Samsung Announces Cause of Galaxy Note7 Incidents in Press Conference

Zarathustra[H]

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As we reported at the beginning of the month Samsung was planning on releasing their investigation into the fiery Galaxy Note 7 issues this month. Today they came through. The main issue appears to have been damage to separators allowing negative and positive electrodes to make contact inside the "jelly roll" of the battery. They do - however - point to several contributing causes that allow this to happen.

Based on what the company learned from the investigation, Samsung implemented a broad range of internal quality and safety processes to further enhance product safety including additional protocols such as the multi-layer safety measures and 8-Point Battery Safety Check. Samsung also formed a Battery Advisory Group of external advisers, academic and research experts to ensure it maintains a clear and objective perspective on battery safety and innovation.
 

RogueTadhg

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45230629.jpg
 

Darunion

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I agree but we live in a world were manufacturer think thinner is better. Thanks Apple.

This was for sure a case of "lets launch product and test at the same time, we don't think there will be an issue so lets not hold back sales for a stupid routine test." I have heard this said before and it makes you smash your face on the desk.
 

vegeta535

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This was for sure a case of "lets launch product and test at the same time, we don't think there will be an issue so lets not hold back sales for a stupid routine test." I have heard this said before and it makes you smash your face on the desk.
Oh no doubt it wasn't properly tested but it still is the end result chasing the thinnest benchmark.
 

bds1904

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Looking at everything it's clear that the causes of the issues were:
  1. Poor preproduction engineering
  2. Poor assembly procedure design
  3. General lack of acceptable QC
 

andrewaggb

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Looking at everything it's clear that the causes of the issues were:
  1. Poor preproduction engineering
  2. Poor assembly procedure design
  3. General lack of acceptable QC

I just hope their $5B+ mistake actually results in real safety changes industry-wide. There have been so many battery recalls over the years that you'd think nobody would ship anything with a lithium battery anymore unless they were extremely confident it was safe for all use cases. But it just keeps happening...
 

Zarathustra[H]

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This was for sure a case of "lets launch product and test at the same time, we don't think there will be an issue so lets not hold back sales for a stupid routine test." I have heard this said before and it makes you smash your face on the desk.

Well, with all things electrical there are quite a few regulatory requirements for testing before they can go to market. I'm guessing it had more to do with oversight than intentional proceeding without testing. When you make a new product it's not always straight forward what you need to test, and what you don't need to test.
 

Azrak

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So... 1. compressing the soft-body battery corners into a space not designed for it, 2. electrodes that don't stop before the jelly roll curve, 3. missing insulators and 4. poor welds. Seems like 75% battery manufacturing problems (2, 3, 4) and 25% Samsung battery fitment design issues (1) to me.
 

Darunion

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Well, with all things electrical there are quite a few regulatory requirements for testing before they can go to market. I'm guessing it had more to do with oversight than intentional proceeding without testing. When you make a new product it's not always straight forward what you need to test, and what you don't need to test.

True, but also as this is not their first product. Unless their EE's were all new that were involved on battery as well as gate testing personel. They also have to be careful what they say as it could cause more additional investigates and/or fines as well as loss of product/company faith. Also they handled it so poorly, I guess also have to take into consideration that it is a korean company, and in my experiences over there, it is a lot different than here.
 
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Gee a battery shorting internally causing fires...who'd a guess that would be the outcome.

Duh!
 

Lord_Exodia

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Many knew the moment they made the battery non removable it would come back to bite them in the ass. Many were right. I still have my note 7 but it looks like Verizon is shipping me a box to return it according to my latest email from them. Sadly there is not a single phone in their portfolio that I want. I would be willing to fall back to a Note 5 until a Note successor is announced but NOT at a 2 year lock in contract with that device and to make matters worse that phone is no longer available. Verizon has nothing that does what the Note does. Looks like I need to speak to them about this.
 

otherweeb

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Kudos to them for actually disclosing their findings. I expect they institute greater lifecycle testing of new components.
 

Krazy925

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Many knew the moment they made the battery non removable it would come back to bite them in the ass. Many were right. I still have my note 7 but it looks like Verizon is shipping me a box to return it according to my latest email from them. Sadly there is not a single phone in their portfolio that I want. I would be willing to fall back to a Note 5 until a Note successor is announced but NOT at a 2 year lock in contract with that device and to make matters worse that phone is no longer available. Verizon has nothing that does what the Note does. Looks like I need to speak to them about this.
They told my buddy to kick rocks and he gave up unlimited for it.

Also 4 posts to blame Apple.
 
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Kudos to them for actually disclosing their findings. I expect they institute greater lifecycle testing of new components.

This was reported as the problem not 2 weeks into the mess when it was going on, people were to busy with saying the world is going to burn down to notice.

As for lifecycle testing, again, I will say it AGAIN, there was a 0.0031% failure rate, based on reports, NOT actual confirmed cases, these reports also include phones that just get hot/no longer work, not actual fires. But who cares about facts and statistics when you can make tasty headlines with hysteria. Because 96 reports of bad batteries out of 3.1 million phones and the sky is going to catch fire.
 

Zarathustra[H]

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This was reported as the problem not 2 weeks into the mess when it was going on, people were to busy with saying the world is going to burn down to notice.

As for lifecycle testing, again, I will say it AGAIN, there was a 0.0031% failure rate, based on reports, NOT actual confirmed cases, these reports also include phones that just get hot/no longer work, not actual fires. But who cares about facts and statistics when you can make tasty headlines with hysteria. Because 96 reports of bad batteries out of 3.1 million phones and the sky is going to catch fire.


True, and I would agree that in most cases a 0.0031% is a resounding success...

Have even one of those fuckers take down a plane - however - and you're going to have a bad day.
 

Trepidati0n

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True, and I would agree that in most cases a 0.0031% is a resounding success...

Have even one of those fuckers take down a plane - however - and you're going to have a bad day.

How? There isn't enough ignition mass to cause any significant damage to an plane. However, it would definitely cause a lot of panic and hysteria..no doubt.
 

Lith1um

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This was for sure a case of "lets launch product and test at the same time, we don't think there will be an issue so lets not hold back sales for a stupid routine test." I have heard this said before and it makes you smash your face on the desk.

Reminds me of a story I just read about how the US NAVY entered WWII with untested torpedoes because testing them would cost 10 grand a torp. The defective torps would run between 8 and 15 feet deeper than set to run , causing them to pass harmlessly under their targets.

The torps also had a defective contact fuse, the detonator would deform under impact and not detonate.

The NAVY ordinance dept refused to believe the torps were defective and instead the Navy charged the commanders with incompetence and cowardice, ending the command careers of many good men by court marshal. For over 18 months they sent men into battle with torps that wouldn't hit, or wouldnt detonate if they did hit.

Even worse, the torps would sometimes run a circle and strike the sub that had just launched them. Other times, they would detonate prematurely.

Interesting to note that the Navy finally hired Einstein to determine the cause of the detonator defect, but refused to listen to his findings.
 

Zarathustra[H]

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How? There isn't enough ignition mass to cause any significant damage to an plane. However, it would definitely cause a lot of panic and hysteria..no doubt.

Lets say it ignites a blanket or a jacket or some other crap a passenger brought on board. It may not be enough to bring down the plane outright, but it could be enough to fill the plane qith noxious fumes and result in another Malaysia Airways MH370 where the plane just continues on autopilot until it drops off the radar somewhere.

Smoke and confined spaces are never a good combination.
 
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True, and I would agree that in most cases a 0.0031% is a resounding success...

Have even one of those fuckers take down a plane - however - and you're going to have a bad day.

There have been a number of laptops that have caught fire and forced planes to land, and not long ago a iPhone 6 started smoking forcing a plane to land. Yet almost no media talking about it when it happened.

All batteries in cell phones and laptops along with countless other devices are ALL fire hazards. For some reason the media jumped all over this and went batshit with it.

Without a doubt an issue, however people deal with devices that can kill you at a FAR higher percentage rate every single day and consider it normal, then this happens and everyone loses their mind, that is what I don't get.

How? There isn't enough ignition mass to cause any significant damage to an plane. However, it would definitely cause a lot of panic and hysteria..no doubt.

Indeed, like the fires/smoke from the devices above, no real damage to the plane, I think one got some burns on the seat, and other than that, some people were treated for smoke inhalation and that was about it.
 
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I agree but we live in a world were manufacturer think thinner is better. Thanks Apple.

I love how morons blame Apple for everything, even Samsung phones catching fire...

Thank consumers not Apple... they are just giving us what the majority want not what you want.
 

lcpiper

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How? There isn't enough ignition mass to cause any significant damage to an plane. However, it would definitely cause a lot of panic and hysteria..no doubt.


Ummm well. There is a whole lot of oxygen being pumped around in airplanes and they have these things called human bodies that frequently inhabit the same air space with all the oxygen .........
 

Bahanime

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Why is it so hard to make a removable battery? It's not only safer, easier to replace if there's issues, but it allows secondary backup batteries for the long haul use scenarios.

As much as smartphones have improved, battery life while under load is still abysmal. We're talking 2-4 hours of load.

I would be so happy with a phone that's 1 or 2mm thicker, but had double the usable battery life.
 
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Bandalo

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Why is it so hard to make a removable battery? It's not only safer, easier to replace if there's issues, but it allows secondary backup batteries for the long haul use scenarios.

As much as smartphones have improved, battery life while under load is still abysmal. We're talking 2-4 hours of load.

I would be so happy with a phone that's 1 or 2mm thicker, but had double the usable battery life.

Two reasons. One, when people decide to buy a new spare or replacement battery for their phone, they go look for parts. They find a good OEM battery for $65. Then they see a "compatible" battery on eBay for $5. The crappy $5 battery destroys the phone, leaks, has crappy life, explodes, or causes some other headache. Now the user goes on Facebook and complains about their crappy Note 8. So Samsung gets negative press, and probably has a lot of warranty claims to deal with.

Second, it's much harder to make a phone water resistant when you have a removable battery. They'll also never feel as "solid" or be quite as compact or thin if you need to include that feature. While I'm on your side with the thinness, I WOULD like a waterproof/resistant phone.
 

Konig-Wolf

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The thinness of the phone wasn't worth it. I've used the Note series since the beginning, and wanted to upgrade my Note 4 to a Note 7...I'm glad I waited now, and I'm rocking an LG v20, which has everything the Note 7 did, except a stylus...but it does have a removable battery. Hopefully the Note 8 will go back to the pro-sumer direction of the Note series before the 5 & 7.
 

Caned

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They should have given 'free' note 7's to all isis members, would have been an easier way to get rid of them both. ^^
 

Koween

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I think samsung handled this issue very well. They didn't blame the users and just left it at that, but went deeply into red to return all of the phones. The detailed explanation is great and should put most people at ease. Hopefully manufacturers learn from this and don't try to cut corners on qc.
 

Quartz-1

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Yes, Samsung are to be commended for their full and detailed disclosure.
 
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rat

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I love how morons blame Apple for everything, even Samsung phones catching fire...

Thank consumers not Apple... they are just giving us what the majority want not what you want.

I think it's reasonable that Apple is brought up when it comes to this issue as they pushed the trend of having non-serviceable batteries. Immediately after one of the largest batter recalls ever... Apple announces a new Macbook with no removable batteries.

And yeah, they've had problems with their batteries, too. Every single generation. Some with recalls.

http://mashable.com/2016/11/30/iphone-6s-battery-recall/#__ERY7H44Sq3

iPhone.png iphone2.jpg iphone3.jpg iphone4.jpg iphone5.jpg iphone6.jpg iphone7.jpg

As someone else in this thread said, the recall investigation would have never been necessary if they had removable batteries to begin with.

There is absolutely no fucking reason for a device to not have removable batteries.
 
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Apple do have servicable batteries... All you have to do is take it to an Apple store and have it replaced with another genuine battery and not a cheap knockoff so you can blame them later. As for batteries catching fire, that can happen to any phone with if you subject it to impact or pressure. The difference is the Note 7 did it by itself.
 
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Consumers (in general) want thinner and lighter tablets, phones, and laptops so the entire industry is moving to this. In order to make them thinner and lighter, you have to make the batteries non-removable. I know on the Dell laptop side, they are still removable but you have to take the whole thing apart to change a battery and most people aren't able to change those themselves due to having to disassemble the thing and having to deal with the tiny battery connector.
 

rat

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Apple do have servicable batteries... All you have to do is take it to an Apple store and have it replaced with another genuine battery and not a cheap knockoff so you can blame them later. As for batteries catching fire, that can happen to any phone with if you subject it to impact or pressure. The difference is the Note 7 did it by itself.

Having to take a device to a specific store to get it swapped out with a refurb unit is the exact definition of NON USER SERVICEABLE.

Being able to buy an exact replacement part, pop off the battery cover and putting in the new battery yourself, without leaving your house or voiding your warranty, is the bare minimum for "user serviceable."
 
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Having to take a device to a specific store to get it swapped out with a refurb unit is the exact definition of NON USER SERVICEABLE.

Being able to buy an exact replacement part, pop off the battery cover and putting in the new battery yourself, without leaving your house or voiding your warranty, is the bare minimum for "user serviceable."

It is not swapped out with a refurb unit, the batteries have pull tabs to break the adhesive then you fit the new battery. I understand Apple doing this as it means it has to be serviced by them and ensures a proper battery is fitted and not a shitty knock off battery.
 
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Stubbed my toe today walking into work.


Thanks, Apple. You douche bags.
 

NoOther

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Also they handled it so poorly, I guess also have to take into consideration that it is a korean company, and in my experiences over there, it is a lot different than here.

Not sure how they handled this poorly? Everyone I know seems to agree they handled this situation extremely well given the circumstances. Not many other companies would have stepped up to the plate, taken ownership, offered free replacements or money to buy a competitor's product instead.
 
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