If you have issues with OS X and the Seiki, display please submit a bug to bugreporter.apple.com with the following information:
  • attach a close up picture of the image on the display showing the corruption
  • include a reference to bug: 15841651 - 3840x2160 resolution sent as 1920x2160 to external display
  • attach a hardware report from your system (see below)

To obtain a full System Information Report (ASP, system profile):
1. Select "About This Mac" from the Apple Menu
2. Click the &#8220;More Info&#8230;&#8221; button on the About This Mac window
3. Click &#8220;System Report&#8230;&#8221; on the next About This Mac window
4. Select "Save&#8230;" from the File menu (cmd-s)
5. Change the file name and save location as needed
6. Click the "Save" button
 

garrettwp

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Jan 21, 2014
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I am having similar issues as a few others. I have the Seiki SE39UY04 hooked up to a 2012 Macbook Pro Retina via HDMI running Mac OS 10.9.1. Mac OS is not running the display at RGB and is causing issues with banding especially in the reds. I am having issues with trying to force it to RGB mode. I ran the hack from here: http://www.ireckon.net/2013/03/forc...ix-the-picture-quality-of-an-external-monitor and it forces the display to run in RGB mode, but the resolution is now stuck at 1440x900 and can not be forced any higher. It does however correct the banging in the gradient found here: http://img826.imageshack.us/img826/5143/1vs6.png. I hooked it up to my Windows laptop which can only output at 1920x1080 for this display and the banding is non existent and outputs in the correct RGB mode.

So as a few others have stated if we can get the mac to output in RGB mode and not in television mode, this should fix the banding issues. But trying to force mac to use RGB and have the correct resolution at 3840x2160 is the issue.

- Garrett
 

thomaslfessler

Limp Gawd
Joined
Jul 26, 2005
Messages
143
I am having similar issues as a few others. I have the Seiki SE39UY04 hooked up to a 2012 Macbook Pro Retina via HDMI running Mac OS 10.9.1. Mac OS is not running the display at RGB and is causing issues with banding especially in the reds. I am having issues with trying to force it to RGB mode. I ran the hack from here: http://www.ireckon.net/2013/03/forc...ix-the-picture-quality-of-an-external-monitor and it forces the display to run in RGB mode, but the resolution is now stuck at 1440x900 and can not be forced any higher. It does however correct the banging in the gradient found here: http://img826.imageshack.us/img826/5143/1vs6.png. I hooked it up to my Windows laptop which can only output at 1920x1080 for this display and the banding is non existent and outputs in the correct RGB mode.

So as a few others have stated if we can get the mac to output in RGB mode and not in television mode, this should fix the banding issues. But trying to force mac to use RGB and have the correct resolution at 3840x2160 is the issue.

- Garrett

I saw the same results with a 7950 with OS X and a 6870 with Windows 8.1. The best way to get this fixed is to Enter a bug at apple (see my post above). It took less than a day to hear back on broken HDMI performance on OS X. With further research, it turns out that Apple is limiting HDMI bandwidth to a 1.0 specification of 165Hz. HDMI was updated to specification 1.3 in 2006, raising the limit to 330Hz. As long as trey can figure out where to change 165 to 330, it should be an easy fix. The same goes for your bug.

While most assume Apple knows about these issues, their quick response and request for more info tells me otherwise.
 
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