Remastering "Star Trek: Deep Space Nine" with Machine Learning

TurboGLH said:
There's an updated comparison video, shows a much better improvement and a a better comparison between original and upgraded. It's uploaded in 4k, and it was much easier to see the difference (on my 4k monitor at least)

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That one is better. Still not enough sell it again.

More like people should wait until their TV can do this in a couple of years.
 
TurboGLH said:
There's an updated comparison video, shows a much better improvement and a a better comparison between original and upgraded. It's uploaded in 4k, and it was much easier to see the difference
Click to expand...

Hey, those are results that deserves consideration. Thanks
 
TurboGLH said:
There's an updated comparison video, shows a much better improvement and a a better comparison between original and upgraded. It's uploaded in 4k, and it was much easier to see the difference (on my 4k monitor at least)

Click to expand...

THAT...is significant
I'd be happy with that quality for sure.
 
TurboGLH said:
There's an updated comparison video, shows a much better improvement and a a better comparison between original and upgraded. It's uploaded in 4k, and it was much easier to see the difference (on my 4k monitor at least)
Click to expand...
Oh yeah, now that's what I'm talkin' about! That's a significant visual upgrade! The first video I was like... meh. This one, I genuinely had a "Holy crap, this looks good!" moment.
 
TurboGLH said:
There's an updated comparison video, shows a much better improvement and a a better comparison between original and upgraded. It's uploaded in 4k, and it was much easier to see the difference (on my 4k monitor at least)

Click to expand...

yeah that's a lot better!
 
Saturn_V said:
Tonite only at a theater near you. Probably the only chance DS9 will see a HD remaster.

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I went to this with a friend. DS9 is my favorite by Far, i probably watch it end to end 3-4x a year. The HD work was pretty damn impressive with the clips they showed. Battle scenes were great.
 
4saken said:
I went to this with a friend. DS9 is my favorite by Far, i probably watch it end to end 3-4x a year. The HD work was pretty damn impressive with the clips they showed. Battle scenes were great.
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That battle scene from "Sacrifice of Angels" was re-done in HD by DS9's original VFX artist, Adam "Mojo" Lebowitz. It was breathtaking in SD back in 1997, but new one is really astonishing now.


And I really liked their Writer's Room pitch for Season 8 Episode 1. It was neat seeing writers talk through an episode like that.
 
so is this coming out in Blu-Ray 4K then? what's the ETA?

likewise, is there any news on ST: TNG releasing in blu-ray 4K? because if there is no chance of ST:TNG going to 4K, then I'll buy the regular blu-ray version.

and while I'm on this subject, can someone tell me the difference of these 2 blu-ray version of ST:TNG season 1 to 7?


https://www.amazon.com/Star-Trek-Generation-Complete-Blu-ray/dp/B00NQXC2YU/ref=sr_1_2?crid=1WHL7WYXTVF0&keywords=star+trek+the+next+generation+blu+ray&qid=1572609558&sprefix=star+trek+the+next+,aps,236&sr=8-2

as there is a $13 difference

https://www.amazon.com/Star-Trek-Generation-Complete-Blu-ray/dp/B01BP06ENA/ref=sr_1_1?crid=1WHL7WYXTVF0&keywords=star+trek+the+next+generation+blu+ray&qid=1572609694&sprefix=star+trek+the+next+,aps,236&sr=8-1
 
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Happy Hopping said:
so is this coming out in Blu-Ray 4K then? what's the ETA?

likewise, is there any news on ST: TNG releasing in blu-ray 4K? because if there is no chance of ST:TNG going to 4K, then I'll buy the regular blu-ray version.

and while I'm on this subject, can someone tell me the difference of these 2 blu-ray version of ST:TNG season 1 to 7?


https://www.amazon.com/Star-Trek-Generation-Complete-Blu-ray/dp/B00NQXC2YU/ref=sr_1_2?crid=1WHL7WYXTVF0&keywords=star+trek+the+next+generation+blu+ray&qid=1572609558&sprefix=star+trek+the+next+,aps,236&sr=8-2

as there is a $13 difference

https://www.amazon.com/Star-Trek-Generation-Complete-Blu-ray/dp/B01BP06ENA/ref=sr_1_1?crid=1WHL7WYXTVF0&keywords=star+trek+the+next+generation+blu+ray&qid=1572609694&sprefix=star+trek+the+next+,aps,236&sr=8-1
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Doesn't appear to be any difference, as they both have the same Amazon product number.

Also, no, no 4k. I watched a special on the remaster of this. They completely lost their ass on it because fans simply watched it on streaming instead of buying it.
 
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Happy Hopping said:
so is this coming out in Blu-Ray 4K then? what's the ETA?
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if you're referring to DS9 the series, it's unlikely it'll ever be remastered. Estimated to cost north of $20 M and 3-4 years to do it like TNG did.

If you're referring to What We Left Behind, the DS9 documentary- it's available on Blu Ray and digital now. No 4K version announced.

Happy Hopping said:
likewise, is there any news on ST: TNG releasing in blu-ray 4K? because if there is no chance of ST:TNG going to 4K, then I'll buy the regular blu-ray version.

and while I'm on this subject, can someone tell me the difference of these 2 blu-ray version of ST:TNG season 1 to 7?
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One is North American market, one is European. (the film censor labels are Euro) Same BluRay I think, since neither appears to be hard-region coded.
 
Man, it's criminal to shoot/record the show on low ql source. This is film school 101. lol,
 
thesmokingman said:
Man, it's criminal to shoot/record the show on low ql source. This is film school 101. lol,
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They didn't shoot the show on a low quality source. It was shot using 35mm just like TNG was. The problem is that it was then scanned into a computer and all of the CGI was done at a lower resolution. That was done both to save money and because of the limitations of CGI at the time. They only have "Complete" versions of each episode at that lower resolution. They could re-scan the original 35mm film, which is what they did for TNG, but would have to piece each episode back together using new CGI, which once again is exactly what they did for TNG. It would be harder for DS9 because there is more CGI than there was in TNG. 35mm film of the actual filmed scenes does exist however, it's just not worth their time to do anything with it apparently.


https://io9.gizmodo.com/the-detailed-depressing-reason-deep-space-nine-and-voy-1791962332
By the mid-1980s, video technology had advanced enough to the point that many TV shows—including Star Trek: The Next Generation—were no longer editing the 35mm film footage, but scanning it into computers, transforming it into the lower, TV-friendly resolution and edited from there to save money. In TNG’s case, that helped make the VFX work on the show easier, but it also meant there all the show’s film was left in separate pieces. Essentially, for the HD release of Star Trek, all people had to do was scan each episode. For The Next Generation, they would have to scan all those original pieces of film and then edit together each episode again, themselves. It’s more difficult, more expensive, and much more time-consuming.

What’s amazing is that they actually did this for TNG’s Blu-ray release, which was a radical, unprecedented, and incredibly daunting task. Following the edited tape versions that were originally broadcast, a new team painstakingly recreated every episode of the show from the 35mm film footage, a process that cost millions and millions of dollars. But as TNG is the jewel in the Star Trek crown for legions of fans, it was seen as worth it.

Unfortunately, it wasn’t actually worth it. Sales of the extravagant TNG remaster —original retail price $118 for just season one—failed to reach CBS and Paramount’s expectations.

A similar process would have to be done for both DS9 and Voyager—and would actually be even harder. Both shows extensively used CGI effects that were only ever rendered in the lower videotape resolution, which means all the shows’ special effects would need to be completely recreated. But neither show is anywhere near as popular in the public consciousness as TNG, it’s simply too much effort for not enough of a value proposition.
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GotNoRice said:
They didn't shoot the show on a low quality source. It was shot using 35mm just like TNG was. The problem is that it was then scanned into a computer and all of the CGI was done at a lower resolution. That was done both to save money and because of the limitations of CGI at the time. They only have "Complete" versions of each episode at that lower resolution. They could re-scan the original 35mm film, which is what they did for TNG, but would have to piece each episode back together using new CGI, which once again is exactly what they did for TNG. It would be harder for DS9 because there is more CGI than there was in TNG. 35mm film of the actual filmed scenes does exist however, it's just not worth their time to do anything with it apparently.


https://io9.gizmodo.com/the-detailed-depressing-reason-deep-space-nine-and-voy-1791962332
Click to expand...

Man, that's even worse and even more ass backwards.
 


is this an actual CD (or CD set) that you can buy? as I search thru google, amazon and ebay, there is no CD or CD set that covers all the 50th anniverary titles in 1 or few CD?
 
GotNoRice said:
Unfortunately they don't. Here is a fantastic article regarding the situation for anyone curious about if/when we will ever see an HD version of DS9 or Voyager. Unfortunately the outlook is not good.

http://www.treknews.net/2017/02/02/why-ds9-voyager-not-on-blu-ray-hd/
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I think the thing to figure out is what's the delta between what CBS is willing to spend and what it'd cost and then try to do a kickstarter for a 4K set. Even if they can only scan to 2K, it's clear that you can upscale to 4K with good results and HDR would also be nice.

If restoring is 40 million, maybe preselling 100-200k of the series would be enough to make up the difference. Kickstart it and see what happens. DS9 is the only trek I'd be willing to do it, though I'd like to see them try to reformat it for 16:9, if at all possible. I figure they did it for Friends and Lonesome Dove, so it may be possible.

I'm going to keep dreaming that the best Trek series gets a proper HD (if not UHD) release.
 
TurboGLH said:
There's an updated comparison video, shows a much better improvement and a a better comparison between original and upgraded. It's uploaded in 4k, and it was much easier to see the difference (on my 4k monitor at least)

Click to expand...

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TurboGLH said:
There's an updated comparison video, shows a much better improvement and a a better comparison between original and upgraded. It's uploaded in 4k, and it was much easier to see the difference (on my 4k monitor at least)
Click to expand...


I'd prefer a proper remastering, but this would probably be good enough for streaming platforms.
 
does anyone knows if there is a soundtrack greatest hits CD that covers the last 5 or 6 star trek films? From First Contact to the last star trek film. I can't find it on amazon or ebay
 
Happy Hopping said:
so is this coming out in Blu-Ray 4K then? what's the ETA?

likewise, is there any news on ST: TNG releasing in blu-ray 4K? because if there is no chance of ST:TNG going to 4K, then I'll buy the regular blu-ray version.

and while I'm on this subject, can someone tell me the difference of these 2 blu-ray version of ST:TNG season 1 to 7?


https://www.amazon.com/Star-Trek-Generation-Complete-Blu-ray/dp/B00NQXC2YU/ref=sr_1_2?crid=1WHL7WYXTVF0&keywords=star+trek+the+next+generation+blu+ray&qid=1572609558&sprefix=star+trek+the+next+,aps,236&sr=8-2

as there is a $13 difference

https://www.amazon.com/Star-Trek-Generation-Complete-Blu-ray/dp/B01BP06ENA/ref=sr_1_1?crid=1WHL7WYXTVF0&keywords=star+trek+the+next+generation+blu+ray&qid=1572609694&sprefix=star+trek+the+next+,aps,236&sr=8-1
Click to expand...
The first one is region A/B/C (all regions) and is a UK import (IN-UK) and it looks like it includes multiple language sountracks. The second one is region A only and is a North American release (Paramount). That one looks like it only includes an English soundtrack.

Look under product details.
 
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Megalith said:
As significant portions of the show were shot on video (and not film, which can be easily scanned to higher resolutions), Star Trek: Deep Space Nine may never get a legitimate HD remaster, but that hasn’t stopped one fan from experimenting with other technologies to see what it could look like: Stefan Rumen (“CaptRobau”), who has been upscaling Final Fantasy VII using AI Gigapixel, has applied that same neural-networking technique to bump DVD footage of DS9 to 1080p quality. While the results are arguably mild, Rumen hopes CBS and other studios take note of how machine learning can be used for improving video quality.

Since I do not own DS9, I cannot just do what I want with it. While I would love to release full episodes, this is just not legally possible. These videos serve more as a proof of concept for CBS to look into machine learning and neural networks to help remaster DS9 and move it a bit closer to the HD era. Imagine what a real team could do, with more powerful equipment, custom trained neural networks (perhaps training the network on TNG vs. TNG Remastered images) and access to the original SD files instead of a DVDRip like me.
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Why is it that when I hover over that link it shows "https://www.hardocp.com/news/2019/03/16/remastering_star_trek_deep_space_nine_machine_learning" but when I click on it it goes to "https://hardforum.com/"?

This is the second time this has done this here and I can't remember where the other one was, but I think it was also posted by you.
 
That's sad. Odo was one of my favorite characters from DS9. René Auberjonois was also a very talented voice actor. Fans of the Legacy of Kain series will remember him as the voice of Janos Audron.
 
prime2515102 said:
Why is it that when I hover over that link it shows "https://www.hardocp.com/news/2019/03/16/remastering_star_trek_deep_space_nine_machine_learning" but when I click on it it goes to "https://hardforum.com/"?

This is the second time this has done this here and I can't remember where the other one was, but I think it was also posted by you.
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hardocp.com now links back to hardforum.com. kyle changed it a week or two ago. hardocp.com is dead :(
oh and he's not at intel anymore either
 
prime2515102 said:
Why is it that when I hover over that link it shows "https://www.hardocp.com/news/2019/03/16/remastering_star_trek_deep_space_nine_machine_learning" but when I click on it it goes to "https://hardforum.com/"?

This is the second time this has done this here and I can't remember where the other one was, but I think it was also posted by you.
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Look at the date. When the main site was still active News posts always included a link back to the post on the main site. Since the main site is no longer active it redirects to here.
 
pendragon1 said:
hardocp.com now links back to hardforum.com. kyle changed it a week or two ago. hardocp.com is dead :(
oh and he's not at intel anymore either
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Armenius said:
Look at the date. When the main site was still active News posts always included a link back to the post on the main site. Since the main site is no longer active it redirects to here.
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My bad, I didn't notice the date. :oops:
 
that was faster than Nick Cage ending his marriage :LOL:

but seriously, I wouldn't miss Intel if I work there. I always thought they are such dinosaur
 
I'd prefer technology that fills in the Black Bars. Not that I can't get use to it but there's always that person who can't watch anything with them so they zoom until they are gone.
 
Happy Hopping said:
I thought he got that new job at intel. It end already? why?
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He posted that there were medical issues with one of his kids and, as I recall, he felt he needed to be home a lot more than he could be if he stayed at the job. I'm pretty sure that he left within a couple of months. Hopefully his kid is doing better now.
 
I too wish his kid a complete and speedy recovery. He hasn't had enough opportunity to frag.
 
did he have to do a long distance move to Intel and now move back? because that's a lot of $ if intel doesn't compensate back

that's something that any high profile new job offer package should have: that if you don't like the job w/i 3 mth., they'll pay you for the moving to move back to your original town, state
 
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