Report: Tesla Is Dead Last in the Driverless Vehicle Race

vegeta535 said:
Fuck that. Maybe in a fully automated world but not with human drivers on the road still being the majority. Not a nice way to wake someone driving into you while you are sleeping. Anyway V8 for life with manual driving.
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Need those airtubes like in Futurama... aka Elon Musk's grand idea.
 
As it sits I drive an hour each way to and from work. If I could catch some z's during that time I would be happy for it. But you JUST KNOW... a bunch of people will start getting tickets for indecent exposure because they are enjoying themselves to Pron while in cars. It will be the new picking your nose.
 
maxius said:
say no to driver-less say yes to freedom
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Say no to being uninformed, say yes to information

vegeta535 said:
Fuck that. Maybe in a fully automated world but not with human drivers on the road still being the majority. Not a nice way to wake someone driving into you while you are sleeping. Anyway V8 for life with manual driving.
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So you'd rather die awake, than in your sleep? Most people want the latter!
katanaD said:
LOL thats hardly even remotely the same thing. now if you have a building where elevators can be competing for the same space at the same time, then maybe

haha
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So elevators are not automated? Neither are subway cars? And you can say it about the latter that they're competing for the same space, even if it is the most convoluted and unclear way to describe the idea. Also there have been elevator systems for over a decade where multiple cabins can occupy the same shaft.
 
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OrangeKhrush said:
Depends where you live. And forgive me, I will never get into a car with no human input controls because you cannot trust automation.
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Regular cars are built by automation as well. Why do you trust those to put them together properly then?

Anything that can be automated is done better by the automated systems than any human can do it. With much less errors, smaller tolerances, and more consistency. This is true about everything that was successfully automated. I'd trust an automated driving system 1000x more than a random driver picked from a crowd. Now if I already know the human driver the answer might be different, but compared to the primate average, I'll go with any self driving system before I trust my life to the monkeys.

A fear of new technology can always be traced back to ignorance about the technology. It's a basic evolutionary trait that is responsible for our species early survival. Fear of the unknown that is. But it can be easily overcome by learning. Some people just choose to revel in ignorance.
 
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Shouldn't be afraid you aren't in control of the car, you should be happy that the other 34526356745786 bumbling idiots(including yourself) aren't in control of their cars. 99.9999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999% of accidents are because of the human.
 
I'm still on team automation, and I drive for fun.

Commuting sucks for the vast majority of people, can't wait to get rid of that aspect of my day.
 
katanaD said:
LOL thats hardly even remotely the same thing. now if you have a building where elevators can be competing for the same space at the same time, then maybe


haha
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What I'm getting at is, people said they'd never ride elevators which were fully automated and not driven by attendants. Anyone who says the same about cars is saying the same thing.
 
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Somewhat tangential but very relevant. The change over to autonomous cars is going to be transformational.



 
Megalith said:
According to market research and consulting team Navigant Research, Tesla is actually doing the worst out of all 19 companies currently involved with automated driving systems. Their report claims that autopilot has regressed; the latest version (V2) has lost functionality that was present in the original.

Navigant ranked the 19 major companies developing AV technology based on 10 criteria, including vision, market strategy, partnerships, production strategy, technology, product quality and staying power. According to the report, General Motors and Waymo, the auto unit of Alphabet, are the top two AV investment opportunities in the market today.
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One could argue that functionality didn't actually exist in V1, and the fact that Tesla ended their partnership with Mobileye is evidence of that fact. Autopilot never was Autopilot; monitored-pilot was probably a more accurate name, and is in line with SAE's definition of L2 Driving Automation.

GM's kit, proposed to be released next year, skips straight to L4. As Sonicks points out, nobody's production vehicle matches Tesla's for automation. It is only in the claims from R&D about the street-readiness of their automation that anyone is exceeding Tesla.
 
Outside of congested cities, I think that companies are dumping WAY too many resources into driverless cars.

Some people actually enjoy driving. Fuckin weird right?!
 
nutzo said:
Sitting in stop & go traffic for over an hour to get to/from work and having to manually shift your car. How is that fun?
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It's really not. But that's why I daily drive an automatic vehicle and keep my fun vehicle as a manual transmission. Stop and go traffic is painful and frustrating to everyone. But when I'm not dealing with tons of traffic and idiot drivers, I enjoy driving.
 
nutzo said:
Meanwhile, many younger people have no desire to drive. They trust technology, and would rather the car drive itself.
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That doesn't sound at all like the young people I know.

FlawleZ said:
Stop and go traffic is painful and frustrating to everyone. But when I'm not dealing with tons of traffic and idiot drivers, I enjoy driving.
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I can see limited driverless technology taking over. They already have automatic front and rear braking, plus lane assist. Engaging it when the speed is <10 MPH seems doable. You would still need an attentive driver to avoid things like signals, pedestrians and other objects entering the road.
 
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JayteeBates said:
Sounds like several I know. Niece would not even have a DL (got it at age 20!) if I hadn't forced her to go and loaned her my car for the test.
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That's probably because someone like my nephew, who is begging for the car keys and working for a car, was driving her around. ;)
 
rgMekanic said:
Outside of congested cities, I think that companies are dumping WAY too many resources into driverless cars.

Some people actually enjoy driving. Fuckin weird right?!
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Enjoy driving or not, it's still dangerous. From a utilitarian point of view - greater good - it's better to have no human driving when it costs nearly a trillion dollars in medical expenses (jn the US) and a million deaths every year (worldwide) or 34,000 deaths in the US.
 
travisty said:
Enjoy driving or not, it's still dangerous. From a utilitarian point of view - greater good - it's better to have no human driving when it costs tens of billions of dollars in medical expenses and a million deaths every year.
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How many times has your computer crashed?
 
rgMekanic said:
How many times has your computer crashed?
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Recently? Ummm honestly can't remember. Even if it cuts accidents by 10% then that's saved 3000 lives in the US.

Based off of Google's self driving, 15 of 16 accidents were caused by the other (human) driver - this is all time for google. A 90% decrease is so far and beyond transformational that human driving is not long for this world.

You're totally free to argue on feelings, i will argue with facts :)

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Better understand the future

 
travisty said:
Recently? Ummm honestly can't remember. Even if it cuts accidents by 10% then that's saved 3000 lives in the US.

Based off of Google's self driving, 15 of 16 accidents were caused by the other (human) driver - this is all time for google. A 90% decrease is so far and beyond transformational that human driving is not long for this world.

You're totally free to argue on feelings, i will argue with facts :)

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Better understand the future

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Because Google would NEVER blame the driver instead of the technology it's dumping billions into in order to save face. Nope, Google and Honest Abe, right there together.
 
rgMekanic said:
Outside of congested cities, I think that companies are dumping WAY too many resources into driverless cars.

Some people actually enjoy driving. Fuckin weird right?!
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and it's not possible.


I drove home last night in a thunderstorm, it was very hard to drive. Traditional camera's and radar would have been ineffective for navigating, a current driverless system would have you sitting on your ass until the storm passed before you could go home.
 
Just wondering how much more do people think an autonomous car will cost?
 
Verge said:
I drove home last night in a thunderstorm, it was very hard to drive. Traditional camera's and radar would have been ineffective for navigating, a current driverless system would have you sitting on your ass until the storm passed before you could go home.
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While my wife's new Toyota is far from autonomous driving technology, the sensors that it does use for break assist, lane departure, people detection, are not "traditional cameras"
 
travisty said:
Based off of Google's self driving, 15 of 16 accidents were caused by the other (human) driver - this is all time for google. A 90% decrease is so far and beyond transformational that human driving is not long for this world.
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Google is very careful in revealing the number of times their cars would have crashed had it not been for the intervention of the car's "HumanPilot".

Of the 69 reportable safe operation events, 13 were “simulated contacts” -- events in which,
upon replaying the event in our simulator, we determined that the test driver prevented our vehicle
from making contact with another object.

From their report on the 2015 testing year (page 6):
http://static.googleusercontent.com...drivingcar/files/reports/report-annual-15.pdf

They improved to 9 HumanPilot prevented accidents in 2016 when driving ~635K miles.

It calculates that if its drivers had taken no action at all, nine disengagements in 2016 would have led to the car hitting an obstacle or another road user.

https://spectrum.ieee.org/cars-that...ving/the-2578-problems-with-self-driving-cars

But this is a far cry from American accident rates, which Google's own study with Virginia Tech says is about 4.2/million miles.

https://www.vtti.vt.edu/featured/?p=422

And one can only imagine how good American drivers would be if they had a dedicated co-driver who's only job is to intervene when you make a mistake and rarely drove in poor environmental and road conditions.
 
sfsuphysics said:
While my wife's new Toyota is far from autonomous driving technology, the sensors that it does use for break assist, lane departure, people detection, are not "traditional cameras"
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Yea i have all those on my car as well... they were all deactivated due to the weather.... as would her's.


But good point?


https://www.teslarati.com/ces-2018-rains-shuts-down-self-driving-demos/

My personal experience has been that camera-based systems are the best when conditions are good. Subaru’s EyeSight may be the most reliable and useful of the forward-looking driver-assistance systems on the market right now. But when heavy rains or worse come, it’s all but useless. Enter Nissan’s current technologies, as found on the Murano and in much of the Infiniti line. This system adds radar and can “look under” traffic to see several vehicles ahead. Much better, but still unable to find a lane in bad weather when markings are unclear. Ford, as far as in-production technology, fares about the same, but with a somewhat less over-reactive adaptive cruise control. BMW has similar limits but has some of the best self-parking I’ve witnessed so far. Tesla has one of the best systems, especially in the current-generation with its defrosting cameras and the like. The best all-around mixture of capability, though, is what’s found in the latest Volvo vehicles. Likely due to the kind of redundancy that Volvo is so well known for when it comes to safety equipment.
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jpm100 said:
Just wondering how much more do people think an autonomous car will cost?
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You don’t expect me to pay full price do you? The government needs to subsidize this. Paying full price would place a large inconvenience on me, and my boss already said I can’t bring my emotional support pony to work (he’s a fascist).
 
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