Samsung No Longer Battery Supplier to Apple

CommanderFrank

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With all of the lawsuits flying back and forth between Samsung and Apple, there is little doubt that both companies are cutting the ties between themselves as supplier and consumer. The latest casualty in the legal wrangling is the iPad and MacBook battery supplier contract from Samsung.

But rumors continue to swirl that the supplier relationship between Samsung and Apple is in the process of eroding.
 

SkribbelKat

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The trouble with being a company that pretty much contracts out everything from designing new devices to putting stuff into boxes to ship to consumers is that you hafta be careful about making the suppliers upset or stuff like this happens.
 

-Axiom-

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Watching Apples decline is going to be more fun than watching Romney lose.:D
 

faugusztin

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The funny part of this whole saga will be the part, when Apple will be overwhelmed by refunds due faulty products. You can already see it with the bad retina displays from LG (because Samsung is evil), now you will get Chinese batteries, later they will move the ARM CPU production to TMSC (if they will be able to secure some production capacity next to AMD and NVIDIA),...

There was a reason why they used Samsung so far, and it wasn't the price.
 

bastage

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LMAO... Now samsung just needs to price apple out of the market.. Apple still has there fan boys , but samsung has proven that the GS3's & galaxy tabs are viable alternatives to the apple crap so if they just simply cut prices so that the no contract price for the phones & tablets were 200ish iOS product sales would hit all time lows.. & Since Apple wants to use everyone else for making those products now it wont hurt samsung as badly as it would have before..
 

Skripka

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The trouble with being a company that pretty much contracts out everything from designing new devices to putting stuff into boxes to ship to consumers is that you hafta be careful about making the suppliers upset or stuff like this happens.

Apple was fine with Samsung as long as they were OEM and nothing more...now that Sammy has moved into Apple's realm of computer product and*gasp* has become a competitor they are the debil. How dare businesses divetsify and expand!
 

SkribbelKat

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Apple was fine with Samsung as long as they were OEM and nothing more...now that Sammy has moved into Apple's realm of computer product and*gasp* has become a competitor they are the debil. How dare businesses divetsify and expand!

Its kinda a popular rumor (dunno if its true) that Apple doesn't do much in-house design. They ask other companies to design their stuff for them based on some vague specifications or whatever. If Samsung designed some of their phones for them and then started running with their own designs, Apple might be getting upset over that. I would think that kinda stuff would eventually leak out to the press though, NDAs or not. :p It could explain why Apple is super-dee-duper upset with Samsung over them competing since they might be thinking, "Hey, we paid them to design X, Y, & Z for us and now they're making junk that looks sorta similar! Sue them!"
 

Skripka

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Its kinda a popular rumor (dunno if its true) that Apple doesn't do much in-house design. They ask other companies to design their stuff for them based on some vague specifications or whatever. If Samsung designed some of their phones for them and then started running with their own designs, Apple might be getting upset over that. I would think that kinda stuff would eventually leak out to the press though, NDAs or not. :p It could explain why Apple is super-dee-duper upset with Samsung over them competing since they might be thinking, "Hey, we paid them to design X, Y, & Z for us and now they're making junk that looks sorta similar! Sue them!"

I think it is more that Samsung undersudied Apple's marketing style. Rather than being like HTC with a million cell devices of varying quality with alphabet soup named product brands that only are sold for a year...making a few quality products, with yearly sequels that get brand recognition.

That and they make devices with rounded corners makes Apple pissed.
 

Skizzy

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The trouble with being a company that pretty much contracts out everything from designing new devices to putting stuff into boxes to ship to consumers is that you hafta be careful about making the suppliers upset or stuff like this happens.

Now someone please correct me if I'm wrong, but I'm pretty sure that the CEO of the most valuable company in the world properly weighed the pros and cons before dabbling into this whole affair.
 

SkribbelKat

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I think it is more that Samsung undersudied Apple's marketing style. Rather than being like HTC with a million cell devices of varying quality with alphabet soup named product brands that only are sold for a year...making a few quality products, with yearly sequels that get brand recognition.

That and they make devices with rounded corners makes Apple pissed.

I think my graphing calculator has rounded edges too. :eek: Watch out Texas Instruments, you're next!

Anyhow, as silly as the drama between the those two companies is to watch, you're probably right. Apple does market recognizable, memorable products and most Android phone companies don't. In fact, offhand I can't even really think of too many other phones by name except for the Galaxy line and the Nokia's Lumina stuff (which nobody buys anyhow).

Now someone please correct me if I'm wrong, but I'm pretty sure that the CEO of the most valuable company in the world properly weighed the pros and cons before dabbling into this whole affair.

I'm 100% sure you're correct, but it's more fun if you believe me and we pretend there are giant alien chopsticks from the planet Zebronam that are hiding on the dark side of the moon that are behind a hugenormous conspiracy to get Apple to make mind-controlling iPhones and they're upset because Samsung, under the control of local demons from the inside of the Hollow Earth, are busy undermining their efforts with competing stuff. The chopsticks, of course, have to resort to begging the High Court of Moustache-Endowed Wizards to favor them, but never thought about how the demons control resource extraction and component manufacture. :D
 

bmango

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Im thinking it is apple that has been the hand that has been feeding samsung, not the other way around. There are other companies out there that can make things besides samsung, so is this really going to be hard for apple? Apple does do most of their design and specs in house.
 

Skripka

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Im thinking it is apple that has been the hand that has been feeding samsung, not the other way around. There are other companies out there that can make things besides samsung, so is this really going to be hard for apple? Apple does do most of their design and specs in house.

Problem being the source of all their profit...their outsourcing of all manufacturing and assembly.

There are VERY few companies able to respond to Apple's demands of volume and miniscule profit margins. FoxConn and Samsung are used because they arethe best options among a handful of willing and able companies. If Apple had much choice they would've ditched FoxConn long ago. Apple doesn't have much choice due to how they operate.
 

bmango

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Do you honestly think that when millions going into billions are to be made, that no one will be available and step up? Small profit margins when your talking about per unit, not when you factor in millions and over a period of time.
 

Skripka

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Do you honestly think that when millions going into billions are to be made, that no one will be available and step up? Small profitmarginswhen your talking about per unit, not when you factor in millions and over a period of time.

Very few companies exist like FoxConn that will not only take miniscule margins...but which can put out massive quantities of product to a high q/c standard and be able to within 24 hours implement massive product design and assembly changes on a moments notice and have them shipping out the door.

If there were so many companies that could do the above Apple would have fired FoxConn a long time back.
 

refraxion

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Im thinking it is apple that has been the hand that has been feeding samsung, not the other way around. There are other companies out there that can make things besides samsung, so is this really going to be hard for apple? Apple does do most of their design and specs in house.

+1. I don't believe Samsung would be where they are today in the mobile realm without the help of Apple. GS3 owner here.
 

ICOM

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Now someone please correct me if I'm wrong, but I'm pretty sure that the CEO of the most valuable company in the world properly weighed the pros and cons before dabbling into this whole affair.

Kinda like Yahoo's CEO declining Microsoft's offer? Yeah...CEOs...


.
 

Ashbringer

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Watching Apples decline is going to be more fun than watching Romney lose.:D

Obama will bail out Apple.
images
 

Ashbringer

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Now someone please correct me if I'm wrong, but I'm pretty sure that the CEO of the most valuable company in the world properly weighed the pros and cons before dabbling into this whole affair.
The problem with a company like Apple is that when they're on top, they don't see anything as a problem. They're literally high on themselves.

I'm sure they have alternatives, but this is Samsung here. They're like the new Sony for quality electronics. Apple will have a hard time replacing, if ever.

I don't believe Samsung would be where they are today in the mobile realm without the help of Apple. GS3 owner here.

Cause Samsung was never know for things like their quality LCD or Plasma screen TVs? How about their memory nand chips? They totally needed Apple to make quality products? It's the other way around. Without Samsung, Apple wouldn't have the tech needed to create their products. It's not like Windows Mobile Phones didn't have Samsung components in them before anyone ever conceived the idea of an iPhone.
 

Jagger100

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Its kinda a popular rumor (dunno if its true) that Apple doesn't do much in-house design. They ask other companies to design their stuff for them based on some vague specifications or whatever. If Samsung designed some of their phones for them and then started running with their own designs, Apple might be getting upset over that. I would think that kinda stuff would eventually leak out to the press though, NDAs or not. :p It could explain why Apple is super-dee-duper upset with Samsung over them competing since they might be thinking, "Hey, we paid them to design X, Y, & Z for us and now they're making junk that looks sorta similar! Sue them!"
Almost any country on the Planet can design an atomic bomb. Its making one that is hard and making 100's that is extremely hard.

Manufacturing capability is where the magic for the modern world lies. You can have all the eggheads in the world coming up with great ideas, but they don't mean anything if you can't make them. And my job has more to do with being one of the eggheads than manufacture, so this isn't self-aggrandizing bias.
 

DejaWiz

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Im thinking it is apple that has been the hand that has been feeding samsung, not the other way around. There are other companies out there that can make things besides samsung, so is this really going to be hard for apple? Apple does do most of their design and specs in house.

+1. I don't believe Samsung would be where they are today in the mobile realm without the help of Apple. GS3 owner here.

Not even close. Samsung has had such a large market share in the mobile market since the 80's that they would be exactly where they are even without Apple. Samsung has been involved with telecom networking since the late 70's. Apple would be up shit creek without Foxconn and Samsung being able to help them out with their i-whatevers self bailout plan, plainly and simply put.
 

doho7744

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+1. I don't believe Samsung would be where they are today in the mobile realm without the help of Apple. GS3 owner here.

Samsung Electronics which is a division of Samsung Groups is about the same size with the same level of revenue as Apple, then you got their engineering, insurance, IT and heavy equipment divisions. So Samsung will be alright.

The key thing is that Samsung has many eggs in many baskets while Apple has many eggs in one basket.

And Samsung makes quality components that many companies want. Apple sells stuff to consumers.
 

Skripka

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Samsung Electronics which is a division of Samsung Groups is about the same size with the same level of revenue as Apple, then you got their engineering, insurance, IT and heavy equipment divisions. So Samsung will be alright.

The key thing is that Samsung has many eggs in many baskets while Apple has many eggs in one basket.

And Samsung makes quality components that many companies want. Apple sells stuff to consumers.

Yup. I have a Sammy microwave.
 

rudy

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This is the natural progression of out sourcing, but it is not going to be that bad for Apple, remember US companies have been out sourcing for a long time, pretty much everyone gets their computers made by quanta. Naturally after a time these suppliers decide they want a piece of the retail profit and start building them self. Then OEMs just put the money they made into a new source, the cycle keeps repeating over and over. Apple has enough money, read more than nVidia or AMD to get contracts with anyone they want. And I am pretty sure for a long time both companies have been letting the contracts expire and looking for alternatives. Don't forget the reason samsung exists is because companies like Sony used to be like samsung, and it wont be long before hua wei or some other Chinese player is happy to fill Samsungs shoes.

Apples success started with the iPod and it made them enough money to demand pretty much anything they want, in fact apple is amazing because unlike most companies they literally can drop down in specs / quality and will still sell like hot cakes.
 

Skripka

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This is the natural progression of out sourcing, but it is not going to be that bad for Apple, remember US companies have been out sourcing for a long time, pretty much everyone gets their computers made by quanta. Naturally after a time these suppliers decide they want a piece of the retail profit and start building them self. Then OEMs just put the money they made into a new source, the cycle keeps repeating over and over. Apple has enough money, read more than nVidia or AMD to get contracts with anyone they want. And I am pretty sure for a long time both companies have been letting the contracts expire and looking for alternatives. Don't forget the reason samsung exists is because companies like Sony used to be like samsung, and it wont be long before hua wei or some other Chinese player is happy to fill Samsungs shoes.

Apples success started with the iPod and it made them enough money to demand pretty much anything they want, in fact apple is amazing because unlike most companies they literally can drop down in specs / quality and will still sell like hot cakes.

Except in the cellphone market iphone prices cannot be lowered much more without carriers considering dropping the device. Tmobile doesn't carry the iphone because they admit that the Apple iphone contract for carriers basicslly mean that Tmo cannot make any money on the device/contract.
 

maboblivion

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Apple takes obvious ideas and patents them and then sells your those ideas at an inflated price.
 

nutzo

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Watching Apples decline is going to be more fun than watching Romney lose.:D

Fix that for you....

Watching Apples decline is going to be more fun than watching all the Obama voters lose their jobs/homes/health insurance/etc. during the upcoming Obama recession.
 

rudy

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Except in the cellphone market iphone prices cannot be lowered much more without carriers considering dropping the device. Tmobile doesn't carry the iphone because they admit that the Apple iphone contract for carriers basicslly mean that Tmo cannot make any money on the device/contract.

Apple makes plenty of profit off the iPhone ecosystem to drop prices, but why would they when people keep buying them by the millions and carriers keep signing bad contracts?
 

pelo

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I was just having this discussion with a family member over Thanksgiving.

Apple's business model relies on other companies to make their product (and even design some of it), but with high margins because their products are labeled as being "cool." That's a very iffy business model, I think. Obviously, they've got absolutely massive cash reserves and are the most profitable company on the planet, but it hinges on something that can best be described as a fashion trend. So long as Apple is heading in the same way that people's needs (well... wants) are headed then they'll do well. But if they make a misstep then they're in trouble.

If granddad and grandma have the same Apple tablet and iPhone as their grandchildren, I'm not sure how long that "cool" title will apply. Unlike Samsung, they don't make their own stuff, nor do they own their own fabs. As soon as Apple's products stop being "cool" they're fucked.
 

Amaroth

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Fix that for you....

Watching Apples decline is going to be more fun than watching all the Obama voters lose their jobs/homes/health insurance/etc. during the upcoming Obama recession.

When you look at the practices of Apple they are very much the democrats of the tech world. PC/Samsung/Microsoft are the unsexy republicans. I look at Apples stock and i'm amazed how its worth so much when they have been losing market share in both the tablet and mobile markets at an astounding pace. Why doesn't their stock reflect it? I'm not an economist.
 

mope54

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If granddad and grandma have the same Apple tablet and iPhone as their grandchildren, I'm not sure how long that "cool" title will apply.
yeah, everyone sitting around the table sharing apps and music and photos seamlessly sure will suck
 

Amaroth

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yeah, everyone sitting around the table sharing apps and music and photos seamlessly sure will suck

Which you will never be able to do seamlessly with Apple devices unless you own an Apple device. This was one of many downfalls of their company in the 80s. I'll take my open ended droid system over Apple every time.
 

pelo

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yeah, everyone sitting around the table sharing apps and music and photos seamlessly sure will suck

Do you think these people think about that stuff?

tumblr_lwsoj1B4r41qfrhcu.png


Apple's marketing is genius, my question that I'm posing is how long will it work? Unlike Samsung or LG, they don't have plenty of different markets to keep them afloat along with the option of making parts for others.

A top-to-bottom approach like Samsung's is easier to maximize with respect to profits. You don't charge yourself a lot when you make your own screen, battery or what have you. Conversely, Apple will always get charged higher prices than what Samsung charges themselves, and that's for damn near every single component within the product.

It's sort of like Intel getting a sweeter deal on wafers from their own fabs than does AMD via GloFo or TSMC. Which also applies here, because Apple is still using Samsung's fabs :p
 

faugusztin

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I look at Apples stock and i'm amazed how its worth so much when they have been losing market share in both the tablet and mobile markets at an astounding pace. Why doesn't their stock reflect it? I'm not an economist.

Because stock market is driven by logic, right ? :rolleyes:
 
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