“Rogue One” Reviewed: Is It Time To Abandon The “Star Wars” Franchise?

Discussion in 'HardForum Tech News' started by Megalith, Dec 17, 2016.

  1. CSI_PC

    CSI_PC 2[H]4U

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    And she is still not as bad-ass as Ripley!
    Although that was some great acting by Sigourney and great all round scripted-defined character.
    Probably one of the best female lead roles we ever seen in sci-fi IMO.
    Cheers
     
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  2. Quartz-1

    Quartz-1 [H]ardness Supreme

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    I believe the use of the models was a deliberate shout-out to Episode IV.
     
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  3. az_max

    az_max Gawd

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    After the movie, I sent my brother a text asking "I wonder if they have Verizon's Intergalactic unlimited plan for sending death star plans?"
     
  4. Lizard Testes

    Lizard Testes Gawd

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    Sure smells like TRP in here.
     
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  5. htpc_user

    htpc_user [H]ard|Gawd

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    I just have one question...what in the hell is the "uncanny valley" people are talking about?
     
  6. kidstechno3

    kidstechno3 Limp Gawd

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    Rogue One was infinitely better than The Force Awakens. If they keep this up with the Han Solo spinoff, I'm game. But I'm sorry TFA was fucking awful. Critics sayings Rogue One was "uninspired" clearly didn't see TFA (which was basically A New Hope 2: Mary Sue and Emo Vader Edition).
     
  7. Ur_Mom

    Ur_Mom I'm Not Serious

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  8. Yeah also related to digital cliff effect with special.effectts (not digital cliff with reception)

    At a point something gets so real the mind goes "it looks real but something is off" which causes a negative response to the object.
     
  9. Boozer

    Boozer 2[H]4U

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    Same here. That scene was really well done and you could feel it in your bones.
     
  10. erexx

    erexx Limp Gawd

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    Please take your wannabe political garbage elsewhere and shove it straight up your ass. WTF is wrong with you?
    Its a good movie.
     
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  11. erexx

    erexx Limp Gawd

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    You need to reexamine your pitiful fucked up life. Know the Alt_Right and know them for what they are hell bent Liars. And its a quote from Wired magazine.
     
  12. Ducman69

    Ducman69 [H]ardForum Junkie

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    SPOILERSPOILERSPOILERSPOILER

    I'm skipping ahead here, but since I just watched it:

    1) Really well made movie, with some great characters despite the lack of time to really flesh them out in a single movie (and you won't see them again, as for obvious reasons they all had to die).

    2) Great special effects, and while the CGI old characters were very obvious, it was good enough to not bother me.

    3) The plot here actually fills some huge plot holes in the sequel IV, and now totally makes sense why the death star had such a major weakness, and why the replacement didn't have that weakness engineered out properly.

    4) If you pay attention to subtext, the pro-Islamic terrorism motif in this movie is mind boggling. They basically portray Islamic terrorists as the good guys, that are just driven to that extreme through Western imperialism. And its not a hint here and there, but basically its like ISIS are really religious freedom fighters, and the empire are old white guys leading faceless uniformed evil soldiers to kill everyone for no reason.

    If you can overlook the politics and don't read into anything, you will really enjoy this movie.

    But if you're very observant of double-meaning and analogies in film and are pro-US and not sympathetic to ISIS, you might even get pissed off to the point of walking out, as its really that blatant with the "white man is root of all evil" Western imperialists deserve to die and multiculturalism is good crap. Buddy was kind of pissed because he's US army and brought his kids to watch it, and was afraid they'd be brainwashed by movies like this.
     
    Last edited: Dec 26, 2016
  13. delita

    delita [H]ard|Gawd

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    #4 - I saw this with my buddy who is Iraqi and we looked at eachother during the scene in Jedha where they are in the city and I was like dude, was the early rebel alliance very ISIS-looking or what?

    It was a good movie though, I don't see how anyone would get "pissed off" and walk out over that, and if they really did...boo hoo, seriously.
     
  14. Ducman69

    Ducman69 [H]ardForum Junkie

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    Well, to be fair, it wasn't just that scene where you have:
    1) A desert setting
    2) A group of white uniformed soldiers with a Star Wars tank equivalent in an urban setting
    3) Attacked by an Islamic looking group that used explosives in an ambush attack.

    The rebels were also planting the Star Wars equivalent of IEDs left and right. Like ISIS, they kidnapped people and put black sacks over their heads to bring them to their desert fort outside the city. Their attacks were stealth ones adn generally suicide missions, just like Islamic terrorists, and the Islamic terrorists, oops, I mean rebels beyond just the truck, I mean, X-wing suicide attacks even crash a pair of 747s, sorry I mean Imperial ships, into the Twin t... Imperial installation, which was pretty damn 9/11ish!

    And the Imperial soldiers are portrayed primarily as peace keepers (trying to identify who is and isn't a combatant and trying to take prisoners rather than shooting on site), except for the black dressed ones that are an obvious parallel IMO to SWAT teams. So you are basically encouraged to root against US police and US military peace keeping forces in the middle-east, and root for the #BLM and Muslim extremists fighting them.

    This is reinforced by the fact that the empire is portrayed as typically older white males almost exclusively, with zero diversity, whereas none of the rebel leads are white males and are essentially a group of random non-American minorities many of which look middle-eastern, which we are encouraged to believe have 100% moral authority to kill white guys on site in suicide missions to die as martyrs for the cause, for the greater good as the means justify the ends.

    I mean, spin it around and imagine that instead of targeting the US and white guys, it was targeting Israel and Jews? I think panty-bunching would be justified, as sometimes you just want to watch a star wars movie without THAT level of propaganda.
     
    Last edited: Dec 26, 2016
  15. delita

    delita [H]ard|Gawd

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    This is one of those scenarios where I'd say "you ain't right but you ain't wrong".

    People create fiction based off of modern imagry all the time. I can't rightly say the people who created this film were thinking the exact thing you are saying when they made these things the way they turned out in the movie. We're so inundated with seeing this kind of stuff on the news every day that I bet someone could have just used what they thought in their mind when creating these scenes and costumes. "This is what a rebel looks like to me" - maybe it wasn't created with the purpose of spreading some kind of anti-police hatred, maybe it was. I mean shit, the original movies are pretty dang old and that's the same empire then as it is now. Empires, rebellions, and police states have been around a lot longer than the Star Wars universe. Anyway, who knows.
     
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  16. Ducman69

    Ducman69 [H]ardForum Junkie

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    Is it though?

    The old rebels were American and white washed, with good guys like white American Harrison Ford and white American Mark Hamill and white American Carrie Fisher and so forth. And while Mark Hamill was out in the desert, the setting actually reminded me far more of a Kansas farm boy that wants to go out and see the world, but dad really needs him on the farm for the harvest and to fix the tractor.

    This one had a different feel with what to me seemed like an intentionally portrayed foreigner feminist, black guy, Mexican guy, Muslim guy, two Chinese guys, along with a whole bunch of middle-eastern terrorist looking supporting characters taking on the white male patriarchy/US Imperialists, like some kind of propaganda piece you'd see played at the DNC. Granted, there was one good white guy, but he seemed portrayed to me as a "we deserve to be destroyed" self-loathing stereotypical modern Swedish white-guilt guy that wants to participate in destroying Western imperialism from within.

    At least, if I had to sit down and say "what parallel could possibly exist in the real world with Rogue One" as a homework assignment, that's the best I could come up with... or quite frankly, if I were pro-ISIS and wanted to create a movie that would glorify martyrdom against Trump's United States, I'd pat myself on the back for this one.

    tl;dr: I don't think the old rebels are the same as the portrayal of these new rebels.
     
  17. delita

    delita [H]ard|Gawd

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    I will say things have changed since the 70's and 80's, but you see this kind of stuff in a lot of other movies. I'm actually surprised that they didn't make Jyn Erso a transgender lesbian so we had 1 of everything in the movie.
     
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  18. htpc_user

    htpc_user [H]ard|Gawd

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    Good one.
     
  19. Ducman69

    Ducman69 [H]ardForum Junkie

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    You know what makes me REALLY curious though... so Disney was not happy with Rogue One, and required them to reshoot a large portion of the film.

    What makes me curious, is if Rogue One was perhaps even MORE blatantly pro-ISIS, to the point that Disney executives panicked and feared huge backlash, and so asked them to tone it down. So perhaps, as extreme as this is, this is the toned down version?

    Something to think about. :eek:
     
  20. Flogger23m

    Flogger23m [H]ardForum Junkie

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    I'll be honest, you sound a bit like a nut here for multiple reasons.

    1) The good guys must be white. Why do you even feel this way? Why is it bad to have non-white protagonists?

    2) I didn't get any feminist message from this. The lead happened to be a female but it certainly was not in your face. I did not see any male shamming or sexist imagery.

    3) IEDs, bombs, ambush tactics, and head covers existed long before ISIS. Even plenty of white people do this daily. Just look to Ukraine. Or southern Europe.

    4) The concept of non-white rebels using IEDs against an empire = the movie is supporting ISIS is laughable.

    5) Drawing parallels with the Empire and the US is fairly silly.

    6) How exactly is the movie pro-ISIS? Non-white people using IEDs? Rebels fighting against an established military? Is that all you have? That describes half if not more of the world's civil wars or insurgents. I'm failing to see the connect to a hard-line conservative religious group committing mass murder in the name of said religion to the rebels in this film. You may as well say it is pro-ISIS because the insurgents use guns.

    Now the original series had an anti-US, or anti-Vietnam War message in the Ewoks as they represented a technologically inferior force toppling a more advanced one. That was the intention of their implementation. It was explicitly an anti Vietnam War message. The feminist argument might be made with the Force Awakens as the lead is exceptionally good at everything, but that may just be poor story writing. I found it odd that she was able to be competitive in a light sabre battle and have well tuned force powers whereas Luke had to build it up over original series.

    But this movie being pro-ISIS? Laughable.
     
  21. Reus

    Reus Limp Gawd

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    Pro-ISIS? Are you for real? This is the nuttiest shit I've heard in a while. Alex Jones should have you on his show. Fucking mind blowing what people believe these days. o_O
     
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  22. wizzi01

    wizzi01 2[H]4U

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    I never said the movie was bad. I called you out for your interjecting politics into this thread. You said it was alt-rights that hated the movie, and I proved your lying ass wrong.
     
    Last edited: Dec 26, 2016
  23. spaceman

    spaceman [H]ardForum Junkie

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    It was a REBELLION. Things happen when you are fighting an evil empire. The series began in 1977. The original premise was the same then as it is now. BEFORE ISIS.

    deeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeerrrrrrrrrrrrrppppppppppppppppppp
     
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  24. naib

    naib [H]ard|Gawd

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    Thing is... Terrorist/Rebels or FreedomFighters is a matter of perspective AND whomever wins.

    Take Starwars universe... Had the Empire squashed the rebels they would have been classed as terrorist. The rebels won and they were freedom fighters
    Now consider ISIS... Say their vision wins and they do engulf the world in their Caliphate, as per the Quran, then they were liberators not terrorists as they get to write the history (and destroy the rest).

    We view ISIS as the bad guys... guess what ...ISIS views us as the bad guys.


    but then again Starwars is an enjoyable story
     
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  25. Terpfen

    Terpfen [H]ardness Supreme

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    Wired is about as unhinged as you are.
     
  26. Wrench

    Wrench [H]ardForum Junkie

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  27. aeonrevolution

    aeonrevolution 2[H]4U

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    I can't remember where the link went, but the whole "Disney made them re-shoort" rumors weren't really what everyone thought.

    It turned out that initially the writers wanted it to happen the way it turned out, but were afraid to do so. INITIALLY the people lived at the end. Disney was actually the one that gave them the green light to let the characters be killed off.

    I think it was the director that was giving an interview that said this.





    Also, how do you guys not see this more as a Nazi WW2 era symbolism thing? I don't get the ISIS comparisons at all. Obviously in this fake universe the Rebels are the good guys. I'd relate them to the resistance folk that aided the Allies in WW2. Plus the Imperial guys look like dead ringers for future Nazi's with their uniforms etc.
     
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  28. Ducman69

    Ducman69 [H]ardForum Junkie

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    Except that not a single one of your arguments that you state I am making, have I made.

    1) The good guys must be white. Why do you even feel this way? Why is it bad to have non-white protagonists?
    I agree with you, the good guys don't have to be white, and that wasn't the point I made.

    2) I didn't get any feminist message from this. The lead happened to be a female but it certainly was not in your face. I did not see any male shamming or sexist imagery.
    Neither did I, I'm glad we agree. This is not a feminist movie, its a pro-Islamic militancy and anti-Western imperialism film, which just so happens to have feminist characters in that the rebel leadership is lead by women, which is intentional per the writers of this film.

    3) IEDs, bombs, ambush tactics, and head covers existed long before ISIS. Even plenty of white people do this daily. Just look to Ukraine. Or southern Europe.
    I have already explained in detail why the scene is a mirror image of middle-eastern urban combat. No, the characters and scenery was not more like the Ukraine than Iraq/Afghanistan.

    4) The concept of non-white rebels using IEDs against an empire = the movie is supporting ISIS is laughable.
    You didn't say anything here, so how is this its own point? Support your assertion the way I did.

    5) Drawing parallels with the Empire and the US is fairly silly.
    You didn't say anything here, so how is this its own point? Support your assertion the way I did.

    6) How exactly is the movie pro-ISIS?
    Why are responding to my very detailed multi-paragraph explanation, and then asking for an explanation? Try reading again.

    So far, you've created straw man arguments I don't support, and only "point 3" is even a point, and no one would confuse Ukrainian or Russian troops with middle-easterners, nor is the setting comparable.

    To expand upon my claim though, Rogue One's writer, Chris Weitz, has stated that the United States under Donald Trump is represented by the Empire, and said that he intended the Empire to represent "white supremacy".

    Furthermore, another Rogue One script writer Gary Whitta stated that the empire is "Opposed by a multicultural group led by brave women." So the authors are making it clear what they intended through the symbolism, which is the narrative that Democrats have been pushing, that women and minorities must unite to take down the white male patriarchy. They ran virtually their entire campaign (unsuccessfully) on this racist and sexist bigoted premise.

    But hey, so what if the writers agree with me, what could they possibly know what they intended? o_O

    Essentially, I agree not only with the writers, but this critics review (except I don't think the pro-Islamic and anti-Western message is a good thing, and find racist ctrl-left propaganda a detraction from what could have been a perfect film): https://themuslimvibe.com/western-m...r-wars-story-that-is-a-victory-for-minorities
     
    Last edited: Dec 26, 2016
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  29. Ducman69

    Ducman69 [H]ardForum Junkie

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    Historically, it was, and the Empire were space Nazis. The portrayal of the Empire and the Rebels in this particular film was different, and very much intentionally meant to reflect modern parallels per the writers of Rogue One.

    They tweeted that:
    1) Empire is meant to represent white supremacy
    2) Donald Trump's America is the Empire.
    3) Rebels are meant to represent women and minorities opposing the white-male patriarchy
    4) Tweeted Rebel insignia with a safety pin, which was a post-Brexit symbol of solidarity with Muslim migrants

    My inference that there are many parallels to crashing two imperial ships into the imperial symbol building is loosely similar to crashing two US airplanes into a US symbol being the Twin Towers, the fact that the combat scenes were very much like middle-eastern urban warfare, that the rebels were made to look like Islamic militants, the use of IED-like explosives planted all over by rebels, and fact that the Empire are all white males and uniformed soldiers was not by accident is certainly a supported interpretation, even if its not the only one.
     
  30. piscian18

    piscian18 [H]ardForum Junkie

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    Actually if you recall Cassian's speech and the allegory was more for french resistance fighters in WWII.

    All this white male supremacy stuff sounds more like somebody has a complex and it's not Rogue Ones writers.
     
  31. lilbabycat

    lilbabycat 2[H]4U

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    ...The article was in The New Yorker, which kinda leans towards the regressive left camp morseo than the """threatened""" male laughing at unrealistic mary-sue star wars females; but the writer, Richard Brody, mentions nothing of sexism or (fe)male-roles, but instead shits on how bad the storyline is and how none of the characters have any motivation behind them...

    When you explain yourself, you're a conspiracy theorist and nothing more. Its a lose-lose scenario. They push this "propaganda" knowing that its a win for them as long as it gets discussed. Either it "starts a conversation", gets people to call them out on their bullshit (which is then defended against by their army of social media gestapos), or the propaganda actually works and you get feeling "extremists" legitimized. The only way for them to "lose" is for no one to see it, so they throw it into iconic franchises (or everywhere).

    "Vote with your wallet" is the only solution. Still working for videogames after the silliness (and pushback) of 2015.

    Double standards and hypocrisy are whats giving white male's complexes. "We" invented almost everything, "we" do almost everything better, but everyone else in the world (except for asians, lol) is trying to tell us these days that we're horrible just for existing and that our strength, intelligence, and accomplishments mean absolutely nothing. The complex is trying to understand a world being handed over to people that truly don't understand all the systems, standards, and rules "we" put in place are there for a reason. And one of those sticking factors is that "we" isn't white males; its the rational, productive, useful members of society telling it to an ever-increasing portion of society that contributes little to nothing, and in recent times those people have found a way to make it harder for those that are productive to do their jobs / live their lives.

    Hollywood of course is an extremely skewed viewpoint of reality, both in the films themselves but also the people that make them. They don't live lives like most people. I put little weight on their opinions of social/political issues, no matter what side they take. And there's F'ing Scientology....
     
    Last edited: Dec 27, 2016
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  32. Derangel

    Derangel [H]ard as it Gets

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    Movies are not written by one person or eve by two. Weitz and Witta had a script. Other people came in and made changes. Hollywood has a looooong history of script doctors and they work on almost every single movie made. Not to mention the reshoots were written by someone else entirely. Script doctors and reshoot writers go uncredited in Hollywood so you won't see their names listed in the credits at the end. Quite frankly, the opinions of those two are entirely irrelevant. Beyond that, the main shooting script was finished before Trump even won the Republican nomination. The movie was completely finished shooting by the time he won. Weitz is blowing smoke up people's asses and pandering to his audience. You are choosing to see what you want to see instead of what is actually on the screen. There are a lot of parallels to a lot of things in the movie. Because Star Wars was created by whole sale ripping off ideas and themes from other stories and modern culture. The Empire is as much as a more extremist US as it is Nazi Germany or any other remotely similar leadership throughout history. The Rebellion is a rebellion. The whole concept of the Rebels doing some rather extreme crap has been around for decades. It comes straight from the Expanded Universe novels, which played with that idea quite often when it delved into original trilogy and pre-original trilogy stories. We're meant to take their side because that's the focus of the universe. You are seeing things that aren't there and trying to twist things that have been part of the franchise for nearly 40 freaking years.

    Witta's statement is stupid. Main cast aside, how many non-white people were seen with the Rebellion? A handful next to dozens and dozens of white people, primarily men. Mon Mothma (a character Lucas created for Return of the Jedi) is barely leading the Rebellion at the point. She's clearly out-voted and has very little real power at that point. She's not a real leader until the Rebellion decides to go to war. Jyn is brave? News to me. She has no defining character traits at all. She does whatever the plot tells her to do. If that's Witta's idea of a strong woman he's a fucking idiot.

    Let's not even get into the likely that this movie has been chopped to hell either while filming or in the editing room. There is nothing exactly political going on in the movie. Nothing subtle, nothing shoved in your face, just nothing. Even if the writers had tried to put subtext in it's not in the final movie. The movie has as much of a political message of any kind as your average Marvel movie. The only thing that is there is what you put there from your own personal biases and seeing what you want to see.

    Edit: I was wrong about something. Tony Gillroy, the guy that wrote the script for the reshoots, was credited in the film as a writer. Probably has something to do with being paid multiple millions of dollars to rewrite a significant (reportedly up to 40%) of the movie. If he really did rewrite as much of the movie as is rumored that makes Witta and Weitz's comments even more irrelevant because it would mean a large portion of everything they had in the script was erased and rewritten. I need to see the movie again at some point, but I can totally believe that big parts were rewritten, especially due to how tonally inconsistent Jyn and Cassian are throughout the movie.
     
    Last edited: Dec 27, 2016
  33. Quartz-1

    Quartz-1 [H]ardness Supreme

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    I disagree. the Rebels could just as easily have been French resistance.

    The sexism was slightly off-putting. Sure the protagonist was female, but none of the sidekicks or redshirts were.
     
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  34. Ducman69

    Ducman69 [H]ardForum Junkie

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    Exactly, the writers who made it very clear that they intended to make it a anti-white male (patriarchy!!!) US empire movie, traditional leftist talking point style, surely pissed off Disney to no end.

    Disney has no political agenda IMO, and just wants to make money, and so don't want to alienate virtually half of the country that voted Trump or are white males that don't like being portrayed as the embodiment of evil (like MTV's recent "What While Males Can Do Differently for 2017, New Years Resolution Suggestion" video that blamed white guys for all the world's wrongs), or are sympathetic to Islamic terrorism, considering the scope of the recent attacks around the world.

    So that's why I was guessing that Disney's demand for reshoots and rewriting was to tone down the original script, that may have been even more blatant. We can't know for sure, but it would be really interesting to see what the original was like!
    Not many, as the majority were made to be either alien or middle-eastern looking, which was intentional per the writers to have a "multicultural group led by women" to destroy the "white supremacist male Empire" in suicide attacks by any means necessary, as the ends justify the means and are completely morally justified.

    As a white guy, it just feels bad when you are blamed for all the world's wrongs, and to give money to people who hate you, when all you want to do is enjoy a cool sci-fi action movie.

    And I think that's what some Star Wars fans here are doing, forcing (no pun intended) themselves to overlook what the writers even say they clearly intended, and is IMO really blatant symbolism, because they really want to enjoy the movie. Unlike some others, I really do think it would have been an excellent movie too, if you remove the political BS. In fact, I think it would be even better, as the Empire would be far more believable if it weren't portrayed as "white guys wanting to destroy the world because that's what white guys do" hate-speech BS.
     
  35. Derangel

    Derangel [H]ard as it Gets

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    Weitz and Witta were pandering to their audiences with those statements. Rogue One was done with primary filming before Force Unleashed even came out. The main shooting script was done before they started filming in August of last year. No one added anti-Trump or anti-Trump voter messages to the movie because no one thought he would win the Republican nomination, much less the actual election. Trump was barely a footnote in the election at the time the movie was written and filmed. Disney would have taken one look at an overly political script and ordered the entire thing rewritten before principal photography even started. Like I said, you are seeing what you want to see not what is actually there.
     
  36. spaceman

    spaceman [H]ardForum Junkie

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    Yup. Just doing the twist with reality as per usual. See what you want to see and claim all else false. That will work out great.

    It is just a movie. Going along the same lines it has followed for 40 years. Leia was an original symbol of a female leader.
     
  37. lilbabycat

    lilbabycat 2[H]4U

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    Perhaps its due to the more blatant examples/voices (Battlefield 1, MTV's racism, the entire democratic campaign; to name a few) that we're seeing/noticing it everywhere?
     
  38. ep0x73

    ep0x73 2[H]4U

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    Side question as I have not seen the movie but Luke and Wedge formed the roque squadron, both are white yet as it has been pointed out the cast is 90% minorities.
    In keeping with canon how he hell did that happen?
     
  39. Dan_D

    Dan_D [H]ard as it Gets

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    Feb 9, 2002
    Exactly. Attack of the Clones and Revenge of the Sith are a shit load better than The Phantom Menace but that doesn't say very much. In truth I think Revenge of the Sith is almost a good movie. Its about the last 15 to 20 minutes where that film gets derailed into the huge pile of shit its generally known for.

    I disagree. Return of the Jedi is a bit underrated. I agree that the Ewoks were retarded. If you take the Ewoks out and replaced them with Wookies I think it would have been the best of the three. The rest of the film is as good or better than the Empire Strikes Back in my opinion. The Force Awakens is very similar to A New Hope so some criticism of the film is valid. That said I think it was surprisingly enjoyable all things concerned. Despite the rehashed story and questionable decisions in the movie, there is something about it that makes it entertaining for me at least. It has an undefinable quality to it that I can't explain. Its got some of the magic of the original trilogy for lack of a better description. The movie does do a good job at appealing to the nostalgia of the original films. It could be argued that this was both intentional and even somewhat necessary to create a successful launch point for further films. Someone new taking over the franchise had to play it safe in order to keep from being lambasted the way George Lucas was.

    I wouldn't really judge the Force Awakens too harshly at the moment. There are many lines of dialog and points in the story which lack their full context. Its designed to be part of a trilogy and evaluating the film fully before that trilogy is complete is premature.

    Disney's efforts are far better than George Lucas's infantile story telling and cash grab tactics. You can argue Disney does the same thing but the Force Awakens and Rogue One are FAR better than the drivel that George has been peddling for the last decade and a half or so.

    He's definitely out of touch.
     
  40. Ducman69

    Ducman69 [H]ardForum Junkie

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    I think one of us is confused here, as I don't understand what you're talking about.

    I am not talking about Force Unleashed, I am talking about Rogue One.
    Again, what are you talking about? I have argued the exact opposite. I believe that Disney ordered a reshoot to reduce some of the pro-militant Islamism and anti-white male propaganda, in order not to alienate at least half of the US population.

    We know for a fact that Rogue One's writers are very political and very left wing, and pro-Islamic and against Western civilization (more specifically the US) which they see as "white male imperialism", with wars in the middle-east. We know that they intended to convey the premise of "a multicultural band led by women" to take on the white male patriarchy, not just because its obviously in the film, but because they said so.

    We know that Disney was not happy with something about Rogue One, but we can't know for sure what because they won't tell us. My guess is not that Disney would ADD political controversy to the film, but that they would try to SUBTRACT from it, meaning the film may have had an even more blatant pro-ISIS and anti-American subtext before Disney came in and tried its best to "sanitize" the film, and not overly alienate a huge portion of their customer base (IOW, I don't think Disney cares about politics). I still see the symbolism the writers intended, but my question is if it was perhaps even WORSE before Disney came and reigned in the worst of their bigotry.