Samsung 40" JU6500 too blurry...

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silent-circuit

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Initially I thought I could handle it, but the longer I mess around with the 40" Samsung JU6500 TV I got for a monitor (having tried models from Sharp, Sony, and Vizio previously) I just can't handle the blur. It has great picture quality -- excellent black levels, contrast, uniformity, etc -- but once things start moving quickly it is a mess. I've actually been getting headaches playing Fallout 4 cause the world is pretty much gone whenever my character turns hard.

As a result I've been considering something I never thought I would -- getting a TN panel.

Basically, it's a 28" Samsung 4K TN, or if I'm willing to wait a week on shipping a 27" BenQ 4K IPS. I've more or less given up on finding a TV in my price range that works well as a monitor. Which is the lesser evil here?

I hate giving up on a 40" as I really enjoy the larger size, but I need this thing to be usable first, big and pretty second.
 
I told you.
But how blurry was you x830c?
edit: Can you try 100% brightness and tell if its still very blurry?
 
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aadik said:
I told you.
But how blurry was you x830c?
Click to expand...

A bit less, but in hindsight not a night and day difference. Honestly I was fine at first with the Samsung. I just started to notice it more and more, and now I can't stand it.

EDIT: You mean 100% backlight? The brightness setting seems to mean next to nothing on this set.

EDIT 2: Yeah, seems to make a difference, but it's far too bright for day to day use, particularly in a darkened room. Still too blurry for me, but better.
 
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If brightness/backlight 100% then this screen dont use PWM dimming and is ''flicker free'' on that brightness, so maybe its less blurry with that becasue PWM makse screens more blurry. Then we know if PWM is that what makes that screen so blurry.
 
This might help?
http://www.rtings.com/tv/reviews/samsung/ju6500 said:
LED Clear Motion
Like most Samsung TVs, it does have a backlight strobing mode (via 'Auto Motion Plus' set to 'Custom, and 'LED Motion Mode' enabled). This is grayed-out in game mode though, so you cannot benefit from it with a low input lag.
Click to expand...

If nothing else, it will let you see whether you find a strobed LCD to be acceptable.
Strobing the backlight is the only thing which actually fixes motion clarity, but there are downsides to it: flicker, a dimmer picture, and bad judder if your framerate does not match the refresh rate.
 
Will try the Auto motion plus thing... thanks zone.

EDIT: Oh dear christ no. That was horrible. I felt like I was in a fun-house or something, waiting for jump scares with strobes all around. I got a headache within 30 seconds.

PWM is one thing -- I don't notice a diffrence in clarity between 50% and 100% backlight on this display... but /fuck/ "auto motion plus". Fuck that.


This thing goes back tomorrow.
 
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Why not get an actual 42/43" 4k monitor? Mine has everything you want plus freesync
 
Tgrove said:
Why not get an actual 42/43" 4k monitor? Mine has everything you want plus freesync
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I'm unwilling to get something I can't return, and ideally look at, locally.

Picked up the Samsung today, was initially surprised by the color clarity given it's a TN but the more I messed with it trying to get good black levels the more disappointed I was. It's going back tomorrow and I'm ordering a 27" BenQ IPS instead for basically the same price.
 
greyx said:
But the contrast is poor, i guess
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Based on the reviews I've read (I've yet to see that model in person, I'm only directly familiar with the 1440P 27"s like the Catleaps and Overlords) the Wasabi Mango 40" and its various rebrands are actually pretty good in terms of picture quality.

My issue is that build quality / QA is relatively poor on the Korean displays like the Wasabi Mango he has. If you get a good one, they're fine, though often poorly designed/built power supplies are an issue and have to be replaced or modded after a time... I had a 27" 1440P Catleap that had to have a PSU replaced in less than 2 months after purchase.

If you get a bad one there's dust between screen layers, massive backlight uniformity and bleed issues, stuck and dead pixels galore (they tend to be "B" grade or worse panels to begin with, hence the low prices). This is why I want to avoid them if possible. There are no official US resellers, so you often have to ship back to South Korea for warranty work, and that is needless to say super expensive for a 40" monitor.

I was briefly looking at the Phillips 40" that's actually sold in the US, but I can't get it locally and reviews / owners here suggest it's a fairly poor quality panel. Bad uniformity, contrast, etc, and lots of people complaining about headaches from the PWM based dimming if the brightness/backlight is set below 100%.

I'll probably end up with the 27" BenQ... or I may just go back to my trusty old 26" 1920x1200 Planar for another year or so while the 4K market improves. 4K at 40" made sense, but 4K at 27" is really, really pushing it. I have to run the desktop at 1920x1080 to avoid eyestrain, so I'm only seeing the extra res in game. It make a difference but it's certainly not night and day, more like just running really, really good AA to my eyes. It was far more noticeable on the larger panels.
 
After reading more 27" 4K reviews, having given up on 40" available locally, I think I'm going to get the BenQ 2711U 4K with the AHVA/IPS panel. I can actually get it for /less/ than I paid for the Samsung TN by having BestBuy price match Amazon.
 
I have this exact model and am not experiencing the same issues you are reporting... Have you followed the guide in this forum on how to configure the TV? It doesn't cover the color, but it does cover how to properly set it up as a PC display or gaming display and in both instances it works great and looks great to me.
 
jedolley said:
I have this exact model and am not experiencing the same issues you are reporting... Have you followed the guide in this forum on how to configure the TV? It doesn't cover the color, but it does cover how to properly set it up as a PC display or gaming display and in both instances it works great and looks great to me.
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I also have the 40ju6500, and while I think its fine, I can definitely see the blur issues he is having. I think I have just had enough time to get used to it so it doesn't bother me in most of the games I play. There are definitely compromises with these tvs but I think, at least for now, they are the best deal for a large format 4k monitor. I will definitely be looking out for a better solution when one is available without buying from Korea.
 
jedolley said:
I have this exact model and am not experiencing the same issues you are reporting... Have you followed the guide in this forum on how to configure the TV? It doesn't cover the color, but it does cover how to properly set it up as a PC display or gaming display and in both instances it works great and looks great to me.
Click to expand...

Yeah, I had it set up as a PC display, 4:4:4 chroma working and all that. Looked over the guide.

The backlight strobing thing did reduce the blurring but gave me a headache even faster than the blurring had before, so that was a no-go. After years of using a fairly fast (~6ms GTG) IPS panel I just couldn't get used to the 16-17ms of the Samsung VA. I hate to lose the size, 40" was awesome in terms of immersion, but considering this is something I'm going to be using daily for years I just couldn't handle the blur.
 
The Samsung's have pointlessly fast pixel response times since the engineers decided to pinch a half penny per unit and not use direct current for the back-light. It's the low LED PWM Dimming frequency which is causing the blur (example) and headaches. Sony TV's don't use PWM and they offer 4:4:4 with lower input lag (37ms versus Samsung 45ms). highest end Samsung with double image PWM ghosting versus naturally blurred Sony X810C.
 
NCX said:
The Samsung's have pointlessly fast pixel response times since the engineers decided to pinch a half penny per unit and not use direct current for the back-light. It's the low LED PWM Dimming frequency which is causing the blur (example) and headaches. Sony TV's don't use PWM and they offer 4:4:4 with lower input lag (37ms versus Samsung 45ms). highest end Samsung with double image PWM ghosting versus naturally blurred Sony X810C.
Click to expand...

I get where you are coming from, but in the price range of the JU6500, the Sony 43" X830C is comparably priced and for what I care about (mainly gaming and PC use) the JU6500 appears to be better even when it comes to motion blur.
 
Just to chime in , I really wanted 4k also , so went through the Samsung , the Phillips , and BenQ 3201 route.

Finally settled on the 32" BenQ 3201's and been using since May.

Every experience is different , but to me the BenQ's just seemed to look better overall for a PC Monitor and gaming , well built , no issues using the displayport for full 4k support and so on.

Not an expert like NCX is by any means , but if you really want a 4k monitor my recommendation is the BenQ 3201. Only issue I've had (and it's on both as I have two ) is occasionally, (say less than once or twice a night ) I get a quick flicker of some odd lines that suddenly flash across , but it happens so rarely I decided to not worry about it.

With buying from Amazon gave me the reassurance of a good return policy , but had zero dead pixels on either.
 
NCX said:
The Samsung's have pointlessly fast pixel response times since the engineers decided to pinch a half penny per unit and not use direct current for the back-light. It's the low LED PWM Dimming frequency which is causing the blur (example) and headaches. Sony TV's don't use PWM and they offer 4:4:4 with lower input lag (37ms versus Samsung 45ms). highest end Samsung with double image PWM ghosting versus naturally blurred Sony X810C.
Click to expand...

The Sony was hardly better, and had significantly higher input lag than the Samsung. The Samsung blurred more, but the Sony lagged and crashed. Both were terrible in their own way.
 
So my most recent plan is to return the inanely overpriced Samsung TN ($600 for a 27" TN 4K...) I can no longer stand to look at and order 3 of these on Thursday/Friday: LG 29" IPS LED 21:9 Ultrawide Monitor which will be on Black Thursday/Friday/Saturday special at BestBuy for $200 each, making all 3 cost exactly the same as the single 26" 4K Samsung TN (which will be on sale for $400... still a disaster at that price).

I'll work out some kind of stand, make it out of wood if I have to. I tend to prefer my screens at a 90 degree angle to the work surface, so that simplifies things. I'm sure multiple displays will introduce a whole new sort of frustration, but this should be fun at least. I'll be pretty cool to play racing gaming like Dirt and F1 titles with crazy wide FOV so I can look left and right and actually see what's next to me, or put them all in portrait just for the heck of it.

I may just get one of the LGs and mount my Planar above it for productivity. Plenty of other things I could put that $400 toward.
 
If I remember correctly then these LG 5x-P series use 6bit panels and if you want 8bit panel then you need to buy 6x-P models.
 
Yeah IDK about the triple ultrawide setup. It seems some games do not play well with that resolution, but I can definitely see the benefits if using it for content creation. The very fact that you have to physically swivel your head to see things on screen may become a bit cumbersome. Probably great for racing games as well but I am going to make a prediction that this will not pan out well for you. Hopefully I'm wrong. Good luck and keep us informed.
 
aadik said:
If I remember correctly then these LG 5x-P series use 6bit panels and if you want 8bit panel then you need to buy 6x-P models.
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6bit? I didn't even realize any panel was anything less than 8bit anymore. That's nuts.
 
LG are little fuckers - all the 21:9 panels until ~2014 were true 8-bit, only with some of the most recent iterations they went back to 6bit+FRC
 
I can just barely afford the 34" 21:9 AOC (would have to return the Samsung as planned and a Razer Ouroboros I'm not overly happy with to cover it) or the equivalent 34" 21:9 LG. From my brief reading so far people are saying the picture is better on the LG (less glow) but the stand is far better on the AOC. Surprises me, since I'm fairly sure they use the exact same panel?

Also not sure if I'm better off with a single 34" 21:9 or 3 of the 29"s. The crazy thing is the 3 29"s would be like $150 cheaper. Could built a rig to hold them all portrait maybe and get a lot more screen real-estate (like ~900 in/2 vs ~400 in/2 I think?), but I realize running 3 displays will be more problematic.
 
Also now looking at the Samsung 34" curved 21:9 4K. It's a VA panel, which as long as it's fast enough I personally actually prefer over IPS due to the better black levels and lack of IPS glow, but I need to find a good review that discusses ghosting as I can't stand when VA panels are pushed too far with overdrive, and I'm worried about the claimed 4ms response time... that's kind of crazy fast for a VA panel.

Not sure how I feel about curved vs flat, but eh.

I hate that my local stores don't carry any of these things, I really really don't want to buy something this important sight unseen.

EDIT:

After reading this review and a few others I'm leaning toward the Samsung. My last VA panel was quite a while ago and not considered high end by any means (Soyo DYLM24D6) which meant it had heavy inverse ghosting and black crush, but what I'm reading on this particular panel suggests it's not bad at all. Going to return everything in the morning and get the order in, hopefully I'll have the new display in hand next weekend, if not a little earlier.

Obviously if that's a terrible idea for some reason I've yet to consider, I'd like to know /before/ I make that order. ;)
 
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Just my luck that the 34" Samsung goes "out of stock online" (and isn't available at any store within 250 miles of me) the day I go to order it. Was showing in stock last night, I return the 28" today and boom...

Guess I'm going with the LG or AOC. Given tilt only adjustment should be fine with my desk and chair, and the LG gets better reviews and is only $40 more, probably the LG.

Anyone have experience with either? Guess I should make a new thread.
 
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